Larry Murphy reported to be moving back to carlow.(MOD WARNINGS, SEE POSTS #2 AND 28)

shotgun mike

Maximilian wrote: »

You really couldn't be more wrong. Discussions like these have a strong tendency to descend into libelfests. When this thread was initially locked & referred to the legal moderators for their opinion, the recommendation was to shut it down. The mods of this forum argued to keep it open on the promise to monitor it closely, so people could have their say.

To my mind, you owe them an apology (but nobody ever admits they're wrong on the internet)

if a mod saying he is 'still alive and kicking' and issueing a warning saying someone is 'treading on thin ice' simply because someone issued an explaination why he didn't post a comment earlier (banned for calling mods Nazis I believe) - that to me is defensive and confrontational.

From what I know about libel law, and I have studied it, it would be very, very hard, nigh on impossibleto libel someone by expressing an opinion on what punishment should have been meted out, and why it is not possible to do so, under current eu and irish law.

I'd happily apologise, but i was under the impression that a mod should facilitate conversation, not both stymie it and steer it.

Maximilian

shotgun mike wrote: »

if a mod saying he is 'still alive and kicking' and issueing a warning saying someone is 'treading on thin ice' simply because someone issued an explaination why he didn't post a comment earlier (banned for calling mods Nazis I believe) - that to me is defensive and confrontational.

An issue with a particular user - nothing to do with you whatsoever. Why bother?

shotgun mike wrote: »

From what I know about libel law, and I have studied it, it would be very, very hard, nigh on impossibleto libel someone by expressing an opinion on what punishment should have been meted out, and why it is not possible to do so, under current eu and irish law.

Who said we had a problem with that kind of discussion?

shotgun mike wrote: »

I'd happily apologise, but i was under the impression that a mod should facilitate conversation, not both stymie it and steer it.

I doubt it to be honest. As for the rest, I refer you to my earlier post. It is due to the mods of this forum that this thread is still open. You're just more interested in having a go at the mods though.

Super-Rush

shotgun mike wrote: »

God forbid that a conversation actually flows, and people discuss what they want to discuss. Obviously while discussing Larry Murphy, his original sentence will come up, and people have opinions on what sentence that should be, or should be free to suggest another one - and if so, what obstacles could be in the way to that sentence.

Its been mentioned previously on this tread, but there is a shocking abuse of mod powers in this forum imo. Mods seem to be in a constant defensive, or confrontational, mode. Its not the way to run a forum. imo. I've read the charter, and like everything else, its open to intrepretation. Just because a mod doesn't like where a conversation goes, doesn't mean he has to start handing out warnings like snuff at a wake.

Where has it been mentioned? I can't see it.

If you have a problem with a moderator(s) then address it via the proper channels, not on this thread.

shotgun mike wrote: »

if a mod saying he is 'still alive and kicking' and issueing a warning saying someone is 'treading on thin ice' simply because someone issued an explaination why he didn't post a comment earlier (banned for calling mods Nazis I believe) - that to me is defensive and confrontational.

I'd happily apologise, but i was under the impression that a mod should facilitate conversation, not both stymie it and steer it.

What is said between a mod and a poster is between the mod and the poster only

Warning Number 2

Read post number 3 and post number 28 before posting in this thread.

If anyone has a problem with the guidelines set out in these posts then maybe this is not the thread for you. There are 6 mods assigned to this forum and all are available to take pm's if people have any further issues.

Failure to adhere to these warnings will result in a ban.

homerhop

Well since i seem to have stirred up a hornets nest here, I would like to state that my opinion expressed was just a personal one. It is no diferent than those of posters who suggest that the shoud be locked up for life or should be banned from every establishment, they are all personal views which is what posting on a form are about.
As for my reply to testicle, there was a wink face posted which i do believe while posting on other forums means not to be taken literally.

Fighting Irish

pure johnage wrote: »

Get over it? tell that to his family and the family of his victims.He committed sick sick crimes and should not ever be let out.

I hate to think how someone mite decide to take the law into his own hands with a few pints in thier system and yet another life could potentialy be ruined by this p.r.i.c.k.

let him rot where he is.

I'm not defending larry murphy here, but it woudln't be his fault if someone killed him and got life for doing so

shotgun mike wrote: »

God forbid that a conversation actually flows, and people discuss what they want to discuss. Obviously while discussing Larry Murphy, his original sentence will come up, and people have opinions on what sentence that should be, or should be free to suggest another one - and if so, what obstacles could be in the way to that sentence.

Its been mentioned previously on this tread, but there is a shocking abuse of mod powers in this forum imo. Mods seem to be in a constant defensive, or confrontational, mode. Its not the way to run a forum. imo. I've read the charter, and like everything else, its open to intrepretation. Just because a mod doesn't like where a conversation goes, doesn't mean he has to start handing out warnings like snuff at a wake.

If only

shotgun mike

pure johnage wrote: »

Get over it? tell that to his family and the family of his victims.He committed sick sick crimes and should not ever be let out.

I hate to think how someone mite decide to take the law into his own hands with a few pints in thier system and yet another life could potentialy be ruined by this p.r.i.c.k.

let him rot where he is.

Why would i tell anyone closely involved in these horrible crimes to get over it? they have to deal with the pain and horror of what this man did in their own way.

I was telling all the people, who my opinion feel some compulsive need to project this public persona of outrage, who jump on a bandwagon and click 'become a fan' on a facebook page, or who simply just want other people to join them in one long collective tut, to get over it.

like it or not, a man has been sentenced, and served his time. all that a lot of people here are talking about is some mob rule, or a completely subjective legal system

foggy_lad

The Gish wrote: »

As for keeping people out of pubs and clubs. That can happen. You do need a valid reason to stop someone from entering a place of business and maybe, just maybe the fact that a person entering the club or pub may cause friction an/or trouble in place is reason enough???

surely if a publican feels that some persons presence is likely to lead to a breach of the paece or any other crime then they have an obligation to keep an orderly house by removing the person(s) or barring their entry??

The Gish

So who bans the mods for taking a thread off topic?????? Just asking now. This post dosent deserve a ban.

I do understand where the mods are coming from when it comes to ensuring that the boards are maintained at a high legal standing but I have looked at numerous posts on this thread that are off topic?????

Thats why I asked the mods in a previous post to move the conversation to another thread if need be !!

ShayK1

The Gish wrote: »

So who bans the mods for taking a thread off topic?????? Just asking now. This post dosent deserve a ban.

I do understand where the mods are coming from when it comes to ensuring that the boards are maintained at a high legal standing but I have looked at numerous posts on this thread that are off topic?????

Thats why I asked the mods in a previous post to move the conversation to another thread if need be !!

This is not the place for that discussion. Use the proper channels if you wish but leave those type of posts out of this thread.

This is my final warning. If there are anymore posts in this thread about the moderating of this thread or of this forum in general I will issue a ban. Use the proper channels. Either PM a mod or Cmod or take it to the feedback forum.

stick-dan

Lads, this thread is on course to be a bandwagon thread also like them groups on facebook (which i do detest). The fact as previously said is a man was sentenced for a crime, served his time whilst exhibiting good behavior, and subsequently was left out to society a free man earlier than his original sentence had planned. I have never got why people get the idea to post their grievances online like this over such serious matters. In the past I have contacted various authorities with regard to the safety of local swans being put in danger in our parks, I've have looked up and researched into various things people were concerned about such as a poster moving to carlow who had a certain medical condition and she needed to know if appropriate services were available in carlow. These things are not just done by me and im not praising myself, but the core posters of the forum exhibit these qualities and concern for their communities frequently, recent examples being BRILLIANT people offering their services in times of need to their communities, during the snow and floods.

People should run along the same train of thought this time with their concerns. Now i'm not familiar with authorities that you could contact with this particular set of concerns but shouldn't that be what people are doing now, instead of uselessly posting up their anger here in the hope to provoke an online vigilante group to assemble. It is not going to help your communities by posting angry thoughts online, get active and do something about it. It could be debated that some of the posts here are as useless as the groups on facebook because in fairness how many people do you expect to come on here and say "i think he didn't do anything wrong". We all know he is a hated figure of society as the man must know himself so there is no need for "i hope he dies", "he should be given the death penalty" responses.This thread has degraded and is now a thread where people are provoking an online argument between the posters and the moderators over a serious legal subject. Quit this online bickering and repay the moderators efforts to keep the thread open by displaying some factual constructive conversation on the "rumoured" movements of Larry Murphy.

sorry shay didn't mean to go off topic was writing it as you posted

The Gish

I think people do appreciate the work the mods do on the forum. Well I do anyway. I was the Irish moderator on an American chat room for years and I do understand that mods have conditions to abide by.
As for usless online chat ? I think some people are using the boards to voice their concerns and opinins, and no matter how wrong you or I think they are I do believe that it is a good thing that people are voicing their opinions here and NOT on the streets.
Like you, I realise that nothing will come form this chat ONLY the fact that people are getting it off their chest and surely that is a good thing.
The boards and chat rooms alike are a usefull tool in society but they can provoke conversation. Is that a bad thing?
He done the crime and he done the time. (Some of it anyway) Do I like that he got out early? No. What can I do about it? Nothing except tell everyone here that I am not happy. Do I feel good after getting it off of my chest? Bloody sure I do.

Sully

Mod Note:

Seems that the mod warnings are being ignored so lets make this post the absolute final warning.

This topic is a touchy one, yes. This topic could bring up lots of very interesting discussions, yes. But this forum is for discussion about Carlow. Not if the death penalty should be brought in because a Carlow man raped someone. Just because Carlow is connected does not mean it should be discussed. The topic itself is questionable but is going ahead under a little stricter supervision then normal (due to the nature of the topic). If someone has a problem with the moderation or a particular post breaching the charter - report the post. Talking about anything else bar the actual topic will see bans/infractions issued and probably thread closure. Why? Because it is bringing it off topic and disrupting what should be a proper discussion.

Carlow mods and CMods will issue warnings and notices here - which is what we are supposed to do. Thats not going off topic. Some individuals are indeed on thin ice based on previous comments/issues not related to anybody but those users.

So a simple re-cap:: Problems with a post or moderation - please contact myself or the other moderators and we can work to resolve the issue if possible. Ranting about it here will see you infracted/banned. Final Warning

So... back on topics. From this point on, bans will be issued.

stick-dan

Whilst on this topic,does anyone think that this man would actually venture into the location being discussed about banning him from? I know he is a convicted rapist, but he ain't stupid, he knows people are after his blood.

And besides all of this is questionable really considering the story has to be confirmed first.

testicle

The man was convicted and served his time. He now has a clean slate with the Criminal Justice system. He can live where he likes as far as I'm concerned.

This isn't the 1800s with witch hunts, lynch mobs, and generally people taking the law into their own hands.

homerhop

stick-dan wrote: »

Whilst on this topic,does anyone think that this man would actually venture into the location being discussed about banning him from?

Animal instinct...bolt for ground you are familiar with.

Sully

testicle wrote: »

The man was convicted and served his time. He now has a clean slate with the Criminal Justice system. He can live where he likes as far as I'm concerned.

This isn't the 1800s with witch hunts, lynch mobs, and generally people taking the law into their own hands.

For once, I agree with you on this one. He has been convicted, he was punished and now he should be allowed continue with his life. If people do not respect him, then they need not speak with him and can just ignore him.

He is fully entitled to live where he wants as long as he abides by the law. Its not going to be easy. Its not going to be easy on his victim or their family either, and I feel sorry for them. But you cant just expect him to leave where is home is.

stick-dan

testicle wrote: »

The man was convicted and served his time. He now has a clean slate with the Criminal Justice system. He can live where he likes as far as I'm concerned.

This isn't the 1800s with witch hunts, lynch mobs, and generally people taking the law into their own hands.

In an ideal world that would be the case but you still often hear that criminals are viciously attacked after their release.

The Gish

While I agree in part to a criminal being released after doing his time for a crime I also believe that where a sentence has been given out that sentence should be completed fully no matter what the person did while inside to earn early release.
God love the people who were the victims of any crime. Do they get any form of early release?
Whether the crime is murder or stealing a car. You do the crime you do the time. Fully I think.

As for this particular post heading I personally dont think that early release is warranted especially in this case because of the nature of the crime and the impact on the victims and indeed the community at large.

With regards to a criminal leaving prison and returning to soceity before the end of his/her sentence, I think that an order should be set whereby the criminal must not live or venture near any know area where his or her victims were living or working. At least this would erase any potential for meeting on the street.

Over the past 10 years I have spent many weeks searching the surrounding areas of Carlow and Kildare for missing persons and to see the impact on families due to a family member going missing is heart wrenching and must be seen to half understand. Imagine what impact there would be to meet a convicted sriminal on the street as you do your weekly shopping or are attending Mass on Sunday morning !!

ShayK1

The Gish wrote: »

While I agree in part to a criminal being released after doing his time for a crime I also believe that where a sentence has been given out that sentence should be completed fully no matter what the person did while inside to earn early release.
God love the people who were the victims of any crime. Do they get any form of early release?
Whether the crime is murder or stealing a car. You do the crime you do the time. Fully I think.

As for this particular post heading I personally dont think that early release is warranted especially in this case because of the nature of the crime and the impact on the victims and indeed the community at large.

I'd completely agree with that.

The Gish wrote: »

With regards to a criminal leaving prison and returning to soceity before the end of his/her sentence, I think that an order should be set whereby the criminal must not live or venture near any know area where his or her victims were living or working. At least this would erase any potential for meeting on the street.

Not in agreement on that one though. Once the full term of a sentence is served, I guess that person is free to live whereever they please.

stick-dan

I do not know how good behaviour can apply to a rapist, it absolutely escapes me because its a contradiction. In sentences as serious as those involving rape, murder, etc good behaviour should not apply, and LM should still be inside.

On the other hand i think someone who shoplifts or cant pay their mortgage, both relating to the fact that they have no money which is frequent in this environment, good baheviour should apply to these people. It's not by choice they perform these acts, its for survival, for their families. There should be different cases.

The Gish

stick-dan wrote: »

I do not know how good behaviour can apply to a rapist, it absolutely escapes me because its a contradiction. In sentences as serious as those involving rape, murder, etc good behaviour should not apply, and LM should still be inside.

On the other hand i think someone who shoplifts or cant pay their mortgage, both relating to the fact that they have no money which is frequent in this environment, good baheviour should apply to these people. It's not by choice they perform these acts, its for survival, for their families. There should be different cases.

Couldnt agree with you more Dan. Let the punishment fit the crime and the circumstances.

Dymo

Sully wrote: »

He has been convicted, he was punished and now he should be allowed continue with his life.

What about the big white elephant that that's going to follow him around for the rest of his life and his uncooperative stance with the Gardai with their other investigations which are still ongoing. He was convicted for the of raping and attempting to murder a young woman from Carlow in 2000 and he has served his time for this but I don't believe he should be set free when he still won't give details which may help the Gardai with other unsolved cases.

Either way no matter what type of new persona he tranforms into upon his release some newspaper is going to track him down.

Villain

This is a very tricky subject to have an internet discussion about.

From my reading of Newspaper articles I won't say anything other than I would read the reports and form your own opinion one such example is:

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/bettinas-death-revives-fears-of-a-serial-killer-511118.html

Which includes the following in the article:

Investigators from Operation Trace have been involved in a detailed background investigation of Larry Murphy since his arrest and conviction. The facts reveal a confident attacker who was calculating and in control.

His detailed instructions to his victim to take off her bra and shoes; his choice of sites where he conducted the rapes; his decision to use the family car and his conversations with the woman giving his children's names, and his use of the plastic bag to smother her, drew together an image of a criminal well versed in the execution of his crime. It pointed to the likelihood that he had carried out similar attacks in the past, all the while fine-tuning his planning.

When these facts were matched to the rapist's background, Larry Murphy became a prime suspect for several outstanding missing women cases. He was a carpenter who grew up in Stratford village on the outskirts of Baltinglass, Co Wicklow. His main pastime was hunting, so he became familiar with the hinterland around Baltinglass and beyond. As a local he had access to farm land to shoot pheasants and foxes. In the late 1990s he went to work on various building sites as a freelance carpenter which took him through the midlands and the east, including Kildare and Dublin. His work gave him access to buildings and homes.

Described as a loner who always seemed to be on the periphery of a group, he was known to single out women in a social setting and fix his gaze on them.

Crucially, it was because of an earlier incident involving another woman, that the two local men who stumbled upon Murphy as he tried to murder his victim were able to identify him.

Larry Murphy was in jail when Bettina disappeared. The discovery of her body takes her murder out of the outstanding cases of missing women. Concealment of bodies is the signature of the disappearances. It stands as one of the most compelling

stick-dan

As will certain groups of people who don't want a convicted rapist living within the confines of the county. There is no point fussing around the point because people in carlow will be after his blood now if the move does indeed materialise from the rumour. I'm not advocating it at all but it happens when dangerous individuals are released. He'd have been better off to stay inside.

the_syco

homerhop wrote: »

Establishments will have a problem banning him if he is released, no different than places tryiing to ban people just because they are from the traveling community.

I don't see how. Travellers are on the list that lists what people cannot be discriminated against. Rapists are not on that list.

ShayK1 wrote: »

Not in agreement on that one though. Once the full term of a sentence is served, I guess that person is free to live whereever they please.

And the women will spend the rest of her life living in fear.

=-=

Although nearly 10 years have passed, I can see him getting "warned" to "toe the line". If he survives the "warning" or not is a totally different matter.

Cybercat

Sully wrote: »

For once, I agree with you on this one. He has been convicted, he was punished and now he should be allowed continue with his life. If people do not respect him, then they need not speak with him and can just ignore him.

He is fully entitled to live where he wants as long as he abides by the law. Its not going to be easy. Its not going to be easy on his victim or their family either, and I feel sorry for them. But you cant just expect him to leave where is home is.

A simple question for you...Would you have the same forgiving attitude if she (the girl who was raped and nearly murdered) was a relative of yours?

That woman is neither a relation or someone known to me,but I do know of Mr.Murphy through an in laws friendship with his wife.

If you think that someone that viciously rapes and tries to suffocate another human being deserves "RESPECT" since he was "PUNISHED",well that says it all for me about the type of character you are.
I genuinely believe that people like you who hide behind keyboards,pontificating like the way you did in the above post and your "warning" on the last page are utter pieces of pond life and a prime example of little man syndrome.

Or maybe you have a connection with Mr.Murphy,somehow?

The fact of the matter is that you are after coming on here as a Mod and defended a convicted rapist and, who only for the intervention of a couple of people,a potential killer.

You are nothing but a disgrace.

ShayK1

since you are new to boards and this is only your 2nd post I'll ask you to attack the post and not the poster. Calling a poster "nothing but a disgrace" will NOT be tolerated.

delonglad

Cybercat wrote: »

A simple question for you...Would you have the same forgiving attitude if she (the girl who was raped and nearly murdered) was a relative of yours?

That woman is neither a relation or someone known to me,but I do know of Mr.Murphy through an in laws friendship with his wife.

If you think that someone that viciously rapes and tries to suffocate another human being deserves "RESPECT" since he was "PUNISHED",well that says it all for me about the type of character you are.
I genuinely believe that people like you who hide behind keyboards,pontificating like the way you did in the above post and your "warning" on the last page are utter pieces of pond life and a prime example of little man syndrome.

Or maybe you have a connection with Mr.Murphy,somehow?

The fact of the matter is that you are after coming on here as a Mod and defended a convicted rapist and, who only for the intervention of a couple of people,a potential killer.

You are nothing but a disgrace.

Excellent post.. A person who carries out a ruthless crime and behaves themselves for awhile while inside to gain early release should not be given a clean slate at all, what makes them deserve it? Prison is in no way sufficient rehabilatation for a man of this mindset. As said before the law has become a joke. I feel for the victims of this mans crimes.

In my opinion he should not be let anywhere near the town where he commited his crime and I also think it is unfair that he be let rome around some other town where there is a chance he may offend again. Keep him locked up and throw away the key. He lost his rights when he crossed the line.

Thats my two cents

Funjunkie

testicle wrote: »

The man was convicted and served his time. He now has a clean slate with the Criminal Justice system. He can live where he likes as far as I'm concerned.

This isn't the 1800s with witch hunts, lynch mobs, and generally people taking the law into their own hands.

Firstly he does not have a clean slate with anyone especially the criminal justice system. He is a registered sex offender and is legally obliged to be monitored for the rest of his life.

I agree in principle that society has a responsibility to uphold Larry Murphy's human rights but the horrific truth is this man has a very very dark history.

I hastened to add this link as I think the mods could lock me up but as it is an opinion piece and this is my opinion I think legally both are not libelous.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/the-unsolved-mysteries-of-the-dark-and-lonely-dublin-mountains-137345.html

the_syco

testicle wrote: »

The man was convicted and served his time. He now has a clean slate with the Criminal Justice system. He can live where he likes as far as I'm concerned.

From http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/the-unsolved-mysteries-of-the-dark-and-lonely-dublin-mountains-137345.html

He then bundled her back into the boot and drove 14 miles into the Wicklow Mountains where he raped her again. He placed a plastic bag over her head and tied a gag around her mouth. He was in the process of strangling her when two local hunters drove down the lane. He panicked and drove off.

She is only still alive as he was caught in the act by chance. And he is now allowed to roam around. I'm sure next time he'll be more carefull about where he kill s his victims...