A parking incident rant - abusive driver, advice please.

poolsupporter

anewme wrote: »

Where they are in my local centre is near the doors of the centre, but behind the main road past the centre, so not very good from a saftey point of view if a child were to run out. Parents would be better parking the other end of the car park, which is usually empty and walking across if they were concerned about kids running out.

The safety argument is baloney....I agree with the person who claimed it as clever marketing by the Supermarkets.

yes, in your centre, but in the majority they are not, after all, most modern centres have massive car parks. artane castle is an old centre and i may be wrong but yours sound s like it is too. all centres built in the last 10-15 years have been built with the conscience of safety as the upmost importance. actually, go research the requirements for building public centres.

keefg

While I am no fan of the "I deserve special treatment because I have children" mentality that seems to have arisen during the last 10 years, these child & parent spaces are not some secret marketing ploy, they are just common sense.

I think the first 6 rows near the door should be reserved for disabled and parent & child spaces and they should be forbidden from parking anywhere else. That way my motor might be safer from bashes from careless motorists.

As an able bodied (and gorgeous ) person I find the best place to park in a supermarket is the spots furthest away from the doors. Takes an extra few seconds to walk to the entrance and I don't have any problems with the sort of confrontation described in the OP or idiots bashing their doors off mine.

anewme

poolsupporter wrote: »

i never said sue the market!!! a formal complaint will do fine, just something to let them know that the customer is not happy. after all these places dont survive without customers. and another thing, i get the feeling you are just on here to whinge? theres plent of other threads for that. the original thread starter wanted opinions and advice on what to do, not advice and opinions on what not to do!!

"Legal backing" indicates a lot more than a formal complaint. While the Supermarket does have a duty of care to its patrons, it can't legislate for one customer having a rant at another as these spats sometimes come out of nowhere.

Question for you - seeing as you are the legal expert when it comes to Supermarkets and their car parks - are the family spaces legally enforceable. I know they are not, say by the Guards, but if security had come out when the taxi man was parking there, could they have made him move and clamped him(if clamping was in the centre), or just requested he move, but he did not have to if he was going to be awkward.

anewme

keefg wrote: »

...... I find the best place to park in a supermarket is the spots furthest away from the doors. Takes an extra few seconds to walk to the entrance and I don't have any problems with the sort of confrontation described in the OP or idiots bashing their doors off mine.

I always park miles away from the door, it is the only way to avoid dents in the car doors.

poolsupporter

anewme wrote: »

"Legal backing" indicates a lot more than a formal complaint. While the Supermarket does have a duty of care to its patrons, it can't legislate for one customer having a rant at another as these spats sometimes come out of nowhere.

Question for you - seeing as you are the legal expert when it comes to Supermarkets and their car parks - are the family spaces legally enforceable. I know they are not, say by the Guards, but if security had come out when the taxi man was parking there, could they have made him move and clamped him(if clamping was in the centre), or just requested he move, but he did not have to if he was going to be awkward.

legal expert, nope, far from it. just many years dealing with such situations. although i admit thats why i have given it up. the question your asking as you probably already know is tricky one. the point really is not about the space any more it is now about the way in which the girl was spoken too. if the girl goes further than making the complaint and decides she was untreated fairly and goes to the garda then the security men are witnesses. this makes it all very messy and not about the space any more, rather about the abuse. the other answer is, if security ask him to move the car as a matter of policy of the centre then he is obliged to conform the policies while on the premises. to be honest it is very contentious kind of thing, however i suspect he may not have reacted to a man or maybe even a couple of men in the way he reacted to this girl. and if he had then yes to the legality of the parking space because i beleive it may have got messy from there, the garda would have been called and yes, he would have ended in trouble with the law, all over a parking space. anyway, this whole thread is starting to annoy me because it is turning into something like the 'accused'... she did not deserve the treatment she received, she did not ask for it, however people on here are subtly putting it like that...

budfox

Firstly, apologies if the thread title is incorrect. Please feel free to suggest a suitable alternative.

The OP was written in some anger so a bit of venting I'm afraid.

She didn't approach them in the supermarket itself however but at the trolley bay outside the centre. She said it to them in a very relaxed manner and was completely thrown by their reply. OK in hindsight she should have kept going but there was completely no need for that language and she was pissed off about it. We never parked where we weren't meant to before we had kids just purely out of respect.

BTW, it takes a real hard bloke to get abusive to a mother with a young child (on her own, no partner with her), doesn't it?

Re: lifestyle choices, I disagree with some of the points being made.

Is the issue here not whether one believes that parent and child parking is appropriate, fair, discriminatory but basic respect for each other and civic duty/responsibility?

So, do we no longer give up our seat on the bus/train for an OAP? Help someone across the road? Hold the door open for a woman? Would you pull over to help a lad push his car, change a tyre?

I'm sorry, but that's my net point here. It's not the first time it's happened and it's a shame that we see this type of behaviour.

Maybe it's all cool now cos sure aren't we all about "de deadly buzz man" and all dat type of crap...no manners, acceptance of scumbag behaviour...

The taxi reference, fair enough. I dont know the rules about being off duty. If he was a private car then nothing that can be done about it. The point there is that as a taxi driver, he should know the basics of road courtesy.

Thanks all for your comments, all of which I've noted. It's the other point of view that you look for when you post up here.

Victor

hopalong_ie wrote: »

A car parking space is a standard 2.5 meters wide, if you cannot park in a 2.5m spot and get your door open, childs door then maybe you should check your parking.

On the contrary, some councils are having to enforce minimum standards for parking space size.

BluntGuy

Arathorn wrote: »

To be fair to most people here they are not saying they take those spaces, just that they don't agree with them in principle.

But what is the principle people don't agree with?

Courtesy?

Pineapple stu

poolsupporter wrote: »

hi, just to let you know. i have worked in security for years and the safety and security of the mentioned centre and all those who frequent it are the responsibility of security staff. trust me, there is legal backing for your partner here if she thinks security did not act to secure her well being while on that particular premises. also, these spots are for the safety of children so security have themselves in knots here. personally, it would be a long and drawn out case which would hardly be worth it in the end. but on the other hand its by not acting accordingly to these incidents that perpetuate the problem and allow it to continue. just another thing, i would also suggest she shops elsewhere where she would have a more pleasurable experience. northside, charlestown, clearwater-finglas, clarehall are all not a million miles away and from my own experience never had such problems especially charelstown and clearwater finglas.

She hasnt a case there as it was her who instigated the argument. She was the one who made a point of finding the couple and have a go at them.
All she had to do if she was upset at a parking spot being used by a people who didnt have kids with them was to just report it to security or whoever was in charge of the car park.
It seems that all she was upset about was that the taxi got a parking spot she was looking at before her.
People need to lighten up and not get stressed over such a little thing.
I have doubts as well to what was actualy said and if the abusive language was as bad as posted.

jasperok

there's some interesting opinions here

Usually I like to think that as far a my moral values go I'm doing allright.
And for me something like this - these parent & child spaces is a question of courtesy / kindness / common sense??
What suprises me is how many people arent into them?

Are we so wrapped up in our busy lives that we dont have the time to park further a way from an entrance so a parent and child or two and a trolley of shopping can get easier access? Have you ever tried taking two children into a supermarket doing the shopping packing the shopping at the checkout - back to the car try to get the kids safely into the car (and not let the full trolley of shopping scrape the sh!te out of your car!)? If not can you empathise with how that could be dificult?

Is having children a life choice? - Yes.

Does that some how void the persons right to be on the receiving end of courtesy and kindness? - No

Does that mean that you should be put out because of their life choice (I hear you ask) - No , No it doesnt at all and thats the sad thing for me here, its not a question of you being put out. Its a question of you doing the right thing, being decent. I mean if you are on a bus sitting down and a heavily pregnant woman is standing next to you do you say "Hah, Bet your sorry you got pregnant now huh?!" No you let the woman sit down or at least offer your seat anywhows ( I dont mean to sound old skool or twee or chauvenistic here but you catch my drift)

I totally am for freedom of speech and respect everyones right to an opinion - a topic like this tests that respect though! I just cant see it from the other side

Spook_ie

skelliser wrote: »

WHAT! FOR SAFETY REASONS! GET REAL FFS!

They are a marketing ploy, pure and simple, installed by supermarkets to try and get more families into the shop. "every little helps!" etc.

As i said already they didnt exist 20 years ago and shock horror! PEOPLE MANAGED JUST FINE!!

I have a tenancy to agree here, it is a marketing ploy, get the kids in the shop with the parents and sell them more impulse buys. Despite the furor about sweetfree checkouts they are rarer than than the discussed parent parking spots!

At the end of the day leave the little gits at home or with friends/parents/grannies whatever but make shops kiddy free

jasperok

I am certainly not presuming that shops and supermarkets intentions are honourable - Far from it,
Still though
The Fact remains that there are spaces which make it easier and safer for people with children to use.

why they are they and whether you decide to let people who may need the benefit the space affords them mopre than you is up to you based on what you think is wrong or right.

murphaph

If the shop has a parent and child space then you shouldn't park in it unless you have said child, end of story.

A shopping centre is private property. The centre management can simply refuse admission to anyone they like, including ignorant twats who park in spaces not designated for them. Why is it that so many Irish people think the rules are for everyone else to follow?

We parked in a disabled space by accident last week. I had a feeling something wasn't right as the space was so wide so when I got out I began looking for a sign, as I was doing this the security chap came flying over and naturally asked us to move. The painted sign on the ground had been obscured by snow, but we didn't throw a fit, we just moved so the space would be free for the person it was designated for.

Children may be a 'lifestyle choice' but without them, the human race is over.

Davidth88

As a parent, let me explain

These spaces are not so little johnny doesn't have to walk an extra few yards, nor are they there to allow people to get to the shops quicker or any such nonsense.

They are there because they are wider , therefore allowing you to lift your child in/out of the car without damaging the car next door.


It's something that gets my goat TBH when people who don't need this extra space park there .

As for the suggestions ' don't take your children to the supermarket ' .... GOD I wish I had a choice , to have some time to browse the supermarket without having a little one on tow would be wonderful , but you know what I don't !. I can't really leave a 3 YO at home on their own you know , thats not really considered good parenting

As for people who park in disabled spots , to my mind they should be made to live with a disability for a period of time , they wouldn't do it again !

budfox

She hasnt a case there as it was her who instigated the argument. She was the one who made a point of finding the couple and have a go at them.
All she had to do if she was upset at a parking spot being used by a people who didnt have kids with them was to just report it to security or whoever was in charge of the car park.
It seems that all she was upset about was that the taxi got a parking spot she was looking at before her.
People need to lighten up and not get stressed over such a little thing.
I have doubts as well to what was actualy said and if the abusive language was as bad as posted.


Your point accepted but she did not instigate an argument. She merely pointed out that they are parked in a space that is meant to be reserved for parent/children parking. I wouldn't describe as being upset but more put out by it. She was upset by the manner in which she was spoken to.

If someone blatently skipped a queue in front of you, would you just ignore it for fear of instigating an argument? Fair play to you.

You are entitled to your doubts, but I ask you, if your partner of 10+ years called you immediately after the incident and quoted verbatim what was said to her, would you doubt him/her? Maybe you would and just turn a blind eye. Again fair play to you if so, cos I wouldn't let any man speak to my partner like that.

Anyway, thanks again for all the comments. All duly noted.

Padraig Mor

Duckjob wrote: »

Can't say I've ever seen these spots on the far side of a car park from the door, have you?

Parent and child spots in Tesco at Wilton, Cork are well away from the door, nearly at the bottom of the car park.

parsi

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Parent and child spots in Tesco at Wilton, Cork are well away from the door, nearly at the bottom of the car park.

As a result they are probably only used by their intended audience.

Maybe that's a good solution - allocate the space but don't put them right at the door where they (and disabled spots and hashed areas) tempt the "I'm too lazy to walk 10 feet" muppets or the "sure I'm only collecting the missus" idiot.

We wouldn't be having this discussion if the spaces were not in a desirable location.

Davidth88

parsi wrote: »

As a result they are probably only used by their intended audience.

Maybe that's a good solution - allocate the space but don't put them right at the door where they (and disabled spots and hashed areas) tempt the "I'm too lazy to walk 10 feet" muppets or the "sure I'm only collecting the missus" idiot.

We wouldn't be having this discussion if the spaces were not in a desirable location.

Not a bad idea actually ..........

corktina

Super Valu in Fermoy have a huge range of reserved spaces including "expectant mother" How the hell do you police that one!!!

Davidth88

corktina wrote: »

Super Valu in Fermoy have a huge range of reserved spaces including "expectant mother" How the hell do you police that one!!!

Maybe they are near the toilets

Seems an odd one.

In general I have found people are unbelievable in how they park in supermarkets , if they could drive in they would... they constantly fill up the ' pickup/setdown ' spaces , etc , drive like maniacs around the car park ( like a race track ) ignore the crossings etc. I usually park a reasonable distance so I can hopefully have an empty space to my nearside ( to help loading little one ) if the parent/child spaces are full ( which they usually are ).

Whats the hurry people ???

Ham'nd'egger

corktina wrote: »

Super Valu in Fermoy have a huge range of reserved spaces including "expectant mother" How the hell do you police that one!!!

Superquinn shops have had them for a long long time; over 9 months even. And they have Spookies favourite anti sweet checkouts!:D

Given that these guys are renowned for simple yet sensible customer based innovations, it tells you a lot about why these spaces are there; to help people get on with it.

V1llianous

I can completely emphasise with the original poster - I've been irked many times by the occupiers of these spaces.

I have a child with special needs and try to use these spaces whenever possible to limit the risk to the child of incidents between the car park and the shop.

In the past few weeks I've had to wait for spaces to become free because of the following reasons:
a) Space used by woman in late 40s with her mother / mother in law - no child in sight.
b) Two parents in big SUV with 2 children in their early teens with no mobility issues (got out the car and ran to the shops).
c) Presumed mother of a small child (car seat in the car) without the child on that occasion.

If when my children are older and can safely negotiate a car park I would park in a normal space and teach my children how to cross the car park safely thus leaving the spaces free for hopefully more worthy / greater requirment.

With my situation with my child with special needs if they were an adult they would possibly qualify for a disabled sticker but as they are not at an age where they can drive they don't - the difference of a parking space that is 300 m closer to the door is a potential safety requirement but not one that I would abuse if not required.

Speak Now

I got abuse from a woman for parking in a disabled spot.

I was collecting the baby from creche and parked in the normal spot.
I had to collect the buggy from a car in a disabled spot, when i did a woman made a comment walking across the car park - you don't look very disabled to me.

I said

1. How do you know my wife or children aren't disabled

and

2. I'm parked over there in the regular places anyway.

Don't know why she jumped at me as it was the only 1 of 3 disabled spaces used and she hadn't seen me park there anyway. She was extremely obese and was probably put out she couldn't park nearer the door herself :rolleyes:

As i walked over to my car i could see the steam coming out of ears

IanPerth

It's scary that some posters have compared disabled spaces to 'mother & baby spaces' !

Disabled spaces are essential, all car parks are legally obliged to have them, and without them disable people could not go about their normal lives.

'Mother & baby spaces' are a shopping center convenience, designed to attract more customers.

If a single healthy person uses a disabled bay , they are a disgrace.

If a single healthy person uses a 'mother and baby space' .... especially if the car park is jammed .... I've no complaints.

If a single healthy person pi*ses off a mother, with a ''the world should be designed for my convenience'' attitude. . . . . . i for one want to give him a high five !

Disabled spaces - - - Should be respected at all times offenders should be confronted

Mother & baby spaces - - - Are an optional convenience designed to get more shoppers in the door. If parents have such a big problem, stop buying such bIG cars.... other parents have to manage on a bus.... but hear this..... HAVING KIDS IS NOT A DISABILITY !!!

Davidth88

IanPerth wrote: »

Mother & baby spaces - - - Are an optional convenience designed to get more shoppers in the door. If parents have such a big problem, stop buying such bIG cars.... other parents have to manage on a bus.... but hear this..... HAVING KIDS IS NOT A DISABILITY !!!

Sorry a renault clio is a big car now ( that's what I have )..... and to open the door wide enough to lift the little one ( when she needed lifting ) you ended up dinging the car next door half the time.

I don't think these spaces are just for the convenience of parent/children , they are there to aid you and prevent damage to other cars

Now of course they are a ' nicity ' we can work without them , but if they are provided then they should be used for the purpose they were provided.

corktina

IanPerth wrote: »

It's scary that some posters have compared disabled spaces to 'mother & baby spaces' !

Disabled spaces are essential, all car parks are legally obliged to have them, and without them disable people could not go about their normal lives.

'Mother & baby spaces' are a shopping center convenience, designed to attract more customers.

If a single healthy person uses a disabled bay , they are a disgrace.

If a single healthy person uses a 'mother and baby space' .... especially if the car park is jammed .... I've no complaints.

If a single healthy person pi*ses off a mother, with a ''the world should be designed for my convenience'' attitude. . . . . . i for one want to give him a high five !

Disabled spaces - - - Should be respected at all times offenders should be confronted

Mother & baby spaces - - - Are an optional convenience designed to get more shoppers in the door. If parents have such a big problem, stop buying such bIG cars.... other parents have to manage on a bus.... but hear this..... HAVING KIDS IS NOT A DISABILITY !!!

i get the feeling you have no kids! Try carting them in and out of cars plus a trolley full of shopping and you'd know better.

People on here have moaned about there cars getting dinged by parents loading children, thats just ONE reason for having special wide bays.

I do agree though that the parent and baby (surely better wording than "child") spaces do not need to be right outside the door as do disabled spaces.

IanPerth

corktina wrote: »

i get the feeling you have no kids! Try carting them in and out of cars plus a trolley full of shopping and you'd know better.

People on here have moaned about there cars getting dinged by parents loading children, thats just ONE reason for having special wide bays.

I do agree though that the parent and baby (surely better wording than "child") spaces do not need to be right outside the door as do disabled spaces.

Don't have kids, nor am I disabled ... but I have a brain,,,, and the basic intelligence to consider the two circumstances :-)

What about ''Elderly Relative Spaces'' , ''bad back Spaces'' ,,, or ''Singles spaces'' ... and you have to park boy / girl / boy / girl etc ... if they made commercial sense they would exist in shopping centres.... but they DONT ! ,,,

'mother & child spaces' are aimed at middle class parents with oversised cars ..... thats why you will never see them in any car park connected to a non profit organisation (eg county council offices etc).

No one likes to see a mother struggling with buggy's etc ..... & i often offer my assistance with lifting prams etc.

But the sense of entitlement ,,,,, that the world should be designed around ''my little johnny & my SUV'' ..... get a grip parents.

corktina

you'll learn I guess when you are struggling some time in the future.

budfox

IanPerth wrote: »

Don't have kids, nor am I disabled ... but I have a brain,,,, and the basic intelligence to consider the two circumstances :-)

What about ''Elderly Relative Spaces'' , ''bad back Spaces'' ,,, or ''Singles spaces'' ... and you have to park boy / girl / boy / girl etc ... if they made commercial sense they would exist in shopping centres.... but they DONT ! ,,,

'mother & child spaces' are aimed at middle class parents with oversised cars ..... thats why you will never see them in any car park connected to a non profit organisation (eg county council offices etc).

No one likes to see a mother struggling with buggy's etc ..... & i often offer my assistance with lifting prams etc.

But the sense of entitlement ,,,,, that the world should be designed around ''my little johnny & my SUV'' ..... get a grip parents.

It's not about a sense of entitlement. It's about basic manners and civic respect. As for being aimed at middle class parents with oversize cars, what a load of toss. BTW, what would you do if someone squared up to your partner and used abusive language? Ignore it? Or say, ah well sure he's a hard working taxi driver. Right.

DublinWriter

IanPerth wrote: »

But the sense of entitlement ,,,,, that the world should be designed around ''my little johnny & my SUV'' ..... get a grip parents.

Yes, damn those SUV drivers...trying to put that 50" plasma in the back...for their second home.

BluntGuy

Not one person has posted a convincing argument why we shouldn't have these spaces.

The main argument seems to be parents can "manage" without them. Well, I doubt many people question that. They are not absolutely necessary, and I don't think anyone argues that.

But I honestly don't see why people have such an issue with 3 or 4 spaces in a car park being designated to make life that little bit easier for a parent, and safer for the child. Can anyone give a genuine practical reason, that isn't selfish or umempathetic?

johnnyrotten

I totally agree with the OP and I agree that the abusive scumbags should not have parked there. But I am more and more thinking that we are better off ignoring a lot of stuff, look at that poor guy stabbed to death last Friday night in Donaghmede, Dublin because he confronted people over a noisy party.
These days you never know who you are dealing with and what weapons they are carrying.
Be safe not sorry. Thanks

Davidth88

johnnyrotten wrote: »

I totally agree with the OP and I agree that the abusive scumbags should not have parked there. But I am more and more thinking that we are better off ignoring a lot of stuff, look at that poor guy stabbed to death last Friday night in Donaghmede, Dublin because he confronted people over a noisy party.
These days you never know who you are dealing with and what weapons they are carrying.
Be safe not sorry. Thanks

This is straying into the political arena now , but actually I think you are wrong , if more people stood up to people then I think things would improve

Fighting Irish

Davidth88 wrote: »

This is straying into the political arena now , but actually I think you are wrong , if more people stood up to people then I think things would improve

We all know that, just don't bit(h when you get stabbed because of a parking space

Penn

IanPerth wrote: »

'mother & child spaces' are aimed at middle class parents with oversised cars ..... thats why you will never see them in any car park connected to a non profit organisation (eg county council offices etc).

Mother and child spaces are designed to make things easier for a parent to do their shopping, which means they are more likely to return to that shop. It doesn't matter if you have a LandRover or a Nissan Sunny, nor does it matter if you are middle class, upper middle class, first class, geography class etc. If you are a mother, and you have a child with you, then you can use those spaces.

THATS why you never see them at county council offices etc. How many people bring their children to county council offices?

In accordance with planning permission, shops like that are required to supply a certain number of car parking spaces for people with disabilities. I don't think the mother and child spaces are a requirement though. The mother and child spaces are not enforcable by law because the shop puts them there themselves. But I think they also have the right to enforce the mother and child parking spaces. So I think the OP's wife should have gone to the management rather than the taxi driver, but I still applaud her for her actions and wish there were more like her.

Also, I wonder how many of the people saying they are against the spaces are parents themselves. I'm not, but I have driven back out of spaces once I realised they were mother and child spaces before, and several times have driven in circles looking for a space even though there were mother and child spaces available. It's called common decency

Cookie_Monster

BluntGuy wrote: »

Not one person has posted a convincing argument why we shouldn't have these spaces.

Because they are a form of (positive) discrimination is why.

Why should people with children get preferential treatment over those who don't?

[sarcasm]
(Also most of them are pictogram with a mother and child, which is sexist :P)
[/sarcasm]

Amtmann

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Because they are a form of (positive) discrimination is why.

Why should people with children get preferential treatment over those who don't?

Um, cos they perpetuate the existence of the species? Like, that's pretty important imo.

Pineapple stu

budfox wrote: »

She hasnt a case there as it was her who instigated the argument. She was the one who made a point of finding the couple and have a go at them.
All she had to do if she was upset at a parking spot being used by a people who didnt have kids with them was to just report it to security or whoever was in charge of the car park.
It seems that all she was upset about was that the taxi got a parking spot she was looking at before her.
People need to lighten up and not get stressed over such a little thing.
I have doubts as well to what was actualy said and if the abusive language was as bad as posted.


Your point accepted but she did not instigate an argument. She merely pointed out that they are parked in a space that is meant to be reserved for parent/children parking. I wouldn't describe as being upset but more put out by it. She was upset by the manner in which she was spoken to.

If someone blatently skipped a queue in front of you, would you just ignore it for fear of instigating an argument? Fair play to you.

You are entitled to your doubts, but I ask you, if your partner of 10+ years called you immediately after the incident and quoted verbatim what was said to her, would you doubt him/her? Maybe you would and just turn a blind eye. Again fair play to you if so, cos I wouldn't let any man speak to my partner like that.

My doubt is there is one story in the opening post and another a few hours after. The title thread says abusive driver when it was more like an abusive shopper and mentioning it was a taxi as if it make people more sympathetic and have a pop at the taxi driver. The opening post says that she saw them in the shop and told them off and in another one she saw them outside at the trolly bay. I wonder if they did actually swear at here or to the extent posted or if its just posted to get maximum effect. If they did then its not nice to be on the end of it but all she had to do was point it out to the security or parking crowd.
If a strange woman came up to me and had a go at me for something that wasnt her business then i would have told her where to go as well or just ignored her.
She approached them and told them off and she didnt like the reply she got end of. No need to make such a fuss over it.

I also agree that the mother and child signs are discriminating. Does it mean that fathers with a child cant park there ?

Riskymove

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

[sarcasm]
(Also most of them are pictogram with a mother and child, which is sexist :P)
[/sarcasm]

you'll be glad to know that the PC Nazis have been on the case here

They are now "Parent and Child Spaces" with an appropriate pictogram of a man, a woman and a child

glad we can now sleep at night!!

gurramok

BluntGuy wrote: »

Not one person has posted a convincing argument why we shouldn't have these spaces.

The main argument seems to be parents can "manage" without them. Well, I doubt many people question that. They are not absolutely necessary, and I don't think anyone argues that.

But I honestly don't see why people have such an issue with 3 or 4 spaces in a car park being designated to make life that little bit easier for a parent, and safer for the child. Can anyone give a genuine practical reason, that isn't selfish or umempathetic?

Why brings kids to the supermarket in the first place?

We wouldnt be having this thread if one parent decided to mind the kids at home and the other did the shopping.

It would make a hell of alot better shopping experience for shoppers and retail workers without kids screaming and running riot all over the supermarket!

vektarman

V1llianous wrote: »

With my situation with my child with special needs if they were an adult they would possibly qualify for a disabled sticker but as they are not at an age where they can drive they don't - the difference of a parking space that is 300 m closer to the door is a potential safety requirement but not one that I would abuse if not required.

On a point of information there is no mimimum age to hold a disabled parking sticker, the holder does not necessarily have to be the driver, this is a common misunderstanding.

Cookie_Monster

Furet wrote: »

Um, cos they perpetuate the existence of the species? Like, that's pretty important imo.

when there's already 6.5 bn of us, i think not

Riskymove wrote: »

you'll be glad to know that the PC Nazis have been on the case here

They are now "Parent and Child Spaces" with an appropriate pictogram of a man, a woman and a child

glad we can now sleep at night!!

So that makes them family and child space which will require both parents to be there

DWCommuter

I thought some of you here might be interested in this.

http://ezinearticles.com/?10-Ways-You-Can-Increase-Your-Sperm-Count&id=79931

Amtmann

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

when there's already 6.5 bn of us, i think not

That's no answer at all. Families are encouraged as they are the basis by which our society reproduces itself. If you want to argue for self-extinction or for an across-the-board hiatus in all human reproduction for a period of, say, two decades, then by all means, make sure you don't have any kids and spread the word to those who'll hear you. It wouldn't be a clever way to do things though. As for the rest of us who recognise that kids are important and that we should make life that bit easier for hard-pressed parents in this country, a paltry dedicated parking space isn't pushing the boat out too far. But I suspect you're just arguing for the sake of it tbh.

Amtmann

gurramok wrote: »

Why brings kids to the supermarket in the first place?

We wouldnt be having this thread if one parent decided to mind the kids at home and the other did the shopping.

It would make a hell of alot better shopping experience for shoppers and retail workers without kids screaming and running riot all over the supermarket!

And you'd have ten-fold the amount of social retards then. How do you think you learned how to function as an individual in a society of fellow individuals? You picked it up as a kid, through the process of socialisation. People aren't born knowing the significance of a handshake, how to purchase a loaf of bread, or about concepts such as what happens in the human world in the morning-time, or at noon, or at night. These things -- all things -- are ritualised social constructs, and they're learned by children through a combination of participation and observation. Locking children away from the most normative aspects of daily life produces really weird, estranged, alienated, socially awkward people.

Cookie_Monster

Furet wrote: »

These things -- all things -- are ritualised social constructs, and they're learned by children through a combination of participation and observation. .

They can learn how not to **** up other peoples cars then too

zagmund

Furet wrote: »

And you'd have ten-fold the amount of social retards then. How do you think you learned how to function as an individual in a society of fellow individuals? You picked it up as a kid, through the process of socialisation. People aren't born knowing the significance of a handshake, how to purchase a loaf of bread, or about concepts such as what happens in the human world in the morning-time, or at noon, or at night. These things -- all things -- are ritualised social constructs, and they're learned by children through a combination of participation and observation. Locking children away from the most normative aspects of daily life produces really weird, estranged, alienated, socially awkward people.

You beat me to it . . .

It's possible that people who weren't brought to the shops by their parents when they were kids turn out to be spoiled, selfish people who don't understand the idea of common curtesy (through socialsation and observation of what other people do) and who don't understand that sometimes it's better to obey guidance signs like the ones in the parking bay than to just think of themselves.

I wonder if the people who have comprehension problems over the idea of somewhere providing nominated parking spaces like this have a problem with other non-legally enforceable signs like "Please turn off your phone in the cinema so you don't disturb other patrons" . . . oh, wait.

What about signs like "Please be quiet" in the library - do they respect these ? Or "Please reduce your speed" in housing estates ? I think these may also be the same people who refused to clean the path outside their houses in the recent bad weather in case "some old bag" fell and sued them.

z

budfox

Making a stand: Asda will fine customers who break car park rules
Last updated at 13:13 10 January 2008

Asda will fine drivers £60 for parking in its disabled or parent and child spaces when they shouldn't, it was announced today.


The supermarket is rolling out the penalty nationwide from Monday following a trial at six stores.
It will donate profits from the fines to baby charity Tommy's and the Motability car scheme for the disabled.


The trial in the Liverpool area caused a 60 per cent increase in the number of parking spaces available for disabled drivers and parents with young children.
Asda said the penalty system followed its attempt to tackle the problem constructively in the past. It will roll out the fines to all Asda food stores where it owns the car park.


The retailer's customer service manager Paul Hedley said signs would alert drivers to the potential fines.
"At Asda we have decided to take a stand to keep specialised parking spaces available to those customers that need them," he said.
"Most customers using these bays without good reason don't realise their actions impact on people that rely on them to do their weekly shop."
Priority parking spaces are reserved for disabled customers with a blue badge in their cars and for parents travelling with a child under 12.


An Asda poll found four out of five of its customers thought the parking fines should be extended nationally.


The roll-out starts in north London on Monday and will be in force at all relevant Asda stores by mid-March.
Tommy's chief executive Jane Brewin said: "Putting fines in place for parking misuse is a bold move by Asda but is the right one for giving parents with young children a helping hand."

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-507395/Asda-fine-customers-60-parking-disabled-family-bays.html#ixzz0czhnD6Nl

DublinWriter

gurramok wrote: »

Why brings kids to the supermarket in the first place?

We wouldnt be having this thread if one parent decided to mind the kids at home and the other did the shopping.

Oh FFS.

Most parents actually have jobs outside the house and don't have the luxury of time, especially when most kiddie-winks need to be in bed by 7pm/8pm.

I'm sure you'd be a lot happier if parents dragged their kids around your local 24 hour supermarket at 2am in the morning.

-Corkie-

I agree dublin writer i hope this driver was reported. I see a lot of dublin taxi drivers think they own the place. How dare he tell her to f off. If i had been me i would have kicked the scumbag around the place.