The offical TNA thread - News, Spoilers and the rest...

waltersobchak · 13-07-2010 11:16pm

This is literally the first thing i though Jeff looks like..

D2D · 13-07-2010 11:23pm

waltersobchak wrote: »

This is literally the first thing i though Jeff looks like..

Great, now I've the spider pig song in my head

jaykhunter · 13-07-2010 11:47pm

waltersobchak wrote: »

The things is how much do they need to do to either break even or turn a profit?

I read/think the going rate for breaking even on PPV is ~20,000 buys. After that it's all sweet, sweet profit.

It's painfully obvious that TNA book for their TV, not their PPV; hell most of their plot points and build is for TV shows! Although Victory Road bucked the trend; in general it's the case where free TV is much better than PPV (last month's Slammiversary was inferior to the following iMPACT). TNA are pretty much in the business of catering only for their TV and foregoing PPVs, but for some reason are doing them every month still, despite them losing (a ton of) cash each month

Pride can be costly

jaykhunter · 13-07-2010 11:47pm

Dare_2_defy wrote: »

Great, now I've the spider pig song in my head

great, now that song's in my head!

DM_7 · 13-07-2010 11:50pm

jaykhunter wrote: »

great, now that song's in my head!

+1

D2D · 13-07-2010 11:52pm

Thanks Walter, 1 song 3 people:mad::mad:

waltersobchak · 13-07-2010 11:52pm

jaykhunter wrote: »

I read/think the going rate for breaking even on PPV is ~20,000 buys. After that it's all sweet, sweet profit.

It's painfully obvious that TNA book for their TV, not their PPV; hell most of their plot points and build is for TV shows! Although Victory Road bucked the trend; in general it's the case where free TV is much better than PPV (last month's Slammiversary was inferior to the following iMPACT). TNA are pretty much in the business of catering only for their PPVs and foregoing PPVs, but for some reason are doing them every month still, despite them losing (a ton of) cash each month Pride can be costly

Is 20,000 for when they run outside the iMPACT Zone? Because id image the cost of those huge arena would be massive.. But i'd definitely imagine saving face but losing profit can only last for so long, im surprised they dont do what Jim Crockett Promotions used to do with their huge Clash of the Champions specials on the TBS Superstation in the 80s..

Spider pig Spider pig, looks like Jeff Hardy.. But hes a pig..

DM_7 · 13-07-2010 11:57pm

waltersobchak wrote: »

Spider pig Spider pig, looks like Jeff Hardy.. But hes a pig..

:eek::mad::D

jaykhunter · 14-07-2010 12:21am

Yep, costs are much larger for running PPVs outside of the impact zone, that's why only a few per year will be outside Orlando (probably none more this year until Bound For Glory) but yes definitely, hopefully TNA stop haemorrhaging cash in their PPV stream and get a deal with Spike to run 3-hour supershows every other month, dropping to 6 PPVs/year.

PPVs are really expensive to air, in that the cost of actually putting one on needs at the very least 15,000. Being live is pretty expensive.

I believe TNA only does 12 PPVs/year because of two things :
1) WWE have (at least) 12/year (and they wanna be just like WWE)
2) They've been doing 12/year for the last.....~6 years (and so pride gets in the way)

As an aside, ROH do internet PPVs, which is much, much cheaper to air live.

Vince135792003 · 14-07-2010 12:33am

jaykhunter wrote: »

Yep, costs are much larger for running PPVs outside of the impact zone, that's why only a few per year will be outside Orlando (probably none more this year until Bound For Glory) but yes definitely, hopefully TNA stop haemorrhaging cash in their PPV stream and get a deal with Spike to run 3-hour supershows every other month, dropping to 6 PPVs/year.

PPVs are really expensive to air, in that the cost of actually putting one on needs at the very least 15,000. Being live is pretty expensive.

I believe TNA only does 12 PPVs/year because of two things :
1) WWE have (at least) 12/year (and they wanna be just like WWE)
2) They've been doing 12/year for the last.....~6 years (and so pride gets in the way)

As an aside, ROH do internet PPVs, which is much, much cheaper to air live.

If you get it right though, ppv as a revenue stream is one of if not the most profitable revenue stream a wrestling company can have.

jaykhunter · 14-07-2010 12:39am

Vince135792003 wrote: »

If you get it right though, ppv as a revenue stream is one of if not the most profitable revenue stream a wrestling company can have.

Definitely, take a look!!

Top 10 PPV buy rates (Domestic) 2009

1. UFC 100: Brock Lesnar vs. Frank Mir, July 11, 1.6 million

2. Boxing: Manny Pacquiao vs. Miguel Cotto, Nov. 14, 1.25 million

3. Boxing: Floyd Mayweather Jr. vs. Juan Manuel Marquez, Sept. 19, 1.05 millon

4. UFC 94: Georges St. Pierre vs. B.J. Penn, Jan. 31, 920,000 buys

5. UFC 101: Penn vs. Kenny Florian/Anderson Silva vs. Forrest Griffin, Aug. 8, 850,000

6. Boxing: Pacquiao vs. Ricky Hatton, May 2, 825,000

7t. UFC 107: Penn vs. Diego Sanchez, Dec. 12, 650,000

7t. UFC 97: Silva vs. Thales Leites/Chuck Liddell vs. Mauricio Rua, April 18, 650,000

9. UFC 99: Lyoto Machida vs. Rashad Evans/Matt Hughes vs. Matt Serra, May 23, 635,000

10. Wrestling: WWE WrestleMania 25, April 5, 582,000 buys

Vince135792003 · 14-07-2010 12:49am

To me both WWE and TNA have almost stopped trying to push ppvs. It's only in Wrestlemania season that WWE typically promote well now.

WWE are on a gimmick ppv kick and TNA give too much away on their tv shows causing their ppv buy rates to be at all time low (apparently their last 2 shows did less than ten thousand according to the observer show today which is farcical).

Although the market is alot harder now with UFC every month, I don't think either should give up. If you give the people what they want, they'll buy it (Angle/Joe in the cage as an example).

In some ways though, WWE have more work to do. Having 2 main belts is a challenge but when you don't emphasise them as something special, it makes pushing a 50 dollar ppv a hard task.

D2D · 14-07-2010 10:09pm

Tommy Dreamer suffered a torn MCL during the Impact taping on Monday that for the episode that will air tomorrow.

On his twitter account at twitter.com/thetommydreamer, Dreamer wrote, "I did tear my MCL in knee Monday night. I must keep my no surgery streak alive. Need brace, tape, gum, and peanut butter to keep it together."

And the ECW Invasion gets off to a great start

Machismo Fan · 15-07-2010 7:08pm

AJ Styles topped the PWI 500 this year. As useless as PWI is, AJ has had a very good year.

Vince135792003 · 15-07-2010 7:55pm

Machismo Fan wrote: »

AJ Styles topped the PWI 500 this year. As useless as PWI is, AJ has had a very good year.

Who was number 500?

Machismo Fan · 15-07-2010 8:00pm

Vince135792003 wrote: »

Who was number 500?

I'm not sure is it even out yet so I don't know but it's been revealed that AJ is No. 1.

starviewadams · 15-07-2010 8:01pm

Machismo Fan wrote: »

AJ Styles topped the PWI 500 this year. As useless as PWI is, AJ has had a very good year.

Being embarrassingly re-invented as Ric Flair no.2 counts as a good year??

Machismo Fan · 15-07-2010 8:11pm

starviewadams wrote: »

Being embarrassingly re-invented as Ric Flair no.2 counts as a good year??

AJ's had a year of very strong matches and his ability as a heel has managed to make that character work as best it can.

D2D · 15-07-2010 8:16pm

waltersobchak · 15-07-2010 8:23pm

Shocked its not been given to Orton or Sheamus as they've both had stellar years, AJ on the otherhand hasnt..

jaykhunter · 15-07-2010 8:36pm

Machismo Fan wrote: »

AJ Styles topped the PWI 500 this year. As useless as PWI is, AJ has had a very good year.

That's an incredibly accurate statement! :pac: Regardless of PWI being an ignorant kayfabe magazine, congratulations AJ Styles!

jaykhunter · 15-07-2010 8:43pm

waltersobchak wrote: »

Shocked its not been given to Orton or Sheamus as they've both had stellar years, AJ on the otherhand hasnt..

Well PWI are kayfabe so they take win-loss records into serious consideration, not quality of in-ring matches or mic work. Triple H was #1 last year!!!

The fact that AJ styles has not been reduced to curtain jerker with that awful Flair Halloween costume is nothing short of phenomenal. And his heel mic work has improved a lot. Towards the end of last year Russo let AJ shine; in that triple threat and then singles late last year. From an in-ring perspective Orton and Sheamus don't come close, in my opinion.

Machismo Fan · 15-07-2010 8:55pm

waltersobchak wrote: »

Shocked its not been given to Orton or Sheamus as they've both had stellar years, AJ on the otherhand hasnt..

How in any way has Sheamus had a better year than AJ? Sheamus has went from one mediocre feud to another, had a bunch of matches ranging from decent to mind numbingly boring and won nearly every match he's won by DQ. AJ strung together the best consecutive PPV main events in TNA history, had a good reign as champ and managed to keep some amount of credibility and legitimacy despite a shocking character.

waltersobchak · 15-07-2010 9:09pm

Machismo Fan wrote: »

How in any way has Sheamus had a better year than AJ? Sheamus has went from one mediocre feud to another, had a bunch of matches ranging from decent to mind numbingly boring and won nearly every match he's won by DQ. AJ strung together the best consecutive PPV main events in TNA history, had a good reign as champ and managed to keep some amount of credibility and legitimacy despite a shocking character.

Yeah but Sheamus has Main Evented PPV's seen by more than 7,000 people..

DM_7 · 15-07-2010 9:10pm

waltersobchak wrote: »

Yeah but he's Main Evented PPV's seen by more than 7,000 people..

I was waiting for that!

Machismo Fan · 15-07-2010 9:12pm

waltersobchak wrote: »

Yeah but Sheamus has Main Evented PPV's seen by more than 7,000 people..

So by that standard no ROH wrestler should be anywhere near the list. Don't be ridiculous. :rolleyes: I'd much rather you establish a proper reason for Sheamus being top that list but then again you can't because it can't be justified.

Vince135792003 · 15-07-2010 9:17pm

Any list is always subjective but the PWI list is not worth even arguing about.

waltersobchak · 15-07-2010 9:29pm

Machismo Fan wrote: »

So by that standard no ROH wrestler should be anywhere near the list. Don't be ridiculous. :rolleyes: I'd much rather you establish a proper reason for Sheamus being top that list but then again you can't because it can't be justified.

The guy has had an AWESOME year, you cant deny that,he is a 2 time Champion, and has only been pinned twice on PPV(once being the Elimination Chamber) and his the first wrestler in a very long time to break into the stagnant Raw Main Event scene, is the first wrestler since Lesnar to asscend the WWE ladder that high, that quickly..

Orton, doesnt need explaining the guy has had an incrdible year..

Whereas why does someone whos slipped from TNA's main event to mid card mediocrity and has lost every bit of credibility with the casual fans with this Flair gimmick deserve to be the top of the 500 list? Kayfabe or not, he doesnt in my honest opinion.

Machismo Fan · 15-07-2010 9:46pm

waltersobchak wrote: »

The guy has had an AWESOME year, you cant deny that,he is a 2 time Champion, and has only been pinned twice on PPV(once being the Elimination Chamber) and his the first wrestler in a very long time to break into the stagnant Raw Main Event scene, is the first wrestler since Lesnar to asscend the WWE ladder that high, that quickly..

I'm sorry but boring feuds with Goldust and Benjamin and a squash of Jamie Noble was about half of the last year for him. This was followed by a WWE Title win because he licked up to HHH and he's barely won a match clean in the last year (not even on house shows). That in no way constitutes an 'awesome' year in my book. Just that WWE pushed him does not mean he's deserved nor backed it up since. Hell, I don't even know where you're coming from with Orton - he's done very little in the last year except bury Kofi.

jaykhunter · 15-07-2010 11:10pm

Walter, you're completely entitled to your opinion, that's fair enough, I think it's awesome you think so highly of Sheamus!

Can you list off a few matches and promos that Sheamus has done for you to think he's the best in the world right now?

Same with Orton?

Vince135792003 wrote: »

Any list is always subjective but the PWI list is not worth even arguing about.

Yep. Completely.

On another point, I'd definitely have Sheamus as a serious contender for "most improved wrestler" this year. His promo work and matches have gotten much better.

The offical TNA thread - News, Spoilers and the rest...

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