ENO Freewheel vs. Cheaper options

DirkVoodoo

Ok, so before I start: NO, I will not ride fixed. I may try it now just because I have no freewheel but I am sticking with singlespeed. I know this makes me uncool and I'm missing out, but I'm ok with that!

My commuter is about 20 months old now and a few things are starting to fall apart. The bottom bracket is starting to grind (cheap RPM piece of junk) so I'm probably going to replace that with a Shimano UN54. The freewheel, however, has been on it's last legs for some time now, but I just seem to be happy running it into the ground. I reckon I got a year and a half out of it, maybe 5000kms (total estimate) but the nasty grinding noise has now turned into the cranks spinning as I walk it and I notice the bike is a lot more sluggish when I ride it.

It came with an ACS claw freewheel (have to double check this) and I was happy enough considering the Shimano freewheel as a replacement. The 16 tooth one is 16 euro on CRC but out of stock, so it gave me time to read around. I've heard the white industries ENO freewheel is very highly regarded, more so for proper BMX-ers rather than commuters, but considering our weather recently I think having something hard wearing, albeit expensive, would be a good investment. I found a guy who ships them for 56 euro.

So, my question is: should I just get a shimano and replace it in a year or go for the ENO which seems to last for 3 years+ and is rebuildable?

My only worry is if the bike gets stolen I'm taking a bigger hit, but overall a 40 euro difference isn't that big I guess when taken in the context of the overall bike price.

Any opinions? I'm looking at you flickerx.

doozerie

I only know the ENO freewheel from what I've read about it, but everything I've read has been positive and full of praise for them. By comparison, I've read mixed reviews of the Shimano freewheels. I have a Shimano freewheel on my wheel which I have yet to use, but just by feel alone the bearings seem poor. Being able to replace the sealed bearing in the ENO is definitely an advantage and it doesn't seem to require specialised tools to do so either.

ENO also offer a freewheel with two cogs, in case you want the convenience of having two gears available on the same side of the hub. You'd obviously still have to move the wheel forward/back and manually move the chain but that'd be quicker than swapping the wheel around. Assuming you can maintain a decent chainline on both cogs, this might be an option worth considering too.

56euro is an excellent price too - where did you find one for that price? When I've checked before the cheapest I could find online was about £65 sterling excluding shipping. At that price I'd go for the ENO, personally. If their reputation is anything to go by, your hub will likely fail before the freehub.

DirkVoodoo

Cheers Doozerie, very useful and I think you've helped me make my mind up.

I found it here, everywhere else seemed to be about 90 dollars before shipping. I logged into my paypal and the shipping didn't change, so I'm not sure if that is an error on his part or paypal's, but I would be surprised if his shipping fee within the united states is the same as sending it to Ireland.

I like the idea of the quicker engagement too, my current freewheel takes a good while before it engages which can be quite inefficient around town.

doozerie

You should budget for import duty plus VAT being charged as it is coming from the US, although it is always a bit of a lottery as to whether or not you do get charged (though some shipping companies such as UPS and Fedex always apply the charges, plus an admin fee). Even if you were hit by these charges though it might still work out cheaper than more local sources.

DirkVoodoo

doozerie wrote: »

You should budget for import duty plus VAT being charged as it is coming from the US, although it is always a bit of a lottery as to whether or not you do get charged (though some shipping companies such as UPS and Fedex always apply the charges, plus an admin fee). Even if you were hit by these charges though it might still work out cheaper than more local sources.

Good point, can you actually buy these in Ireland? All the sources I found seemed to be US or australian.

TinyExplosions

HTFU and go fixed.

Right, now that's out of my system, the ENO stuff is great -get it

here's the dealers in the UK, though retail seems to be around £67

-Final edit, I swear - this will save potential faffing around with customs etc

doozerie

The closest I've found online are sites in the UK. The UK version of the White Industries website gives an RRP of £67 sterling - I haven't checked the individual dealer sites though to see if any of them give a better price:

http://www.whiteind.co.uk/#/dealers/4533315046

Funnily enough, the product info on both www.whiteind.co.uk and www.whiteind.com list only the 3/32" versions, no mention of 1/8". I've seen one retailer site mention that the same ENO freewheel will work with both 3/32" and 1/8", but if you have a 1/8" drivetrain already that might be something to clarify with the retailer.

DirkVoodoo

Nope I'm all 3/32! I'll email that chap and see if he has had any EU orders and is the shipping to Ireland price correct.

abcdggs

feel free to ignore me completely, just wondered why you're so against going fixed?

TinyExplosions

abcdggs wrote: »

feel free to ignore me completely, just wondered why you're so against going fixed?

Cos he's a great big pansy!

Convict

Bought mine here http://www.aspirevelotech.com/. I wasn't charged postage and didn't have to pay any import duty. They put the value on the package at $20 which I hadn't asked them to do. As for the freewheel, it's well worth the money. I've dealt with aspirevelotech several times since and there's no problem there either.

DirkVoodoo

Cheers Convict.

@abcdggs: Tiny ain't far off, I like riding a one geared bike but I have visions of clipping kerbs, vaulting myself over the bars and severing digits. I've caught caught clothes a few times in the past (wear shorts now) but it could have been worse or more embarrassing with a fixed. I will give it a proper go soon, but my route from Foxrock to town is quite a fast descent (and now the cycle path from Brewery rd. to Oatlands has become an offroad track) but on a 44-16 I couldn't imagine my feet being able to spin fast enough. Sometimes it's just nice to coast.

DirkVoodoo

I got a reply from Ernesto, he says he has shipped to the UK plenty of times before and $12 should cover it.

So that brings the total price to $80 (~ 56 euro). He was a bit unclear on the customs part, he says everything is sent by USPS so I only know it may take a while to arrive.

Lumen

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

So that brings the total price to $80 (~ 56 euro). He was a bit unclear on the customs part, he says everything is sent by USPS so I only know it may take a while to arrive.

Duty will be 4.7% + possibly a handling fee from USPS. Then there's VAT.

I thought fixies singlespeeds were supposed to be low maintenance?

DirkVoodoo

So I would nearly be better off just ordering it from somewhere in the UK like here or here, rather than paying less for a part that may become more expensive (or the same price) by the time it gets to my door? Plus it will probably get here quicker.

I think a new freewheel after 20 months isn't exactly high maintenance :rolleyes:

Anyway you should know by now I have a fairly fretful personality.

doozerie

It looks like goods under the value of €150 are not subject to customs duty, but are subject to VAT, as per The Citizens Information website :

If you buy online or by mail order etc.

From outside the EU

You can buy goods from outside the EU up to a value of €22 without incurring any VAT charges. Goods up to a value of €150 may be imported without payment of Customs Duty. To avoid these packages being stopped by Customs, the value should be clearly marked on the label. However, VAT and import duty is charged on importations of tobacco, tobacco products, alcoholic product and perfumes even if they cost less than €22. The Revenue Commissioners provide a Guide to the reliefs available for the import from non-EC countries.

If your online purchase costs more than €22 you will have to pay VAT. If your online purchase costs more than €150 you will have to pay VAT and Customs Duty. This will be collected by the company that delivers your parcel. The company usually have an administration charge. Methods of delivery and collection differ from company to company, so you should contact them directly for more information.

It is not unheard of though for some shipping companies to just apply customs duty and VAT as a matter of course, plus their administration fee of course. They shouldn't, and you should be able to claim back the customs duty afterwards, but just bear it in mind as a possibility. Where charges are applied I believe they are applied as follows:

((Value of goods + delivery cost) * Customs duty) * VAT + administration charge

...so bear in mind that you pay VAT on the customs duty and on the delivery charges too. Customs duty shouldn't arise in this case though as the freewheel is less than €150, but you should budget for being charged for VAT on the goods+delivery. It is a bit hit and miss as to whether you do get charged though so you might be fine (I think that USPS deliver via An Post at this end, who are a bit more "casual" about applying the charges).

Because I can never remember the actual figure for customs duty, I've just tried to dig it out now. It's a bit like sticking needles in your own eyes though, as one document links to another and to another, etc., until you eventually find one that actually gives any kind of a figure. All goods are broken down into sub-, sub-, sub-, ... categories so it is ridiculously tedious to find the right one for bike parts. I ended up with a figure of 2.7% for customs duty from the TARIC database linked to here but I don't know if that is right (I possibly used the wrong category) and differs from what Lumen listed above.

DirkVoodoo

Thanks Doozerie, extremely comprehensive post. So, going by what you and Lumen have said I'm coming out with 70 euro before any administration/handling fees.

To be less attractive than the UK options this would have to be more than 15 euro. Do you guys think it's worth the risk? I mean I'm not going to get hit with 30 or 40 euro in handling fees am I?

doozerie

I've been charged handling fees by at least two shipping companies in the past (Fedex was one, can't remember the other(s)). I can't remember exactly the flat fee they charged but I think it was somewhere between €10 and €20, definitely no more than €20.

On those occasions when I've been charged customs and VAT by An Post though I wasn't charged an admin fee at all. I'm not sure if they do typically charge an admin fee at all but it may be mentioned on their website.

DirkVoodoo

Cool, I'm taking the plunge! I'll let you know how I get on, thanks for all the help.

abcdggs

came across one today...
http://cgi.ebay.ie/WHITE-INDUSTRIES-ENO-FREEWHEEL16-TEETH-SINGLESPEED_W0QQitemZ120531944789QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_sportsleisure_cycling_bikeparts_SR?hash=item1c10438555#ht_500wt_1182

DirkVoodoo

Good find, be interesting to see what they sell for in the end, the place I got it from (Ernesto you crazy dog!) was comparatively cheap but nowhere near those ebay bids at the moment.

abcdggs

If it's going cheap i'll probably throw a bid in there...

Has yours arrived yet?

DirkVoodoo

No, probably another week. Can't come quickly enough though, my freewheel is totally shot. I swapped it over to fixed after saturday but haven't been on it yet.

blorg

On this topic I have a 17T and 18T freewheel. Former is a "Dicta Brand" from Taiwan, latter Shimano SF-MX30.

Neither had more than a couple of days use as I went fixed but the former remained on the bike for a while until I got the remover tool; the Shimano one is mint.

€10/15 respectively if anyone wants them.

abcdggs

I also have one, unknown number of miles on it though. can't imagine i'll use it again, you can have it to tide you over if you want. 16t
cleaned it out the other day and it's running well

Home:Ballyhoura

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

ebay bids at the moment.

I was watching it out of interest...£19 with 30sec to go..then it jumped right up to £36.03. Almost doubled, mad stuff!

abcdggs

Hate it when that happens!
~£41 delivered though which isn't great considering the mileage on it...

blorg

Always happens with eBay, if bidding on an auction I use JBidWatcher and just put in my honest max bid. Have won a fair few that way. If you bid up early you only increase the price, sniping is the only way to go...

Most of the stuff I buy there on Buy it Now though these days, the auctions can be such a hassle.

DirkVoodoo

blorg wrote: »

Always happens with eBay, if bidding on an auction I use JBidWatcher and just put in my honest max bid. Have won a fair few that way. If you bid up early you only increase the price, sniping is the only way to go...

Most of the stuff I buy there on Buy it Now though these days, the auctions can be such a hassle.

Shhhh! I hear they have ebay spies everywhere, and they are french!

EDIT: I also only ever use buy it now, I couldn't be arsed bidding against people I can't see.

abcdggs

On a day like today i'll try grab myself a bargain, won an auction there placing my bid with 3 seconds to go. It's like gambling but i dont lose money if i dont win

blorg

Sniping is completely within the eBay Ts&Cs!

@abcdggs- if you use sniping software you can put in your honest max bid days in advance and the software bids for you last second. So you don't have to hang around looking at the auction.

abcdggs

Oh i know, it's not really anything i need. just watching Winter olympics and trolling ebay between races

btw, ski cross looks very fun and speed skating has to be the ice bound equivalent of euro cycling

DirkVoodoo

Minor update for anyone who was following this. After immediate payment through paypal on February 10th I was told be Ernesto that it would be with me in about 3 weeks. Today I received an email saying "it's on it's way!".

Now, I'm not in a rush to get this and my old freewheel is hanging in there, but I read on mtbr forums of other customers who were given misleading delivery times.

It seems Ernesto is just a guy running a business out of his house. Nothing wrong with that but it does mean his stock levels are inconsistent at best. Compounding this is a basic website that offers no other option except "buy now". No out of stock notices or updates from Ernesto.

If you want transparency, you won't get it here. I'm not saying he is dodgy, everyone seems to get there parts in the end, but an email from Ernesto along the lines of "awaiting new stock, should be here in x days, dispatched in y days" would be nice. He is quite happy to take money and leave you waiting.

Just a small warning for anyone thinking of buying from him. If you need it soon, probably best giving it a miss.

I reckon by the time I get it it will be around 6-7 weeks since I paid for it.

DirkVoodoo

Well, I guess I have to apologise to Ernesto. It arrived today!

In a way this just makes the email I received even more puzzling and I think he needs to work on his communications a bit, but I wouldn't hesitate to recommend him as long as you don't mind waiting for ~ 3-4 weeks.

It looks sweet, can't wait to fit it. The ratcheting mechanism sounds very crisp:

blobert

Just wondering how this is working for you?

My 15t Ac Racing Freewheel has broken, they are out of stock in the one place in the world that sells them so I'm looking for alternatives to the Shimano.

Its annoying there seems to be nothing between the cheap Shimano and this which is pretty pricey.

Thanks

blorg

I think if you want 15T the AC Racing is the only option, it uses a fundamentally different design to get 15T, no? If you want 16-18T what is wrong with the Shimano?

I have a taken-off-a-new bike Shimano 18T and another unused-but-left-on-bike 17T, €15/10 respectively if anyone wants.

DirkVoodoo

blobert wrote: »

Just wondering how this is working for you?

My 15t Ac Racing Freewheel has broken, they are out of stock in the one place in the world that sells them so I'm looking for alternatives to the Shimano.

Its annoying there seems to be nothing between the cheap Shimano and this which is pretty pricey.

Thanks

It's very nice, very smooth and engagement is almost instantaneous. The only downside is that the extra pawls make the freewheel clicking sound less like the "click" I am used to and more of a "buzz". It has taken a while to get used to but if you don't like your bike sounding like it is being attacked by a bumble bee as you freewheel then I might avoid buying one.

Really enjoying it though, bike feels sharper around town with all the stop-starting.

I'll have to confirm the actual cost, I think it was about 58 euro including delivery, which if the reports of it's excellent lifespan and rebuildability are correct, then it is a viable alternative to the Shimano.

blobert

Thanks, It seems the chap you bought it from is no longer selling them.

See no mention on his site?

I'd be happy enough to pay €58, but £67+ is getting pricey.

I've had a few of the Shimano ones before and found them not to be great quality. The AC racing ones are better but I'd be willing to pay more for a more reliable/serviceable one.

Thanks