Milsim exposure, letting people have a go

Puding

SligoAirsoft wrote: »

Lads, can we not just take the best of the experiences we've had from events in England and abroad and introduce these elements to the younger airsoft players who may not get the opportunity to travel and experience them, I've been in Redbarn and watched the lads tell stories of Sennybridge and the likes and watched the way the younger ones hang on every word....

Lets not lose track of what this tread want to accomplish

a change of rule sets and the right attitude and you can have your own story from ireland to tell but will not happen over night, what needs to happen is those players telling the storys should then be encouraging the sites and helping players to get into this area of airsoft, there in a perfect position, take the interested they generate from the story's they tell and let it grow

Hivemind187

I've been crunching numbers on the ride home and I have a few ideas in my noggin regarding this.

What it would take though is the following;

20-30 experienced MilSimmers to play a semi-NPC role as the OpFor. Please dont say "my whole tea,m is up for this" because that doesnt help with numbers. We'd need accurate and reliable data.

2-6 commanders (a senior each side and a few field i/c's).

4-8 marshals.

A large enough venue to accomodate 60-80 people comfortably without having to stand on top of one another and enough cover to make moving from one area to another unseen possible without losing out on the challenge factor.

Two "Game Controllers" (no xbox gags).

Some props.

Some maps.

A story.

6 weeks of planning.

2-3 months of advertising (web, retailers, posters, forums).

A forum thread or two.

A stack of radios.

A whole day.

... Roberts your mothers brother.

Keeping the scenario simple (Think "Counter Strike").

The OpFor are terrorists (we'll find some way to indicate this visually).

The "newbs" are the cops/commandos.

The Commanders are directing the thrust and parry of the over all battle, radioing instructions and commands to their units in the field.

The OpFor are on script - carefully controlled contacts and maneuvers so as not to overwhelm the new players but still provide a pretty big challenge.

The objectives/plot events are issued via the controllers to the I.C's (set up coms station, establish overwatch position, capture documents, steal nukes etc etc) and are simple enough to not require field interpretation (a known issue even for experienced players).

Building to building FIBUA is preferable for this because it is less hampered by the weather and its easier to plot for (trust me on that).

Rules are simplified. Players are told they can carry - say - 600 rounds in total between all of their guns. No uniform restrictions (the OpFor will all wear balaclavas or something ... luminous ones ... with polka dots). Usual grenade rules. Simple medic rules. No executions etc. Respawn time to not exceed a half hour (for a full day)

The senior commanders will need to be on the ball and it might be worth placing some experienced players in the command of the newb units just to keep things a little more controlled.

So, if we were able to sort out a venue, who would actually be prepared to step up and commit to something like this?

*also coverage for AI and Take Aim would be a bonus to any repeat effort while getting the word out to others.

Firekitten

Count me Deffinately in here Ronan for whatever you think I could help with Don't mind doing more than one job to get this to fly.....

If you would like... I have a decent scenario half written that i think would fit perfectly, would you like me to have a flick over it and pass it on?

fayer

Only venue I know of that could handle this properly is MAC?

Hivemind187

Firekitten wrote: »

Count me Deffinately in here Ronan for whatever you think I could help with Don't mind doing more than one job to get this to fly.....

If you would like... I have a decent scenario half written that i think would fit perfectly, would you like me to have a flick over it and pass it on?

Sure. I actually have one written already but I wouldnt mind taking a look at what you have.

SligoAirsoft

sounds good to me but the big question is where ???
We have to remember that this is geared towards the younger airsoft players as an introduction and therefore location will play a big part regarding attendance....

Would Moyvalley allow something like this ??? I am of the understanding that along with the gaming areas used in the Take Aim there is a much larger woodland that could be used also and the last time I was there just before Christmas the lads spoke of events being launched like this in the summer spanning over a full weekend.

only asking correct me if I'm wrong or if for some reason it would be out of the question.....

evilrobotshane

Hivemind187 wrote: »

So, if we were able to sort out a venue, who would actually be prepared to step up and commit to something like this?

I am, of course. Let me know what you need.

Hivemind187

SligoAirsoft wrote: »

sounds good to me but the big question is where ???
We have to remember that this is geared towards the younger airsoft players as an introduction and therefore location will play a big part regarding attendance....

Youre right, location is a major factor but you could have the best location on earth and still get nowhere without a decent set of heads putting the nuts and bolts together. Right now we can get an answer on who is and who isnt actually interested in playing and look at the logisitics like venues tomorow.

Hivemind187

evilrobotshane wrote: »

I am, of course. Let me know what you need.

You sir, are a leg end in your own lunchbox.

Firekitten

Hivemind187 wrote: »

You sir, are a leg end in your own lunchbox.

Evil Robot Shane: the only man to take package sandwitches to a hard routine milsim : Legend

Leftyflip

I'm there to marshal if you need me Ronan.

Firekitten

Sneak preview of a scenario i have available... which is possibly workable for this?

The Bear and the Bolshevic - Scenario

In the 1950s, The NKVD established a research station on the outskirts of the small boarder town of Shevzitva, in Northern Georgia. The facility operated under the smoke screen of the Kremlin for 39 years, before closing its doors one day, and being left to rot, like the former glory of the USSR. 20 Years later…. 2009, The Sourinksy Research facility’s long dormant lights blaze once more, and people have begun to vanish.

Who is involved?

The KGB:
Information has filtered through the usual contacts with strange details… The Sourinsky Facility has gone active again. Who? Why? What? The KGB sends a small unit to Shevzitva to investigate the quality of the information regarding such a black stain on their history.

The MVD (Russian Army):
Sent by the Kremlin to assist the local Law enforcement of Shevzitva,t he Local MVD commander on the ground is tasked to be ready for ‘any’ eventuality.

Mossad:
KGB intercepts refer to a long dead project that Mossadhad only heard snippets of during its near 40 year existence. One of Russia’s best kept secrets…. project Второй Шанс… The chillingly named, ‘Second Chance’. Mossad dispatches men to this Eastern European Hotspot to find out more before it can be hidden again.

Note: Using Mossad as the ‘friendly’ intelligence agency allows scope for a ‘middleeastern’ *event* and will tie the two events together… This allows a coherent ‘chase’ for *insert bioweapon company* and their sticky paw prints all over the globe, USA, Russia, Syria… Korea… ondwards toward the climax of the events wherever this may fall… Only an Idea, but it gives coherent scope to the event’s theme… the virus, local uprisings when *insert bioweapon company here* gets into town, being chased down by intelligence agencies using the civilians for their own ends… Potential for a massive showdown… Mercs, the free world… big badda boom… forget who said that… nevermind.

Shevzitva Population:
Unease has spread through the civilian population of Shevzitva, fuelled by long dead rumours and ghost stories. The population begin to



Sourinksy facility background:
Lead by Doctor Vasilli Durenko in the 1970s to the facility’s close in 1989 under unlisted circumstances. Vasilli was poached from the USSR on its collapse in 1990 and began working for Bio-Trax Corporation who provited him the faclilities, funding and equiptment to further his research, at any cost….
The facility was used for multiple human experimentations during its existence, and notably for Project Второй Шанс.
Rumours state this project was the cause for the 1989 shutdown, and Durenko’s ‘disappearance.’



Team Roles:
Govornment troops, IE, MVD, are peace keepers. Respawn locations and general AO is village perimeter. With ‘checkpoints’ on the roads out. Operating on patrols, snatch and grabs, and defensive jobs. Namely, cordon of the facility, not allowing exit or entry to village. (can be plot worked to create tension) and LEO type roles.

Civilians, respawning at locations within the village. No overall commander, but several lesser command roles, at each respawn location, similar to platoon commanders operating on their own remit. Each will be operating for their own end, although a similar end goal, allows alliances and betrayals within and infighting… In village respawns allows for more civilian population within the 'town', and in houses with less of the ‘house to house spraysoft and general ‘take the village, defend the village crap that generally arrises at obua locations (presuming senny at this point). This should also reinforce the ‘our town’ mentality, and allows for snatch and grab operations on those locales and patrols. It is very much the townsfolk’s place at first… Perhaps a mayor in overall command at the town hall.

Potentially usage of the top ‘patrol base’ as ‘Facility Sourinksy’ Remoteness from village yet relative close proximity provides ample situational control… I found 11 as biotrax too close to the fire and too contained.


Note: Written for a Sennybridge event that was planned but didnt happen, Can be modified to fit the available site obviously...

Hivemind187

Kitten, I like it - lots of scope, factions and intrigue - but in my opinion it's a bit too complex for what we are looking to do.

The key element of this is that it is meant to draw in the inexperienced skirmisher and (hopefully) brainwash convert them to a MilSimmer.

What I was thinking was more along the lines of slightly exaggerated MilSim elements, focussing some very simplistic plots (and the objectives that go with them) on the key elements of MilSim as a game; Objectives, Communication, Tactical Maneuvers, Timing etc

I'm not sure that having a half dozen lads standing around at a check point waiting for something to happen is going to do much to help impress the skeptic or reform the brapp-meister unless we are going to attempt to direct players right at them - which puts us back on the "skirmish" side of things.

What I think we need here is something that bridges the gap (taking on board the points various well screwed on heads have made) between the "Uber-l33t-gucci-softing-mil-sim-commando" and "Joe Skirmisher". This means they will want action.

A simpler set up of newbies on attack and OpFor on defence would be easier to control and give a better experience to the new player. I guess what I'm driving at is the SAS Killhouse on a grand scale - forcing them to play and act in a co-ordinated fashion while learning to conserve their brappage for when its needed - yet not letting the pace slow down so much that their attention drifts and they start wandering around looking for something to vandalise.

Say, for example, a simpler scenario of:

"Unspecified Terrorists" have occupied the town of Ballyrimjob and have planted a series of powerful explosives in buildings within the town. They have issued "Vague Threats" and seem intent on detonating the devices if their "Absurd Demands" are not met. Add to this a number of hostages (NPC's) who are in need of rescue and a "Terrorist Leader" in need of capture and you have as many as two dozen objectives and its still a direct action by the "Newbie Commandos".

Say a dozen "Oil Drum Bombs" which need to be captured and dis-armed (either by the players or by escorting an NPC into position), a half dozen "hostages" in need of rescue and extraction and one "Terrorist Leader" who need to be captured and extracted to a specific point. A couple of curve ball missions thrown in to the game for good effect like sabotaging the communications lines between the buildings or capturing terrorist uniforms for infiltration attempts and you round off the day nicely. Tea, medals, all of that.

However, thats not to say your plot/plan isnt without its merits for flavour text but I think it's selling the content you have short to throw it away on what is essentially an introduction to MilSim.

Firekitten

Twas a flying idea really... I've got 12 or so similar ones worked up lol. The plan, is probably a tad extreme, but would be good for a later one if we got a mod site... deffinately.

As for this, mm, yours works, but im a little sensative about having a game involving 'terrorists and bombs' here... or the chatter that would inebitably happen between airsofters on forums, the phone or in the pub ith some loose lipped gob****e ending up having the gardai coming to join in the fun en force.

The concept works, its simple and effective.

I'll write up another simple one in a bit to toss into the mix... anyone got any maps of prospective sites? (would help actually)

MerryDespot

Hivemind187 wrote: »

the town of Ballyrimjob

Ballyrimjob ... nice ...
Joking aside, I see no noobs signing up here yet, so let me be the first - I'm on for this Hivemind.
... have balaclava - will travel!

Hivemind187

Bombs, bags of money, gene samples, illicit pictures of Gordon Brown doing interesting things with a scullery maid ... the object isnt all that important (though bombs are easier to write a believeable reason about).

I know what you mean about having games written. Once you get your first one done its almost impossible to stop.

Firekitten

I'm a writer part time... the thought of being able to live something i've writen is far too tempting to resist.:D

coys

I'd love to give this a try!! also, if theres any way I can help, gimmie a shout

gungun

all the ideas for story line sound brilliant:)
im dying to get into the milsim stuff (all those shuper shpec opsh movies do that i guess:D) ((but yes. i know milsim wont be all like that, another reason i wanna try it))
not sure if i could be of any help in organiseing a possible event except for spreading the word

se conman

I would love to attend this event and would have a few empty seats if anyone needed a lift from the Kilkenny area.

SligoAirsoft

Hivemind187 wrote: »

Right now we can get an answer on who is and who isnt actually interested in playing and look at the logisitics like venues tomorow.

Easy tiger !!!! only making a suggestion, the last time I checked that's what this was about didn't know we had to wait for set times to make them.......

Thanks for letting us in on the agenda so who is taking the minutes

Hivemind187

SligoAirsoft wrote: »

Easy tiger !!!! only making a suggestion, the last time I checked that's what this was about didn't know we had to wait for set times to make them.......

Thanks for letting us in on the agenda so who is taking the minutes

I think you may have taken me up wrong. Its the lack of tonality on the internet.

Bad internet ... no biscuit.

Damo 2k9

I'd be up for it anyways (another noob) depending on where it is,and I'm sure that is a big factor for any other of the young people
Maybe a bus or something could be good, with different pick up locations along the way to the site could work ?
Also, would this be run over a weekend or what ?

Spooky-Vinny

My only problem to the "mid caps only" or "limited ammo" thing is that my gun is not up to scratch or good enough to be able to take these into affect well. But dont get me wrong, i would looooove to start playing milsim but for me(and im sure somepeople out there feel the same) it will cost us a great deal of money more to have a good time.
if you know what i mean?
for example:
my gun is terrible.. fps, rate of fire, accuracy, range! i basicly have a love hate for my gun...
but where in a skirmish all i must do is shoot twice as much ammo to make up for my bad stats of my gun, in a milsim i would be wasting ammo, which i can only imagen to be very fustrating as a mid cap would only hold about 150 rounds...
also i would love to play the "semi-auto" but my gun is too inaccurate which i would only imagen to be uber fustrating...
but dont get me wrong, i would love to play milsim, i love the thought of it all, i have used my friends proper guns for all requerments of milsim and it is perfect and very very enjoyable where with my gun... it only depresses me... ='(

also what would be the rules for box mags?
xXx

Puding

Spooky-Vinny wrote: »

My only problem to the "mid caps only" or "limited ammo" thing is that my gun is not up to scratch or good enough to be able to take these into affect well. But dont get me wrong, i would looooove to start playing milsim but for me(and im sure somepeople out there feel the same) it will cost us a great deal of money more to have a good time.
if you know what i mean?
for example:
my gun is terrible.. fps, rate of fire, accuracy, range! i basicly have a love hate for my gun...
but where in a skirmish all i must do is shoot twice as much ammo to make up for my bad stats of my gun, in a milsim i would be wasting ammo, which i can only imagen to be very fustrating as a mid cap would only hold about 150 rounds...
also i would love to play the "semi-auto" but my gun is too inaccurate which i would only imagen to be uber fustrating...
but dont get me wrong, i would love to play milsim, i love the thought of it all, i have used my friends proper guns for all requerments of milsim and it is perfect and very very enjoyable where with my gun... it only depresses me... ='(

also what would be the rules for box mags?
xXx

i can understand your thought but i would not worry, of course if you have a upgrades aeg there can be some advantage but as with everything in milsim if you work together with your team the limitation you explain will have less impact in milsim due to the team work

and box mags would be a big no no unless on a replica support weapon

Damo 2k9

I think Hivemind said there is a limit of 600 bbs, im guessing that your aloud use hi caps but not aloud have more than 600 rounds combined
Not sure tho :P

Spooky-Vinny

Puding wrote: »

i can understand your thought but i would not worry, of course if you have a upgrades aeg there can be some advantage but as with everything in milsim if you work together with your team the limitation you explain will have less impact in milsim due to the team work

and box mags would be a big no no unless on a replica support weapon

i can understand your point but i still stand by my point where it would not be as good fun as there are moments in airsoft where i would be sadened by the fact that i would havto decide if i would hit this (possibly moving) target and if he is in range of my gun, where i could make a complete mess of the situation and just expose myself.
im not sure if you can understand my fustration i have with my gun,
although resently i tried a lipo in my gun, and believe it or not, it is a miracle cure for my gun of some sort, i can explain why but it picks my guns states up to the point where i'v matched all other players again... but im afraid of it tearing my gun inside out...

and so box mags are allowed for all support weapons?
i feel that this is unfair lol
xXx

Leftyflip

Box mags only belong on support guns, box mags on anything else is just ridiculous.

Box mags on M4s = Disgusting
Box mags on Stubby Killers = Appalling.
Box mags on G36s = Just wrong
Box mags on Mp5s = WTF???
etc

Spooky-Vinny

Leftyflip wrote: »

Box mags only belong on support guns, box mags on anything else is just ridiculous.

Box mags on M4s = Disgusting
Box mags on Stubby Killers = Appalling.
Box mags on G36s = Just wrong
Box mags on Mp5s = WTF???
etc

i know what you mean,
but isn't the g36 also used as a support weapon in the real world?
xXx

Puding

Spooky-Vinny wrote: »

i can understand your point but i still stand by my point where it would not be as good fun as there are moments in airsoft where i would be sadened by the fact that i would havto decide if i would hit this (possibly moving) target and if he is in range of my gun, where i could make a complete mess of the situation and just expose myself.
im not sure if you can understand my fustration i have with my gun,
although resently i tried a lipo in my gun, and believe it or not, it is a miracle cure for my gun of some sort, i can explain why but it picks my guns states up to the point where i'v matched all other players again... but im afraid of it tearing my gun inside out...

and so box mags are allowed for all support weapons?
i feel that this is unfair lol
xXx

you will have those same worrys no matter how upgraded your aeg is do i open fire or not

i get what your saying 100% put i can not really say this nicely but you need to stop worrying about the competitive angle and being on a level with say other players in terms of aeg, in milsim you can complete and objective without firing a shot, in milsim the sides will not be level at times and the objectives will not be level so the fact that your aeg is not as upgraded as the next guy means relativity little to the bigger picture, just ask the guys at berget and to some extent sennybridge, you do not need to upgrade to be competitive, is 328 can go up against 400 then you will be fine

this is going to sound really bad, but if your that worried about being on a