Guard Dog Quits Position

podgemonster

Ok heres the backstory. We live 200m from our farm yard. We have always have a dog around to bark to know if someone was around and also for company for my father and granfather while they were working, never an aggressive dog.

The last dog we had was prince, a mixed labrador breed, very friendly and very hungry but a great barker. As always my grandparents fed him everyday and took him for walks the odd time. He had a dog house and a bed, tho he prefered to sleep on straw with the cattle.
Unfortunatley my Grandparents are no longer with us and my Dad took over feeding the dog etc...

Prince started going down the road to an 50 yr old couple who would give them their dinner scraps, this became a regular thing and now Prince no longer visits the yard. He remains outside this couples door and they have put a bed and old doghouse outside for him. Im pretty sure they feed him proper dog fod now tho.

Whenever we see prince (rarely) he tucks his tail and is reluctant to approach maybe because he knows he should be in the yard (1 pat on the head and hes fine however).

Naturally he is not MY dog but I wonder is it right to take Prince from this couple and ask them to ignore him or is he happier with them. My father is quite annoyed not because of the lack of a guard dog but more the lack of company. Also if we get a new dog would it happen again?

star-pants

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question - who's dog is it?
Is Prince your family's dog?

If so, the couple were wrong to 'adopt' him in this manner, putting out a bed and so forth, if they knew he belonged to someone.

podgemonster

It was my grandfathers dog, there was nothing in a will or anything about transfer of ownership. But it was my grandfathers farm and now its my fathers.

star-pants

Well ... technically the dog is your family dog.
Do ye have a license for him? is he insured?

The decision is really up to yourselves, if you want to try and 'take' your dog back - how old is Prince?
IF ye decided he's older and so perhaps better down with the other couple, and feel you might be upsetting him trying to take him back, and decide to get a new dog - I think you should have a word with them. Ask them do they wish to adopt Prince - that if they do then you guys will no longer mind him/take him to the vets so forth , that Prince would be their full responsibility. And that if you are getting a new dog, for them *not* to feed the new dog or take it in.

By the sounds of it, you may have lost Prince, if he's guilty and sad coming in to you, not doing his job and so forth, it might be more stress to try and get him back / retrain to do his job. But not an impossible task if you want him back.

But if you do get a new dog, I think you need to spend more time with the dog too, to make sure it knows it's owners/family.

TooManyDogs

Dogs are funny little people. I inherited a little terrier when my mother died, and I also moved house shortly afterwards. She decided she prefered the neighbours to us at the new house and moved in with them! :eek: We had very little fencing between the 2 gardens and gradually I noticed her kennel had moved next door, then her food bowl and lead.

Initially I was really hurt and upset, took it personally that she didn't like me anymore. It took me ages to realise that it wasn't that she didn't like me, just that the lady next door was really like my Mam, and I'd say reminded my terrier of her. She was happier next door so gradually I learned to live with it, knowing she was happier next door.

So my advice is to leave Prince where he is, maybe the couple down the road remind him of your grandfather, and he's just happier there. He won't bother being a watch dog to your dad's farm if he feels he's happier down the road anyway.

Magenta

TooManyDogs wrote: »

Dogs are funny little people. I inherited a little terrier when my mother died, and I also moved house shortly afterwards. She decided she prefered the neighbours to us at the new house and moved in with them! :eek: We had very little fencing between the 2 gardens and gradually I noticed her kennel had moved next door, then her food bowl and lead.

Would you not have spoken to the neighbours about them taking things that don't belong to them? First the dog, then her kennel, bowl and lead?
That's stealing!

TooManyDogs

If they had taken the things for their own dog, or were actively encouraging my dog over to their house I would have considered it stealing. But cos it was her stuff and she made the first move and chose to live there I didn't mind. When she eventually died they gave all the stuff back, they're good neighbours so I didn't see the point in damaging relations when they were so good to her and doted on her.

Magenta

TooManyDogs wrote: »

If they had taken the things for their own dog, or were actively encouraging my dog over to their house I would have considered it stealing. But cos it was her stuff and she made the first move and chose to live there I didn't mind. When she eventually died they gave all the stuff back, they're good neighbours so I didn't see the point in damaging relations when they were so good to her and doted on her.

My neighbours used to "borrow" my cat for hours. I'd be out looking for her and the whole time they would have her in their house. I had to ask them to stop because she's my cat, and if she has an accident in their house or gets sick, who pays the vets' bills?

Before that, other people had taken their cat, and they weren't happy about it, but yet they did the same with my cat and thought nothing of it!

TooManyDogs

Magenta wrote: »

My neighbours used to "borrow" my cat for hours. I'd be out looking for her and the whole time they would have her in their house. I had to ask them to stop because she's my cat, and if she has an accident in their house or gets sick, who pays the vets' bills?

Before that, other people had taken their cat, and they weren't happy about it, but yet they did the same with my cat and thought nothing of it!

Yeah, that'd be very annoying, can completely understand why you'd be upset. Def not the case in my situation. My little terrier used to track my neighbour whenever she left the house! We live in a small rural village and if the neighbour went up to the pub, or mass, or even to the girl who does beauty treatments she'd find the dog waiting for her when she was leaving the place!!! In the end it was just easier for my neighbour to bring her with her where she went, cos the dog was going to end up there anyway!

boomerang

Maybe Prince himself is craving a bit of company, especially since your Grandad passed away? The yard is 200m from your house, and maybe your Dad doesn't spend much time down there every day? Makes sense to me that he would gravitate towards the neighbours' house if he's kept out in the yard and doesn't get much attention. No reason for a dog to be constantly hungry either, unless he's not getting enough food or he has a medical problem. That would have tempted him towards the neighbours too, particularly if they're giving him scraps. If they're giving him proper dog food now I think they've emotionally invested in him and would be reluctant to give him back.

I think you've got to decide what's best for Prince. But I would follow star-pants advice. If you're happy to let the neighbours keep Prince you should tell them that he is now their responsibility and encourage them to get a dog licence so if Prince ever bit anyone or caused an accident - they'd be held responsible as the dog's owners, not you.

To be honest the common denominator in all of the stories in this thread is a lack of secure fencing so that the dog has the option to roam. In my book, that's just wrong. No dog should be given the opportunity to wander. I know it's not very feasible to enclose a farm though! Plus I think the dog would be miserable confined in a run to prevent him going to the neighbours.

There's no dog that would be happy spending long hours alone without company, kept apart from the family with nothing to do. So yes I think it's very likely if your Dad gets another dog and keeps him the same way, that the same thing will happen.

anniehoo

Is anyone else totally confused as to how you can literally lose your dog to a neighbour?

Animals arent stupid so if theyre getting better fed, more attention and more love somewhere else i dont blame them for trying to find a new family. My neighbours loved my dog too...but i certainly wouldnt of let her just "move next door" and think it was grand.Id be looking at myself to be honest and what kind of a pet owner i was to let it happen in the first place or am i missing something here?

Blueprint

No, I was thinking the same...

I know for a fact that there's no way either my dog or my 3 cats would decide to move owners on me, as they know where they're well off!

Years ago we did have a part time dog of a sort, we were living out in the country and this Lab used to come and visit us every day because her owner left her alone all day and she was lonely. We were the only family around who actually used to go for walks around there, so she'd just tag along. The poor dog was pretty neglected (fed and housed, but not much care or attention given), but she always went home at around six to greet her owners.

TooManyDogs

anniehoo wrote: »

Id be looking at myself to be honest and what kind of a pet owner i was to let it happen in the first place or am i missing something here?

I think you also have to take into consideration that my dog and the OP's dog lost their elderly owner. In my case my Mam's terrier had been her constant companion for 10 years, their was only the 2 of them in the house and they had a quiet life together. When my Mam died and I took her dog, she was living in a house with 3 other much younger dogs, in a house that was being gutted and re-built with a younger couple who certainly didn't have as quiet a lifestyle as my Mam did.

I don't agree with not having fences either but unfortunately the garden was half an acre with no fencing, one of the first things we did was start fencing but with that amount of fencing to be done you're talking thousands of euro, so it took us time.

So was it fair to insist a much older dog live in a very lively house when she clearly wasnt happy? Or let her live next door with an older couple in a much quieter house? Funny thing is though, whenever we went away for the weekend with the other dogs she'd appear as we were packing the car and come with us! I know I didn't treat her badly, and wasn't a bad owner, I simply couldn't give her what she was grieving for, the lady next door could. And don't tell me dogs don't grieve......

anniehoo

TooManyDogs wrote: »

So was it fair to insist a much older dog live in a very lively house when she clearly wasnt happy? Or let her live next door with an older couple in a much quieter house?

No of course not but its this part that im confused by

TooManyDogs wrote: »

gradually I noticed her kennel had moved next door, then her food bowl and lead.

How do you "gradually" see things like that and not wonder what was going on?The animal shouldnt have chosen a new home by itself, you should have, if you couldnt manage. A dog doesnt wake up one day and decide "hmmm i think ill pack my bags and move gaffs for a quieter life"!

Im just a bit astonished that all your pets belongings end up in another persons house without wondering what was going on. Rehoming a pet that isnt suitable for its environment-that i can accept, its letting the dog do it over a period of time basically by itself without querying it has me confused.

TooManyDogs

anniehoo wrote: »

A dog doesnt wake up one day and decide "hmmm i think ill pack my bags and move gaffs for a quieter life"!

Im just a bit astonished that all your pets belongings end up in another persons house without wondering what was going on. Rehoming a pet that isnt suitable for its environment-that i can accept, its letting the dog do it over a period of time basically by itself without querying it has me confused.

Actually this dog did decide to move. And then when it rained she put their dog out of his kennel hence them taking her kennel. Of course I noticed it was gone, and was talking to them about it, and decided to leave it there once I heard the reason for them taking it.

I think you should read my initial post where I stated that I was very upset when she first started going next door but gradually realised it was the best thing for her. She was safe and as loved next door as she was in my house, I continued to pay for all vaccines, worm doses etc.

Who said I couldn't manage her??? You decided that all on your own. She was simply happier spending most of her time next door and coming into me to visit, then go back next door for more peace and quiet. Of course I would have prefered her to be happy to live with me permanantly but she wasn't, she was happy and safe next door. So I felt it better to let her live there and not force her to be unhappy. Until you've been in that situation you can't really criticise someone else.

anniehoo

TooManyDogs wrote: »

Until you've been in that situation you can't really criticise someone else.

Fair enough. Im not criticising just trying to understand thats all.

Magenta

TooManyDogs wrote: »

I continued to pay for all vaccines, worm doses etc.

Did she ever need any vet treatment? You were paying for her routine stuff, what happened if she had an accident in their home, would you have paid for treatment for that too?

TooManyDogs

Yeah, I ended up paying a huge bill for her when she got ill. I considered her my responsibility until the day she died. The way I saw it was that I didn't choose for her to live next door, they didn't choose for her to live there either, she did that all on her own. Initially they would send her home straight away but she simply wouldnt go! So if she was happier to live there, and they were happy for her to be there, then it made me feel better to make sure she never lacked any medical care.

TooManyDogs

anniehoo wrote: »

Fair enough. Im not criticising just trying to understand thats all.

Fair enough. I guess it's just a bit of a sensitive area, you can't imagine how sh*t you can feel by your dog not wanting to live with you, particularily when it's a final link to your Mam. It hurts like hell. And you're left with the choice of forcing her to be unhappy when she's already hurting because she's without her owner (how do you explain death to a dog?) or letting her do what's obviously best for her.

star-pants

Toomanydogs - that's very sweet what you did, you obviously had the dogs best interest at heart and saw where she was happiest. Not an easy task.

Now if we could get back on topic for advice on the OP

lrushe

My neighbour leaves her bedroom window open so my cat can climb up onto her extension and get in to sleep on her bed :eek: I don't really mind as she always comes home. I know it might be hurtful but your dog has choosen to go to the couple as he must be getting something there that he's not getting at home at least that what I hope brings my cat home everyday. If he is happy where he is I say just leave him be, dogs are super loyal and won't just wander off and live down the road for no reason so if you do get another dog in the future pay it a bit more attention and it won't want to go anywhere

podgemonster

boomerang wrote: »

Maybe Prince himself is craving a bit of company, especially since your Grandad passed away? The yard is 200m from your house, and maybe your Dad doesn't spend much time down there every day? Makes sense to me that he would gravitate towards the neighbours' house if he's kept out in the yard and doesn't get much attention. No reason for a dog to be constantly hungry either, unless he's not getting enough food or he has a medical problem. That would have tempted him towards the neighbours too, particularly if they're giving him scraps. If they're giving him proper dog food now I think they've emotionally invested in him and would be reluctant to give him back.

I think you've got to decide what's best for Prince. But I would follow star-pants advice. If you're happy to let the neighbours keep Prince you should tell them that he is now their responsibility and encourage them to get a dog licence so if Prince ever bit anyone or caused an accident - they'd be held responsible as the dog's owners, not you.

To be honest the common denominator in all of the stories in this thread is a lack of secure fencing so that the dog has the option to roam. In my book, that's just wrong. No dog should be given the opportunity to wander. I know it's not very feasible to enclose a farm though! Plus I think the dog would be miserable confined in a run to prevent him going to the neighbours.

There's no dog that would be happy spending long hours alone without company, kept apart from the family with nothing to do. So yes I think it's very likely if your Dad gets another dog and keeps him the same way, that the same thing will happen.

Ok jus to answer a few Q's:
The always hungry remark, thats jus a humourous comment, as Prince would go crazy when about to be feed and has a rep of smelling out sandwiches\breakfast rolls. In no way was he mal nurished and in fact was feed quality food on a daily basis.

Prince is 9 and is not insured (he isnt a pure bred or anything like that).
Also I am not his owner, never was, my Grandfather was. My father then assumed ownership.

I am inclined to agree with star-pants and TooManyDogs. Prince is probably happier at the neighbours. Plus taking him home and keeping him there would probably involve a chain and thats going down the wrong route.

I would expect my father to get a new guard dog in time. The comments and personal situations have all been very helpful so far, thank you!

Magenta

podgemonster wrote: »

Prince is 9 and is not insured (he isnt a pure bred or anything like that).

Non purebreds can run up high bills the same as any other dog.

joyce2009

you know the old saying ,,,let sleeping dogs lie,,, i think in this case it literally means that...:)