Have you ever had depression?

Lawliet

Noel2k9 wrote: »

Wow, just after reading that, and all l can say is that you sound like an amazing person for getting through all of that by yourself- you must be an incredibly strong person. It sounds as if you've tried to get over most of it and move on, which is great because your life is moving on, and so are you. Sorry if some of this is ilegible, I wrote it on my phone because I read your post on boards mobile and just had to reply.

Nah I'm not strong, I'm a bit of a crybaby tbh! I just coped as best as I could, same as anyone would and I was lucky enough that things got better.
Thanks though, it means a lot

Midnight_EG

Pygmalion wrote: »

Just read [url=http://gizmodo.com/5726667/the-agonizing-last-words-of-bill-zeller[/url]this[/url].

I simply can't bring myself to reading that after only reading the opening line

Smoking_Gun

Pygmalion wrote: »

Just read [url=http://gizmodo.com/5726667/the-agonizing-last-words-of-bill-zeller[/url]this[/url].

It's truly horrifying that a person can have such a destructive impact on another's life (as his abuser did) and walk free.:(

Piste

Vivara wrote: »

I would encourage anyone here to read either 'Doctoring the Mind' by Richard P. Bentall or 'Madness Explained' by the same author, the latter being heavier to read.

People who are wondering if people have or have not depression have fallen into the trap created by psychiatrists and drug companies.

Depression, mental illness and madness are not purely medical conditions that can be treated with drugs. To me (and to many respected psychologists and psychiatrists themselves), there is not a clear dividing line between mental health and mental illness. We all experience elements of depression in our daily lives, some more so than others. We are all vulnerable to depression.

However, depression is a very serious problem, there is no one denying that. I am however, trying to dispel the myth that one either has or does not have depression. That is rubbish. As I've said above, there is no dividing line. The very fact that people wonder whether they have depression or feel down is proof of this.

Secondly, I'd like to draw your attention to several studies regarding the effectiveness of medication vs. counselling or psychotherapy. Surely people must realise that the reason they are depressed is almost always due to something that has happened in their lives, whether they are aware of it or not.

Using medication is simply treating the symptoms, and not the cause. While people are on drugs such as Paxil and Prozac, there is no doubt that there is huge evidence of their effectiveness. However, there is also considerable evidence to show that psychotherapeutic methods such as cognitive behavioural therapy (CBT) are just as effective. In fact, in a study by DeRubeis and others, it was shown that CBT was considerably more effective once treatment was stopped.

In 2005, during a study of 240 patients they reported that cognitive therapy worked as well as a Paxil for moderate to severe depression. (Note the severe.) At eight weeks, the response rate was very similar at around 50%, with Paxil having a slightly, although marginally, lower percentage. But by 16 weeks, 58% of patients in both treatment groups were feeling better.

This is where it gets interesting. Twelve months later, the patiests who had finished after just 16 weeks of the cognitive therapy also had an identical relapse rate as the people who were still on the drug after twelve months.

The people who stopped taking Paxil after the 16 weeks were then compared to those who had also stopped cognitive therapy. Guess what? Those who had the 16 weeks of the drug had a relapse rate twice as high as those who had just 16 weeks of the cognitive therapy.

So basically, taking drugs by themselves will not help you unless you plan to be on them for the rest of your life. Just sixteen weeks of psychotherapy is twice as effective as sixteen weeks of drugs, while being much cheaper. If you want the same effect as the 16 weeks of therapy with antidepressants, you have to stay on the drug forever.

I'm sure many people on this forum are unaware of these facts. Given the really tough times we're in, many people simply cannot afford to spend tens or hundreds on medication when all they need to do is talk to someone who is suitably qualified, especially when drugs are considerably less effective and much more expensive in the long run.

Even though I've attempted to quote my post like an academic paper and actually mentioned the studies showing evidence for what I'm saying, I know that there will no doubt be people who somehow disagree with me. I would encourage anyone who does to read the books I've mentioned, or even Google similar studies — there are so many of them with many of the common antidepressants that people have mentioned in this thread.

Regards,
Ed.


EDIT: Just said I'd include the name of another study for people to look at. It's a longitudinal follow-up study by Moncrieff and Kirsch, also from 2005. To just take a quote from it:



If you didn't catch that, those not prescribed the drugs had a slighty better outcome than those who were prescribed antidepressants. I — being the sceptic that I am — would expect people to have even a small chance of a better outcome for all their time on the medication, but to find out that people actual had a worse outcome is scary.

It's nice to see someone referencing claims for a change!

Just on your point about mental health not being purely medical, I agree with that, but there are some cases where CBT and counselling just isn't enough because there are neurochemical imbalances in the brain. Schizophrenia is one that comes to mind. Anti-psychotics and sedatives are needed in this case as it's not a condition that will respons to purely CBT and other forms of therapy. To truly tackle severe mental illness with a biological basis a pharmacological as well as therapeutic approach is needed.

Pigwidgeon

Pygmalion wrote: »

Just read [url=http://gizmodo.com/5726667/the-agonizing-last-words-of-bill-zeller[/url]this[/url].

Wow that's awful. Some of the comments underneath are just awful.

Pigwidgeon

Just doing some study for my psychopharmacology exam and I found some interesting statistics in my notes.

- In 2009 in Ireland, there were 10,000 suicide attempts.
- World-wide, more people suffer from mental illnesses than cancer
- Depression is the 2nd most widespread illness in the Western World.

So going by those statistics, I cannot understand the taboo in Ireland surrounding depression. Obviously we are much better than we used to, but with statistics like that, we are miles away from where we should be.

If I find any more interesting ones in my notes I'll post them up too.

Seren_

kateos2 wrote: »

- World-wide, more people suffer from mental illnesses than cancer

That's unreal.

As you say Kate, I can't believe there is such a taboo around mental illness in this country when you take facts like that into consideration. The old adage that everyone has been affected by cancer at some stage (whether it be themselves/a family member/friend) should obviously be true for mental illness then too, but there is nowhere as much publicity

One thing I dislike, which I have mentioned in previous threads, is the labeling of depression as an illness or a disease, that could possibly account for some of the stigma/taboos that surround it?

Seren_

Deleted User wrote: »

One thing I dislike, which I have mentioned in previous threads, is the labeling of depression as an illness or a disease, that could possibly account for some of the stigma/taboos that surround it?

I get what you're saying, but that's something I'm a bit conflicted on. I think that if depression wasn't seen as an illness, it wouldn't be taken as seriously by some people (just going from my personal experience here, and how my parents reacted - the fact that they thought of it as me having an illness made them take it more seriously than if they saw it as a case of me just feeling "sad").

However, marking depression as not being an illness could make some people admit to it more freely, as it may make them less embarrassed about it. If depression is an illness, admitting to having it may make them feel weak.

Lawliet

Your Text Here wrote: »

However, marking depression as not being an illness could make some people admit to it more freely, as it may make them less embarrassed about it. If depression is an illness, admitting to having it may make them feel weak.

Going on my own person experience here, I would think the opposite would be true. It isn't taboo to get an illness, you might not go around shouting from the roof tops that you were sick, but you wouldn't be ashamed of it, you wouldn't try to hide it from everyone close to you and resist treatment.

People know that when they get an illness it's not their fault, however a lot of people who suffer from depression think it is their fault. I think having it defined as a mental illness allows people to draw a line under it and accept that there's nothing with them as a person, this is just an illness they have that needs to be dealt with.

KnifeWRENCH

I think everyone should read this book if they get a chance:



It's called "I Had a Black Dog" and it's by Matthew Johnstone, who himself has been a sufferer of depression. It's so simple yet really powerful, and says a lot more with a few simple sentences and illustrations than most 'self-help' books ever manage.

The author has a blog aswell: http://ihadablackdog.blogspot.com/

flyswatter

Might as well bump this to see how everyone's getting along.

I'm doing pretty good these days.

I'll explain more later.

Seren_

So am I actually! A lot different from this time last year. Just goes to show that it does get better, no matter how much you think it won't.

amacachi

Out of interest can I ask what age people who are feeling better now are and if they think any treatment they may have had helped?

sara_q

My sister suffers from depression, she just gets "down" from time to time...it came to a head this time when we found out she hadn't returned to college after christmas. She's 21, and its been on and off since she's about 14. Now she is taking medication, a v mild dose apparently and honestly I think its really helped. So people if you're suffering get help, its there and she says now she just feels "normal" like everyone else.

flyswatter

amacachi wrote: »

Out of interest can I ask what age people who are feeling better now are and if they think any treatment they may have had helped?

21. I had a broad illness which was psychotic mainly. The meds were important of course but I was lucky to have fantastic treatment and therapy.

Even then though that wouldn't have been enough without my own self input.

I've lost 2.5 stone I'd say in 3 months. Kind of varies depending on the exercise I do. I think my BMI is grand for my height (6'2 ish). I'm not a lanky guy, broad shouldered, blocky. I used to play rugby in school as a prop (Hate that position!) Backrow FTW!

I'll probably try some marathon or cycling a lot over the summer.

And yeah, I'll start a blog soon. I'll give the fitness a mention definitely. I'm a bit obsessed with that at the moment.

I had to work hard to get to this stage. Pure tenacity really. I'm very driven.

Seren_

amacachi wrote: »

Out of interest can I ask what age people who are feeling better now are and if they think any treatment they may have had helped?

Yeah, there's no way I'd still be here if it wasn't for the treatment I've gotten over the past 18 months. I think a combination of an anti-depressant and therapy works well; one helps the other. When I was at my worst I used to be in the counsellor's office every day just to make sure I hadn't done anything - I would just sit there for the hour crying more often than not. You need the anti-depressant to get your mood up enough to be even able to talk about what's wrong. But there's absolutely no use in going on meds if you're not going to work on the reasons why you're feeling down.

That's all just my own experience though - everyone's different. Something that might work brilliantly for one person could be awful for another. I'm 21.

Konata

I'm also doing a lot better I still struggle with my eating disorders and the warped thinking that comes with them from time to time but I haven't self harmed since last September so that's awesome! I'm reading again and doing an evening course so my concentration has massively improved. I'm doing bits of exercise aswell but still need to improve on that.

The main thing is I don't spend all day in bed anymore, I have a fairly regular sleeping pattern, I can leave my house without having panic attacks and I don't feel like I'm missing out on everything in life anymore.

I'm still on a fairly high dose of anti depressants but I'm cool with that. I need to stay stabilised for longer before they can be reduced. I'd be nowhere without the therapy I got or without the help of my family and friends. It's been a loooooooooooooooooong road and I'm not there yet but I'm closer than I ever have been. And fingers crossed for college in September - third time lucky I say!

EDIT: Oh, and I'm 21 too. Been suffering from some form of mental illness since I was about 13.

flyswatter

That's great that you're doing well Konata.

I had a panic attack a few weeks ago. First time in ages to be honest. They were all psychosis related.

I'm in the post psychotic comedown stage at the moment.

Everything was so much easier to deal with the medication. I'm not going on any again though.

I couldn't help staying in bed before although I would make a real effort to get up to go to the airport.

Thank feck I exercised and got out there to be honest cos I was eating too much in hospital.

My mind races a good bit. I'm fine though when I'm not tired.

I think my friends would be shocked if I told them I had a serious mental illness.

The topic of Schizophrenia comes up the odd time, kind of joking sometimes and serious. Kind of awkward. People don't understand it.

Do you have Bipolar Konata?

Konata

No, just severe depression. But also anorexia, bulimia and self harm at various points. The term "Borderline Personality Disorder" has been mentioned to me - it kinda encompasses and explains everything.

flyswatter

Konata wrote: »

No, just severe depression. But also anorexia, bulimia and self harm at various points. The term "Borderline Personality Disorder" has been mentioned to me - it kinda encompasses and explains everything.

Clinical depression yeah? I was friends with a guy who had that.

He was doing his best to work and do stuff but he was so depressed he couldn't get out of bed at home.

What did you do to make yourself sick?

degausserxo

Jaysus, think it was late May the last time I posted in this thread, so I may aswell give yous an update! (possible trigger warning for some of you, by the way.. bit bleak-sounding at first, but it gets better, promise!)

After being hospitalized last May, things really went downhill for me. Couldn't be left alone, couldn't go out by myself, had to be babysat all the time incase anything happened. My parents cancelled a three month holiday to look after me, but the guilt hit after a while and I begged them to go to Spain (they've an apartment there) for even a couple of weeks. It was around that time that I was pretty much drunk the entire day, just sitting in my room, or completely out of it on pills. Self harm was at an all time high. Hit the lowest point of my eating disorder (very recently diagnosed with bulimia, more on that in a while), was going five or six days without eating and vomiting seven or eight times a day to the point of blood. Lost a fair bit of weight, but I'd put on a LOT in previous months, so I was still fairly chub.

I had a psychiatrist's appointment in June. By that point I was taking a lot of different painkillers and sedatives, and turned up to the appointment pretty trashed. I was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder that day, was given a leaflet for Pieta House for the whole self harm bit, and sent on my merry way. I was told that under no circumstances was I to go back to school or college for at least a year. Got home, convinced that there was nothing wrong with me, ripped the leaflet into tiny pieces, threw out all of my medication. That night (I don't remember much, weirdly enough though I can recall exactly what and how much I took) I tried to kill myself. Don't remember much about being in hospital. I was out cold for two days. When I woke, I was still high as a kite, pulled wires and things out of my arms, pulled out the catheter. I was let out after a while anyway, and started going to Pieta House.

Bit anxious at first going there obviously, didn't know what to expect, but I am so, so glad that I went. Things went pretty smoothly until August. I physically fought someone in the street because I thought that they were after me. One night in particular, I was extremely suspicious and paranoid of my brother. Kept pushing and pushing at him to start a physical fight, and eventually I did. Ended up throwing hot water over him and burning his face. We haven't spoken since then, even though we still live together. Ended up purposely injuring myself pretty badly. That night, while pacing around the living room while my mam and sister were there, I began to hallucinate again, convinced that I saw two men in the garden trying to get in to get me. Sent to the hospital again. Injuries were stitched up, given more assessments, sent home after a day when I was out of it. Grand. Early September rolls around, and another attempt at my life. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder. That's where it ends.

I can honestly say that I would not be here if it weren't for Pieta House. I've kicked a ten year self harm problem with their help, and haven't engaged in it since October. Since that September I've been on mood stabilizers which have worked wonders in that I'm not aggressive or manic, or at least I haven't been for a good while now. Recently though, my concentration has been completely shattered (it's taken me quite a while to write this, actually), among other things, and my doctor thinks that it might be a relapse, although I'm not entirely sure. I've been put up to the max dose of my particular antidepressant though, just in case. The eating problem has recently come to a head, too, only because I'm terrified for my health - my stomach just does not work anymore. It flat out won't digest anything. My heartbeat is irregular. I've to get a bunch of tests done soon. But it's onwards and upwards from here. I'm hopefully returning to school this September; a fresh start is DEFINITELY in order. It's gonna be hard to get completely healthy again, by my god it'll be worth it.

flyswatter

degausserxo wrote: »

Jaysus, think it was late May the last time I posted in this thread, so I may aswell give yous an update! (possible trigger warning for some of you, by the way.. bit bleak-sounding at first, but it gets better, promise!)

After being hospitalized last May, things really went downhill for me. Couldn't be left alone, couldn't go out by myself, had to be babysat all the time incase anything happened. My parents cancelled a three month holiday to look after me, but the guilt hit after a while and I begged them to go to Spain (they've an apartment there) for even a couple of weeks. It was around that time that I was pretty much drunk the entire day, just sitting in my room, or completely out of it on pills. Self harm was at an all time high. Hit the lowest point of my eating disorder (very recently diagnosed with bulimia, more on that in a while), was going five or six days without eating and vomiting seven or eight times a day to the point of blood. Lost a fair bit of weight, but I'd put on a LOT in previous months, so I was still fairly chub.

I had a psychiatrist's appointment in June. By that point I was taking a lot of different painkillers and sedatives, and turned up to the appointment pretty trashed. I was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder that day, was given a leaflet for Pieta House for the whole self harm bit, and sent on my merry way. I was told that under no circumstances was I to go back to school or college for at least a year. Got home, convinced that there was nothing wrong with me, ripped the leaflet into tiny pieces, threw out all of my medication. That night (I don't remember much, weirdly enough though I can recall exactly what and how much I took) I tried to kill myself. Don't remember much about being in hospital. I was out cold for two days. When I woke, I was still high as a kite, pulled wires and things out of my arms, pulled out the catheter. I was let out after a while anyway, and started going to Pieta House.

Bit anxious at first going there obviously, didn't know what to expect, but I am so, so glad that I went. Things went pretty smoothly until August. I physically fought someone in the street because I thought that they were after me. One night in particular, I was extremely suspicious and paranoid of my brother. Kept pushing and pushing at him to start a physical fight, and eventually I did. Ended up throwing hot water over him and burning his face. We haven't spoken since then, even though we still live together. Ended up purposely injuring myself pretty badly. That night, while pacing around the living room while my mam and sister were there, I began to hallucinate again, convinced that I saw two men in the garden trying to get in to get me. Sent to the hospital again. Injuries were stitched up, given more assessments, sent home after a day when I was out of it. Grand. Early September rolls around, and another attempt at my life. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder. That's where it ends.

I can honestly say that I would not be here if it weren't for Pieta House. I've kicked a ten year self harm problem with their help, and haven't engaged in it since October. Since that September I've been on mood stabilizers which have worked wonders in that I'm not aggressive or manic, or at least I haven't been for a good while now. Recently though, my concentration has been completely shattered (it's taken me quite a while to write this, actually), among other things, and my doctor thinks that it might be a relapse, although I'm not entirely sure. I've been put up to the max dose of my particular antidepressant though, just in case. The eating problem has recently come to a head, too, only because I'm terrified for my health - my stomach just does not work anymore. It flat out won't digest anything. My heartbeat is irregular. I've to get a bunch of tests done soon. But it's onwards and upwards from here. I'm hopefully returning to school this September; a fresh start is DEFINITELY in order. It's gonna be hard to get completely healthy again, by my god it'll be worth it.

Sounds terrible. What were you diagnosed with? I convinced my parents to go away to Spain but my brother was at home so it was ok. They would have stayed if the doctor told them I was at risk. They took precautions though like leaving doors unlocked etc.

Have you heard of Clozapine? I wish I was put on it to be honest.

degausserxo

I was initially diagnosed with borderline personality disorder, but they topped it up with bipolar disorder. Apparently the two occur together quite a bit and are quite similar.. or something. I think a family member of mine was on clozapine actually. Why do you wish you were on it?

jumpguy

Best of luck degausser, I'm rooting for you to make a full recovery!

flyswatter

degausserxo wrote: »

I was initially diagnosed with borderline personality disorder, but they topped it up with bipolar disorder. Apparently the two occur together quite a bit and are quite similar.. or something. I think a family member of mine was on clozapine actually. Why do you wish you were on it?

If my blood type was right it completely clears up psychosis.

I was OCD first, obsessive thoughts, I was always on anti pyschotics and my GP knew that I was more than OCD from the start.

degausserxo

Danke schoen (:

vampire of kilmainham

KnifeWRENCH wrote: »

Yes, I have. It's not fun.
In my case it was only "mild" depression, so I can't even begin to imagine what serious depression is like. Have been prescribed Lexapro since November; it's only in the last few weeks that I've felt any noticeable improvement though.

It's a good topic to discuss; depression is one of things that has an unnecessary stigma attached to it. I understand people who have or who have had it may be reluctant to admit to it to people but personally I've no problem being honest and open about it. It's absolutely nothing to be ashamed of.

same here i have no problem telling people about my depression

flyswatter

vampire of kilmainham wrote: »

same here i have no problem telling people about my depression

Fair play, that's the spirit!

jumpguy

Actually heard an ad on radio today questioning why suicide is such a taboo topic, I was kinda busy at the time of it and didn't pay much attention, assumedly it's government-sponsored somehow. Was good to see that, finally, encouragement of a change of attitude to mental health issues are actually gaining proper momentum.