We are in a national crisis, where is our government?

P_1

OK so, most of the country is currently buried under snow or is closely resembling a free version of 7up on Ice.

We have now had two critical transport failures in getting people out of Dublin City Centre.

The country has essentially run out of material to grit the roads.

Rural areas have been without power and water.

What I want to know is where our government have been thoughout all this? In particular, where are Ministers Dempsey and Gormley, who's portfolios are responsible for dealing with these current crises?

Is it going to take some poor unfortunate to die for our government to show some leadership in this crisis, one which is certainly as serious as the banking crisis?

aurelius79

Funny story, some 70 year old woman cracked her head after slipping on some ice on the footpath yesterday. Half an hour after she's taken to hospital, the whole path is covered in grit. So yes, I believe someone will have to die before the current reactionary government takes serious action.

ninty9er

It's not majorly linked to central government. Gritting and water supplies are the business of local authorities. "Where are our councils?" is a more pertinent question where action has not been taken.

Kristopherus

All I'm seriously wondering is that it took so long for a thread like this. I too am wondering where The Gormless One is. Last time we saw him was after the Copenhagen Conference. He should be out shovelling like the rest of us. Useless Git:eek: As for Dempsey, so long as Meath is not under a metre of snow, he dose'nt give two flying fcuks:eek:. These are members of a govt that sunk 4.5 billion into Anglo Irish, yet won't provide funding for gritting of at least the majority of the roads and footpaths.

imme

ninty9er wrote: »

It's not majorly linked to central government. Gritting and water supplies are the business of local authorities. "Where are our councils?" is a more pertinent question where action has not been taken.

Does the Fianna Fáil led government not bear responsibility, what happened to leadership. Why hasn't Cowen and his ministers responsible not held a press conference, similar to the toxins in pork issue 2 years ago.
Where's Cowen???

Sand

This is not a national crisis, it is a bit of cold weather. That it is confused with a national crisis is merely a symptom of how poor and feckless our local government is.

The real national crisis is that our local government and services are incapable of planning for or dealing with a few centimeters of snow in the capital. I have some sympathy for the argument that the weather was exceptionally bad, but it was exceptionally bad back on December 19th...fast forward a couple of weeks and local government can no longer claim to be surprised given there is no expected break in the weather.

On top of the flooding prior to this there is something deeply wrong with local government in this country. Mind you, given that people elect the likes of Stroke Fahy to their county councils, maybe theyre getting what they deserve?

ninty9er

imme wrote: »

Does the Fianna Fáil led government not bear responsibility, what happened to leadership. Why hasn't Cowen and his ministers responsible not held a press conference, similar to the toxins in pork issue 2 years ago.
Where's Cowen???

Agriculture is a multi-billion €uro export industry with responsibility lying witht he department of Agriculture and Food.

Gritting and water supplies are the responsibility of city and county councils. They have new budgets as of 1 January, to spend as they wish.

As already stated, it is not a national crisis. It's snow and ice, was there a state of emergency every winter in the 50s?

sceptre

Local council issue as people have said. Some councils are better than others it seems. For almost all of you, it's a local call to ring and complain about (and to) the people you voted into your local authorities only six months ago if you're less than impressed.

Overheal

pithater1 wrote: »

OK so, most of the country is currently buried under snow or is closely resembling a free version of 7up on Ice.

We have now had two critical transport failures in getting people out of Dublin City Centre.

The country has essentially run out of material to grit the roads.

Rural areas have been without power and water.

What I want to know is where our government have been thoughout all this? In particular, where are Ministers Dempsey and Gormley, who's portfolios are responsible for dealing with these current crises?

Is it going to take some poor unfortunate to die for our government to show some leadership in this crisis, one which is certainly as serious as the banking crisis?

Rawr Katrina black people rabble rabble.

Lets hop over to the United States for the Weather:

http://www.usatoday.com/weather/storms/winter/2010-01-06-cold-snap_N.htm

There's been up to 50-60 inches of snow buildup in certain parts of the country. Florida is below freezing. There have been 4 Hypothermia deaths so far.

But you know what? While this is a bad winter on the books, this kind of weather is not uncommon in many areas. And I can't recall it being ever referred to as a National Crisis. Nor is it now. Despite being a big headline.

Cop On. Calling it a Crisis is hyperbole and another chance for dissenters to voice their frustrations at the govt. I wouldnt be a big fan dont get me wrong, but its not their damn fault is it?

P_1

Well I would consider thousands of people being forced to walk home in sub zero conditions from the center of our Capitol on two seperate occasions within one week to be a significant enough problem to merit the title of a crisis.

A significant number of people being stuck in their homes running out of water and electricity would also merit a similar title.

While the responsibility for providing water and gritting lies with local government it is clear that they are struggling with this responsibility and thus, the government should step in at this stage. Did they not do the same during the floods a few weeks ago?

Fratton Fred

when my brother in law serviced my car, he commented on the rust on the screw heads and said you can always tell a car that is from the UK because they use salt on the roads.

i presumed from this that in Ireland there was an alternative method of gritting. i didn't realise they just don't bother.

it is a local council issue though, not a central government one.

Eliot Rosewater

pithater1 wrote: »

Is it going to take some poor unfortunate to die for our government to show some leadership in this crisis, one which is certainly as serious as the banking crisis?

People have died. Brian Crowleys brother died driving to mass last week; I heard the journey to the Church from his house was less than a mile. He was in a rush, and you know with the ice. Its a very sad story.

I heard another story (unconfirmed, from Waterford City) that a girl, after being dropped home by taxi, slipped in her porch, got knocked out and died of hypothermia during the night.

So I suppose its really a question of: what do you want government to do? A lot of it is about people themselves changing their habits. No non-essential driving at all. Slow down, etc.

Kristopherus

Govts are there to provide leadership. There has'nt been an iota of leadership evident since the start of this freeze-up. As for councils having money since ist January, they will be lucky if the get notification of their 2010 allocation by the end of January.And it could be Easter before the cash is lodged to their accounts.

LoanShark

Who cares if Dublin has a bit of snow?, The North West parts of the country have been covered in snow for nearly 3 weeks!..

You cannot seriously blame Fianna Fail for the this!

It is not a national crisis,It is a cold snap in the weather that loads of other countries are going through at this present moment too!

This is a way of life that we are all going have to get used to, because it will become more frequent..

Nobody can be blamed for the preparation for this, Because it is not the norm for us to have it..Take for example Donegal Co. Co. have used a years supply of grit in three weeks..

So, for Dublin to be crying and expecting sympathy from the rest of us, Tough! Live with it! (Because that is what would be said to us for living outside of Dublin!)

Liam Byrne

Just wait until Sean Fitzpatrick or some other bwanker scheister can't drive their merc or get their helicopter off the ground; then FF will come running to rescue them.

Until then, though, the ordinary people of Ireland are on their own.

LoanShark

imme wrote: »

Why hasn't Cowen and his ministers responsible not held a press conference, similar to the toxins in pork issue 2 years ago.

Because more people eat pork than snow??

Badabing

It's up to every local council to provide the local services to the people, we had elections in june and every Labour Fine Gael Socialist etc.. said we need change at local level well we got it now they must prove it.

imme

Sand wrote: »

The real national (1) crisis is that our local government (1) and services are incapable of planning for or dealing with a few centimeters of snow in the capital. I have some sympathy for the argument that the weather was exceptionally bad, but it was exceptionally bad back on December 19th...fast forward a couple of weeks and local government can no longer claim to be surprised given there is no expected break in the weather.

On top of the flooding prior to this there is something deeply wrong with local government in this country. Mind you, given that people elect the likes of Stroke Fahy (2) to their county councils, maybe theyre getting what they deserve?

(1) you say national crisis and then you say local authorities. They're local authorities, can you ascribe a national characteristic to them, you accuse them all of being being feckless etc.
Are they all the same.

(2) you mention the calibre of person elected to local government and you say that people get what they deserve. Are you mixing up the day to day running issues of local authorities with the reserved functions of elected councillors.

Overheal

pithater1 wrote: »

Well I would consider thousands of people being forced to walk home in sub zero conditions from the center of our Capitol on two seperate occasions within one week to be a significant enough problem to merit the title of a crisis.

A significant number of people being stuck in their homes running out of water and electricity would also merit a similar title.

While the responsibility for providing water and gritting lies with local government it is clear that they are struggling with this responsibility and thus, the government should step in at this stage. Did they not do the same during the floods a few weeks ago?

Again you're bringing up facts of life for cold winter climates. Closures of airports, stranded motorists, deaths, blackouts, etc.

But again, this has never to the best of my knowledge merited National Crisis status.

2 Crises show up when you google national crisis [wiki]: Sputnik; and the Cuban Missile Crisis :rolleyes:

edit: Crisis

1.
a. A crucial or decisive point or situation; a turning point.
b. An unstable condition, as in political, social, or economic affairs, involving an impending abrupt or decisive change.
2. A sudden change in the course of a disease or fever, toward either improvement or deterioration.
3. An emotionally stressful event or traumatic change in a person's life.
4. A point in a story or drama when a conflict reaches its highest tension and must be resolved.

Sand

(1) you say national crisis and then you say local authorities. They're local authorities, can you ascribe a national characteristic to them, you accuse them all of being being feckless etc.
Are they all the same.

Tell you what - assume I put " " around the words national crisis.

(2) you mention the calibre of person elected to local government and you say that people get what they deserve. Are you mixing up the day to day running issues of local authorities with the reserved functions of elected councillors.

Im certainly not confusing the role and responsibilities of the local authorities with the functions of the elected national government.

nesf

As others have said, it's not a national crisis. Christ, people in Dublin have to walk home and they call it a national crisis? We've had people in rural areas running out of food and fuel for heating for weeks at this stage yet no mention of a crisis. I despair about some people. I really do. Having to walk home in the cold constitutes a national crisis? Heaven forbid if ye had no water for 2 weeks similar to parts of Cork this year etc.

Kristopherus

2 Crises show up when you google national crisis [wiki]: Sputnik; and the Cuban Missile Crisis


Maybe you should have used google.ie:D

imme

Sand wrote: »

Tell you what - assume I put " " around the words national crisis.



Im certainly not confusing the role and responsibilities of the local authorities with the functions of the elected national government.

I'm not sure that you answered my questions, ah well. :cool:good for you.

Overheal

nesf wrote: »

As others have said, it's not a national crisis. Christ, people in Dublin have to walk home and they call it a national crisis? We've had people in rural areas running out of food and fuel for heating for weeks at this stage yet no mention of a crisis. I despair about some people. I really do. Having to walk home in the cold constitutes a national crisis? Heaven forbid if ye had no water for 2 weeks similar to parts of Cork this year etc.

I made a habit of walking home in Ennis from school. You know. The Nylon trousers, the freezing rain? Yeah it was harsh. All 2.3 miles of it. But I wouldnt go write a congressman about it. Put it that way.

Kristopherus wrote: »

2 Crises show up when you google national crisis [wiki]: Sputnik; and the Cuban Missile Crisis

Maybe you should have used google.ie

To smaller countries small problems seem monumental [thats a joke. settle down]

ateam

This is not a national crisis.

Byron85

pithater1 wrote: »

Well I would consider thousands of people being forced to walk home in sub zero conditions from the center of our Capitol on two seperate occasions within one week to be a significant enough problem to merit the title of a crisis.

Welcome to life for the majority of people outside of the Capital. Boo hoo.

Overheal

In a similar vein, the London bus bombings in 06 would have far more property as a Crisis. Where Tens of thousands of people were left stranded. If not millions. I forget at this stage. I suppose it was the turning point/crisis that birthed mainstream Tweeting in the form of Eye Witness phone camera footage; and the instalation of Emergency Service Overrides for telecommunications...

But OK, next point I think the OP is asking: is the regulatory authority (City Planning Comittee, whomever) doing their job? Was their eventuality plan sufficient in the face of current weather and traffic conditions? Did the energy grid fail? Why did it fail and what can be done to adress that failure?

bangersandmash

LoanShark wrote: »

Who cares if Dublin has a bit of snow?, The North West parts of the country have been covered in snow for nearly 3 weeks!..

...

So, for Dublin to be crying and expecting sympathy from the rest of us, Tough! Live with it! (Because that is what would be said to us for living outside of Dublin!)

Predictable response. One poster moans about having to walk home, and suddenly the entire population of Dublin is crying and expecting sympathy

hallelujajordan

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Just wait until Sean Fitzpatrick or some other bwanker scheister can't drive their merc or get their helicopter off the ground; then FF will come running to rescue them.

Until then, though, the ordinary people of Ireland are on their own.

Yeah, cos the snow only affects 'the ordinary people' . .

I'm a member of FF (as you know) and at 4pm this afternoon 'the party' turned up on my doorstep with a snowplough, a bucket of salt and a nice hot cup of cocoa. . Feck you 'ordinary people', you're on your own !

ninty9er

hallelujajordan wrote: »

Yeah, cos the snow only affects 'the ordinary people' . .

I'm a member of FF (as you know) and at 4pm this afternoon 'the party' turned up on my doorstep with a snowplough, a bucket of salt and a nice hot cup of cocoa. . Feck you 'ordinary people', you're on your own !

I never got that memo, must have been a snow related delay with the servers in Mount Street :P. Well feck it anyway, and there was me sitting at home with my Lemsip all day. Wonder will Maurice O'Donoghue be out around Munster with the plow again tomorrow??

LoanShark

bangersandmash wrote: »

Predictable response. One poster moans about having to walk home, and suddenly the entire population of Dublin is crying and expecting sympathy

Well, RTE news and all the national papers as well as people posting on this site kinda adds fuel to the fire!