Procedure of De-Modding

IITYWYBMAD

seamus wrote: »

You know full well what I meant by that comment. Yes, it is perfectly fine to talk about the facts of a case while it is ongoing.

I could also assume that you were mis-informed.

Debating it, offering your opinion on it or discussing "what-ifs", is not. Even the normally ballsy media refrain from mentioning anything except what's been said in court.

Again, that is simply not true. You can quite happily debate the public evidence of any ongoing court case, once you keep out of the realms of contempt. Have a look at last Sunday Indo's comment piece, for a perfect example.

5starpool

seamus wrote: »

You rarely see it, that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Admins and mods are shocked, completely and utterly shocked, when a user responds to a ban PM with "Ok, sorry about that". That kind of response is in the minority. Most people will respond with abuse, will start a helpdesk thread appealing on some nonsensical basis or will simply not respond at all and later on piss and moan in a feedback thread about overly sensitive mods and "the man" stifling debate.

At least 75% of the time that I have banned people or warned them to cool it a bit I get a 'sorry about that' type of response.

I think the most important part of these actions is the initial contact. If the initial contact from a mod to user is seen as overly sensitive or somewhat aggressive you will likely get the same back in spades, and the same if you treat people with respect.

On a different note, giving someone an infraction for 'being naughty' or banning someone for questioning a mod decision on thread have always been things that grind my gears. The theory behind them is sound, but the manner of execution is severly flawed imo.

BuffyBot

I've split a large chunk of Help Desk related posts to this thread just so we can get back on point.

Anyway, to give some information out: I'm going to let this run for another day or two, then start taking out all the individual points from the various posts so we can incorporate them into the discussion we're going to have. As a result of that, we should then have some new ideas/options about how to do this in the future to present to the Mods, and from there a more workable, consistant policy should come about.

_blank_

BuffyBot wrote: »

the discussion we're going to have

Just a point of clarification.

Does "we" mean The Admins, or "we" as in everyone here in FB?

Des

Des wrote: »

Just a point of clarification.

Does "we" mean The Admins, or "we" as in everyone here in FB?

Hopefully the admins, otherwise we will never get anywhere.

BuffyBot

As stated earlier in the thread: the whole point of this discussion is to get people's input and ideas so that we can take them on board about how we do this in the future

_blank_

BuffyBot wrote: »

As stated earlier in the thread: the whole point of this discussion is to get people's input and ideas so that we can take them on board about how we do this in the future

That isn't clarification.

Do you mean "we" Admins, or "we" collectively everyone posting in FB.

It's very simple.

Thanks.

BuffyBot

I'm not sure which part of my various posts/comments along the lines of

I'll collate what comes up here, and take it to the rest of the Admins. As part of the sites evolution, how we do things constantly changes - this procedure is no different

wasn't clear. As the form the policy has to take will be decided by the Admins, for presentation to the Mods for discussion, I think it follows pretty naturally that I'll be taking the collected ideas and input to the Admin team for further deliberation

Fajitas!

BuffyBot wrote: »

I think it follows pretty naturally that I'll be taking the collected ideas and input to the Admin team for further deliberation

I'm sorry, but could they not all come along here? I'm not saying that you're not the man for the job or anything, but it's a discussion for the Admin team, it should be with the Admin team, rather than a collection of ideas being brought to them.

I reckon it would be an good exercise in communication between the users and the Admin team.

BuffyBot

It's a lot easier for one person to collect the points and present them to the many, than have multiple people trawl through every single page of a 19/20 page thread (especially when they may be quite time limited, being volunteers). It also will give us one single place to go than to start having to dig through this thread everytime we want to look at an individual idea or point.

Fajitas!

It's a lot easier for one person to collect the points and present them to the many, than have multiple people trawl through every single page of a 19/20 page thread (especially when they may be quite time limited, being volunteers). It also will give us one single place to go than to start having to dig through this thread everytime we want to look at an individual idea or point.

But surely people's input and ideas can be hashed out with the Admin team to produce something the community is happier with, if it's done with all with enough interest to reply and get involved (Yes, yes, we'll have folk coming along to troll, but tbh, they're rather easy to spot).

(especially when they may be quite time limited, being volunteers)

Ah yes, I know it can be quite time intensive, but being fair, if you're name is down on the list, it's down for a reason... and it's something that can/will affect the future day-to-day running/interactions on Boards.ie so it should be something to make a bit of time for. It could well make life easier for all involved.

Fajitas!

Fajitas! wrote: »

Ah yes, I know it can be quite time intensive, but being fair, if you're name is down on the list, it's down for a reason... and it's something that can/will affect the future day-to-day running/interactions on Boards.ie so it should be something to make a bit of time for. It could well make life easier for all involved.

Very good point. Might even go a long way towards restoring some faith in the Admins if some good comes from all this brouhaha.

BuffyBot

Fajitas! wrote: »

But surely people's input and ideas can be hashed out with the Admin team to produce something the community is happier with, if it's done with all with enough interest to reply and get involved (Yes, yes, we'll have folk coming along to troll, but tbh, they're rather easy to spot).

Simply because having a 3 place discussion will just make more a nightmare. That fact that we're not doing it here as live doesn't negate the feedback that's been given so far.

Ah yes, I know it can be quite time intensive, but being fair, if you're name is down on the list, it's down for a reason... and it's something that can/will affect the future day-to-day running/interactions on Boards.ie so it should be something to make a bit of time for. It could well make life easier for all involved.

Our names are on a list, but for a lot less time than we've been putting into the site over the last few days, as my baggy eyes and general cranky demeanour will testify

The Admin debates won't last forever, neither will the discussion we'll be having with the Mods - everything has to come to an end point. I'm looking at this thread as a kind of "public consultation" where people are having a chance to input into it with their thoughts. Consultations can only go on for so long though and while we have some motion, I want to capitalise on it - otherwise we're just dragging it out until the next big event happens, and it gets pushed down the list while we fight another fire: which I don't want to happen in this case.

The Muppet

A question for the members of the act social group. Who are ye asking to be accountable and to whome? I ask because we have all been told and told others that this is not a democracy and the owners can do as they wish. Has this changed recently?

Apologies if the question is off topic here but I would genuinly like to know.

_blank_

Why not get access and ask?

The Muppet

Des wrote: »

Why not get access and ask?

I don't like private forums, they tend to be too clique for my liking, plus joining could be seen as endorsment of their agenda. I would rather know what I was signing up to before deciding whether to join or not.

_blank_

The Muppit wrote: »

I don't like private forums, they tend to be too clique for my liking, plus joining could be seen as endorsment of their agenda. I would rather know what I was signing up to before deciding whether to join or not.

Then click on my sig and have a read.

The Muppet

Des wrote: »

Then click on my sig and have a read.

I can't see sigs on this temporary account, I will check it out when i get my proper account back.

_blank_

The Muppit wrote: »

I can't see sigs on this temporary account, I will check it out when i get my proper account back.

No need to wait. Just click here

sceptre

The Muppit wrote: »

I can't see sigs on this temporary account, I will check it out when i get my proper account back.

Click "show signatures" on this page (your User CP options). And sort out your account.:)

RoundyMooney

I assure you it's as far from a clique as you'll find.

And I'm no fan of private fora, to say the least.

Click the link, and join. If you don't agree, no one will think any less of you

Nevyn

Joining is not seen as an endorsement and you don't need permission to leave.

The Muppet

Fair enough, I'll have a look.

The Muppet

Tried to get in it but I don't have enough posts.

dr.bollocko

You need 25 unforunately. Apologies for the annoyance. Drop me a pm if you need anything else as I fear we are dragging this thread horribly off topic.

The Muppet

N.P. but I have to say that I find it a little ironic that a group calling for transparancy would set itself up in a private group.

tbh

The Muppit wrote: »

N.P. but I have to say that I find it a little ironic that a group calling for transparancy would set itself up in a private group.

it's really just private so the lads can have a bit of peace to sort out what they want to say, not to stop people from reading or contributing - take it from me!

Fajitas!

but I have to say that I find it a little ironic that a group calling for transparancy would set itself up in a private group.

It's not exactly private, anyone can join, anyone can leave. Everyone has access, if they want the access

That fact that we're not doing it here as live doesn't negate the feedback that's been given so far.

Well, my problem with that would be, how do I know if my feedback is being taken on board, and if it is, how it's being taken up - which I find discouraging, I'm hesitant to give feedback if it's not going to be received... if you get me?

The Admin debates won't last forever, neither will the discussion we'll be having with the Mods - everything has to come to an end point. I'm looking at this thread as a kind of "public consultation" where people are having a chance to input into it with their thoughts. Consultations can only go on for so long though and while we have some motion, I want to capitalise on it

I completely agree that consultations and debates don't last forever, but their outcome should lead to a resolution that all are involved and happy with. Yes, it might lead to a bit of rabble, but there's another discussion in progress about that whole side of it.

I reckon you could capitalise on this in more than one way - As I said earlier, a good exercise in communication between the Admin team and user base.

Hagar

The social group is 100% visible to every admin and the existance of the group is being actively promoted via members sigs to all the posters on this site. Admittance to the group is just a matter of a PM, I don't think we have refused a single poster to date. In my view that is pretty transparent.

We don't have the ability to create a forum and having a forum created through the normal channels is a slow enough process. We don't want to go outside the Boards forum as we are very much a Boards community. That leaves us with forming a Social Group.

Why not make a couple of extra posts and come and see what it is all about?

tbh

Fajitas! wrote: »

I completely agree that consultations and debates don't last forever, but their outcome should lead to a resolution that all are involved and happy with.

they should - but they won't. Human nature. Can the people who don't get what they want live with it tho, that's the real question.
In fairness to ACT, one thing they've done is shown that it's not just the usual voices fighting the power this time. That of itself is pause for thought.