New DCC (Dublin City Centre) 30kph limit

thebman

I think it makes driving impossible in the city centre but that you can't avoid having to drive there since public transport is a joke that never gets fixed.

So realistically they want people to drive close to city centre and park and walk/cycle the rest of the way which isn't really practical either IMO.

I think a blanket 30KPH zone doesn't make any sense and I don't see why you could have the zebra crossing idea combined with a 30KPH limit for a few hundred metres either side of the crossing.

And then you know get police to enforce the rules we have rather than coming up with daft ones because we can't be arsed to enforce the ones we have.

Spiritoftheseventies

thebman wrote: »

I think it makes driving impossible in the city centre but that you can't avoid having to drive there since public transport is a joke that never gets fixed.

So realistically they want people to drive close to city centre and park and walk/cycle the rest of the way which isn't really practical either IMO.

I think a blanket 30KPH zone doesn't make any sense and I don't see why you could have the zebra crossing idea combined with a 30KPH limit for a few hundred metres either side of the crossing.

And then you know get police to enforce the rules we have rather than coming up with daft ones because we can't be arsed to enforce the ones we have.

would help if pedestrians crossed at the appointed traffic lights. One individual in dark clothing walked straight across me on terenure Road tonight. And where exactly does 30k zone begin and end. No thought gone into to it at all.

BluePlanet

Originally Posted by philspector
It is a crazy way to deal with a very specific problem of pedestrian management. Some improved policing, pedestrian barriers, marshalling of temple bar visitors and relocation of taxi ranks would address the issue.

tbh you sound like someone that's spending too much time in your car.
We are talking about the city centre of a capital city, where pedestrians outnumber vehicles by about a factor of 10. And you expect to marshal pedestrians by corraling them with barriers like cattle?
The city centre should not be some sort of thorough-fare for motorists.
I encourage you to get out your metal box and have a stroll around. The city centre is an unpleasant place as a pedestrian and it needn't be. Indeed just about anywhere they've pedestrainsed has seen greater foot traffic and a boon for shops.
That should be the goal here, pedestrain safety is just a welcome extra in my book. Anything that inconveniences or bans private motor vehicles from the city centre gets my support.

Spiritoftheseventies

BluePlanet wrote: »

tbh you sound like someone that's spending too much time in your car.
We are talking about the city centre of a capital city, where pedestrians outnumber vehicles by about a factor of 10. And you expect to marshal pedestrians by corraling them with barriers like cattle?
The city centre should not be some sort of thorough-fare for motorists.
I encourage you to get out your metal box and have a stroll around. The city centre is an unpleasant place as a pedestrian and it needn't be. Indeed just about anywhere they've pedestrainsed has seen greater foot traffic and a boon for shops.
That should be the goal here, pedestrain safety is just a welcome extra in my book. Anything that inconveniences or bans private motor vehicles from the city centre gets my support.

again no. Pedestrians endanger their own safety by not making themselves visible as I mentioned above.. 40kph is a proper speed and use for all traffic in cities and residential areas. 30kph is too low.

BostonB

No enforcement this evening when I passed down the quays most traffic was struggling to stay at 40 kph. There was no 30 sign where I turned on to the quays either.

Guell72

Bus gate, ridiculous parking fees, now a 30kph speed limit.
Im not going into the city center anymore now. I'll do all my shopping in Newry. Can get there quicker anyway from the North Side.
Well done Dublin City council.

Carawaystick

Where were these supposed green waves?
I went from Tara Street to Aungier St this morning and was stopped at the lights at the end of Pearse St, at College St., College Green x2 and at Aungier St./JJ.Smyths

This evening I was stopped by the lights at Stephen's st/St Great Georges st; SouthGreat Georges st/Exchequer st; Southgreat georges st/Dame st; DameSt/Trinity st; College Green/Foster Place; College Green; College Green/College Street; Fleet St/d'Olier st; and Townsend st/ Tara St. this was every single light I passed I was stopped at. There was no traffic except on Townsend st, and I don't think I exceeded the limit by much or at all.

Green wave me hole

Just had a look at the map, it's completely out of date. When was there a hospital on Peter Street? I thought that was gone to Tallaght a long while ago.
Also when was there a road beside Coppers? not for a long while.

Run_to_da_hills

BostonB wrote: »

No enforcement this evening.

You will have to wait about two weeks to be sure of that.

BostonB

Too true

Dub13

I see the now mandatory facebook group has been setup....

Remove the New 30km/h Dublin city speed limit,I have a Vote

Patser

Carawaystick wrote: »

Where were these supposed green waves?
I went from Tara Street to Aungier St this morning and was stopped at the lights at the end of Pearse St, at College St., College Green x2 and at Aungier St./JJ.Smyths


Green wave me hole

Dublin Mayor was on Matt Cooper this evening about this issue. Said the lights will be reprogrammed soon, so the 'Green Wave' will follow.

However she was unable to say if the Luas along Abbey St is affected by this new speed limit. Abbey St is a pedestrian heavy area, and the Luas is a 'Motorised Vehicle' and the new bye law made no mention or exemption for it.

Also on the show was the Chairman of the Dublin Cycling Campaign (can't remember his name and their website doesn't mention it). Unsurprisingly he was all for it, saying it will encourage a switch to cycling, and I was thinking about this. Will it?

I mean for the vast majority of commuters there will probably be a slight impact - they'll still be stuck in traffic, so little emphasis to change there. So the alternative reasoning must be that cycling will be better and safer, but again will most cyclists who commute notice a difference with traffic still congested.

And I'd genuinely like to ask Cyclists (ok there are a few cheap jibes in here, but I can't help myself), if they were to rearrange problems that deter people from cycling below, where would the new limit fit.

Badly Parked Cars blocking cycle lanes
Car/Taxis/Buses pulling in and out in front of them
Narrow roads with traffic in close proximity
Other cyclists moving slowly in front
HGVs/Buses turning with poor visibility
Sore arse/ poor saddle
Lack of respect from other road users
Pedestrians stepping out
Lack of changing facilities in work, no showers.
Muppets stealing bike, tyres, saddle
Infertility http://www.livescience.com/health/090710-cyclists-sperm.html
Traffic passing at 50 kmh, only at off peak times, now reduced to 30kmh in a limited area

Posy

Dub13 wrote: »

I see the now mandatory facebook group has been setup....

Remove the New 30km/h Dublin city speed limit,I have a Vote

I wondered how long that'd take!!

pfy2k

Don't worry or get annoyed about your stupid Councils 30km/h City centre speed limit. Just head north to Ulster and spend your cash and save money and forget about shopping in Dublin!:D:D:D

AlekSmart

Quote:
Originally Posted by philspector .
the reason cited by DCC for the new limits is to address pedestrian behaviour between 10pm and 3am in teh temple bard/dame st area at weekends. They rightly point out that drunken pedestrians wander out through temple bar/dame st wandering amongst taxis/cars.

Gosh,just shows DCC`s brass neck as I was under the impression that this "Pedestrian Behaviour" issue had been addressed over 20 years ago,by amonsst other things the introduction of the Nitelink service,and a major overhaul of the Licencing Laws.....guess that was so successful they needed a follier-upper.....:rolleyes:

But it ain`t all bad news,as one can be assured that even now the DCC "Team" will be dusting down the oul flip-chart for a tour of major European Capitals as they reveal the secret of Dublin`s incredible success to the stunned forreners......:P

shotamoose

Spiritoftheseventies wrote: »

And where exactly does 30k zone begin and end. No thought gone into to it at all.

So you haven't even bothered to look up the map that clearly shows where the zone begins and ends before having a good moan? No thought is right.

thebman wrote: »

I think it makes driving impossible in the city centre

How does a 30km/h speed limit in a small area make driving 'impossible'? It just makes it slightly slower - oh the horror!

Some people really need to get over themselves tbh, the world doesn't exist to guarantee you a nice smooth fast drive everywhere you want to go you know.

Cookie_Monster

shotamouse wrote: »

How does a 30km/h speed limit in a small area make driving 'impossible'? It just makes it slightly slower - oh the horror!

Some people really need to get over themselves tbh, the world doesn't exist to guarantee you a nice smooth fast drive everywhere you want to go you know.

It makes it slower, which makes it more frustrating, which makes it more likely for people to do stupid things, which makes it more dangerous.

BluePlanet

I'm wondering what % of these "outraged" motorists actually have to traverse the 30kph zone?

Compared to the % that just don't like the excruciating pain involved in reducing their speed on route to the bleedin Jervis shopping centre.

JimsAlterEgo

Are cyclists covered by this? Any fit cyclist could easily go over 30K!!

seamus

JimsAlterEgo wrote: »

Are cyclists covered by this? Any fit cyclist could easily go over 30K!!

No, speed limits don't apply to cyclists. I very much enjoyed overtaking the traffic on George's St this morning.

RobbieTheRobber

shotamouse wrote: »

So you haven't even bothered to look up the map that clearly shows where the zone begins and ends before having a good moan? No thought is right.

How does a 30km/h speed limit in a small area make driving 'impossible'? It just makes it slightly slower - oh the horror!

Some people really need to get over themselves tbh, the world doesn't exist to guarantee you a nice smooth fast drive everywhere you want to go you know.

It doesn't affect them as the average speed during the day on these routes would rarely exceed 30kph. Still though typical Irish behaviour is to moan about any changes and then later to moan about the fact that nothing ever gets changed, gotta love ireland.

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

It makes it slower, which makes it more frustrating, which makes it more likely for people to do stupid things, which makes it more dangerous.

Those sound like the behaviours of bad drivers, drivers cant deal with traffic get upset. :rolleyes:

Wibbler

seamus wrote: »

No, speed limits don't apply to cyclists. I very much enjoyed overtaking the traffic on George's St this morning.

From the evidence that I have seen, most of the other rules of the road don't appear to apply to cyclists either.

BluePlanet

Wibbler wrote: »

From the evidence that I have seen, most of the other rules of the road don't appear to apply to cyclists motorists either.

Fixed that for you.

RobbieTheRobber

Wibbler wrote: »

From the evidence that I have seen, most of the other rules of the road don't appear to apply to cyclists either.

So going on this thread the only people who ever obey the rules of the roads are not pedestrains and are not cyclists so that just leaves car drivers.

I dont really know how these car drivers manage to do everything in their cars without having to get out and become either a cyclist or a pedestrian but fair play to them. Next time I want a newspaper I'll try driving my car right to the counter in the newsagent, becasue that must be what every other car driver is doing. :rolleyes:

RobbieTheRobber

seamus wrote: »

No, speed limits don't apply to cyclists. I very much enjoyed overtaking the traffic on George's St this morning.

I dont doubt you passed the traffic on your bike, but i do doubt this was down to you exceeding 30kph on your bike, I think you'd be mad to try and cycle around the city at that speed.

Cookie_Monster

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Those sound like the behaviours of bad drivers, drivers cant deal with traffic get upset. :rolleyes:

Which would include the majority of people on the road tbh.

Cookie_Monster

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

I dont doubt you passed the traffic on your bike, but i do doubt this was down to you exceeding 30kph on your bike, I think you'd be mad to try and cycle around the city at that speed.

why?

What can you possibly see wrong with that?

seamus

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

I dont doubt you passed the traffic on your bike, but i do doubt this was down to you exceeding 30kph on your bike, I think you'd be mad to try and cycle around the city at that speed.

My speedo says different. George's street is actually very quiet in the mornings because it provides no through route to anywhere so it's mostly taxis, busses and delivery vehicles. So I had plenty of room to overtake two taxis who were crawling along.

MJohnston

This seems to me to be up there with putting extra taxes on alcohol to deal with alcoholism and "sorting out" the drug problem by banning it altogether. Sure it'll probably produce the kind of numbers that look good in the press, but what about dealing with the root causes of those numbers?

Safety education in this country is terrible for pedestrians, cyclists and drivers. I'm nearly always in the city centre on foot, and I've seen countless examples (far too many for it to be written off as 'anecdotal') where people waiting at traffic lights will follow the one person who spots a gap and runs across, without even looking at (a) the approaching traffic or (b) the traffic lights. Inevitably this results in braking traffic, bumped horns and frustration, but I'm sure very occasionally it results in deaths too. Just last week I saw a girl simply walk in front of a Luas on O'Connell street without checking behind her to see if it was coming. She only noticed when the Luas driver beeped the horn a few times, but he couldn't stop and it looked like she got her arm whacked by the side of the tram.

I'm only mentioning these examples of pedestrian stupidity because this thread seems very heavily weighted towards blaming the driver. On the bad driving side, I saw a lady last night driving very quickly in the right hand lane on a two way two lane street, then going the wrong way through a roundabout, again at speed. There are plenty of bad drivers, lots of bad cyclists (even more since Dublin Bikes started), but in terms of population, you'll find a lot more silly pedestrians. Cut the speed limit and you'll slow traffic down, making it easier for drivers to react to the stupidity of others, but you won't correct the core causal behaviour.

Jip

BostonB wrote: »

No enforcement this evening when I passed down the quays most traffic was struggling to stay at 40 kph. There was no 30 sign where I turned on to the quays either.

None that you could see, but there was a garda on the south quays at the DCC offices with a speed gun.

And I got stopped at every traffic light from Pearse Street to where I turned off at the James Joyce Bridge, plus traffic from O'Connell Street onwards seemed to be worse than normal.

MJohnston

Oh yeah, and I happened to be in the city centre on Monday morning, at about 6am, to drop off my girlfriend at the Aircoach bus-stop (conveniently located in the non-traffic friendly city centre) why were none of the VM signs used to indicate this new limit? For someone without a TV, I heard nothing about this new limit until I looked up this forum today to find out why my train was 40 minutes late.