Opened a can of worms

anniehoo

Im a public sector worker so got paid today, minus not only decembers budget deductions, but also for the Union day of strike in November. We were made aware that we would lose a days pay if we participated and i was fine with that.

Now, after the strike took place, we got an email from the head honcho in work stating that if we participated in the strike we were to reply to the email stating whether we were present or absent.This appeared to be the only attempt from them at getting an attendance record for that day. I replied stating i was absent of course. Honesty being the best policy and all that. Or so i thought.

Ive since found out that the majority of people here,who took the day off did not reply to the email and subsequently didnt get a wage reduction. There was only one other person besides myself who owned up to being absent.

Im furious and have emailed my Union about this matter. I feel its incredibly unfair that others have got off scott free, while im being hammered in wage reductions for being honest. Already people are gossiping and complaining, basically afraid that theyre now going to be caught out.

Have i got a right to demand a reimbursement of my days pay and pursue it further,or is it just a case of "suck it up and lesson learned"?

edit/oh and it wasnt a measly sum of money either...€120 net gone for the strike day and another €100 odd for budget cuts. Im down so much money this month its unreal.

Quandary

When it comes to money people will show their true colors very quickly - if they thought they'd get away with it then the vast majority wouldnt be as honest as you were!

The whole process was obviously very badly managed and cataloged, but hey thats not surprising is it :rolleyes:

Fair play to you though, if nothing else at least you have a clear conscience and a bit of integrity!

BroomBurner

Are you/your colleagues definitely sure that they were not deducted?

I'm in the Public Sector also, and was told that only those that were due to be in attendance that day, or had preplanned Annual Leave, were to notify HR in advance. That way, the default was to remove the pay for everyone bar the minority.

Contact someone in your HR to verify with them how it was carried out.

brightspark

I'm confused are you complaining that you didn't get paid or that your colleagues may have got away with cheating the system and got paid even though they weren't working?

We were made aware that we would lose a days pay if we participated and i was fine with that.

Have i got a right to demand a reimbursement of my days pay

Why? you didn't work why should you get paid?

Are you saying your bosses are so incompetent that they will pay people even when they don't work? I doubt if any private sector bosses would.

BTW I lost a lot more once during a strike which although I wasn't a member of the striking union I didn't pass the picket and so got nothing (no work=no pay), and unlike the picketers I didn't even get strike pay!
But just as I respect the right to strike, I also don't expect to get paid for the days I don't work.

Are you also aware that some public sector workers such as nurses and other essential personal sometimes work during strikes and still dont get paid!

duckysauce

you did not work the day , so why get paid ?, what other people do aint the issue, you did not work

jesus_thats_gre

anniehoo wrote: »

Have i got a right to demand a reimbursement of my days pay and pursue it further,

Surely you a pulling the piss here?

Here is a better idea, go tell your boss that everyone else got paid for their day off and make sure they get the money taken of them next month. They aren't entitled to it and probably just spent the day in Newry shopping.

Firetrap

What I'm curious to know is how you normally register that you're in work. Do you clock into the office? Do you have to document anywhere what work you did during the week? The mind boggles that they had to go around and ask everyone did they show up for work.

anniehoo

brightspark wrote: »

I'm confused are you complaining that you didn't get paid or that your colleagues may have got away with cheating the system and got paid even though they weren't working?

As i already said

anniehoo wrote: »

We were made aware that we would lose a days pay if we participated and i was fine with that.

I was fine with it. I decided to participate in the strike, i was aware of the consequences and replied honestly to the email asking if i was absent or present.It was alot of money to lose but it was my choice. What im pissed off about is, i was only one of 2 people who were honest in the building. While my colleagues laughed at us for being so gullible in responding to the email they got a full day off with pay. Completely unfair do you not think?

brightspark wrote: »

Are you saying your bosses are so incompetent that they will pay people even when they don't work?

Basically yes and they did. The only method of ascertaining attendance on that day was the reliance that people would be honest and say whether they were in or out. Our section was closed, i informed our external clients even. It wouldve been blatantly clear from walking around that nobody was in. Yet, the only names that went to HR were the ones who replied to the mail.

I just feel the whole process was unfair and for my honesty i got screwed while...literally other people in work were laughing at the fact i lost money this month and they didnt.

Jo King

These people are so incompetent they cant even deduct a days pay from employees who did not attend at work for a day! No wonder their pay is being cut. It should be cut even further if that is the standard of performance of the managers. It is this kind of incompetence that has brought the country to ruin. Massive amounts of money wasted on IT projects which never delivered, poor planning and regulation in many areas. Next time there is a one day strike the doors should stay closed. who would notice the difference?

bryaner

Jo King wrote: »

These people are so incompetent they cant even deduct a days pay from employees who did not attend at work for a day! No wonder their pay is being cut. It should be cut even further if that is the standard of performance of the managers. It is this kind of incompetence that has brought the country to ruin. Massive amounts of money wasted on IT projects which never delivered, poor planning and regulation in many areas. Next time there is a one day strike the doors should stay closed. who would notice the difference?

Yes maybe cut the high grades pay but not the poor fooker on the frontline

again!

leeroybrown

I'd go so far as to say that it's likely wilful and deliberate incompetence in this case.

OP - you'll just have to suck it up and hope your colleagues don't turn on you for highlighting this.

bryaner

leeroybrown wrote: »

I'd go so far as to say that it's likely wilful and deliberate incompetence in this case.

Sneaky act

xoxyx

Firetrap wrote: »

The mind boggles that they had to go around and ask everyone did they show up for work.

Is it possible that the bosses were on the side of the union strikers and didn't want to deduct the pay, so they were trying to find away around it?
Either way - you did the right thing OP. It credits you that you were willing to give up money to stand up for what you believe in.

Kimbot

From what I know, your payroll section know if you are paying Trade Union subs.

If you are paying subs you get docked pay its as simple as that, thats how our place done it.

Firetrap

Back to the original question, I don't think there is anything you can do unless you want to make trouble for yourself. You can't turn around and tell them it was a horrible mistake and that you did actually work that day. If you snitch on your work colleagues, it's going to make you some enemies. Is it worth all that for the loss of a day's pay?

tenchi-fan

You shouldn't get paid for the day because you didn't work. You have no recourse.

Regarding your colleagues, well they're everything that's wrong with the system really. You could report them but they could make things a lot worse for you than any government cuts if they found out.

I think you should notch it up to experience. Personally, I would not tell my employer that I attended work if I took the day off because I'd be leaving myself wide open to disciplinary action and I'm too honest too.

brightspark

In the private sector it's normally considered gross misconduct (a typically sackable offence) to be clocked in if you weren't actually at work.

OP you did nothing wrong, you were on strike and didn't get paid. Your colleagues are another matter if they claimed they were working that day.

Just remember that some of the taxes we all pay, including you, allegedly was just given to your colleagues for doing nothing!

Jo King

z_topaz wrote: »

Is it possible that the bosses were on the side of the union strikers and didn't want to deduct the pay, so they were trying to find away around it?

That would be fraud if that was the case. Either these people are incompetent or they are crooked. Maybe both. Easy to figure why the country is in the state it's in with that quality of public servant.

cbreeze

Jo King wrote: »

That would be fraud if that was the case. Either these people are incompetent or they are crooked. Maybe both. Easy to figure why the country is in the state it's in with that quality of public servant.

Managers will have known who was in/out on the day. It will look odd in their payroll stats if so many were allegedly working on a strike day when all the manager had to do was look out the window and see who was picketing outside. I understand the picketers did shifts for about an hour and then breezed off.

tricky D

brightspark wrote: »

In the private sector it's normally considered gross misconduct (a typically sackable offence) to be clocked in if you weren't actually at work.

OP you did nothing wrong, you were on strike and didn't get paid. Your colleagues are another matter if they claimed they were working that day.

Just remember that some of the taxes we all pay, including you, allegedly was just given to your colleagues for doing nothing!

This - instant sacking. In the private sector you'd be very lucky to keep your job. I've seen people being instantly dismissed for similar dishonesty. 5 minutes to clear your possessions and escorted out the door by security. Not a pretty sight at all. It's a pity, but wholly unsurprising, that the public sector seems to turn a blind eye to such dishonesty.

wmpdd3

Gross mis-conduct, in my opinion, but even worse that you are in the same office as these guys and you can see this and their 'manager' didn't see it.....the mind boggles.

I still can't understand how any organisation can exist where you could be paid for a days work that you didn't do. I'd be delighted to save 9 hours pay from my payroll budget.

Also, if I didn't reply to an e-mail form my boss in the time allowed I would be severely dealt with.

anniehoo

Thanks for your replies so far. Listen, im not some goody two shoes here or anything. I was just honest. I was more afraid of not replying or saying i was in when i wasnt. Id of been mortified to be pulled up and sacked for lying. I didnt think it was worth it. But, yeh

leeroybrown wrote: »

hope your colleagues don't turn on you for highlighting this.

this is what im afraid of. But, im also not just going to "suck it up" too easily either. My Union have been notified, i expect them to take action over it. Im certainly not going to name names but i just want some kind of noise to be made about the unfairness of the situation.

jonny24ie wrote: »

From what I know, your payroll section know if you are paying Trade Union subs.

They do and i think thats how it shouldve been deducted too.

Firetrap wrote: »

If you snitch on your work colleagues, it's going to make you some enemies. Is it worth all that for the loss of a day's pay?

I hate that word "snitch". I can guarantee you nobody would be sticking up for me if it was the other way around. I said im not naming anyone in particular but im also not letting it lie either.This is what has the country in a heap, too many people getting shafted and not saying a word.

Firetrap

If you can at all, can you let us know how you get on?

anniehoo

Firetrap wrote: »

If you can at all, can you let us know how you get on?

Will do. Feelin a little bit nervous about headin in tomorrow but..i havent done anythin wrong. Its more the backlash from colleagues who i normally get on great with im a bit worried about.

the_syco

anniehoo wrote: »

edit/oh and it wasnt a measly sum of money either...€120 net gone for the strike day and another €100 odd for budget cuts. Im down so much money this month its unreal.

We (the private sector) were told there'd be a massive saing, as all those who called in strike would save us X amount of cash. It seems from the abvove that this is not the case, and people, and some think they should have their money for not working...:rolleyes:

Thick Tights

the_syco wrote: »

We (the private sector) were told there'd be a massive saing, as all those who called in strike would save us X amount of cash. It seems from the abvove that this is not the case, and people, and some think they should have their money for not working...:rolleyes:

I think some of them take the attitude that since they did as much work on the day of the strike (i.e. sweet f.a.) as they normally do, they should be paid as if they had gone in. I am surprised that they are not looking for the money saved by not boiling kettles for innumerable cups of tea and playing computer games on PCs to be paid to them as a performance related bonus as well!

bryaner

Thick Tights wrote: »

I think some of them take the attitude that since they did as much work on the day of the strike (i.e. sweet f.a.) as they normally do, they should be paid as if they had gone in. I am surprised that they are not looking for the money saved by not boiling kettles for innumerable cups of tea and playing computer games on PCs to be paid to them as a performance related bonus as well!

Maybe you should have applied for one of these brilliant, easy, massive paying

jobs so......

tenchi-fan

bryaner wrote: »

Maybe you should have applied for one of these brilliant, easy, massive paying

jobs so......

people who joined the public sector recently missed out on the benchmarking, partnership agreements and the annual inflation-beating payrises... it's true there are a lot of overpaid people in the public sector and the public sector in general needs a radical overhaul that will involve involuntary redundancies, changes of work practices and massive re-organisation.

bryaner

tenchifan wrote: »

people who joined the public sector recently missed out on the benchmarking, partnership agreements and the annual inflation-beating payrises... it's true there are a lot of overpaid people in the public sector and the public sector in general needs a radical overhaul that will involve involuntary redundancies, changes of work practices and massive re-organisation.

Overhaul needed yes, deadwood clearout yes but there has to be an end to blaming the

worker on the frontline and fueling a public- private sector war..

vector

I take it that the OP doesn't enjoy flexi-time?

In flexi-time offices, be they public or private, in my experience employees clock in (RFID/magstripe) every day, so, if there was a strike then hey presto no one would clock in and the payroll would take care of itself.

I was also too honest in a job... your story reminds me... I would clock out at 11.00 to go to the newsagent across the street and clock in at 11.06 when I got back because you were supposed to note whenever you left the building. HR called me in and said the system could only handle one clock in and one clock out per day! so sometimes clocks force people to be dishonest