Could "aliens" be visitors from the future??

MadPatrick

We all know about UFOs and aliens and stuff, and we all know that sooner or later, and if it's possible man will manage to travel through time.
So is it a possibility that the aliens that have been seen(and not imagined) are actually people from the future who have evolved to not need the amount of muscles modern humans have and need bigger brains to process the amount of info we receive??

Discuss

Carra23

They could be but they could also just come from another planet or they may not even exist have you seen one ?

PirateShampoo

MadPatrick wrote: »

We all know about UFOs and aliens and stuff, and we all know that sooner or later, and if it's possible man will manage to travel through time.
So is it a possibility that the aliens that have been seen(and not imagined) are actually people from the future who have evolved to not need the amount of muscles modern humans have and need bigger brains to process the amount of info we receive??

Discuss

Belive it or not im actually a fan of this idea, and have thought about it myself because i think your right with your line of thinking that if mankind continued to evolve and heavily rely on technology then our bodies would get smaller and brains would get bigger etc.

Put it this way, i think it holds more water than lizard people.

sold

This has been discussed in physics ad nauseum. Time travel is possible in theory. If you ever studied the works of Einstein you would be familiar. It would be possible to travel forward in time, but it unclear if we could travel back. Anyway the theory needs you to travel a speed of light.

Also remember that time is relative to a point. There is also the problem that when mass reaches the speed of light it expands and time slows. So if we were able to make a machine that could travel a the speed of light as the moment we don't know who to counteract the speed against the mass.

Lab_Mouse

Yeah it isnt beyond the realms of possibility.They could appear to be alien because the technology they would use would be so far advanced to what we have.

MadPatrick

Carra23 wrote: »

They could be but they could also just come from another planet or they may not even exist have you seen one ?

I've never seen an alien, but I have seen lights, faster than a sattelite and slower than a shooting star, obviously not compelling evidence.

However, it's a difficult question: Is it harder to travel millions of light years to a planet that may or may not possess life(most wouldn't and it would be a distressing job looking for a needle that might not exist in a haystack) or that humans of the future look into their past and need to stick things in anuses to figure out where in time they are

sold

Lab_Mouse wrote: »

Yeah it isnt beyond the realms of possibility.They could appear to be alien because the technology they would use would be so far advanced to what we have.

You read to many Sci-fi books. You could also take the opposite stance, yes there are aliens but they are in the stone age and WE are the most advanced in the universe. Facts are to date there is no conclusive proof of inteligent life outside earth,

MadPatrick

The distance they would have to travel is actually astonishing, we're talking about millions of lightyears to the nearest planet capable of producing life, even then the odds of intelligent life are far less enthusiastic.

There probably is intelligent life out there, the numbers are in favour of this theory but the chances of them ever coming to earth while humans still exist are minuscule.

seamus

sold wrote: »

This has been discussed in physics ad nauseum. Time travel is possible in theory. If you ever studied the works of Einstein you would be familiar. It would be possible to travel forward in time, but it unclear if we could travel back. Anyway the theory needs you to travel a speed of light.

Also remember that time is relative to a point. There is also the problem that when mass reaches the speed of light it expands and time slows. So if we were able to make a machine that could travel a the speed of light as the moment we don't know who to counteract the speed against the mass.

Within current knowledge of course you're right.

But then Newton was probably one of the greatest minds before Einstein, and although his works are still perfectly valid today for "classic" physics, they don't apply in certain circumstances on the micro level which Newton couldn't possibly have forseen or accounted for.

It would be extremely irresponsible of us to assume that Einstein managed to corner the entire market in terms of relativity and velocity and there are no more "dimensions" (not in the literal sense!) in that regard.

Of course, UFOs as time travellers is ridiculous. Any society sufficiently advanced to develop time travel would have the cop on to not use it. Besides, the most obvious answer is 99.99% of the time the correct one - UFOs are manmade or "common" phenomena which people have simply failed to identify correctly. No-one has ever encountered an alien being and the chances of doing so in our lifetimes are practically zero.

King Mob

Well assumeing that the Grays are the real ones, it's a slightly more likely explanation than coming from another planet.
It would explain why they are so similar to us (bipedal, two eyes, nostrils, hands and so on.)

But that being said it's far from the most likely explanation.

Lab_Mouse

sold wrote: »

You read to many Sci-fi books. You could also take the opposite stance, yes there are aliens but they are in the stone age and WE are the most advanced in the universe. Facts are to date there is no conclusive proof of inteligent life outside earth,

You didnt read the OP did you?He was saying that if mankind of the future if they had time travel(a very big if!!)and they traveled back in time to now that they would appear alien because of the fact they would have technology that we dont have or understand.Say some fancy form of propulsion for there aircraft

And yes you are quiet correct that there has been no intelligent life found yet and if there is no-one knows what level of technology they would have.

Bottle_of_Smoke

seamus wrote: »

Of course, UFOs as time travellers is ridiculous. Any society sufficiently advanced to develop time travel would have the cop on to not use it.

Erm, that's not how knowledge works. One person/group comes up with it. They might have the cop-on not to use it but then another(richer) group comes along and uses it.

For some reason time-travel seems a lot more likely to me than aliens making the massive journey from the nearest planet with intelligent life.

indough

always liked this idea, not to say i necessarily believe it but its an interesting thought

either that or theyre from some alternate universe which is out of sync with us time wise

Undergod

No reason it couldn't be. If humans did develop time travel they might well want to investigate the past.

Lone Stone

sold wrote: »

This has been discussed in physics ad nauseum. Time travel is possible in theory. If you ever studied the works of Einstein you would be familiar. It would be possible to travel forward in time, but it unclear if we could travel back. Anyway the theory needs you to travel a speed of light.

Also remember that time is relative to a point. There is also the problem that when mass reaches the speed of light it expands and time slows. So if we were able to make a machine that could travel a the speed of light as the moment we don't know who to counteract the speed against the mass.

Interesting , So then it could be possible that aliens we think we see could be a specie's from the past before humans ! that's visiting the future aswell :eek:
I never thought of that before actually hmmmm ....

argosy2006

i have no clue about this,,, does space go on forever? never ending travel possible?
and is ther another sun other that our own? yes i have no clue lol,,
tell me

argosy2006

The Universe is EVERYTHING that humans know of. But there is an unbelievable amount yet to learn. We have yet to find the "edge" (or end) of the Universe, being many billions of light-years away. We have no idea where the edges might be, where the Universe ends, if there is an end to it. Given our limited technological capabilities, the Universe is still too vast for us to see all of it or understand it all.

Our Solar System is located in the Milky Way Galaxy which is just an average galaxy in the Universe which contains hundreds of billions of galaxies. Our Milky Way Galaxy is approximately 100,000 light-years across and roughly 7,000 light-years thick at the center bulge. A light-year is the distance it takes for light to travel in one year traveling at 186,000 miles per second (like circling the Earth seven times a second) (or 670,000 miles per hour), approximately 6 trillion miles in one year. The Milky Way Galaxy looks like many other galaxies in the Universe, being a Spiral Galaxy having "arms" that twist around the center bulge. Some of the largest galaxies are three times larger than the Milky Way. Some galaxies exist alone and others are part of clusters of galaxies. Scientists theorize that black holes are at the heart of galaxies. Our Solar System is located about 2/3 the way out from the center bulge in one of these arms.

When you look up at the clear night sky, you generally see a maximum of about 3,000 stars from your half-side of the Earth, so around the entire Earth people can see a total of about 6,000 stars with unaided eyes. Our Sun, being about 4.5 billion years old and about 109 times the size of Earth, is an average star. Other stars can be larger or smaller than our Sun, some being larger than our entire Solar System. When looking at the night sky using only your unaided eyes, with the exception of other galaxies that can generally only be seen through telescopes, all of those points of light in the sky are other stars, nothing else. In other words, they are all other suns! Not only that, with the exception of the other galaxies, all of the stars you see, including those through telescopes, are ALL within our Milky Way Galaxy, no matter where you stand on Earth.

Knowing that all of the stars are other suns, this means that our Solar System is not the only solar system in the Milky Way Galaxy. It is estimated that there are from 200 billion to 400 billion stars (suns) in our Milky Way Galaxy, many of which could be other solar systems.

heavyballs

MadPatrick wrote: »

The distance they would have to travel is actually astonishing, we're talking about millions of lightyears to the nearest planet capable of producing life, even then the odds of intelligent life are far less enthusiastic.

There probably is intelligent life out there, the numbers are in favour of this theory but the chances of them ever coming to earth while humans still exist are minuscule.

totally agree
however i can tell you that i have seen a ufo at a very low alt,about 80-120 feet and about 50-60 yards away,
i am of very sound mind and have ruled out all possibilities
it was a stell sphere about 4 yards sq,my wife also witnessed it,it moved up diagonally and then back to original position,then as we both looked at it,it vanished
could it have been a probe of some description,man made?

argosy2006

heavyballs wrote: »

totally agree
however i can tell you that i have seen a ufo at a very low alt,about 80-120 feet and about 50-60 yards away,
i am of very sound mind and have ruled out all possibilities
it was a stell sphere about 4 yards sq,my wife also witnessed it,it moved up diagonally and then back to original position,then as we both looked at it,it vanished
could it have been a probe of some description,man made?

where did u see it. was it a dream ,were u wacky on de tobacky at the time,

heavyballs

argosy2006 wrote: »

where did u see it. was it a dream ,were u wacky on de tobacky at the time,

never taken a drug in my life,was in Kilkenny near where i lived at the time in a field,about 7 at night on a summer night so it was really bright and totally clear,

argosy2006

heavyballs wrote: »

never taken a drug in my life,was in Kilkenny near where i lived at the time in a field,about 7 at night on a summer night so it was really bright and totally clear,

kool, i,m from kilkenny, where about was this, how far away in feet was it from you

Owen

So creatures travel countless light years, develop technology to do it and instead of visiting a large land mass, or urban area, choose a field in Kilkenny? Not dismissing you per se, but logic would dictate that they choose somewhere a little more obvious.

argosy2006

argosy2006

is that your sphere?

mysterious

Aliens and UFOs are real, there is nothing whacking or insane about it.

I can't believe people still question that it is. It's 2010 people. It's not insane or bizzarre. It's just something we try imagine in movies, because thats where we tend to put most of our tmie into, movies, hollywood and the 9 to 5 slavery to continue back onto the movies, hollywood and enterttainment.

Most of us never actually look at the sky. When we walk down street. Infact most of us would be afraid to incase people might think we are been weird.

But its not weird. I see UFOs and no they are not jumbo jets, or planes. There is a lot of activity going on in space and a lot of it is kept hidden from the mainstream media as obvious. So its really about us we the people realsing whats unknown and making it known.


Threre are other dimensions and universes, and and infinity never ends, even if a universe does end a new is birthed. So all in all, its actually stupid to think or even assume that there is only a possibility of life out there when we are life sitting on a prison world kept in the dark of whats outside our world.

heavyballs

argosy2006 wrote: »

kool, i,m from kilkenny, where about was this, how far away in feet was it from you

in my earlier post i described the distance,
it was in a field down the lane towards Jenkinstown woods(i think that's what it's called)just off the Kilkenny road coming from Durrow

heavyballs

argosy2006 wrote: »

is that your sphere?

no ridges or photoshop in my one

argosy2006

DID U GET A PIC

heavyballs

PaintDoctor wrote: »

So creatures travel countless light years, develop technology to do it and instead of visiting a large land mass, or urban area, choose a field in Kilkenny? Not dismissing you per se, but logic would dictate that they choose somewhere a little more obvious.

maybe you should read my initial post? i agreed with the other poster regarding the fact that it is improbable that alien's could visit us giving the vastness of the universe and the distance of the closest planets to us,that's why i reckon it could have been some type of advanced enginering device or something similiar
one thing i can tell you is that it was a steel sphere,nothing else

heavyballs

argosy2006 wrote: »

DID U GET A PIC

negative,btw this was 3 and half years ago

Owen

heavyballs wrote: »

maybe you should read my initial post? i agreed with the other poster regarding the fact that it is improbable that alien's could visit us giving the vastness of the universe and the distance of the closest planets to us,that's why i reckon it could have been some type of advanced enginering device or something similiar
one thing i can tell you is that it was a steel sphere,nothing else

Well, to travel through time, you need to factor in travelling through space too, but that's a bit much for this forum.

Say we 'agree' it's time travel and your steel ball is from the future - hypothetically. Why Kilkenny?

heavyballs

PaintDoctor wrote: »

Well, to travel through time, you need to factor in travelling through space too, but that's a bit much for this forum.

Say we 'agree' it's time travel and your steel ball is from the future - hypothetically. Why Kilkenny?

i was agreeing with his theory but if you read my post imo what i saw is more likely advanced enginered by humans,thats my opinion,is that plausible?i don't know

Whybin

sold wrote: »

This has been discussed in physics ad nauseum. Time travel is possible in theory. If you ever studied the works of Einstein you would be familiar. It would be possible to travel forward in time, but it unclear if we could travel back. Anyway the theory needs you to travel a speed of light.

One of the most realistic proposed methods of time travel, and it still requires expending more energy than exists in the universe, does indeed rely on relativistic time dilation to work. However time dilation does occur below the speed of light, in fact it occurs to some extent at any speed, you just need to be going very fast for it to be measurable. They've shown this with atomic clocks in concordes travelling at the speed of sound.

So what you do is; you stabilise a wormhole, put the first end next to earth and move the second end away at as close as you can get to the speed of light. When you bring the wormhole back to earth less time has passed for one end than the other. So travelling through the first wormhole would send you backwards in time.

But, this means that while it is conceivably possible to travel backwards in time, you couldn't travel further back than when the 'time machine' was first made.

Plus, aliens haven't visited earth. Why the hell would a species invest the time and resources to seek out other intelligent life and not announce themselves? Wouldn't you want to say hi if you'd travelled that far?

Wibbs

The problem with the time travel thing for me is that the time needed to evolve into these "greys" would be long. It makes more sense that we and other civilisations would evolve machine replacements. This gets rid of the issue of time. Then even if you cant break the speed of light, it doesnt really matter. Aim at a star, switch off for however long it takes and then switch back on when you arrive. If aliens ever do get here they're far more likely IMHO to be machines than biological. 2001 and teh first star trek movie make much more sense to me than ET.

The other issue is our brain as it is is at the limit of size. Any bigger and issues of feeding it etc come into play. It could get more complex yes but big headed aliens are unlikely on our scale anyway.

mysterious

Wibbs wrote: »

The problem with the time travel thing for me is that the time needed to evolve into these "greys" would be long. It makes more sense that we and other civilisations would evolve machine replacements. This gets rid of the issue of time. Then even if you cant break the speed of light, it doesnt really matter. Aim at a star, switch off for however long it takes and then switch back on when you arrive. If aliens ever do get here they're far more likely IMHO to be machines than biological. 2001 and teh first star trek movie make much more sense to me than ET.

The other issue is our brain as it is is at the limit of size. Any bigger and issues of feeding it etc come into play. It could get more complex yes but big headed aliens are unlikely on our scale anyway.

Your thinking to much in linear phyiscal terms.

Races more advanced than earth have defeated the limitations of time and distance. Meaning they can change evolve without the boundaries of the 3rd density physicality. They can surpass the speed of light in thought pattern, meaning they can go to the next star by thought. They open a vortex with their minds and bam they are in. Timelines are like dimensions. They resonate at different frequencies. E.Ts have been creating thier own timelines since the dawn they have left their 3D physical worlds when the universe was young and yes we were like them. It does however get really complicated for them and not just for us, as to how messy these timelines become. Why?

Because all our timelines affect each other, if they go back in time they alter the future. etc. The higher E.ts know that so they are trying to ensure all balance and harmony is restored in the lower dimensions and vibrations, including earth.

Earth plays one of the most important aspects to all these timelines, because earth was choosen as the most universal planet to where souls from all over the universe and from different timelines to create this super consciousness that evolves from scratch. it's explains why we don't remember our previous lives and why there is so much conflict and differences on this world. The 2012 timeline fits into all this, and it explains why the ancients knew so much about our present changes, because the E.Ts were the directors behind, Atlantis, Maya, Egypt, The Hopis and many other tribes and races on earth.

And aliens are not likely to be machines, but there are many aliens who might be, just not what we think they are in earth terms. We have to expand our mind and consciousness and just stop thinking about the universe from the way we see it on earth via science. What we are been taught is really wrong and ****ed up.

Wibbs

mysterious wrote: »

Your thinking to much in linear phyiscal terms.

Rare enough Im accused of that.

Races more advanced than earth have defeated the limitations of time and distance.

Ok lets accept the existence of other intellignet life...

Meaning they can change evolve without the boundaries of the 3rd density physicality.

What does 3rd density physicality mean?

They can surpass the speed of light in thought pattern, meaning they can go to the next star by thought. They open a vortex with their minds and bam they are in.

Thoughts obey einstein just as much as the light from a torch. Thoughts are quite slow, when its a chemical signal or even electrical. Dont believe me? If I stick a needle into my toe, I'll react slower than if I stick a needle in my finger. Shorter distance in the latter. We think far far better than computers because of organisation rather than speed.

Timelines are like dimensions. They resonate at different frequencies.

While that makes vague sense, it makes no real scientific sense. Dimensions are not different frequencies. Time most certainly isnt.

E.Ts have been creating thier own timelines since the dawn they have left their 3D physical worlds when the universe was young and yes we were like them. It does however get really complicated for them and not just for us, as to how messy these timelines become. Why?

Because all our timelines affect each other, if they go back in time they alter the future. etc. The higher E.ts know that so they are trying to ensure all balance and harmony is restored in the lower dimensions and vibrations, including earth.

Earth plays one of the most important aspects to all these timelines, because earth was choosen as the most universal planet to where souls from all over the universe and from different timelines to create this super consciousness that evolves from scratch. it's explains why we don't remember our previous lives and why there is so much conflict and differences on this world.

Interesting story, I find it hard nay impossible to believe. I'd love to know how they get around the real pain in the bum that is causality. Even if one could externally view the whole of the universe from birth to death as a single entity, you still couldnt screw with causality. The only way I could see to do same would if you had an infinite multiverse. Even then you would be creating another past not effecting the past in the timeline you started from.

The 2012 timeline fits into all this, and it explains why the ancients knew so much about our present changes, because the E.Ts were the directors behind, Atlantis, Maya, Egypt, The Hopis and many other tribes and races on earth.

2012 has more than a few issues. For a start the date may well be wrong. Secondly they didnt consider it an end of times, just a full circle of their wheel.

Atlantis shows up in just one text of Platos. No other author mentions it. I would have no difficulty believing it referred to either a race memory of an advanced civilisation or a story tacked together describing the minoan culture getting blown to bits in the thera eruption. indeed reconstructions of what is now the island of santorini fit quite well with Platos description of atlantis a ringed island with a city in the center. Plus his descriptin of the atlantan soil being made up of red earth and balck earth. Some on santorini. The minoans made the mainland greeks look like monkeys at the time, so its not a stretch. Add in stories of other islands and hyped up notions of their advancement(including this island BTW) then Plato was weaving a early greek sci fi tale of warning for his readers. Beyond some hippie channeling Atlanteans which was popular in the 60's, thats about all we know of Atlantis.

We know a bit of the Mayan belief system and it has a few crossovers with other pre columbian systems. The Egyptian systems we know very well. Their beliefs and personal writings. None of which Im aware of speak of apocolypse or 2012. They werent a very apocalyptic bunch anyway. that seems to be more an abrahamic religion thing. Certainly this focus on the end of the world. AFAIR The ancient egyptians didnt even have an end of days. Their own indigenous calender wasnt too great and they later grabbed the babylonian one, much like ourselves with its attendant issues. The mayan was a great calender. Brilliant indeed. Allows for procession and all sorts of stuff.

And aliens are not likely to be machines, but there are many aliens who might be, just not what we think they are in earth terms.

I agree. they wouldnt be machines in the sense of what we understand. They wouldnt be like the Terminator . They would be a major evolution of that. Like the aforementioned Greeks had a primitive steam engine, which was a machine, but the PC sitting on the desk is also a machine. An alien machine lifeform would be that much removed again. We are machines as it is. Biological ones, that are energy inefficient and vulnerable with pretty crappy repair and redundancy systems and short working and thinking lives. If we could build a body that could house an intelligence that was better, then that would be the way to go.

We have to expand our mind and consciousness and just stop thinking about the universe from the way we see it on earth via science.

If someone can show the more esoteric stuff working and repeatedly working then it would be science. Lets say its true that these aliens you believe are opening thought wormholes and fecking around with timelines exist. OK? Well then they would have techniques to do so. A procedure that worked and was repeatable and teachable and results would be consistent. They would have to be if they were screwing with time and space or things could get very dodgy. It would not by requirement be some vague hippie dippy stuff. It would be science of the highest form. Likethe saying goes it might look like magic to us, but it would be science, so this antipathy to science one hears among the left field types is a bit daft.

What we are been taught is really wrong and ****ed up.

If you or anyone can show me or anyone else a repeatable technique that delivers consistent results and new repeatable and testable insights, then sign me up. Indeed sign science up.

Torakx

Todays modern sciences are funded by money.
Money = debt which needs to be paid back to the bankers.Every euro out there is owed back with interest.(Since we cant pay the interest on the very first euro without borrowing the second euro we are constantly in debt)
So imo science is working for debt not for itself.
When Debt is no longer a factor in scientific research and results i may start to feel more reliance on their scientific studies.
The science part is all fine.Just the people controlling it are not.

Yitzhak Rabin

Torakx wrote: »

Todays modern sciences are funded by money.
Money = debt which needs to be paid back to the bankers.Every euro out there is owed back with interest.(Since we cant pay the interest on the very first euro without borrowing the second euro we are constantly in debt)
So imo science is working for debt not for itself.
When Debt is no longer a factor in scientific research and results i may start to feel more reliance on their scientific studies.
The science part is all fine.Just the people controlling it are not.

Thats extremely oversimplified(and still doesnt negate any of the scientific theories)

Its true that the government have to borrow money at interest. But its not just super rich billionaires who are lending money and making money back off it. I mean, I can lend the government money at interest by purchasing Irish government bonds. Same goes for banks. In fact if you feel like making a bit of profit off the banks at the moment you can lend BoI money at an 11% return over 5 years. Pretty good deal, but risky.

mysterious

Wibbs wrote: »

Rare enough Im accused of that.

Ok lets accept the existence of other intellignet life... What does 3rd density physicality mean? Thoughts obey einstein just as much as the light from a torch. Thoughts are quite slow, when its a chemical signal or even electrical. Dont believe me? If I stick a needle into my toe, I'll react slower than if I stick a needle in my finger. Shorter distance in the latter. We think far far better than computers because of organisation rather than speed. While that makes vague sense, it makes no real scientific sense. Dimensions are not different frequencies. Time most certainly isnt. Interesting story, I find it hard nay impossible to believe. I'd love to know how they get around the real pain in the bum that is causality. Even if one could externally view the whole of the universe from birth to death as a single entity, you still couldnt screw with causality. The only way I could see to do same would if you had an infinite multiverse. Even then you would be creating another past not effecting the past in the timeline you started from. 2012 has more than a few issues. For a start the date may well be wrong. Secondly they didnt consider it an end of times, just a full circle of their wheel.

Atlantis shows up in just one text of Platos. No other author mentions it. I would have no difficulty believing it referred to either a race memory of an advanced civilisation or a story tacked together describing the minoan culture getting blown to bits in the thera eruption. indeed reconstructions of what is now the island of santorini fit quite well with Platos description of atlantis a ringed island with a city in the center. Plus his descriptin of the atlantan soil being made up of red earth and balck earth. Some on santorini. The minoans made the mainland greeks look like monkeys at the time, so its not a stretch. Add in stories of other islands and hyped up notions of their advancement(including this island BTW) then Plato was weaving a early greek sci fi tale of warning for his readers. Beyond some hippie channeling Atlanteans which was popular in the 60's, thats about all we know of Atlantis.

We know a bit of the Mayan belief system and it has a few crossovers with other pre columbian systems. The Egyptian systems we know very well. Their beliefs and personal writings. None of which Im aware of speak of apocolypse or 2012. They werent a very apocalyptic bunch anyway. that seems to be more an abrahamic religion thing. Certainly this focus on the end of the world. AFAIR The ancient egyptians didnt even have an end of days. Their own indigenous calender wasnt too great and they later grabbed the babylonian one, much like ourselves with its attendant issues. The mayan was a great calender. Brilliant indeed. Allows for procession and all sorts of stuff.
I agree. they wouldnt be machines in the sense of what we understand. They wouldnt be like the Terminator . They would be a major evolution of that. Like the aforementioned Greeks had a primitive steam engine, which was a machine, but the PC sitting on the desk is also a machine. An alien machine lifeform would be that much removed again. We are machines as it is. Biological ones, that are energy inefficient and vulnerable with pretty crappy repair and redundancy systems and short working and thinking lives. If we could build a body that could house an intelligence that was better, then that would be the way to go. If someone can show the more esoteric stuff working and repeatedly working then it would be science. Lets say its true that these aliens you believe are opening thought wormholes and fecking around with timelines exist. OK? Well then they would have techniques to do so. A procedure that worked and was repeatable and teachable and results would be consistent. They would have to be if they were screwing with time and space or things could get very dodgy. It would not by requirement be some vague hippie dippy stuff. It would be science of the highest form. Likethe saying goes it might look like magic to us, but it would be science, so this antipathy to science one hears among the left field types is a bit daft. If you or anyone can show me or anyone else a repeatable technique that delivers consistent results and new repeatable and testable insights, then sign me up. Indeed sign science up.

If we are to continue, you need to find out what 2012 is really about and not the mainstream crap of 2012. I've had enough of explaining myself to people about the real deal. It's NOT the end of the world. It was NEVER prophecied to be the end of the world. The Mayans DID NOT say it was the end of the world, but the end of an age. Which means a new age and the end of the old calendar. There is real complex stuff on 2012 out there and yes is even backed by science etc. Its just out in the mainstream. The mainstream is just baloney doomsday macaroni and cheese.


Thoughts make this reality. Its not slow at all. Thoughts become matter. You need to actually understand how powerful thoughts are. As I said earlier you think in very very linear terms and solely on the physical view of reality. Not everything is linear or physical in this universe. Science is not everything and science can only determine the physical existence of this universe. Period and Science will never understand anything beyond time or distance or non physical. Science can only determine and come up with logic. Creation isn't logical While logic does hold ground, but logic is simply just trying to look through a small tinted glass to view the whole universe. You can never understand and see everything with logic from the whole picture.


Intelligent life does exist, here and elsewhere, you are limiting yourself so much on this subject, to the point your stranded without science and whats been taught........

Wibbs

mysterious wrote: »

It was NEVER prophecied to be the end of the world. The Mayans DID NOT say it was the end of the world, but the end of an age. Which means a new age and the end of the old calendar.

Yep and my contention would be that this is where it begins and ended for them. No big shift of reality behind it. They reckoned there were other long counts ending in their calender so no big deal. Though their calender is a seriously elegant one, I would put little faith in their mystic angle given they reckoned the world was created a few 1000 years ago.

There is real complex stuff on 2012 out there and yes is even backed by science etc.

Links? Id be interested to see it anyway.

Thoughts make this reality.

Well I would say thoughts filter the reality based on individual perception.

Its not slow at all.

Yep it is. OK another experiment. Look at someone working on a building site. Somthing like hammering. You will see the strike before you hear it. Obviously as light travels faster than sound. Put on a blindfold. Now your reality is tenths of a second behind. If thoughts and the mind were capable of bypassing percieved reality this would not be an issue.

Thoughts become matter.

While some interesting experiments have appeared to show that the mind or the expectation of the viewer can affect an otherwise random quantum event, that if true only shows the ability to effect matter at some level(or shows a level of precognition which is even more wacky causality wise). It does not show anything like thoughts creating matter or energy for that matter. If you can show me just one repeatable experiment, even one that's only repeatable 10% of the time where someone can create matter, then cool. Hell 1% would make me sit up. You need to actually understand how powerful thoughts are.

As I said earlier you think in very very linear terms and solely on the physical view of reality. Not everything is linear or physical in this universe.

Define non linear. Define physical.

Science is not everything and science can only determine the physical existence of this universe. Period and Science will never understand anything beyond time or distance or non physical.

I never said science is "everything". Theres a lot of bad science in history and there's a lot of bad science today and there will be more in the future. I see science as a descriptive term for expanding understanding. And because of its experimental angle its the best so far.

Science can only determine and come up with logic. Creation isn't logical While logic does hold ground, but logic is simply just trying to look through a small tinted glass to view the whole universe. You can never understand and see everything with logic from the whole picture.

It depends on what you define as logic. A problem I have with many both left field types and others is the misappropriation and misunderstanding of words like logic and science and indeed the spiritual. If reality has a structure it will be by definition logical. It may be a different logic to 2+2 =4 but it will be logical.

Intelligent life does exist, here and elsewhere, you are limiting yourself so much on this subject, to the point your stranded without science and whats been taught........

Ive been taught and have taught myself quite an array of subjects and angles. Enough anyway to see problems or to ask some questions. If a scientist type tells me "oh you just dont get it or wouldnt understand, I take that in exactly the same way you appear to be telling me from another angle. Namely their theory has holes, they are railroaded or have narrowminded themsleves into an "accepted" position and "you just dont get it" simply doesnt cut the mustard for me.

Show me.

Torakx

Has anyone an explanation for those lights floating around in space? Some of them on the NASA videos appear to be responding to their enviornment or changing direction in an unatural manor.

Theres a theory that this is where the US have been getting most of there technology for back engineering U.F.O's.
Id be interested to know do people think those videos are fake or that the moving lights can be explained.
Here is a link to a documentary about them.
http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/the-secret-nasa-transmissions/

Bruthal

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Belive it or not im actually a fan of this idea, and have thought about it myself because i think your right with your line of thinking that if mankind continued to evolve and heavily rely on technology then our bodies would get smaller and brains would get bigger etc.

Put it this way, i think it holds more water than lizard people.

Evolving is normally driven by natural selection according to evolution theory. So something that started off as a slight random change but is an advantage to an animal species will gradually become more prevelant. Man might not evolve anymore because everyone survives now without the need for any new charachteristics. Maybe brains will get bigger, its an interesting one though.

studiorat

mysterious wrote: »

If we are to continue, you need to find out what 2012 is really about and not the mainstream crap of 2012. I've had enough of explaining myself to people about the real deal.

They aren't asking you to explain yourself, just explain what you are talking about.

mysterious wrote: »

It's NOT the end of the world. It was NEVER prophecied to be the end of the world. The Mayans DID NOT say it was the end of the world, but the end of an age. Which means a new age and the end of the old calendar. There is real complex stuff on 2012 out there and yes is even backed by science etc. Its just out in the mainstream.

So what's with all the earthquakes you predicted on the other thread?

mysterious wrote: »

Thoughts make this reality. Its not slow at all. Thoughts become matter. You need to actually understand how powerful thoughts are. As I said earlier you think in very very linear terms and solely on the physical view of reality. Not everything is linear or physical in this universe. Science is not everything and science can only determine the physical existence of this universe.

Who told you this then?

And how can you suggest someone can only think solely on the physical view of reality when you are discussing time. Using mathematical models we do actually think outside of time and use imaginary time, and it works quite well apparently. Imaginary time, just like imaginary numbers runs perpendicular to 'real' time.

It turns out that a mathematical model involving imaginary time predicts not only effects we have already observed but also effects we have not been able to measure yet nevertheless believe in for other reasons. So what is real and what is imaginary? Is the distinction just in our minds? -- Stephen Hawking

bonkey

mysterious wrote: »

The Mayans DID NOT say it was the end of the world, but the end of an age.

Actually, they didn't even say it was the end of an age.

The previous age ended on a given date ( 12.19.19.17.19) in their long-count calendar. The same date in the current long-count calendar falls in December 2012 (or doesn't, depending on who you ask).

The Mayans didn't predict the end of the current age on the same date, at all....its pretty-much a modern, western-world idea which has sprung from who-knows-where.

Torakx

robbie7730 wrote: »

Evolving is normally driven by natural selection according to evolution theory. So something that started off as a slight random change but is an advantage to an animal species will gradually become more prevelant. Man might not evolve anymore because everyone survives now without the need for any new charachteristics. Maybe brains will get bigger, its an interesting one though.

Or we might have a nuclear holocaust leaving the survivors living underground for thousands of years creating a society with larger dark eyes,grey skin and a higher intelligence due to the fast production of an underground system.
*takes a deep breath* Who will then go back in time and create a secret society who will try and take over the world to stop the nuclear holocaust.Which is in the year... oh well you get the idea

MadMattDog

If you rule out all the planets we know of that can't support life like ours, there are still 10,000+ that can. Not to mention there can be other forms of life, inteligent life. So it is highly likely that they are future visitors, but I would think had this happened, might they have warned us of disasters we had yet to face, or give us technology they had invented already? Its mind bogoling really...

SoulTrader

heavyballs wrote: »

DID U GET A PIC
Originally Posted by argosy2006
negative,btw this was 3 and half years ago

Well, just take the negative to a pharmacy and you've got yourself a picture:)

bonkey

MadMattDog wrote: »

If you rule out all the planets we know of that can't support life like ours, there are still 10,000+ that can.

What do you base these figures on?

Its mind bogoling really...

Flippantly,this whole thread reminded me of a recent xkcd.

Bruthal

Torakx wrote: »

Or we might have a nuclear holocaust leaving the survivors living underground for thousands of years creating a society with larger dark eyes,grey skin and a higher intelligence due to the fast production of an underground system.
*takes a deep breath* Who will then go back in time and create a secret society who will try and take over the world to stop the nuclear holocaust.Which is in the year... oh well you get the idea

Yes and probably more likely

mysterious

bonkey wrote: »

Actually, they didn't even say it was the end of an age.

The previous age ended on a given date ( 12.19.19.17.19) in their long-count calendar. The same date in the current long-count calendar falls in December 2012 (or doesn't, depending on who you ask).

The Mayans didn't predict the end of the current age on the same date, at all....its pretty-much a modern, western-world idea which has sprung from who-knows-where.

They actually did:D They probably used the word "age" in their own calandar in their own interpretation. The age of pieces is over and we are now in the age of Aquarius. We have moved half way around the equinox since 13,000 years ago. Which was the age of leo. The ages are broken down as to how we spin around our galaxy in their alignments and signs.

What they are showing is actually very self explanatory. The old calandar is up, meaning the age we have been living in. The reason we are in such upheaval and changes at the moment even connects to this whole process.

You can however try edge a few words to make it seem like something else. But this is all happening as it's supposed to. There are much more powerful things going on that is affecting our planet at this time than most can begin to fathom.

There were civilizations more advanced than we are were 13,000 years ago in terms of spiritual and awareness to higher forces in the universe. Technology, materialism, and division has actually kept us dormant and non advancing for the last 12000 years

I would also inform you that a lot of the Mayans deep documented stuff about 2012 was taken by the Vatican. Most of what we should know at this point is kept within them. So when you announce things like you think you know the facts, it's always good to recheck and realise that there is a LOT more to this then you know at this point.

Flamed Diving

Wouldn't this require a deterministic future? If so, would you accept that every action you take has already been determined, and will always be so?