The OFFICIAL Dublin Marathon Pacer Thread

--amadeus--

Yep, starting early this year... Pending official blessing this is a preliminary sounding out of people who would be interested / willing to pace and the bands they would be willing to run to as well as generally raising awareness of what we want to do - basically the more people know about it the better our chances of filling all of the slots.

So why should you pace?

Speaking personally it was the single most enjoyable race experience I have ever had. The camaraderie in teh first 20 miles and the grit that the group showed in the last 6 were brilliant. I personally came away with a very different perspective on the runners who finish further down the field and the looks on the faces of people who had just broken a time target that they thought beyond them was utterly priceless. I think it says something that every single one of teh pacers that I spoke to afterwards said that they would do it again in a shot. Hopefully one or two of them will pop in here and give thier side of it because I'm struggling to explain the feel good factor that it gave!

In terms of bandings (and this is pending DCM approval) I would like to aim for:

3:00 / 3:15 / 3:30 / 3:45 / 4:00 / 4:15 / 4:30

that's seven bands and I'd like 3 runners per band with a couple of "floaters" that can be slotted in if we get drop outs, so it's a big ask. We'd be looking for similar criteria to last year - to have run at least 3 (preferably 5) marathons, to have run 30 mins faster than pace time (some wriggle room on that for sub 3 I think) and to have done so within 12 months of teh race.

Any questions, comments or queries fire away!

RacoonQueen

It's unlikely I'll be racing Dublin this year so I'll declare interest as an outsider in the 4:15 or 4:30 pace band depending on everything going my way this year training and racing wise.

Oisin11178

Did you guys pacing feel much pressure doing this at this years marathon?
Id be will to do something like this and with a pb of 3h37 id be ok for 4h15 or 4h30 according to your criteria. Say some1 was to go sub 3h30 at edinburgh would they be ok to pace 4h.
I ran with the sub 3h30 pace group this year and only for cramp id have got it. Ive got to say it made the experience way more enjoyable for me.

catweazle

Any chance any of ye would do it for me in Connemara this year

spb100

As a member of the 4.30 pacer group, I can echo the above thoughts on the impact not only on myself but other runners. It was a real pleasure to be able to give something back for a change. It was a memorable day and certainly will not be forgotten for a very long time.

Count me in please! Will be happy with 4hrs, 4.15 or 4.30.

SPB100

--amadeus--

Oisin11178 wrote: »

Did you guys pacing feel much pressure doing this at this years marathon?
Id be will to do something like this and with a pb of 3h37 id be ok for 4h15 or 4h30 according to your criteria. Say some1 was to go sub 3h30 at edinburgh would they be ok to pace 4h.
I ran with the sub 3h30 pace group this year and only for cramp id have got it. Ive got to say it made the experience way more enjoyable for me.

There was some pressure. One guy came up to me within half a mile of teh start and said that he had run three or four marathons all slightly over 4 hrs and he'd never managed to break it. All the way round he kept nattering away but by 22 he was struggling a bit. He kept saying how good it was to be paced and the idea that we might screw it up and leave him missing his target again was there. On here we talk about not letting people down but when it's an actual person (or people) it's different.

3:30 for 4:00 would be fine, looks like sub 4 will be popular!

village runner

I paced 3.30 last year and it was probaly the easiest and most enjoyable marathon that i ever ran. There was pressure but the pace was over 1 min slower than you can run so should be easy.
Would love to pace 3.15 this year but i will have to post that time in berlin. Would a sub 2.50 get me the job ? 2.45 might be out of my sight.
Put me down for 3.30 but i would love a crack at 3.15.............

--amadeus--

village runner wrote: »

I paced 3.30 last year and it was probaly the easiest and most enjoyable marathon that i ever ran. There was pressure but the pace was over 1 min slower than you can run so should be easy.
Would love to pace 3.15 this year but i will have to post that time in berlin. Would a sub 2.50 get me the job ? 2.45 might be out of my sight.
Put me down for 3.30 but i would love a crack at 3.15.............

Wasn't it you who lost your balloon at the start line last year? Not sure we'd trust you with another one

Well between Rotterdam and Berlin and last years results you'll have three sub 3's and hopefully be down at the 2:45 - 2:50 mark, as well as being an experienced pacer so I'd imagine pacing 3:15 would be within your reach. At this stage it's just "expressions of interest", we'll be sorting out the exact details in a few months, and once we get official say so.

village runner

--amadeus-- wrote: »

Wasn't it you who lost your balloon at the start line last year? Not sure we'd trust you with another one

Well between Rotterdam and Berlin and last years results you'll have three sub 3's and hopefully be down at the 2:45 - 2:50 mark, as well as being an experienced pacer so I'd imagine pacing 3:15 would be within your reach. At this stage it's just "expressions of interest", we'll be sorting out the exact details in a few months, and once we get official say so.

Balloon that was me.
I would reccommend pacing to anyone who is doing another marathon 2 months before hand. Nice to give something back.

theFinishLine

Any chance ye will be able to get the same sub three pacers back from 2009 :D- I hear that one of the boys practically raced his own marathon while carrying a balloon around. I seen pictures of him sprinting along Nassau street on his own. Not a person with him. The other fellow dropped out at 22 miles?

Sub three pacers need to be people who (1) have done enough marathons that they are not looking to set some pb or refresh an old time and (2) absolutely can finish the course with the group they are pacing.

--amadeus--

theFinishLine wrote: »

Any chance ye will be able to get the same sub three pacers back from 2009 :D- I hear that one of the boys practically raced his own marathon while carrying a balloon around. I seen pictures of him sprinting along Nassau street on his own. Not a person with him. The other fellow dropped out at 22 miles?

Sub three pacers need to be people who (1) have done enough marathons that they are not looking to set some pb or refresh an old time and (2) absolutely can finish the course with the group they are pacing.

Sub 3 wasn't perfect last year and lessons have been learned but I think that's a bit harsh.

The two sub 3 pacers were known to the DCM committee and are exceptionally fast runners with recent PBs well under 2:45. When our original two sub 3 pacers dropped out through injury the pacers who ran were approached with only a few weeks to go to the race and so didn't have as much prep time as teh rest of the crew.

On the day - as can happen to anyone - one of teh pacers injured himself. While he could have carried on running it wouldn't have been at the correct pace so he did the right thing and slowed to a walk.

The other pacer carried on and finished in 2:57:xx. That's a fraction fast - most of the other pacers finished less than 60 seconds off goal time - but to be only a couple of minutes off pace after 26 miles with so little prep is a credible performance, in my opinion. I studied teh pacers performance pretty closely afterwards and certainly didn't see *any* pacer running alone at any stage, so if you have links to those photos I'd be interested to see them as it would be very disappointing. However if people aren't able to keep pace with the pacer he can't slow down for them, can he?!

Lessons have been learned - we're looking earlier this year to allow us to recruit more people. We're hoping for three pacers per group rather than two. We'll try and brief pacers better so that they all finish within 60 seconds of goal.

But I think that slagging them off is a bit unfair.

TFBubendorfer

I won't be RACING Dublin this year and this might do as an alternative, so I'm definitely interested but can't commit fully yet - it's a bit early for that.

I have run 13 marathons (or longer) with a best of 3:05, and most recently did 3:12 in September - not quite within 12 months of this year's race, I know . I guess that should qualify me from the 3:45 group down.

Peckham

I’m a long way from deciding my autumn plans (even whether I decide to run a marathon in the autumn, however you can put me down as a potential for a 3:30 pacer (maybe even 3:15 depending on how the next few months go).

If I race Berlin then I can pace Dublin. If I decide on Amsterdam (8 days before Dublin), then it would be risky. If I decide on New York (or not to do a marathon at all), then I won’t be available for Dublin. Nice to have all these options!

Jaysus, Mrs P will kill me if she hears I’m thinking about 3 marathons in 2010!

--amadeus--

Cheers, thanks lads!

I'm not looking for firm commitments yet, just looking for a rough idea of how many people might be interested. Good to see a couple of people coming in at the 3:15 / 3:30 level as well.

And it's not really 3 marathons, you just have to be careful what you say "Yep, def only racing 2 marathons this year" isn't a lie, after all

IronTractorBoy

I agree with the previous comments about enjoying pacing once we got over the shock of the size of the balloons.

You can put me down again for the 4:30 group.

jinka

--amadeus-- wrote: »

Sub 3 wasn't perfect last year and lessons have been learned but I think that's a bit harsh.

The two sub 3 pacers were known to the DCM committee and are exceptionally fast runners with recent PBs well under 2:45. When our original two sub 3 pacers dropped out through injury the pacers who ran were approached with only a few weeks to go to the race and so didn't have as much prep time as teh rest of the crew.

On the day - as can happen to anyone - one of teh pacers injured himself. While he could have carried on running it wouldn't have been at the correct pace so he did the right thing and slowed to a walk.

The other pacer carried on and finished in 2:57:xx. That's a fraction fast - most of the other pacers finished less than 60 seconds off goal time - but to be only a couple of minutes off pace after 26 miles with so little prep is a credible performance, in my opinion. I studied teh pacers performance pretty closely afterwards and certainly didn't see *any* pacer running alone at any stage, so if you have links to those photos I'd be interested to see them as it would be very disappointing. However if people aren't able to keep pace with the pacer he can't slow down for them, can he?!

Lessons have been learned - we're looking earlier this year to allow us to recruit more people. We're hoping for three pacers per group rather than two. We'll try and brief pacers better so that they all finish within 60 seconds of goal.

But I think that slagging them off is a bit unfair.

Can you let me know where and when both pacers broke 245 recently??
One of the pacers dropped out but not through injury.
The real problem was expecting an 050 and 040 with little preperation to run sub 3 comfortably.

--amadeus--

jinka wrote: »

Can you let me know where and when both pacers broke 245 recently??
One of the pacers dropped out but not through injury.
The real problem was expecting an 050 and 040 with little preperation to run sub 3 comfortably.

I don't know the 3 hour guys personally and they were recruited directly by the DCM organisers, I'm repeating from memory what I was told at the time.

No-one is trying to claim that the pace groups last year were perfect - the thread on last years group had a lot of excellent constructive suggestions on how we can improve it. I'm now here 10 months ahead of teh race trying to get the wheels in motion to ensure that all of teh pacers this year are of a high enough standard and have enough prep time - not least because teh lessons of last years sub 3 group have been learned. To that end I want to look forward to recruiting this years Pacers in this thread rather than go over (yet again) the sub 3 groups difficulties from last year.

christeb

I'd like to provisionally be put down for the 430 group, as I'm planning to run my Autumn Marathon 8 days pre-DCM. If recovery is the same as '09 I'll be fine to pace 430.

village runner

3 in each group is a great idea.............Takes pressure of a pacer who might be having an off day........

donothoponpop

Can we keep the balloons after? If so, I'd be on for 3:30 or whatever.

Oisin11178

Probably didnt make it clear in my first post but i would like to volenteer. Id be ok for 4.15 and 4.30 as things stand.

RacoonQueen

Would it be an idea to have pacers on standby on the day in case one of the pacers begins to struggle/picks up an injury etc then a new pacer can jump in at the next aid station or at a later aid station after one pacer has been forced to pull up?

christeb

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Would it be an idea to have pacers on standby on the day in case one of the pacers begins to struggle/picks up an injury etc then a new pacer can jump in at the next aid station or at a later aid station after one pacer has been forced to pull up?

Surely with 3 pacers for each group this time around this won't be necessary. Essentially only one of each group needs to finish for it to have accomplished it's goal

Krusty_Clown

Ya can put me down for 3:30, if there's space. Hope to run a good sub 3 next year, but don't think I'll come near hitting the form to pace a 3:15.

Wally Runs

Wally, would love to Pace again this year. 4.15 or 4.30, mind you I will have to see what the year has in store for me. I missed all my targets last year by many many minutes.

theboyblunder

I think this is a great idea. I ran 3.10 last year and am planing to race longford this year so might be able to pace sub 4.00, 3.45 or 3.30 (last one if longford goes well). will know more later in the year

Oisin11178

Id love to pace the sub4 group. As amadeus said its going to be very popular. Would it not be worth looking into having maybe even 1 more in sub4 due to its popularity. I know a lot of 1st timers that ran dublin last year and sub 4 seemed to be the time the majority were going for. With the extra exposure the pacers will have due to this being the second year i reckon there will be alot more demand this year and maybe 4 pacers in this band would be no harm.
Just my thoughts on the matter anyway, feel free to ignore me:D

--amadeus--

Oisin11178 wrote: »

Id love to pace the sub4 group. As amadeus said its going to be very popular. Would it not be worth looking into having maybe even 1 more in sub4 due to its popularity. I know a lot of 1st timers that ran dublin last year and sub 4 seemed to be the time the majority were going for. With the extra exposure the pacers will have due to this being the second year i reckon there will be alot more demand this year and maybe 4 pacers in this band would be no harm.
Just my thoughts on the matter anyway, feel free to ignore me:D

No, it's a fair point - with so many good nominees there might even be grounds for 2 teams of 3 starting at different points in the pen or something. We can work out finer details as we go - better to have too many than too few!

Aggie Plod

Racoon Queen has a very good idea there. Looking at the posts there are plenty of people offering 4.30 but not many of the faster pace(not suprising since not many runners achieve this very high standard). Runners who are capable of 3.00 pacing are often still pursuing their own goals and pacing a marathon disrupts a valuable part of their training but if the fast pacers relayed ,maybe doing half marathon each it could work very well. Potentially more volunteers and more reliable pacing. Someone could be waiting at halfway timing mat with their own balloon ready to go. I suspect main obstacle could be race organisers.

Krusty_Clown

I guess part of the problem is that when you want to follow a 3 hour pacer, you want to be following someone who knows what is required to hit that goal. A runner who is capable of throwing together a 1:30 half marathon on demand in training may never hit a 3 hour marathon in their lifetime, or have the experience required to lead a team of people persuing that agenda.

I for example, could hit a 1:30 half pretty easily, but am only at a stage where I am trying to achieve a sub-3. Would I feel confident enough to lead a group of my fellow peers through the first or second half of their sub-3 goal? I think you'd still need to fall back on the 2:30-2:45 runners to pace the sub-3 groups. There's too much at risk.

--amadeus--

^ what KC said, basically.

Also teh DCM committee veto'd teh idea of people just doing half each last year

robinph

--amadeus-- wrote: »

^ what KC said, basically.

Also teh DCM committee veto'd teh idea of people just doing half each last year

But you would often find the pacers for the elites only going as far as half way in the like of London, although they would then be required to change pace as well depending on what the guys around them ask for on the way.

--amadeus--

Yea, I think the pro pacers drop out at 20 miles or something. The exact reasons for teh refusal I don't know but I do know that the question was asked. If we struggle we can always ask it again.

This is all a bit up in the air atm anyway - I've swaped emails with HW (who did all teh real graft last year anyway) about getting this off teh ground but my not being a mod complicates things a little bit. A lot harder to organise if I can't edit thread titles, stick & unstick threads, etc. Everything will hopefully be clearer in a couple of weeks.

Oisin11178

How are the volenteers lining up amedus?
Early days yet but i suppose it would be nice if you could sort this out in the next couple of months. Looking for peeps near the time is no fun for anyone id bet.

donothoponpop

--amadeus-- wrote: »

This is all a bit up in the air atm anyway - I've swaped emails with HW (who did all teh real graft last year anyway) about getting this off teh ground but my not being a mod complicates things a little bit. A lot harder to organise if I can't edit thread titles, stick & unstick threads, etc. Everything will hopefully be clearer in a couple of weeks.

You could set up a private forum room where you invite anyone who expresses interest, where you'd be in control of threads, invites, edits, etc. We did this when we organized the Bullettin' Boards WW Relay team last year, and it worked very well. You also have all relevant material and info "boxed" for use year to year, and can keep things as private as you like.

--amadeus--

Good idea on the private forum. Depending what happens on the new mod front may not be needed.

As far as how things are looking HW is going to talk to teh committee and hopefully get us a green light after which we can swing in and start some serious recruiting. Until then it's slowly, slowly, catchee monkey!

--amadeus--

Drum roll please!!

I have just had email confirmation from HW that we are all systems go for for DCM 2010!

The slightly scarier news is that the organising committee have trusted us with finding *four* pacers at the following bands; 3.00, 3.15, 3.30, 3.45, 4.00 and 4.30.

So that is a huge ask. We need 24 high quality runners, each with a minimum of 4 marathons and a recent (last twelve months) time that is a minimum of 30 minutes faster than the band you propose to pace. We have some wriggle room but I'd like to stick as closely to that set of criteria as is possible. I'm going to stand by as a sub ready to step in from 3:15 or (more realistically) 3:30 down in case we have drop outs but with 4 recruited per band we should be in good shape.

But we need to get cracking now. If you are interested then please let me know. And feel free to spread the word amongst your friends and running club mates, it really is worth it.

I'm not going to hold any of you to your earlier expressions of interest but there were 10 yes'es and 2 maybes over the last few pages breaking down as follows:

4:30 - 5
4:00 - 2
3:30 - 3

A few of you offered up for more than one band so I've allocated on what I thought was your first preference. Assuming that everyone commits then 4:30 is covered and if we get one of the 4:30 guys to step up to 4 we're almost there on that as well.

So now is the time to commit - up to now it's just been "yeah, maybe.." but if you put your name in now then the assumption is that it is a firm commitment to pace in the 2010 Dublin marathon. The committee will cover your race entry and will supply a "uniform" (singlet and shorts) to wear on the day. If you are interested then please drop me an email to pacer@flexability.ie including the following details:

- Name
- Boards ID (if applicable)
- Marathon PB
- Most recent marathon time, date and location of race
- Brief running CV (number of years running, total number of marathons, etc)
- contact info (home address, mobile number, email)
- sizing info (singlet size and waist size for shorts)

The committee have the right of veto on any application and unfortunately not everyone who applies will be selected / allocated to thier preferred pace group but I hope to accommodate as many as I can!

Any questions fire away!

Oisin11178

Good luck with the search Amadeus. Ive sent you an e-mail and would love to pace the 4h group.

RedB

This may not be the appropriate time or thread to ask but will there also be specific support threads for each paced group? These obviously needn't be hosted by the specific pacers themselves but if Boardsies are good enough to act as Official pacers then maybe there should be 'Official Boards Threads' to complement that situation. A lot of people are going to get to hear about the pacers and it might be appropriate to piggyback specific threads that they could also be guided to?
I know I'd be keen to see a specific support thread for my DCM target time when the time comes .

--amadeus--

Well anything "official" would need a mod to green light but as a user I see no reason why there wouldn't / couldn't be support threads for teh various pace bands. On the RunnersWorld website they have dedicated threads at various paces for the London marathon for example. We also have a generic "sub 3" thread on here already and for last years DCM myself and Peckham hosted a couple of mentored training threads, one for novices and one for sub 4 runners and they seemed pretty popular. They are pretty time intensive so I wasn't planning on doing it again this year but if there is enough demand I probably would. A thread per group might be overkill though - maybe one for sub 3, sub 3:30, sub 4 and sub 4:30 would cover us?

Plenty of time to worry about that yet!

--amadeus--

Slowly, slowly it all starts to come together!

We now have a brand new private forum called "Marathon Pacers" where we will be putting the pace groups together and sorting out logistics. If you want access (even if you are not a pacer and just want a nosy) then send donothoponpop a PM.

NOTE: The new forum is strictly for marathon pacing, any general marathon threads stay on the main forum

RedB

--amadeus-- wrote: »

Well anything "official" would need a mod to green light but as a user I see no reason why there wouldn't / couldn't be support threads for teh various pace bands. On the RunnersWorld website they have dedicated threads at various paces for the London marathon for example. We also have a generic "sub 3" thread on here already and for last years DCM myself and Peckham hosted a couple of mentored training threads, one for novices and one for sub 4 runners and they seemed pretty popular. They are pretty time intensive so I wasn't planning on doing it again this year but if there is enough demand I probably would. A thread per group might be overkill though - maybe one for sub 3, sub 3:30, sub 4 and sub 4:30 would cover us?

Plenty of time to worry about that yet!

Me again . I'm just wondering if the idea of support threads for various paced groups was going anywhere 'officially'? There's a few of us on here who're eyeing up the basic P+D 50M schedule for DCM10 and throwing shapes around the idea of having a thread associated with it. We're aspiring to sub 3:30 and would obviously like if there was a bit of mentoring involved rather than just blindly trying to follow the schedule or even if there was just someone here who'd throw an eye on the thread and drop a few pearls of wisdom now and again. The P+D 18 week schedule only kicks off on 21/6 which is still 6 weeks away but it might need a bit of base training for some to be able to hit it right on Day 1 :rolleyes: (e.g. me).
My initial concern about starting an unmentored thread myself is that my ambition mightn't match my current ability and that I would be unable to follow the P+D schedule fully or else wouldn't be able to run fast enough to hit my target pace i.e. I could talk the talk, etc

--amadeus--

Hmmm...

RK has already started the novices thread and it's going great guns. And at the other end the Sub 3 Support thread will probably cater for the DCM once training gets rolling.

Which leaves 3:15 / 3:30 / 3:45 and (probably) 4:00 as the pace bands uncatered for by threads. Do we need a thread for each of those? Maybe an "Improver / sub 3:30" thread might be an idea?

Does it need a mentor though? You'd need someone fairly tidy - KC would be a good candidate, Tergat if he'd be up for it. Ecoli has talked about coaching too. Off teh top of my head I would have thought any of those would be great.

Why not start the thread and ask on it for a volunteer to mentor it?

donothoponpop

There's now a general Pacers forum, where all aspects of pacing specifics are discussed. It's private, but if you send a PM to me, I will give you access. Pacing topics can still be discussed on this thread, but I'm going to unsticky it, as I think its served its purpose.

eliwallach

donothoponpop wrote: »

but I'm going to unsticky it, as I think its served its purpose.

Says he, flexing his moderator muscles :rolleyes:.

--amadeus--

Just when you thought it was safe to read about Dublin...

Ladies and Gentlemen it gives me great pleasure to introduce the provisional pace groups for DCM 2010:

Name|Pace Band|Comments
VR|3:30|Provisionally Confirmed
theboyblunder|3:45|Provisionally confirmed
SPB100|4:30|Provisionally Confirmed
Wally Runs|4:30|Provisionally Confirmed
ITB|4:30|Provisionally Confirmed
Peckham|3:30|Provisional
christeb|4:00|Provisionally Confirmed
Oisin11178|3:45|Provisionally Confirmed
KC|3:30|Provisionally Confirmed
TFBubendorfer|3:30|Provisionally Confirmed
MCOS|4:00|Provisionally Confirmed
SureWhyNot!|4:00|Provisionally confirmed
Izoard|4:30|Provisionally Confirmed


As a reminde the organisers are looking for 4 pacers per band so we are covered for 3:30 and 4:30.

Slots still open:

3.00 - 4 Slots open (1 provisionally filled)
3.15 - 4
3.30 - 0, full
3.45 - 2
4.00 - 1 (provisionally I'll fill that)
4.30 - 0

As I said in teh private forum it's been a while since these slots were allocated and a few of you have gone faster or whatever so if you want to move up or down a band give a yell. And if any of you reading this want to take the plunge and volunteer please drop me a PM with the following:

- Name
- Boards ID (if applicable)
- Marathon PB
- Most recent marathon time, date and location of race
- Brief running CV (number of years running, total number of marathons, etc)
- contact info (home address, mobile number, email)
- sizing info (singlet size and waist size for shorts)

And we'll look and see how we stand. Thanks!

Oisin11178

4 per group should be a good bit of crack. Was this just decied?
You will do well to find 4 sub 3 pacers:D

--amadeus--

Oisin11178 wrote: »

4 per group should be a good bit of crack. Was this just decied?
You will do well to find 4 sub 3 pacers:D

4 per group will be great. Not sure if we will do 2 * 2 or 4 together though, we'll decide that closer to the time. 4 sub 3 guys will be tough. Not impossible though!

Peckham

How come I've got a different status to everyone else in the list above? Not fair!

Pretty certain that I can do this - am all guns blazing for Berlin so the fitness should be there, and have dropped the pacing plans into a conversation with Mrs P.

--amadeus--

Peckham wrote: »

How come I've got a different status to everyone else in the list above? Not fair!

Pretty certain that I can do this - am all guns blazing for Berlin so the fitness should be there, and have dropped the pacing plans into a conversation with Mrs P.

Apologies P!

Right all pacers should have access to the Pacers forum, there is a thread in there on details. Can you all please check that because I need some details off you all. Thanks!

RacoonQueen

If I do Dublin as a race I'm going to get one of those leads you get for children and attach myself to Peckham. Otherwise you can keep still me in mind as backup for 4:30.