Olympus - Where do they stand?

Hey all,

Still extremely new to the whole photography lark. I bought myself an Olympus E-420 a few months back and intended to learn the ins and outs of DSLR photography.

Whilst I understand that DSLRs are essentially all one and the same, I also understand that there are poorer cameras than others, and better cameras than others.

I like my E-420 physically; It's easy enough to hold, light and doesn't give me any issues with bulkiness or anything. In fact, I think it's a pretty sexy camera.

However, though I have very little experience with other cameras, after trying to play about with the Aperture for a little while today on the camera, I can't help but feel a little frustrated.

I'm gonna be simplifying this, because I'm a novice, but you know the way you can change the background of an image from clear to blurry by playing with the Aperture setting (depth of field), well... It's just not happening for me.

I'm having serious issues focusing on the items I want to focus on (even in Auto), and depth of field seems to be non-existent.

So, I'm wondering, to you boardsies who know a lot more about this than I, is this issue down to the camera being an "entry level" camera that doesn't cost all that much and just can't cope with these settings to the level i seem to expect it to be able to, or would it be more realistic to assume I'm a moron who can't use a camera?

I attend the first night of a beginner's photography class tomorrow night, and so I'm really just wondering if I'm wasting my time with that camera, or will it all start to work out as I get more hands-on assistance?

FX Meister

Maybe something to do with the minimum aperture setting on your lens. You won't get as good depth of field if your largest apertuer is, for example, 4.5

Well according to Argos;

"Lens included with camera - Zuiko Digital ED 14-42mm 1:3 5-5.6."

Though I'm not entirely sure of the meaning behind those numbers.

DotOrg

Deleted User wrote: »

Well according to Argos;

"Lens included with camera - Zuiko Digital ED 14-42mm 1:3 5-5.6."

Though I'm not entirely sure of the meaning behind those numbers.

your course should explain exposure and it's relationship with depth of field

your lens zooms from 14mm to 42mm meaning it's a wide angle zoom lens

when you zoom out to 14mm (very wide) the widest aperture you can set the lens at is f3.5 (the most shallow depth of field your lens can do)

when you zoom into 42mm, (bring far away objects closer) the widest aperture your lens can handle changes to f5.6 (less depth of field)

a more expensive lens would have a fixed aperture, meaning it would remain at f3.5 no matter what you zoom to

DotOrg

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm having serious issues focusing on the items I want to focus on (even in Auto), and depth of field seems to be non-existent.

what issues? do you mean the camera changes focus when you move the camera, do you mean it looks for focus but the lens keeps moving back and forth?

best way to learn focus would be to practice with a patterned object in a bright room. learn how to focus on it using the centre point in your viewfinder; hold that focus and then move the camera so you are composing the picture the way you want it. with most cameras, it's a case of holding down the 'shoot' button, halfway

Deleted User wrote: »

or would it be more realistic to assume I'm a moron who can't use a camera?

that's a little harsh, as you may be able to learn how to use it, if you can't learn, then you may just be a moron ;-)

AnCatDubh

A properly functioning Olympus E-420 will be well capable -you have no worries with your purchase.

The bokeh (resulting from a narrow depth of field) you seek will be a product of a few factors- principally aperture, focal length, distance to subject. Check out the dofmaster - http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html This gives you a calculation based on the factors involved. Then bench test the results.

On the focussing issue, that's a bit more puzzling. A couple of thoughts - As a new user you may find manual focus difficult (inherent on digital slrs compared to the dinosaur film models with their wonderful split prisms). I don't know if the Oly has it (assume it has) but there is a custom setting usually available for "catch in focus" which means that it won't take any photograph unless it is in focus - can be annoying while you are attempting to get the desired focus but you will know that something as per the focussing mechanisms and algorithm of the camera is in focus when you do take the photograph. Whether it is the desired result or not is another matter. :pac: (assumption here is your lens are reasonably clean / not greasy at all or anything that might deflect the focussing system).

I was actually talking to Boardsie Chorcai today, and he went through a few things with me, one of which was Aperture/Depth Of Field. This is why i was trying it out with my own camera.

On his camera, although of course he knows his own camera inside out (Canon, by the way), it seemed pretty easy, and the effects very noticeable when he altered the settings. On mine, it seems to just do as it pleases.

Can i ask, if it is a case that the lens jus sucks when It comes to this kind of thing, what should I be looking for in a lens where I would want to change the Depth Of Field a lot?

Just regarding the focus thing,

the camera is clean. Good as new, I try to look after this kind of stuff. When in auto-focus, the lens will keep move back and forth, and when it finally settles, it will be focused on, from what I can tell, nothing.

For example, I put a rubik's cube in front of my computer keyboard/monitor/general desk area and held the camera to it. I auto focused (button at the halfway down mark) and... it didn't focus on the Rubik's cube. I don't know what it was trying to focus on, as everything just seemed blurry. I can adjust this with Manual foucs alright (twisting the end of the lens), but you have to be really precise in order to do that, and it's not so much that I dont want to use manual focus, it's more an issue that the camera (any camera!) should be well capable of auto focusing on an item, especially a bright coloured one in an otherwise dulled area.

duffarama

Deleted User wrote: »

I was actually talking to Boardsie Chorcai today, and he went through a few things with me, one of which was Aperture/Depth Of Field. This is why i was trying it out with my own camera.

On his camera, although of course he knows his own camera inside out (Canon, by the way), it seemed pretty easy, and the effects very noticeable when he altered the settings. On mine, it seems to just do as it pleases.

Can i ask, if it is a case that the lens jus sucks when It comes to this kind of thing, what should I be looking for in a lens where I would want to change the Depth Of Field a lot?

There is nothing wrong with your camera or lens.

The 14-42 is a great, small, sharp, kit lens.

However, the depth of field (DOF) on all Olympus DSLR's is twice that of 35mm. So at 3.5 you have 2x the depth of field of somebody using a 5d for example. This can be useful, in macro for example more depth of field is, I find, really useful.

You seem to be wanting to take shots where you're blurring elements that aren't in focus, the kit lens on any camera won't be terribly good at that, there are other lenses available though.

You can use manual focus lenses with an adaptor, or get one of the great lenses for bokeh that will fit your Olympus, the Panasonic 25mm F1.4 or the much cheaper Sigma 30 F1.4 or when available the Sigma 50mm F1.4

With those lenses your equivaent DOF is now F2.8 (yet still functions as 1.4) so less will be in focus, depending on the type of shot.

5uspect

Sounds like your focus point is not set to center.

Autofocusing in modern cameras lets you focus on areas other than the exact middle of the image. You can change it to full auto where it determines the best focus point or you can control it. The arrangement of focus points and how you select them depends on your model of camera.

The manual (here, page 53) says the E-420 has only three. Canon cameras have a few more (9-12) and some Nikons go mad with 40ish.

On Canon I know the focus point in the viewfinder will glow red. I'm not sure about Oly.
Are you aware of these? Have you tried shooting in Live View mode?

EDIT: Oh and stick the camera in "A" mode and dial in an aperture of 3.5 (or 5.6 depending on where the zoom is) and get a subject in focus pretty close to you with a long distance to the background. The object in the foreground should be greater than 0.25m or 0.82ft away from you. See this written on the lens below above the red dot?

This is how close it can focus.

So get a AA battery or something bigger and but it on the kitchen table 0.25m or so away from the lens. but something else at the far end of the table or even further and take a shot with the settings above.

duffarama

Deleted User wrote: »

Just regarding the focus thing,

the camera is clean. Good as new, I try to look after this kind of stuff. When in auto-focus, the lens will keep move back and forth, and when it finally settles, it will be focused on, from what I can tell, nothing.

For example, I put a rubik's cube in front of my computer keyboard/monitor/general desk area and held the camera to it. I auto focused (button at the halfway down mark) and... it didn't focus on the Rubik's cube. I don't know what it was trying to focus on, as everything just seemed blurry. I can adjust this with Manual foucs alright (twisting the end of the lens), but you have to be really precise in order to do that, and it's not so much that I dont want to use manual focus, it's more an issue that the camera (any camera!) should be well capable of auto focusing on an item, especially a bright coloured one in an otherwise dulled area.

Not necessarily, try C-AF and S-AF and try using the focus points and choose an area of contrast, you point that camera against a well lit blank wall and it won't focus. Sometimes you need to help the auto focus, also, that lens won't focus any closer than 25cm, it's not a macro lens

AnCatDubh

Deleted User wrote: »

For example, I put a rubik's cube in front of my computer keyboard/monitor/general desk area and held the camera to it. I auto focused (button at the halfway down mark) and... it didn't focus on the Rubik's cube. I don't know what it was trying to focus on, as everything just seemed blurry. I can adjust this with Manual foucs alright (twisting the end of the lens), but you have to be really precise in order to do that, and it's not so much that I dont want to use manual focus, it's more an issue that the camera (any camera!) should be well capable of auto focusing on an item, especially a bright coloured one in an otherwise dulled area.

One possibility - Every lens will have a minimum focusing distance - if you are within that distance then it can't focus - technically not possible. If this is correct then move away. Simple. This distance will vary from lens to lens. This is why some lens are explicitly for macro/close up work i.e. they can focus at close up distances. By moving away you may need to crop in post processing if you don't have enough focal length / range.

I'm gonna head off to bed now guys, but I'll update this thread tomorrow night at some point, when I've palyed about a bit more and tried some of your ideas.


Thanks a lot for the help.

Chorcai

As with anything the more you know the easier it gets ! Have a good long read of the manual. And sure if ya think you have messed up the setting just revert back to default and try again

SinisterDexter

Just a thought or two on the Rubix Cube.

If you are looking at the rubix cube through the live screen then half pressing the button does nothing... took me a while to work this out.

Just because the rubix cube is in front of the lens doesn't mean it will be able to focus on it. You didn't state, so I am just trying to cover, that you didn't have the rubix cube an inch or two in front of the lens.

Just my thoughts.

BTW I have a e-410 for the last 3 years.

Morrisseeee

Here's a good guide : http://www.wrotniak.net/photo/43/e510-sett.html
....and there are other good guides/helpful info there aswell.
The lens you are talking about is a great little kit lens, and it performs great in certain circumstances, ie. for a landscape or a macro, not true macro but try this, pull out the lens to 42mm, put it on a tripod, you will be surprised how close it can get to a small subject, use 'live-view' and the 7* or 10* to get sharpness, then play with apertures, use long exposures if you haven't enough light, experiment & have fun .

This is one example with the 14-42mm @ 42mm:


....another @ 42mm:



This is an out of focus shot with a 135mm lens:

Cheers again for all the help guys.

Yeah, I think the issue is that I had objects too close to the lens, and it didn't focus on them. Seems to be OK focusing on the Rubik's Cube if it's about 6-8 inches away.

So I suppose this falls into another question; If i want to buy a new lens, what am I looking for to be able to take those kinda shots? I know macro is obviously the style of photography, so I have to ask, is there a downside to a macro lens? Do they have difficulty focusing on distant items, or can they double as an all-rounder?

Also, what places do you guys recommend for buying this kind of stuff? I've heard eBay can be very reliable for lens purchases, but are there any other sites out there with a solid returns policy and a decent price? Not just for lenses, but for other camera orientated stuff, too.

Also, are lenses actually capable of being faulty? Or do they just get dusty and old and require cleaning up?

It'll probably be a while before I splash out on a new lens, as now I know this ones limitations, I won't keep thinking it's broken, but I'd like to still have some idea for mooching about the net, you know.



Also, while I'm here, I'd like to give a big thank you to Chorcai. He travelled into Drogheda yesterday, and spent literally hours with me explaining things to me in straight forward terms and we even messed about for over an hour out in the cold weather with long exposures to play about with Light Trails.

He didn't even ask or look for anything in return. Fair play to him and thanks again Chorcai. I appreciate it.

duffarama

Deleted User wrote: »

So I suppose this falls into another question; If i want to buy a new lens, what am I looking for to be able to take those kinda shots? I know macro is obviously the style of photography, so I have to ask, is there a downside to a macro lens? Do they have difficulty focusing on distant items, or can they double as an all-rounder?

Also, what places do you guys recommend for buying this kind of stuff? I've heard eBay can be very reliable for lens purchases, but are there any other sites out there with a solid returns policy and a decent price? Not just for lenses, but for other camera orientated stuff, too.

The macro lenses available for your camera are all superb. The 35mm is one of the best value for money lenses on any camera system. The 50mm f2 is one of the sharpest lenses ever made. However, you should look at the zooms too.

The 14-54 and 12-60 lenses offer a good wide angle to portrait range and decent macro capabilities, well I know the 12-60 does and assume same for the 14-54 mark I and II

I got mine from the ebay user Kerso and have had 2 trouble free years with the lens.