Homosexuality: What do you think?

Pygmalion

Fad wrote: »

Thing is, they dont.

The church has no problem with homosexuals, the church has a problem with homosexuals having sex. I think the official line is something along the lines of being a homosexual isnt in itself sinful, but the "Act" of homosexuality is sinful.......something like that.

They consider it unnatural and a burden, and advise people to seek help for it etc.
Not the same as considering it a sin, in that you don't go to hell for finding a guy attractive (only if you act on it), but to say they don't have a problem with it is pushing it.

Jay P

Fad wrote: »

Thing is, they dont.

The church has no problem with homosexuals, the church has a problem with homosexuals having sex. I think the official line is something along the lines of being a homosexual isnt in itself sinful, but the "Act" of homosexuality is sinful.......something like that.

Our religion teacher pretty much told us that last year. Though it's not quite as basic as that. The church are against sexual acts where conception is prevented, so oral sex, masturbating and anal sex are all out.

Arcade Panda

I would consider myself hertrosexual. I kissed a girl before for a dare,full on five minute kiss, and I didn't enjoy it at all. It was just strange and uncomfortable. I've only ever fancied lads or been with lads and I've never had the urge to check how green the grass is on the other side. At the same time there are some girls that I would consider really sexy...I don't know it's weird, in my head I'm like "I would" but I know I really wouldn't or wouldn't particularly enjoy it if I did get the chance to do anything about it. It's so hard to explain. I think it's that I appreciate girls.

EDIT: For the record there were no boys there when I was dared to kiss that girl so it definately wasn't for their entertainment :P

lou91

I don't discriminate between guys and girls.... just against ugly people.
Or something to that effect. I'm very picky, it helps having more to choose from.

Davidius wrote: »

However I don't see myself being all that tolerant when it comes to flaunting it. It's great that they can be comfortable with themselves but I find that sort of shíte really gets on my nerves. Keep it to yourself would my way of thinking.

Hmmm, if you see a guy scoring a girl would you accuse them of flaunting their straightness?
Tolerating something doesn't mean accepting it btw.

Fad wrote: »

Thing is, they dont.

The church has no problem with homosexuals, the church has a problem with homosexuals having sex. I think the official line is something along the lines of being a homosexual isnt in itself sinful, but the "Act" of homosexuality is sinful.......something like that.

Nooooooooo.... Please don't condone that logic! The church clearly does have a problem with it. Clearly the way to be a good catholic is to suppress your sexuality, get married and have kids with someone, irregardless of how many lives you fcuk up in the process.

Fad

Jay P wrote: »

Our religion teacher pretty much told us that last year. Though it's not quite as basic as that. The church are against sexual acts where conception is prevented, so oral sex, masturbating and anal sex are all out.

But that's the same for heterosexual couples too, the rules arent in any way different for them.

In a perfect Catholic world, sex would be a procreation event only.

Fad

RandomUserName! wrote: »

Nooooooooo.... Please don't condone that logic! The church clearly does have a problem with it. Clearly the way to be a good catholic is to suppress your sexuality, get married and have kids with someone, irregardless of how many lives you fcuk up in the process.

I dont condone the logic, but feel it's unfair to state that Catholicism is an excuse for militant homophobia.

lou91

Fad wrote: »

I dont condone the logic, but feel it's unfair to state that Catholicism is an excuse for militant homophobia.

It's not an excuse, but it's definitely a cause.

I really do believe that the only people that'll have a problem with it are the religious or the uneducated. Which is one of the reasons I love college... pretty much nobody cares.

hapenny

to each his/her own!!

Jay P

Fad wrote: »

But that's the same for heterosexual couples too, the rules arent in any way different for them.

In a perfect Catholic world, sex would be a procreation event only.

Yeah that's what I meant, that it's not just homosexual sex that the church is against.

Jay P

RandomUserName! wrote: »

Hmmm, if you see a guy scoring a girl would you accuse them of flaunting their straightness?
Tolerating something doesn't mean accepting it btw.

To be honest, seeing anybody kissing just annoys me, it doesn't matter if they're gay or straight.

Davidius

Pygmalion wrote: »

In my head I swapped around the "I'm" and "is" in that sentence and it completely changed the context of everything you said above it.

I've been writing a lot of easily misread sentences these days. I shall go back and edit it to reaffirm everybody of my vagina loving ways. :pac:

sock puppet

I'm bisexual. I only came out a couple of months ago and the 6 or so months before that were pretty rough. I didn't expect a negative reaction but I was afraid it would alter people's perceptions of me.

Fad

RandomUserName! wrote: »

It's not an excuse, but it's definitely a cause.

I really do believe that the only people that'll have a problem with it are the religious or the uneducated. Which is one of the reasons I love college... pretty much nobody cares.

I think that shows a misunderstanding of Catholicism on his part, he's kinda forgetting the whole Golden Rule thing.....

Jay P wrote: »

Yeah that's what I meant, that it's not just homosexual sex that the church is against.

Ah sorry, wasnt sure what you were getting at

Luno

I can't say what I am really, I'm just as attracted to men as I would be to girls. I wouldn't see myself in a relationship with a girl though just because . . I don't actually know really,
I would probably say in myself I'm bi sexual,
Seen a poster say something about girls scoring other girls to get fellas attention, I'll admit I've done stuff like this but it wasn't in the company of anyone except another girl which is hardly looking for attention?

Then there is the whole religion side, coming from a catholic family I may be shunned upon by my parents which I would not like to happen :eek:

Everyone's different and its not something to be ashamed of, its who you are and the whole stereotyping behind the whole thing is ridiculous you would really think this would be in decline but I don't know . . .

lou91

sock puppet wrote: »

I'm bisexual. I only came out a couple of months ago and the 6 or so months before that were pretty rough. I didn't expect a negative reaction but I was afraid it would alter people's perceptions of me.

Oh, it more than likely will alter people's perception of you. They'll process it just like any other fact, like "That girl is tall" or "that guy is black". This isn't a bad thing, unless they're prejudiced against tall, black or non-straight people. That's their problem though, not yours.

Davidius

RandomUserName! wrote: »

Hmmm, if you see a guy scoring a girl would you accuse them of flaunting their straightness?
Tolerating something doesn't mean accepting it btw.

Fascinating semantics old boy/girl/undetermined gender!

I will have you know that I hate watching two people regardless of gender molesting each other in public. It's one of the few things that really fecking annoys me.

Granted I'm more accustomed to seeing straight people at it.

What I'm also talking about is the people who always go on about their sex lives. I don't like people doing it in general but it's a little less desired when homosexuality between men is involved considering that the idea of two men going at it is a bit "can't eat my lunch" to me.

lou91

Davidius wrote: »

Fascinating semantics old boy/girl/undetermined gender!

I will have you know that I hate watching two people regardless of gender molesting each other in public. It's one of the few things that really fecking annoys me.

Granted I'm more accustomed to seeing straight people at it.

What I'm also talking about is the people who always go on about their sex lives. I don't like people doing it in general but it's a little less desired when homosexuality between men is involved considering that the idea of two men going at it is a bit "can't eat my lunch" to me.

Fair enough, I think everyone agrees that excessive PDA is pretty nasty. Except doggers of course, but I digress.

I'm just trying to figure out what "tolerant" actually means, so you'll have to excuse the semantics! I don't know if the whole attitude of "they can do it, but not in front of me" counts. Bit too much like the whole Don't Ask Don't Tell idea in the states. Tolerance would require being able to see two guys/girls kissing and acknowledge their right to do it (PDA aversions aside) even through your own distaste.
May be reading a bit too much into that one though!

Davidius

RandomUserName! wrote: »

Fair enough, I think everyone agrees that excessive PDA is pretty nasty. Except doggers of course, but I digress.

I'm just trying to figure out what "tolerant" actually means, so you'll have to excuse the semantics! I don't know if the whole attitude of "they can do it, but not in front of me" counts. Bit too much like the whole Don't Ask Don't Tell idea in the states. Tolerance would require being able to see two guys/girls kissing and acknowledge their right to do it (PDA aversions aside) even through your own distaste.
May be reading a bit too much into that one though!

All I really meant by me being intolerant was that I wouldn't really like it. I wouldn't be the sort of deny them any of their rights or over step my boundaries.

Jackobyte

I think its class how honest and mature everyone has been with this topic. When posting it I wasn't sure which way it'd go but I'm happy with the way its gone.

A Neurotic

I'm somewhere in the middle myself, but to address the OP's concern, I don't see anything particularly offensive in calling things gay. I do it regularly. When I did it in school, I was greatly amused to see people give me warning-eyes if the gay guy in my class was present. He didn't give a shít.

The word has changed meaning. In much the same way that calling someone a bastard no longer necessarily calls into question the marital status of their parents, calling something gay, for me anyway, has absolutely nothing to do with homosexuality.

I'll admit, I do enjoy ironically using the word fag when in the company of my close friends, but that one still carries pretty negative connotations and shouldn't really be used in everyday language...

EDIT: And to address the other aspect of the OP, despite my somewhat gayness, I really can't stand camp gays, and I hate the fact that the campest, outest ("HELLOOOOOO!") gay people are seen as representative of the typical gay. My dislike has less to do with the fact that they're attracted to men, and more to do with the fact that they're living clichés. How on earth do so many people conform to a certain social niche just because of their sexuality? Is it something innate (in which case I can't really blame them I suppose) or the influence of seeing how homosexuality is represented in the media and whatnot?

I'd love to know what percentage of homosexuals actually genuinely have a camp disposition and how many don't. An awful lot of very normal people are gay, but they don't just shove it in everyone's face.

I once ventured into the LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender) society room in college, only to find a bunch of guys with skinny jeans and floppy fringes, discussing which colour to dye their hair and the best stuff for exfoliating their beards. No lie. F*ck that.

Craguls

Admittedly I was a little disappointed with the LGBT in college, I would've figured it would have tried to defy gay stereotypes but instead it seems to flit between embracing them and playing them up or condemning them.

Personally, I have no issue with homosexuality, several of my friends and a member of my family are gay and I suppose if I was to classify myself I'd probably fall into the bi-curious/bisexual category. Although I think it ties in with my own views on relationships more so than anything else; I think anyone can have feelings for anyone else if they feel they have some sort of connection but I think I'm being overly romantic about the whole thing. As someone said earlier in the thread you can like guys and you can like girls it really shouldn't make any difference to anyone.

Crumble Froo

Hotaru wrote: »

I have been thinking about the whole 'That's so gay' insult for awhile now. 90% of its use is not intended to abuse gay people... it's more habit I think. It's thrown around casually but I really think it shouldn't be used so lightly. I'm guilty myself but am making an effort to wean it out of my vocabulary.

totally relate to and agree with that one. anyone seen the south park episode with the bikers and they called the bikers f*ggots, and got into this whole thing about how the meaning of the word has changed so much over the years.

RandomUserName! wrote: »

Oh, it more than likely will alter people's perception of you. They'll process it just like any other fact, like "That girl is tall" or "that guy is black". This isn't a bad thing, unless they're prejudiced against tall, black or non-straight people. That's their problem though, not yours.

i think it will likely alter people's perceptions a little differently to that. like the way you might find out that so-and-so cheated on their ex, or smoked weed, or slept around. none of this information may be relevant to the conversation you're having with them, but that little snippet of information may colour your view of how you see them, and react to them. i think the same is true for knowing that they are gay/bi.


personally, am bi. the way i dress, im usually mistaken for a male (briefly) about once a month (three times this month though), and i like music that usually has more of a male following. in my head, i often think that it's quite obvious to a degree that im not straight, but seemingly most people have never suspected it (or at least, so they say on the occasion it's mentioned in conversation that i am).

similarly, one of my best mates is a guy, with a number of 'feminine' mannerisms. he's got such a cute we walk, always quite well dressed, and into the indie/alternative scene, and it amazes me how many people mistake him for gay.

though from what i can make out from his crew of mates from college (dont know em very well, im not really into hanging out in big groups with opinionated people ), it's quite normal to pash (errr... meet/shift/score/snog) people of the same sex, for shíts n giggles.

*shrugs* i duno, im just generally not all that interested in discussing the sex life of myself, or other people at all. private business.

soccymonster

I'm straight. I'd find other girls preety and stuff but I really couldn't picture myself in any form of a relationship with one.
And I know a gay guy. And a bi-sexual one too. Really doesn't matter to me what they do as long as I don't hear too much about their love lives (i just hate that in general).

Nebit

To answer OP - i don't think any gay/bi person in today's society would be offended by the word gay being used to describe something, in fact i use it myself, always have (even before i came out). i think the only people who get offended by it are overly PC people or parents lol

norwegianwood

Personally, I don't have any problem with gays. It's the 21st century, and that people are still made to feel they have to defend their lifestyle choice is ridiculous. At the same time, i don't think same sex couples should be allowed to adopt, because a child should have a strong male and female influence in thier lives, but that's just my opinion.

Fad

norwegianwood wrote: »

Personally, I don't have any problem with gays. It's the 21st century, and that people are still made to feel they have to defend their lifestyle choice is ridiculous. At the same time, i don't think same sex couples should be allowed to adopt, because a child should have a strong male and female influence in thier lives, but that's just my opinion.

So single mothers/fathers also shouldnt be allowed to parent?

PlayGirl

If you think about it, if someone you know tells you they're gay , chances are they always knew they were. So if they were gay the whole time you knew them how does knowing about it suddenly change things?
They're the exact same person you always knew

Pigwidgeon

Fad wrote: »

So single mothers/fathers also shouldnt be allowed to parent?

That's what I always think when people spout that about same sex couples. Who gives a shit, as long as a child is being brought up in a loving, stable, non-abusive, healthy environment, it shouldn't matter if there's one parent, a mum and a dad, two mums or two dads.

Craguls

There's also significant evidence to suggest that sexual orientation is biological in nature rather than something you choose. There's a pretty good explanation of it in a neuroscience book I have but this seems to get the same point across;

Despite almost a century of psychoanalytic and psychological speculation, there is no substantive evidence to support the suggestion that the nature of parenting or early childhood experiences play any role in the formation of a person’s fundamental heterosexual or homosexual orientation. It would appear that sexual orientation is biological in nature, determined by a complex interplay of genetic factors and the early uterine environment. Sexual orientation is therefore not a choice, though sexual behaviour clearly is. Thus LGB people have exactly the same rights and responsibilities concerning the expression of their sexuality as heterosexual people. However, until the beginning of more liberal social attitudes to homosexuality in the past two decades, prejudice and discrimination against homosexuality induced considerable embarrassment and shame in many LGB people and did little to encourage them to lead sex lives that are respectful of themselves and others

Jay P

PlayGirl wrote: »

If you think about it, if someone you know tells you they're gay , chances are they always knew they were. So if they were gay the whole time you knew them how does knowing about it suddenly change things?
They're the exact same person you always knew

That isn't always the case though. My friend told me and seemed to grow in confidence afterwards, then everybody started to find out, and he grew even more confident, which is great. Though in this way, I can see how one would see someone differently if they just came out, that person might actually change if they become more comfortable with who they are.