Private forum descriptions

pickarooney

Des wrote: »

I didn't design it like that, and I already said that I agree with that point.

OK, as far as I can tell we're in more or less complete agreement.

star-pants wrote: »

Firstly, I doubt that's overly possible for the IT guys to do - have a page with a description on it. If you clicked a moderator forum it gives you the same go away page.

I can't see why it would be that difficult, but I know nothing either.
Do the moderator forums have links under user names? If not, this thread doesn't apply to them. If so, then they should also have a brief page saying it's a forum for site moderators to discuss issues.

Secondly, the ACT thing (which isn't a private forum, it's a social groupy thingy and thus it's different) gives you an explanation when you click on any of the links provided so I don't see how that's hypocritical at all. In fact if anything it's what you want.

Yeah, exactly, if I were a member of the ACT group then I would be in favour of a bit of transparency - "but there is a lot that doesn't need to be [private]". Such as the purpose of private forums.

I've at no point said there shouldn't be private forums (I couldn't give a hoot either way) just that where is is say, a private club with a neon sign outside it would be no harm for it to have another sign saying "membership restricted to people who admire poodles from afar. Contact XYZ for more details".

I really don't get this big 'omg out all the private forums' crap. It does not grate on my life *that* much if I don't have access somewhere. If you're that curious about someones modding of a private forum, pm them and ask them. But IMO they've every right not to tell you or to decline you access.

I don't see why I should have to waste my time and the moderator's time asking the question any more than I should have to ring the owner of a club to ask him what they do.

Kiera wrote: »

Its a private forum so why should it tell people what its about? If you want to know then pm the mod and ask them!


This is a social group. Completely different to a private forum. If you click the link to ACT you'll see what the group is about.

As above.

Dudess

tbh wrote: »

why the hell do people have such a hard time with a forum they can't see?

Why the hell do people take opinions/criticisms so personally here? Plus, you can see the name. It goes against the spirit of Boards. Get rid of the private forum titles under mod names and all good in the hood.

just live and let live ffs.

Indeed.

I say that as someone who isn't in a private forum btw.

I said what I said as someone who was invited to two private forums.

irishbird wrote: »

whats the point in joining a private forum about reading glasses if you dont wear reading glasses ?

Again, I'm not talking about the ones with a specific purpose, I'm talking about the "hangout" ones with the zany, cryptic names (yet more esotericism and arousing of curiosity). I don't agree with the existence of that type of forum in the first place, that's just my opinion. /shrug

Des wrote: »

Would anyone like access to Team Boardroom? It's a forum set up so myself and the assistant manager can talk about previous and upcoming matches, because we know that some of the opposition players read the public team forum, we like to keep our plans away from them.

Does that meet everyone's approval, or is it too clique-ish?

As I said earlier, soccer and its offshoots will attract ass-hats so it's understandable they'd be private/limited.

Des wrote: »

A private forum.

Seriously, couldn't you just have answered that person's question?

And no need for the disingenuousness re the Mod/Admin forums - there's obviously a good reason for them being private.

star-pants

pickarooney wrote: »

I can't see why it would be that difficult, but I know nothing either.
Do the moderator forums have links under user names? If not, this thread doesn't apply to them. If so, then they should also have a brief page saying it's a forum for site moderators to discuss issues.

Yes they do, such as there's a PI Mods forum, and other such type Mod forums. Why should they tell you what they are? Only those that need access have access.
The set up of having a moderator would mean that it would fall under your name AFAIK, and so for it not to show up would mean a lot of fiddling about I'd imagine for the IT guys, clearly not something that's really a priority.
Regarding setting up a page, that would mean that the link to the forum would have to default somewhere different each time. The default link if you don't have access is the same everywhere. So again, a lot of messing about for the tech guys, and again, hardly up there on the list.

pickarooney wrote:

Yeah, exactly, if I were a member of the ACT group then I would be in favour of a bit of transparency - "but there is a lot that doesn't need to be [private]". Such as the purpose of private forums.

ACT is discussing very different issues than yours here.
Your issue is with the private forums that have nothing to do with how the site is run. Say Des's one there, about whatever he said it was about, that has no direct relevance to how boards.ie operates. AFAIK none of the private forums that you're interested in do either.

pickarooney wrote:

I've at no point said there shouldn't be private forums (I couldn't give a hoot either way) just that where is is say, a private club with a neon sign outside it would be no harm for it to have another sign saying "membership restricted to people who admire poodles from afar. Contact XYZ for more details".

To be fair, I've never been smacked in the face with ANY private forum, any time I've seen them they've been under the Mods name which is discreet.
And if you couldn't give a hoot then why are you arguing for it?
Yeah I wouldn't mind knowing what some of the private oddly names forums are, but it's nothing something that would bother me this much.

pickarooney wrote:

I don't see why I should have to waste my time and the moderator's time asking the question any more than I should have to ring the owner of a club to ask him what they do.

But private forums aren't a business. It's not in their interest to have people know what they do. If it was, it wouldn't be private.
If you're not willing to bother with a pm to enquire, then why are you bothering wasting your time with this thread?

If I have a private photo album on facebook say, it doesn't give you a page that says 'this albums about X'. It's private cuz I don't want certain people seeing it or being in it. Tell you what's in it, practically defeats the purpose of having it private.

Dub13

This is about Slydice right...?most probably woman trying to infiltrate it.Is there nowhere left safe for us menfolk.

Silverfish

Dub13 wrote: »

This is about Slydice right...?most problem woman trying to infiltrate it.Is there nowhere left safe for us menfolk.

It always comes back to Slydice.

pickarooney

star-pants wrote: »

Yeah I wouldn't mind knowing what some of the private oddly names forums are, but it's nothing something that would bother me this much.

So you're in at least partial agreement, but aren't bothered..

But private forums aren't a business. It's not in their interest to have people know what they do. If it was, it wouldn't be private.
If you're not willing to bother with a pm to enquire, then why are you bothering wasting your time with this thread?

...don't understand why I would be bothered...

...but you go to all this bother to argue against me anyway?

Something tells me you're just arguing for the sake of it

Sparky

Just to clear a few things in technical terms.

The links under the Mods name is there purely so that people know that the Mod has privileges over a forum, aka to close, delete thread etc etc and to allow access and ban access. This is infact a custom script that Cloud developed. Certain CMods and Mods will have forums like PI Mods under their name because they need to allow access to these private forums when new mods are added and when mods step down. The script cannot differentiate between certain genre of forums so to speak.
Now those forums are in relation to the moderation of the site and tbh teh explanation of what they are about it all in the name. There is a Rec Mods forum. Any joe soap who has been around boards knows what that is all about.
The limitation of the modtitles script is that it will show any forum you are a moderator of and in the past there has been requests that private forums should not be listed under a users name.

Now lets take some other forums that are private as they are are for a group of people. I'm not naming forums, but say for example I set up one for a number of people, say 12 people whom we need to organise beers and general gatherings and we are from far and wide around Ireland and it was named WMA "We meet again". 9 times out of 10 there would be no need to let everyone know about it other than those who need to know (the 12 people), but if the question was asked in the group maybe all wouldn't mind people knowing, but then again why would we have to let every user on boards know what it is all about? Is that not why it is private in the first place?

The notice that you see when you have no permissions is a standard vBulletin notice and it was edited by development a while back to add certain explanations as to why there is no access. An example was the soccer forum. However for it to give an explanation as to why there is no access to <insert forum here> would require alot of work and at the end of the day is deemed unnecessary.

Tbh, like I said previously, if you do see a private forum name under a persons name and you ask them, they may be willing to give you a brief explanation of what it is, but thats up to the moderator and the community inside the forum.

star-pants

pickarooney wrote: »

So you're in at least partial agreement, but aren't bothered..

What I mean is, yeah it might be nice to know one or two that I'd be like 'hmm what's that'. If I'm that bothered/interested then I'll pm them and ask. I've no qualms about that, and I'm sure no mods have issues answering pm's from users. I certainly don't.

pickarooney wrote:

...don't understand why I would be bothered...

...but you go to all this bother to argue against me anyway?

Something tells me you're just arguing for the sake of it

I'm not just arguing for the sake of it, I'm responding to the thread, because you don't seem to have a reason for wanting to know other than 'I should be able to'. And you were comparing it to ACT which I was pointing out was different. My 2c if you will. 2c per post... so that's a few cents by now.

itsallaboutheL

Kiera wrote: »

I asked for a private forum becuase of on thread circle jerking. Isnt it better to do it in private than on thread?

But who decides who gets the hand jobs??

My problem with this, is that at the end of the day access to private forums is pretty much at the mercy of a particular Mod, what if a person is perfectly suited to a group but doesn't get on with a particular poster who happens to be Mod of said group??

I realise it's hard to have any form of transparency when dealing with private forums but some attempt should be made imo.

EDIT: i skipped a page and a bit, and some of my post has already been vocalised.... a few times:o

Dudess

That's very true too - a mod or "prominent" member of a particular forum, which you could be greatly interested in/suited to, having something against you could very much hamper your chances of getting access. That would particularly be a shame in the case of special interest private forums.

Silverfish

I want to be able to show up at all your houses and demand access. Even if you don't like me. Especially if you don't like me.

itsallaboutheL

Silverfish wrote: »

I want to be able to show up at all your houses and demand access. Even if you don't like me. Especially if you don't like me.

This is quite amusing, in a way it perfectly illustrates the problem with some private forums... i.e who "owns" them..

imo, it's not a very adult viewpoint to have..


but it's not my place to comment, i'm not one of the big boys so can't play in the sandbox..

Silverfish

I don't "own" my house, but I still don't leave the door wide open for anyone to stroll in.

I invite people, or they ring my doorbell asking to come in, and usually they are allowed. Unless they are selling something.

Dudess

itsallaboutheL wrote: »

but it's not my place to comment, i'm not one of the big boys so can't play in the sandbox..

That seems a bit passive-aggressive - you can say what you want here (as long as it's not abusive/libellous), nobody's stopping you.

itsallaboutheL

Silverfish wrote: »

I don't "own" my house, but I still don't leave the door wide open for anyone to stroll in.

I invite people, or they ring my doorbell asking to come in, and usually they are allowed. Unless they are selling something.

To follow your analogy

nobody is asking you to leave your door open, just leave a note on the door with a few details about the party...

Dudess

Silverfish wrote: »

I want to be able to show up at all your houses and demand access.

Not remotely what people are saying.

Even if you don't like me. Especially if you don't like me.

Well if a suitable person doesn't get access because one mod/"prominent" member dislikes them, that's hardly reasonable... just pathetic.

Silverfish

itsallaboutheL wrote: »

To follow your analogy

nobody is asking you to leave your door open, just leave a note on the door with a few details about the party...

Yes, because that's always ended well for people

You complained initally that access was decided by the mod of the forum, you said that was wrong. So you think they shouldn't be able to decide who has access to the forum.

So that only really leaves it public. So what you are saying is, no forums should be private?

Overheal

Silverfish wrote: »

I want to be able to show up at all your houses and demand access. Even if you don't like me. Especially if you don't like me.

Did anybody say anything about Demanding?

Silverfish

Overheal wrote: »

Did anybody say anything about Demanding?

I only saw mention of the alternative, requesting, which nobody seemed happy with.

Nerin

Dudess wrote: »

That's very true too - a mod or "prominent" member of a particular forum, which you could be greatly interested in/suited to, having something against you could very much hamper your chances of getting access. That would particularly be a shame in the case of special interest private forums.

As far as i know the private forums with members that aren't closed off decide by member suggestion whos allowed in.

itsallaboutheL

Silverfish wrote: »

Yes, because that's always ended well for people

You complained initally that access was decided by the mod of the forum, you said that was wrong. So you think they shouldn't be able to decide who has access to the forum.

So that only really leaves it public. So what you are saying is, no forums should be private?

i said it was wrong in an instance such as this...

itsallaboutheL wrote: »

My problem with this, is that at the end of the day access to private forums is pretty much at the mercy of a particular Mod, what if a person is perfectly suited to a group but doesn't get on with a particular poster who happens to be Mod of said group??

Which could easily be avoided, if either

a) There's more than one mod (which i dont think is the case on all private forums but could well be wrong)

or

b) the decision is passed to the members if a Mod doesn't think they're in a position to be impartial..

And no it doesn't just leave the public, it leaves the private members.

Overheal

Silverfish wrote: »

I only saw mention of the alternative, requesting, which nobody seemed happy with.

Thats the thing - I get the strange feeling as though I already have, and have had the requests to know more about some of these private forums ignored by the moderators of these forums that I have PMd in the past. No "Sorry Overheal its just a group for me and a few friends from Swords" - just an ignore.

_blank_

Dudess wrote: »

That's very true too - a mod or "prominent" member of a particular forum, which you could be greatly interested in/suited to, having something against you could very much hamper your chances of getting access. That would particularly be a shame in the case of special interest private forums.

OK, let's take the special interest argument incidence.

Smoking was, until today, what you would probably term a "special interest private forum". For as long as I was moderator, I only ever denied access to one person, on the grounds that I had ascertained from previous posts that they were under the age of 18. It was a forum rule, so no dice.

Anyone could have PMd me for access, many did, and I never would have dreamed of denying someone access.

But that's how the forum rolled.

Other Private Forums may be small communities, not "special interest". Their members may, or may not, be open to new members. They may have some criteria for membership which they may see in people from their posts, and then extend an invite to join them. Nobody ever knows until they are invited, nor should anyone care.

Let's say I set up a Private Forum called "People who like to post in Feedback" and called it PWLTPIF. I'd see that you have posted in Feedback in the past, I'd say to the other members of the forum "Hey guys, Dudess seems to like to post in Feedback, wanna invite her in?". Now, someone may object, and that's ok, because you'd never know and could get on with your life without even knowing there is such a forum.

Of course, if you wanted to join a private forum for people who like posting in Feedback, you could ask the Admin could you have a Private Forum, you might call it "People who post in Feedback" or PWPIF, and you could have all your members there, and neither forum may ever know about the other.

Crazy isn't it?

There are probably tens of Private Forums for people who just want to shoot the shít. All given Admin Approval, all different groups, because the people in Comeonbanus don't necessarily want to shoot the shít with the people in PWLTPIF.

Oryx

Silverfish wrote: »

I only saw mention of the alternative, requesting, which nobody seemed happy with.

Im happy with requesting. I tend to get turned down, but Im tough that way, and can live with it. I can see why people have a problem with it, but I can also see why private forums with private membership, with new members chosen by the group, should be allowed to remain thus. Anything less defeats the whole purpose of making them private.

In fact, Im only aware of about 6 or 8 private forums. How can I miss what Im not even aware of anyway?

itsallaboutheL

Dudess wrote: »

That seems a bit passive-aggressive - you can say what you want here (as long as it's not abusive/libellous), nobody's stopping you.

if it was, then i apologise, but i'm not the only one being passive aggressive, or overtly for that matter.

Silverfish

Overheal wrote: »

Thats the thing - I get the strange feeling as though I already have, and have had the requests to know more about some of these private forums ignored by the moderators of these forums that I have PMd in the past.

So have I. No skin off my nose, if they didn't think I was suitable for their forum, that's their prerogative.
I didn't decide after that that they had no right to even have or moderate a private forum.

Overheal

The other thing I guess, about asking to get into a forum you know nothing about. Or firing out multiple PMs to get into multiple forums about multiple topics to multiple mods that you know nothing about. It is a form of Rudeness. Despite the facts that some of these forums I know nothing about would be perfectly fine with people asking to get in while dozens more would just be annoyed about getting a PM. How am I to know which is which?

I didn't decide after that that they had no right to even have or moderate a private forum.

Silverfish: I never said anything of the sort.

_blank_

Overheal wrote: »

The other thing I guess, about asking to get into a forum you know nothing about. Or firing out multiple PMs to get into multiple forums about multiple topics to multiple mods that you know nothing about. It is a form of Rudeness. Despite the facts that some of these forums I know nothing about would be perfectly fine with people asking to get in while dozens more would just be annoyed about getting a PM. How am I to know which is which?Read Carefully Silverfish: I never said anything of the sort.

Why would you want access to a forum you know nothing about? That's a bit ...weird, no?

Lots of times people have posted in AH, or elsewhere, about cigarettes or smoking.

The mods there would sometimes direct them to me, I had no problem with that.

Silverfish

Overheal wrote: »

The other thing I guess, about asking to get into a forum you know nothing about. Or firing out multiple PMs to get into multiple forums about multiple topics to multiple mods that you know nothing about. It is a form of Rudeness. Despite the facts that some of these forums I know nothing about would be perfectly fine with people asking to get in while dozens more would just be annoyed about getting a PM. How am I to know which is which?Read Carefully Silverfish: I never said anything of the sort.

Where did anyone say they'd be annoyed about getting a pm?

Its a lot easier for one curious user to send one pm to a moderator asking about the forum than it is for the mods of private forums to mailbomb everyone just in case they may want access.

Um, read carefully, I didn't specifically say you did say that

itsallaboutheL

Silverfish wrote: »

I didn't decide after that that they had no right to even have or moderate a private forum.

I'm going to assume this is aimed at me, and i'd appreciate if you stopped mis-quoting me...

and if your not mis-quoting me then your simply making up a counter arguement because nobody has implied anything of the sort...

also for the record, i've asked for access to one private forum on the recommendation of another user and was granted access so i don't have any sort of hidden agenda..