Can i get a refund on this -particular- second hand good?

keepkeyyellow

So about a month ago I bought an iPod touch second hand and I didn't really have the chance to use it and I'm just after realising that the battery is wasted, I looked up the specs and it says that it should play music for 21 hours, I charged it fully set it playing away with no headphones and it's been an hour and a half and half the battery is gone

I know that when buying second hand goods you should half lesser expectations but considering I paid 120€ for this and a brand new one costs 190€, a 87.5% loss in battery life is too much in my opinion

The shop was cash converters on parnell street and I still have the receipt lying around somewhere

i71jskz5xu42pb

Unless they told you the battery was faulty you're entitled to the usual refund, repair, replace options.

From here

When you buy a second-hand item from someone who is selling it as part of their trade, you are entitled to the same rights as if it is new.

Enright

I dont like your chances
caveat emptor - buyer beware, you cannot expect new perfortmance from a secondhand good, did you ask about the battery life?

JimsAlterEgo

u should have asked, but given the amount spent I would have expected it to be close to fully working

Cabaal

OP you said you left it playing away with no headphones so I assume it then used its speaker, Apple never quote the play time with the likes of an iPhone/iTouch whilst using the speaker...they quote it with headphones.

So in other words test it with headphones

keepkeyyellow

Cabaal wrote: »

OP you said you left it playing away with no headphones so I assume it then used its speaker, Apple never quote the play time with the likes of an iPhone/iTouch whilst using the speaker...they quote it with headphones.

So in other words test it with headphones

No speaker on it

whiterebel

keepkeyyellow wrote: »

No speaker on it

Which makes it a 1st gen iPod Touch and could be 2.5 years old. You paid €120 for it? They must have big windows in that Cash Converters.

MagicMarker

keepkeyyellow wrote: »

So about a month ago I bought an iPod touch second hand and I didn't really have the chance to use it and I'm just after realising that the battery is wasted, I looked up the specs and it says that it should play music for 21 hours, I charged it fully set it playing away with no headphones and it's been an hour and a half and half the battery is gone

I know that when buying second hand goods you should half lesser expectations but considering I paid 120€ for this and a brand new one costs 190€, a 87.5% loss in battery life is too much in my opinion

The shop was cash converters on parnell street and I still have the receipt lying around somewhere

Did you get a receipt? Do you still have the receipt? And what warranty information is there on the receipt?

January

My OH bought a macbook in there once and when he turned it on it was riddled with porn. About 100 videos. He brought it back the next day and they took it back no problems.

MagicMarker

adrieanne__x wrote: »

My OH bought a macbook in there once and when he turned it on it was riddled with porn. About 100 videos. He brought it back the next day and they took it back no problems.

Bargain tbh.:)

rubadub

You can get new ipod batteries for about €10-15 online, and they have far better lifespan than the originals. I know lads who bought ipods and immediately threw out the battery and put in a better one. You just have to be confident enough to open the damn things, plenty of videos on youtube.

i71jskz5xu42pb

Enright wrote: »

I dont like your chances
caveat emptor - buyer beware,

Ill informed nonsense, the onus is not on him to ensure that the device is fit for purpose and of a reasonable quality given the price paid.

Enright wrote: »

you cannot expect new perfortmance from a secondhand good, did you ask about the battery life?

I don't see where he said he expected new performance? All he said was that an hour and a half of battery was not reasonable given the device is touted as having 21 hours of battery. It is not reasonable.

rubadub wrote: »

You can get new ipod batteries for about €10-15 online, and they have far better lifespan than the originals. I know lads who bought ipods and immediately threw out the battery and put in a better one. You just have to be confident enough to open the damn things, plenty of videos on youtube.

Why would he go to the hassle of paying for a new battery, cracking open a device that was not designed to be cracked open when he is entitled, in my opinion, to a refund/repair/replace?

rubadub

Reign Brave Rebellion wrote: »

Ill informed nonsense

Not really, from the very site you mentioned

On the other hand, you cannot expect second-hand goods to be of the same standard

In your post you said the battery was faulty, but it does work, the shop will probably argue this is not a fault. I also do not fancy his chances.

Reign Brave Rebellion wrote: »

Why would he go to the hassle of paying for a new battery, cracking open a device that was not designed to be cracked open when he is entitled, in my opinion, to a refund/repair/replace?

Because it could be less hassle for him to do so, up to him to decide, just giving options. It is what I would do in his situation, maybe he lives near the shop, for me I hate travelling and they might just offer money back. Even if they did put in a brand new battery it is not worth my while journeying into town which would take me a few hours. I live in the real world and would have fully expected a dead battery in the thing, ipod batteries don't last pissing time.

i71jskz5xu42pb

rubadub wrote: »

In your post you said the battery was faulty, but it does work, the shop will probably argue this is not a fault. I also do not fancy his chances.

Well we'll have agree to disagree on that. A battery that holds an hour and a half of charge is faulty in my books. Not saying he should expect as new, but 1.5 hours? If it was €120 Euro of my money I would not be fixing it. There's no point having a dog and barking yourself.

rubadub wrote: »

I live in the real world and would have fully expected a dead battery in the thing

If the expectation was that the battery was dead then it should have been sold as such. You live in a world where you put up with this kind of carry on.

jor el

Reign Brave Rebellion wrote: »

Well we'll have agree to disagree on that. A battery that holds an hour and a half of charge is faulty in my books.

From what I can see, the OP said after an hour and a half, the battery was at half level, not empty. Now, without actually running the battery down, he doesn't really know how long the other "half" will really last.

The OP needs to see exactly how long the battery lasts, and then see where he stands. I would imagine that it's perfectly acceptable for an old electronics item to have a reduced battery life, and for it to be sold as such. iPod batteries are well known for not lasting more than a few years.

dudara

You essentially have the same consumer rights when buying second-hand from a business (as part of their normal trade) as you do when buying new.

This does take into consideration the age and quality of the item i.e. you wouldn't expect brand-new performance from a 5 year old item, but you can expect a certain level of performance.

But first, determine the extent of the performance of the iPod. The battery may not be faulty, it may simply be wearing out. Rechargeable batteries tend to wear out over time.

drunkmonkey

dudara wrote: »

You essentially have the same consumer rights when buying second-hand from a business (as part of their normal trade) as you do when buying new.

Have you a link for that or is the same rights you have as a consumer purchasing a new product(when does your warranty end, 12mts??), If a business sells something second hand and offers a 14day money back is that not then your total warranty. I'm sure cash converts have a return policy, I can't see them being liable for warranty issues when the product is out of warranty.

I think the ipod is still fit for purpose regardless of battery life, it's like claiming a second hand car is not fit for purpose because it's not capable of the same amount of milage as a new one.

i71jskz5xu42pb

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Have you a link for that

Second post
http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/Guides-to-Consumer-Law/Shopping/secondhand-goods.html

rubadub

Reign Brave Rebellion wrote: »

If the expectation was that the battery was dead then it should have been sold as such. You live in a world where you put up with this kind of carry on.

I wouldn't consider it "carry on" at all, I would fully expect it from a second hand unit, esp. from what somebody else said is probably a 2.5year old unit. They are well known to exagerrate times, as are many companies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPod#Battery_problems

Battery problems
The advertised battery life on most models is different from the real-world achievable life. For example, the fifth generation 30 GB iPod is advertised as having up to 14 hours of music playback. An MP3.com report stated that this was virtually unachievable under real-life usage conditions, with a writer for MP3.com getting on average less than 8 hours from an iPod.[77] In 2003, class action lawsuits were brought against Apple complaining that the battery charges lasted for shorter lengths of time than stated and that the battery degraded over time.[78] The lawsuits were settled by offering individuals either US$50 store credit or a free battery replacement.[79]

iPod batteries are not designed to be removed or replaced by the user, although some users have been able to open the case themselves, usually following instructions from third-party vendors of iPod replacement batteries. Compounding the problem, Apple initially would not replace worn-out batteries. The official policy was that the customer should buy a refurbished replacement iPod, at a cost almost equivalent to a brand new one. All lithium-ion batteries eventually lose capacity during their lifetime[80] (guidelines are available for prolonging life-span) and this situation led to a market for third-party battery replacement kits.

They usually quote mid-low quality music files playing, and the type which is most efficient on the player -probably not mp3. It usually presumes things like back to back playing, the menu not being lit up, and mid to low volume etc.

I am actually surprised he is getting 1.5hours and it the battery says it is only half gone, I originally thought he got 1.5hours in total. I have changed about 4-5 batteries for mates, most were ~1.5-2years old.

drunkmonkey

Reign Brave Rebellion wrote: »

Second post
http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/Guides-to-Consumer-Law/Shopping/secondhand-goods.html

tks

In relation to cash converters I presume all products are sold as seen, if they are when does the contract between seller and purchaser end? It's does not say.

Prisoner6409

Fact is and I'm sorry to say but the OP paid far too much for that ipod.

Head The Wall

Batteries are consumables, they have a limited recharge life. The more they get used the less they will hold the charge. Thats probably the case here, same with any battery device e.g phone

yaddayadda

As the owner of the shop, I can reassure you that you have a 60 day warranty on the item. Hopefully you kept the receipt, but even if not, call in, ask for Brian and we'll sort you out.

astrofool

Lithium batteries have a 2 year optimal life, after which their capacity drops off exponentially. This is the way it is expected to perform, so would not entitle a user to a replacement. I'd never buy an old device with a built in battery.

yaddayadda

Firstly we are not a Cash Converters, but an independent, (see title)although we opened firstly as a franchise we had no choice but to become independent about 18 months ago.
The shop has a 60 day warranty on most of the goods, this item falls under that warranty.
I would expect about 75 to 80 % of full battery life to be acceptable on any item I sell, unless clearly explained to the customer, (very rarely the case as we test all items before sale.) Unfortunately, due to the very large range of items we deal in, we don't get to specialise in any one field and occasionally an item of one generation may be confused with that of the next. In all cases, first , second or third generation I would like my customers to be happy with the goods I sell, as I consider the reputation of the store and it's goods to be essential to the business. We strive to be as fair and honest as possible to both buyers and sellers, and take all complaints very seriously. I have no problem with offering keepkeyyellow a full cash refund on the item, but find it a bit of a shame that he or she didn't call the number on the receipt and ask.

Brian Keegan.

i71jskz5xu42pb

Fair play for responding on here.

yaddayadda wrote: »

I would expect about 75 to 80 % of full battery life to be acceptable on any item I sell, unless clearly explained to the customer

And fair play for talking sense. I wouldn't expect as much as 80% but the amount of people on here who seem to expect the battery to be pretty much dead leaves me scratching my head.

Head The Wall

Reign Brave Rebellion wrote: »

Fair play for responding on here.


And fair play for talking sense. I wouldn't expect as much as 80% but the amount of people on here who seem to expect the battery to be pretty much dead leaves me scratching my head.

Reign Brave Rebellion if you bought the same device from Ebay would you also expect a good battery on it. The battery condition is going to be different in every case so unless the seller is replacing the battery then that is not always going to happen.

An old battery when it is charged may show 70-80% but it is 70-80% of a reduced battery not the specified 10 hours etc. That is the problem