band practice amp?

Squidgy Black

i need an amp just about loud enough to practice with my band.
my budgets around 100e and i was thinking of something like a 15 watt cube or one of those ga5's on thomann.
any ideas?

uniqueusername2

I think you'd be struggling to keep up with a drummer with a 15w solid state amp. A 15w valve would be more than enough but you probably would need at least a 30-50w solid state I'd say.
For 100 quid you're better off looking on adverts and see what you can pick up. More bang for your buck there I'd say.

r3nm0r3RASCAL

Would this be any good to ya? I know its a bit more powerful but its within your price range you could always turn it down!!!!!
amp

Blackhorse Slim

Just be aware there's a big difference between 15 watts valve and 15 watts solid state. The GA5 is 5 watts valve, and would likely be louder than the 15 watt cube. If your drummer is any way loud, I don't think either will really do - if he's quiet, then maybe. But even then, you'd be looking to get a little bit more from your amp.

You would be better off saving up a little more money, or looking for something second hand. The Harley Benton GA15 would be fine for volume - I don't know the amp itself, but it looks like a cheap Fender clone and 2 EL84 valves will give you plenty of volume.

If you prefer the cube, the 30watt cube would be a much better bet than the 15.

Squidgy Black

thanks for the help lads,
yeah he can be a pretty aggressive drummer sometimes,
i was just afraid anything big would be too much for the tiny room we practice in (and my ma wouldn't let me turn it on).
i might go with the ga15 or a 30 watt ss.

r3nm0r3RASCAL

no problem hope it works out for ya.

Sandvich

stetyrrell wrote: »

thanks for the help lads,
yeah he can be a pretty aggressive drummer sometimes,
i was just afraid anything big would be too much for the tiny room we practice in (and my ma wouldn't let me turn it on).
i might go with the ga15 or a 30 watt ss.

But the drummer would be taking up more space and making more noise than the vast majority of guitar amps. If your ma is okay with a drummer she'd be okay with a loud guitar amp.

As a general rule you need 50 Watts SS at least to get a clean sound over a drummer, and 20 or so Tube. It depends on a lot of things like speaker sensitivity(one of the reasons Tube amps are louder is that they generally have more expensive, more efficient speakers bundled with them).

To be honest you might stuggle a bit with a 30 Watt SS. 30 Watt is only slightly louder than 15 Watt. 150 Watts would be twice as loud as 15 Watts. So a 50 wat at least would be about 1.3 times as loud, which you'll percieve as a pretty big difference and should be about enough.

Squidgy Black

i never play without distortion, or at the least overdrive (sometimes both for fun), so clean sounds are pretty much out the window.
we practice in the drummers house so it kinda sounds too loud on it's own in my house.

Sandvich

What amp do you have now?

Keep in mind people say that it can't do "clean" at that level, that also means any distortion pedals you'd run through the clean, to a lower degree. After a while the amp's dirt will make your distortion pedal sound muddy or you'll get feedback.

Sandvich

I saw your ad on adverts, you're not going to get an amp you can jam with a drummer with for 100 euros and have it sound any good at all. The Cube 15 is unlikely to be loud enough. It might just about cut it, but why not save up and get something you know will actually work?

You don't want to get a new amp and have it sound like fizzy crap, or not keep up.

Maybe the best you could do is to find a Peavey Vypyr or Roland Cube 30 and make sure your drummer keeps quiet.

rcaz

stetyrrell wrote: »

i never play without distortion, or at the least overdrive (sometimes both for fun), so clean sounds are pretty much out the window.

Don't think like that when you're buying the amp though. Last thing you want it to save up for and buy an amp, only to decide later you want some cleans and have to go looking for a new amp again.

Sandvich

In my opinion you should get this -

http://www.adverts.ie/showproduct.php?product=182169&cat=55

It would be a fantastic amp. You'd never have trouble going against a drummer and since it's Solid State it'll sound just as good as quiet as you want it to go.

Squidgy Black

so it's now either between the peavey 75 watt and a 30 watt cube.
i'm guessing the peaveys a safer bet.
any opinions?

Sandvich

I noticed you having to haggle a bit. 130 is a really good deal for a Bandit I almost feel a little bad for them. They go for about 260 new. The Bandit is actually a "good" Solid State amp, most SS amps you'd buy in the shops aren't very good.

I know you probably don't have a lot of money, but 130 is not a lot of money for an amp. I spent 200 and a bit on my Vox AC4 and I barely consider that anything - while still finding most of the big tube amps that would get talked about here too expensive, they can be a thousand quid or over easily. I know you probably don't have a lot of money - but if you could borrow an extra 30 quid off someone, it'd be a great idea. The Bandit is a good enough amp that if you wanted more sounds, you could just get more pedals instead of a whole new amp. A lot of Swedish metal bands used that same amp.

Another suggestion;
http://www.candyappleredguitars.com/product_info.php?products_id=933&osCsid=19c1ff44febabcc7ab2d6f93a505067a

This is only a 15 Watter but a loud 15 Watter, it'd probably work alright alongside the drummer. And it's another "Good" amp. Peavey and Vox are the only ones who generally make good mass market Solid State amps for cheap.

Blackhorse Slim

stetyrrell wrote: »

so it's now either between the peavey 75 watt and a 30 watt cube.
i'm guessing the peaveys a safer bet.
any opinions?

They are both decent amps, the second hand Peavey would be ideal.

The_g-man

As an alternative to getting a loud amp to compete with loud drums, you could look in to muffling the drums volume. Over time you could collect the different accessories between the band and this would help to pick out clearly sections and sounds that need more attention during your practice.

In the mean time the Bandit doesn't look too bad, but keep an eye out for the cube 20x or 30x second hand as well. The built in effects may be a bonus to you.

Grolschevik

Go for the Bandit. You will not regret it (as long as it's working properly).

Don't be seduced by the idea that an amp with built in effects is "better". If I had the spare cash at the moment, I'd get it, because it's a good-sounding, loud and reliable amp that you can carry easily on the bus. A consideration not to be sniffed at!

I had a Peavey Studio Pro for years, and I loved the sound of it. I regret selling it to this day. In fact, it wouldn't be too innacurate to say that I've made every amp I've since owned (including expensive valve jobs) sound like the sound I learnt on. Which was the Peavey...

You will not regret buying that amp. Unless you need a very processed sound in one package.

Sandvich

OP, what are your plans now?

I really think you should borrow the 30 quid off someone and grab the Bandit. I don't think you realise that you're not going to get an amp you can physically hear over a drummer for 100 or under.

The only thing about the Bandit is that it's a 1x12 and might be a bit heavy for carting around. A 1x10 might be a bit lighter for you, I'd have no trouble carting my AC4 around but it's not very loud.

I think maybe looking out for a 30 Watt Spider amp might be a good idea, as long as you steer clear of the Spider IIIs, they have a bad reputation.

Also check out your local Cash Connectors, or whatever pawn shop you have around there. I've seen some interesting stuff in there on occasion, they have no idea how to price things which results in 50 euro Danelectro FAB pedals(which are 30 new at most) but sometimes you'll see things go for cheap to balance it. Make sure to tell us what you see though. Don't buy something purely because it says it's 30-50 watt.

Squidgy Black

tried out an artec 50 watt in waltons,
played clean over the drummer, well loud enough.
sold an old ds1 so my budget went up just enough so i'll probably pick one up soon. the peavey was waaaay too big for me to carry to and from practice.

Sandvich

50 watts should be able to get over a drummer. On your limited budget though I'd definitely go second hand. If you're patient enough stuff will turn up eventually, like I missed a deal on an MXR Blue Box only to get another a few days later. The difficulty will be in finding an amp that's loud enough, that you can carry around. If you had the money I'd recommend a ZT Lunchbox but that's unlikely to happen.

Are you sure the Peavey is too heavy for you? There are few amps that can clear a drummer that will be light enough to carry. You might want to look at the Envoy which is the model down from the bandit, if you can find one second hand.

I can't find anything about the Artec. The only amp I remember them making was that little portable one that looked kind of fun.

Grolschevik

Sandvich wrote: »

There are few amps that can clear a drummer that will be light enough to carry. .

My old Peavey was. Guitar in one hand, Peavey in the other.

Also, I gigged the other day with my Laney VC15 unmiked. It's 15 "valve watts" and only a 10" speaker. And it weighs about the same as my guitar in its hard case.

I gigged with a loud drummer, 5-string bass, acoustic guitar, and dual vocals. I was asked to turn down by the "sound guy". Now, the amp cut through, but there was very little in the realms of low end oomph, so, while it did the trick, it wasn't the best option.

A 50w solid state 1x12" is more than portable and will be heard. Again, go for that Peavey. Or I will...

Squidgy Black

yeah only waltons sell them. Drive channel sounded muddy but i use pedals anyways. 130 for the 50 watt. They had a 35 watt but the extra 20 quids worth the safety. Great advice though lads. Saved me from wasting my money on a smaller amp.

Sandvich

Grolschevik wrote: »

My old Peavey was. Guitar in one hand, Peavey in the other.

Also, I gigged the other day with my Laney VC15 unmiked. It's 15 "valve watts" and only a 10" speaker. And it weighs about the same as my guitar in its hard case.

I gigged with a loud drummer, 5-string bass, acoustic guitar, and dual vocals. I was asked to turn down by the "sound guy". Now, the amp cut through, but there was very little in the realms of low end oomph, so, while it did the trick, it wasn't the best option.

A 50w solid state 1x12" is more than portable and will be heard. Again, go for that Peavey. Or I will...

I could totally do with a fairly lightweight amp that can do that. I have a ZT Lunchbox which has amazing cleans but it has no dirt on it and needs to be connected up to a cab. I'd love to get a get up and go combo I can take around when size and weight isn't as at a premium as it would be taking my smaller amps, but still handy enough not to kill my back. Do you have any idea? My budget would be a lot bigger than the OP's though, I'd be looking at up to 400 used, 450 new. Was considering a JCM2000 combo but it might be too heavy, or the new Jet City 20 Watter but it has no effects loop and little headroom.

I know Laney make a few "metal" type amps; the guys from Opeth used them. But do they make a high gain combo?

Sandvich

stetyrrell wrote: »

yeah only waltons sell them. Drive channel sounded muddy but i use pedals anyways. 130 for the 50 watt. They had a 35 watt but the extra 20 quids worth the safety. Great advice though lads. Saved me from wasting my money on a smaller amp.

It's silly purposely getting an amp with muddy dirt. You can manage something with decent dirt for that price, so why not? It'd probably be better than any of your pedals. What do you have? Please don't say Metal Zone.

130 for the Bandit would be a steal - you should go for it.

Squidgy Black

ds1, sd1 and soon an od3. Nah got rid of the metalzone. Now have a metalcore :P

Sandvich

stetyrrell wrote: »

ds1, sd1 and soon an od3. Nah got rid of the metalzone. Now have a metalcore :P

I don't think it's a lot better. The SD1 is a great pedal though. Do you really need an OD3? It'll be similar to the SD1.

The thing is, if you're just getting generic Boss distortion pedals, a good amp will cover that territory. If you're getting unique distortions and fuzz pedals, I can understand(or a pedal like an SD-1 as it's a good boost and tube amp emulator).

The distortion on the Peavey Bandit would probably kick the balls off the metalcore.

Squidgy Black

my cousin's a big boss fan so i don't complain, i get the leftovers.

Squidgy Black

another option would be to get the ga5 and on of those cheap 1x12 cabs hmm...

Sandvich

Something will turn up on adverts sooner or later.

Squidgy Black

meeting a fella for a marshall mg50dfx soon enough,
got it for a nice 115 so yeah (:

Sandvich

The MGs are pretty naff but that's mainly because they're overpriced for what they are. For that price they're not too bad. The Peavey would have been a much better quality overall but I guess the MG will be good for a beginner. I hope you enjoy it.

Squidgy Black

hmm had a think about the peavey..
but no headphone output so it's a no-go.
so would you recommend the marshall or the artec?
i've heard some really bad things about the marshalls fans etc.
and the artec comes with a warantee i think

Sandvich

stetyrrell wrote: »

hmm had a think about the peavey..
but no headphone output so it's a no-go.
so would you recommend the marshall or the artec?
i've heard some really bad things about the marshalls fans etc.
and the artec comes with a warantee i think

The Peavey has no headphone out? That's a bit odd. The newer models probably do.

The MG would probably be fine for that price. It won't sound amazing, but the main reason people hate MGs is because they're cheap Solid State practice amps that Marshall tries to flog for similar prices to tube amps just because they have the word Marshall on the front. If you can get it for 115, it's not so bad. If it's one of the newer MGs it'll probably sound okay.

I don't really know anything about the Artec. But keep in mind - the resale value of a Marshall will always be higher. Eventually you'll want to sell the Marshall and move onto a better amp. You'll probably get close to what you sold it for. Artec is a fairly unknown brand so you won't get much for it.

Based on that, I recommend getting the Marshall and in another year or two start researching more expensive amps. Personally I'd recommend maybe trying to find a Peavey Vypyr 30, it's a good modelling amp, or an AD30VT. I doubt you'll get one for 115 though.

http://www.adverts.ie/showproduct.php?product=176232&cat=all

You could try whittling this guy down to 130 probably. This was my main amp for ages, it was pretty class.

Squidgy Black

was it loud enough for the drums?
played a 15 watt amp earlier fully turned up with my sd1 in front of it.
impossible to hear.

Sandvich

I'd say it probably would be, yeah. What you can do too is get a more efficient speaker later on to make it even louder.

If your drummer is really that loud you couldn't hear a 15 Watter at all then the 50 might be a better idea. You can get a 50 Watt Valvetronix as well but it'd be more expensive.

Wattage rating isn't very good since it doesn't take into account speaker efficiency. This is one of the reasons why tube amps are louder, they have more efficient speakers. The speaker in the AD30VT is about 97db.

Squidgy Black

hmm i might get the fella to bring it down and i can give it a test run with the drums.
heard bad things about the mg with the fan and all so quite skeptical of it

Squidgy Black

sorry i just checked,
the amp i was using was a 10 watt with a 6.5 " so it was pretty small

Sandvich

That's not going to cut it, at all. It's not just the fact that it's a 10 Watter, I bet it wasn't any louder than a Microcube which is about 3 or 4 Watts.

The MG 50 Watt will probably cut it. It just won't be a great amp. The Valvetronix will be quite a bit better, but it might not be as loud.

Squidgy Black

hmm, a lot to consider.
those ga5 heads and a 1x12 cab any good?

Sandvich

You'd have difficulty clearing a drummer with a GA5 to be honest.

Squidgy Black

okay thanks. i might pop into musicmaker during the week and give the mg and the vox a test...

Sandvich

http://www.adverts.ie/showproduct.php?product=183531&cat=16

It's here too.

Yeah, I'd try them both out first.

CianRyan

I feel like I should be saying something here.

First thing's first, the "Marshall" is in no way, shape or form a Marshall, bar the badge on the front of it.
Those MG's are muck. They're not reliable, their clean's are to sharp and their distortion sounds like a bee flying around inside a tin can.

I won't say anything on the Artec as this is the first time I've heard of them.

The Peavey, I use to use a bandit65. When I got it, I thought it was a savage yoke and that mentality stayed with me for a long time.
It's easily loud enough to play over loud drummers, it has very nice cleans and can be tweeked to give you a good range of nice distortions.
I play death metal, hardcore, punk and blues, mostly and it worked great for all of those.
Now I have upgraded to a big 150watt tube amp wallet killer but I'm still with Peavey.
And wouldn't you know it, my cab decided to blow a while back and while I'm saving to buy a new set of speakers I've been plugging my head straight into my bandit set to clean and I've been getting some great sounds out of it, even with the hole in the speaker.

They can be pretty heavy but you will get use to it. As you're playing longer and start getting bigger amps, they'll get heavier and you'll stop caring.
Hell, you wont care how heavy the bandit is two weeks into owning it.
As regards to the volume, it has a volume knob that goes down, don't worry about it being too loud.

Not much experience with Vox but I know they do make great amps.


If it was me, I'd get the bandit.
I payed 150 POUNDS for for my bandit65, at €130 the bandit75 is a steal.

I'll be disappointed if you don't go for it.

That's my two cents anyway.

Cian.

Squidgy Black

so the vt30 won't be loud enough.
2x12 crate gx vs the marshall now.
it more than likely be the marshall. sound isn't tooo important as i'll probably trade up before i actually get any gigs. i'm only 15 so really all i need is the power.

CianRyan

stetyrrell wrote: »

so the vt30 won't be loud enough.
2x12 crate gx vs the marshall now.
it more than likely be the marshall. sound isn't tooo important as i'll probably trade up before i actually get any gigs. i'm only 15 so really all i need is the power.

Did you read my post at all?

This forum seems to have a thing with 15 year olds coming on, asking people about amps, getting great advice, ignoring it and buying an MG because they they think they're buying a Marshall.

I'm hardly an oul lad either, I'm only 19 so I know what it's like buying an amp for jamming with the lads. You want something that will just do for the mean time?
It'll be the worst decision of your life.


Do what ya like anyway, I give up...

Squidgy Black

no headphone output on the peavey,
so my ma won't let me touch it.
and to be honest there's no point in leaving the amp in my mates house and only playing it once a week. i would've gone for the peavey, i'm still trying to convince her but so far it's a no-go.

CianRyan

It's only loud when you decide to make it loud.
If you keep it at around one or two, not only does it sound better but it won't be any louder than what you're playing through now.
Your man said there's a Pre-amp out on the amp?
Same thing.

You're thinking to much about the weight. Sure, it's heavier than a 15 yoke but it's really not that bad at all. You get stronger from lugging them around and you stop noticing. I'm not exactly a big guy but I have no problem moving my gear around and these days, it ways more then me. It might take two people but that's grand like.

Quattroste

stetyrrell wrote: »

no headphone output on the peavey,
so my ma won't let me touch it.
and to be honest there's no point in leaving the amp in my mates house and only playing it once a week. i would've gone for the peavey, i'm still trying to convince her but so far it's a no-go.

What happened to Rock and Roll Ste? Tell you Ma(m) that there is a headphone output.

Beside, as Cian has said, playing it a very low volumes is no louder than an acoustic guitar.

Squidgy Black

i'll get the peavey then
by the way, anyone got a spare soldering iron lying around?

Squidgy Black

i'm more punk to be honest
but she's my main source of income so i do what the boss says:o

Sandvich

Solid State amps can be set at any volume.

I'm pretty sure it does have a headphone jack - it'll just be called "Direct out" since it's not just for headphones but for lining in. Makes it easy to record with too, though it'll probably sound a bit worse without the speaker, a lot of those speakers are made to filter off the high end.

You can probably plug the headphones into the "send" of the effects loop too. A preamp basically colours the tone, adds preamp distortion and brings it up to line level, which should be close to what you'll need with headphones. Of course, then you won't be able to use any effects or reverb.