General Feedback.

Boston

Moderators can decide where they want to put this, but as this is a specific issue relating to posters here and this forum, I decided to start the thread here.

The issue:

So recently a no chat rule was introduced to the know your loungers thread. It seems to me, unless I'm mistaken, that this was done with no consultation of the membership nor with a explaination of the rational behind the decision. Now I get that moderators have to make calls sometimes, but I also notice that some of this forum moderators are members of the "Greater transparency", collective. As such, surely an explanation is in order?

My view:

There seems to be a lot of posts getting edited, and a lot of warnings being handed out. Sooner or later that will be stepped up to infractions, and from there bans, ala soccer forum approach. If most people want to chat, and the rest don't care, why stop it? Why have rules for that shake of it? Things should only be banned when there is a need for it.

That said, I found the thread incredible cringe-worthy with all the horrific looking guys responding to photos of attention seeking flirts, letting them know how hot they are. Mutual masturbation was the order of the day. A pretty valid reason for curtailing the behaviour.

The questions:

To the readership) Would you prefer chat to be allowed?
To the moderators) Why was it removed?

Yours
boston.

Pyr0

Nah, I'd rather chat be left out of it to be honest. I'm pretty sure there's a thread on this.

I share pretty much the same view as yourself regarding the attention seeking/flirting but all the chat would just clog up the thread, you'd have replys with full pics all over the shop too. Best to leave it out.

Silverfish

1 person posts a pic. 4 people quote it. Adding their own pic. Person 1 wants to reply, adding another pic. The thread is then no longer 'Know your Loungers' it is then the 'Super Have a Conversation While Finding Pics to Post Challenge'.

We decided to try the rules of the Know Your Nerds thread in AH, which introduced those rules for the same reason.

Plus, the flirting was going well against the charter.

Clare Bear

Boston wrote: »

That said, I found the thread incredible cringe-worthy with all the horrific looking guys responding to photos of attention seeking flirts, letting them know how hot they are. Mutual masturbation was the order of the day. A pretty valid reason for curtailing the behaviour.

.

For that reason alone I'm glad chat is gone from that thread. It's exactly what has been destroying Ladies Lounge for me, the sleaze factor by the same few posters.

Boston

Silverfish wrote: »

1 person posts a pic. 4 people quote it. Adding their own pic. Person 1 wants to reply, adding another pic. The thread is then no longer 'Know your Loungers' it is then the 'Super Have a Conversation While Finding Pics to Post Challenge'.

We decided to try the rules of the Know Your Nerds thread in AH, which introduced those rules for the same reason.

Plus, the flirting was going well against the charter.

That seems like a fair explaination.

Clare Bear wrote: »

For that reason alone I'm glad chat is gone from that thread. It's exactly what has been destroying Ladies Lounge for me, the sleaze factor by the same few posters.

It is somewhat unsettling. Do you feel the situation has improved due to the above move?

Stella777

Clare Bear wrote: »

For that reason alone I'm glad chat is gone from that thread. It's exactly what has been destroying Ladies Lounge for me, the sleaze factor by the same few posters.

I've had the same thought, but thought that maybe it was just in my head, or that I was getting too old!

Clare Bear

Boston wrote: »

That seems like a fair explaination.



It is somewhat unsettling. Do you feel the situation has improved due to the above move?

The sleaze still exists in various other threads regularly but at least people can now look at that thread without cringing/feeling uncomfortable so I think it's much better without chat and I'm glad the mods made that decision.

Silverfish

Well, the point of the Ladies Lounge is a 'safe' place for ladies to post, safe from inane comments, 'How YOU doin'?' type posts, 'tits or gtfo' posts, or just general come-ons and sleaze.

One of the things found is when some people post things like that, they may intend it as a joke, but the recipient may find it uncomfortable. So this is their place to get away from that.

So please please, if anything does make anyone feel uncomfortable (or old!) report it and we'll try come to some resolution.

shellyboo

Boston wrote: »

The questions:

To the readership) Would you prefer chat to be allowed?


Yours
boston.

God no. The chat was turning the thread into the same few posters posting pic after pic after pic and the same people replying and fawning over them. Tedious, and drew too many eejits into the forum. Leave the chat out of it for definite.

Boston

It was fairly noticable. I'm sure those involved thought they were being rather demure and sophisticated.

shellyboo

Boston wrote: »

I sure those involved thought they were being rather demure and sophisticated.

I lolled

Wibbs

Glad you brought it up actually.

Funny I was more of the live and let live persuasion among the mods. If people want to chat then go mad. I wouldnt be overly insistent on every thread being "serious" and if people want to post what they want to post from a womans angle go mad as far as I would be concerned(within the charter).

That said, more and more I saw what they meant and agreed. There were reported posts and people have even removed pics because of the sleaze factor even if 90% of the time it wasnt intentional IMHO. The more I actually read it the more its seemed to be going all BeboBook on us. Fine but that's their remit I reckon.

Boston wrote: »

It is somewhat unsettling. Do you feel the situation has improved due to the above move?

I think so, yea. More new posters for a start, which must be a good sign.

Stella777

Was there really flirting in the NYL thread? I never saw any, but maybe I haven't been on here long enough.

What I didn't like was the quoting of photos. It cluttered up the thread the made it a headache to view.

I do like that thread in general. It's fun to see pictures of other people. Personally, I tend to prefer the pictures that show people in their everyday environments, old photos, travel photos, costume photos or funny photos. The photos which show a person doing that whole Bebo/MySpace Blue Steel pout thing get tedious after a while, because they all start to look the same.

Creamy Goodness

Couldn't agree with Clare bear any more.

Fago!

I reluctantly agree. While I liked that chat, I didn't like men quoting on women's pics and saying.... "Wow" or "Beaut" or anything like that.

Plus, as people have pointed out, all the quotes were cluttering up the thread and making it a pain in the hole to look at.

Maybe there could be a compromise. Maybe chat couldn't be eliminated altogether, just quoting and sleazing....

Say Misticles* posted a pic, and if someone has something to say about a pic (As long as it's not sleazy), they could for example say: @Misticles... I know you... Or @Misticles, cool scarf or something generally something constructive or interesting whatever the case may be.

I'm not really fussed tbh, I was just using the above as a compromise. Ultimately it's the mods choice and I'm glad they made the decision.


* I say misticles because she's the latest poster in that thread...

Creamy Goodness

Tbh fago it's all or nothing. The mods here do too much work than they should have to without them having to read every piece of text to see if it's not sleaze flirting whatever etc.

shellyboo

Sleazing was always banned Fago, as it is across the whole forum, but it still happened. And when there was chat in the thread, people commenting on and quoting the pics was giving the people who were posting in it a couple of times a day the positive feedback they were looking for. I'm avoiding the words 'attention whoring' here, but... yeah. That's what was happening. And it was a pain in the hole tbh.

Now without chat there's no feedback loop at all, which is a blessing.

EDIT: Also, if people want to talk to a certain poster, there's a PM function.

Fago!

Creamy Goodness wrote: »

Tbh fago it's all or nothing. The mods here do too much work than they should have to without them having to read every piece of text to see if it's not sleaze flirting whatever etc.

Good point Creams. I agree. That's why I said this:

I'm not really fussed tbh, I was just using the above as a compromise. Ultimately it's the mods choice and I'm glad they made the decision.

They do good work and can't be expected to run through everything....

Sleazing was always banned Fago, as it is across the whole forum, but it still happened.

I never said it wasn't??? Hense:

As long as it's not sleazy

Oh and Boston, are you in a particularly argumentative mood today? First Daragh, now this?

shellyboo

Fago_25 wrote: »

I never said it wasn't???

You said...

Fago_25 wrote: »

Maybe chat couldn't be eliminated altogether, just quoting and sleazing....

Sleazing was already banned - it still happened. What other measures do you expect them to put in place aside from a "no sleazing" rule to clamp down on sleazing, bar "no chat"? I don't see a middle ground between the two.

Fago!

shellyboo wrote: »

Sleazing was already banned - it still happened. What other measures do you expect them to put in place aside from a "no sleazing" rule to clamp down on sleazing, bar "no chat"? I don't see a middle ground between the two.

Ok I agree. There really isn't a way around it other then NO CHAT.

I guess I just miss the chat.

Silverfish

There is an off-topic thread for chatter, the Nangers bar thread.

There is also the "how was your day' thread.

Contrary to popular belief, this is a forum for women to discuss topics from a women's perspective, not a chatroom, in fairness.

There's sufficient off-topic threads without every thread or most threads or indeed ANY other threads descending into chatter just because some people think the thread is of no interest to them and just want to converse with another poster.

It's not fair on the rest of the people reading the threads, and it does put people off posting. That is something we absolutely need to avoid.

shellyboo

Fago_25 wrote: »

Ok I agree. There really isn't a way around it other then NO CHAT.

I guess I just miss the chat.

We already have an OT chat thread though, and the (almost weekly at this stage) beers threads.

To be honest, the forum was pretty unbearable there for a while, every thread turned into the same few people having a chat and an in-joke. It gets boring very quickly and is *hugely* offputting to new posters, and it detracts from the usefulness and purpose of the forum as a whole.

Like, I know how irritating it is when you know people in a forum and want to have a laugh, but that's not really what the forum is for. It's for discussion rather than conversation. Or at least, that's how I see it.

EDIT: Silverfish beat me to... all my opinions

Creamy Goodness

There is a misc. Chat thread that is stickied at the top of this forum that no one seems to use at all except we have random chi chat in every thread which should really go in there.

Tbh what kind of pisses me off slightly about this place now and a wider extent boards is the amount of threads with edited titles *MOD WARNING POST XXX* these have to be put in place because a select few posters can't be arse reading charters or having a bit of cop on. When a topic goes off topic it's incredibly off putting for regulars let alone say a newbie coming into a thread. These warnings houldnt be necessary but at the moment they are.

shellyboo

Creamy Goodness wrote: »

When a topic goes off topic it's incredibly off putting for regulars let alone say a newbie coming into a thread.

+1 million. And a hell of a lot of topics are going off-topic these days. I'm usually not shy about reporting stuff, but I feel a bit of a d*ck reporting people for having banter, yknow?

Chinafoot

I'll be honest and say that I don't post in here all that much because of the amount of chat that goes on dragging threads off topic. Its the same group of people each time too.

Totally agree with the no-chat rule in the NYL thread.

Maple

shellyboo wrote: »

+1 million. And a hell of a lot of topics are going off-topic these days. I'm usually not shy about reporting stuff, but I feel a bit of a d*ck reporting people for having banter, yknow?

Please don't. I sincerely mean this.

While I do think it's great that people have formed a bond outside of TLL/Boards, it's offputting to those newbies who venture into TLL for a number of reasons. It creates an atmosphere of exclusivity and also it's also pretty bloody boring.

So please do use the report post function.

shellyboo

maple wrote: »

Please don't. I sincerely mean this.

While I do think it's great that people have formed a bond outside of TLL/Boards, it's offputting to those newbies who venture into TLL for a number of reasons. It creates an atmosphere of exclusivity and also it's also pretty bloody boring.

So please do use the report post function.

Well, yeah, but that little box always beats me. What to write? :P

I guess "off-topic" covers it.

Maple

shellyboo wrote: »

Well, yeah, but that little box always beats me. What to write? :P

I guess "off-topic" covers it.

That works for me.

Jules

First thanks to Boston for starting this thread. There was discussion about it at the time but we always value feedback from posters. Personally I would love to get rid of the thanks on that thread cuz it's just another wa to perve/sleaze... From some posters not all!

It does bug me how the majority of threads turn into back and forth chat. And I will be honest the my boyfriend this and that threads bugged me, maybe I'm just bitter and twisted single person but for a while there it seemed that it was having an other half is the be all and end all, and trust me it's not. I would love to see more interesting topics. Religon, politics, enterprise, obviously all from a womans perspective.

But again if anyone has any feedback start a thread or just pm one of us, we don't bite... Well most of us don't /looks at Wibbs!

princess-lala

Jules wrote: »

It does bug me how the majority of threads turn into back and forth chat. And I will be honest the my boyfriend this and that threads bugged me, maybe I'm just bitter and twisted single person but for a while there it seemed that it was having an other half is the be all and end all, and trust me it's not. I would love to see more interesting topics. Religon, politics, enterprise, obviously all from a womans perspective.

This part of TLL annoyed me when I first wandered in - everyone seemed to be in relationships and there was never any chat about the single people about or even any single threads! I admit I felt very intimidated at the start.

Im probably guilty of going off topic myself but who isnt! In the picture thread though it used to be a big perv/sleaze thing and is very off putting to a newbie.

Catari Jaguar

I didn't mind the thread chat from other girls to each other but I didn't like the sleaze. Although the number of thanks under the pictures of posters wearing low cut tops speaks for itself... :rolleyes: This forum isn't a singles bar or a cattle mart.

I just hate that people quote the picture to make a comment about it so there are duplicate photos up 2,3,4 times. Grr!

omerin

Don't understand the reasoning behind people posting pictures of themselves on public forums tbh. Attention seeking maybe, cringe worthy almost certainly, security risk definitely

Jules

omerin wrote: »

Don't understand the reasoning behind people posting pictures of themselves on public forums tbh. Attention seeking maybe, cringe worthy almost certainly, security risk definitely

We are a community, we meet up have drinks. I have made some amazing friends on boards. Most of the time I don't think it's attention seeking I think it's just about sharing with the community.

Anyway this is not up for discussion here.

Kirnsy

Jules wrote: »

First thanks to Boston for starting this thread. There was discussion about it at the time but we always value feedback from posters. Personally I would love to get rid of the thanks on that thread cuz it's just another wa to perve/sleaze... From some posters not all!

+1000m
I barely post here and read the odd interesting thread but ive only ventured into this thread in question twice, however this is my 2c as i thought this when i was reading the thread.

While it was interesting to see the different people posting funny pics of themselves or pics of different places they'd been in the amount of sleaze was extremely off putting and from pretty much the same group over and over again (not just male posters Afaik but majority).
The worst thing was the amount of thanks under some of the more revealing pictures of girls who in most cases i'd imagine were completely innocently putting up a picture for the fun of it.

IMO is it really worth having a picture thread? Obviously i am an outsider but the amount of flirting etc it encourages may not be worth the hassle and FWIW banning all chat was a good move.

Giselle

maple wrote: »

While I do think it's great that people have formed a bond outside of TLL/Boards, it's offputting to those newbies who venture into TLL for a number of reasons. It creates an atmosphere of exclusivity and also it's also pretty bloody boring.

I did think that this forum (and I'm sorry if this sounds patronising, I don't mean it to) was populated by young teenagers who know each other, and it wasn't somewhere I'd be interested in posting.I'm glad others are conscious of that problem.

As for the picture thread, I do think the thanks feature could be removed and that would make it a lot less gratifying to attention seekers.

entropi

Giselle wrote: »

As for the picture thread, I do think the thanks feature could be removed and that would make it a lot less gratifying to attention seekers.

Best idea i've heard in a while...good call:)

Although i did think the chat was getting out of hand, and alot of innuendo and sleaze was being thrown about the place...i think personally it has gotten ever so slightly nicer in here. the chat should be, as it is now, restricted to your own photo for descriptive purposes with the thanks feature turned off like Giselle said.

I know that tLL has become a place where it is no longer only a few male visitors/posters anymore, but lets hope that does not get in the way of some (admittedly) quality posting that has occurred over the past year:)

jellie

Clare Bear wrote: »

For that reason alone I'm glad chat is gone from that thread. It's exactly what has been destroying Ladies Lounge for me, the sleaze factor by the same few posters.

to be brutally honest its in far more threads than just that 1. theres some threads i just dont even read anymore or I know from the title not to bother opening. Its the same posters all the time. I report posts when i find something that makes me uncomfortable or against the charter but half the time i dont get as far as reading them.

KnocKnocKnock

Giselle wrote: »

As for the picture thread, I do think the thanks feature could be removed and that would make it a lot less gratifying to attention seekers.

Completely agree with this too. To another poster who said the women had probably innocently posted themselves in revealing clothes etc, I have to say, although I have just created this account, I have been a lurker for years. To me it seemed like many of the posters knew exactly what they were doing when they were posting a picture and it was less about letting people know who you are, more about getting more thanks under your post. I think this kind of thing brings down the credibility of a thread and derails the purpose.

Jules

Unfortunately you cannot get thanks turned off in a specific thread, its all or nothing.

We could put up a poll to see what the majority think?

Boston

I enjoy posting on this forum because it's a different perspective on society and life. I don't come here to study women, to obsess over their flesh or to berate them. But it is interesting seeing things from a different angle. The discussions when they happen are engaging and thought provoking. The flirting is mundane and boring. It's extremely unfortunate that the target audience of this forum feel put off and reluctant to post due to external influence of some male posters. I'm not to sure how to fix that without coming down hard on the fun element of things, I guess I'm lucky I'm not a moderator.

Fago_25 wrote: »

Oh and Boston, are you in a particularly argumentative mood today? First Daragh, now this?

Shrug, I agree with the majority of posters in this thread. Just because I wanted to talk about why the chatting was banned, doesn't mean I disagreed with it being banned. A pretty solid case has been put forward.

Creamy Goodness wrote: »

There is a misc. Chat thread that is stickied at the top of this forum that no one seems to use at all except we have random chi chat in every thread which should really go in there.

Tbh what kind of pisses me off slightly about this place now and a wider extent boards is the amount of threads with edited titles *MOD WARNING POST XXX* these have to be put in place because a select few posters can't be arse reading charters or having a bit of cop on. When a topic goes off topic it's incredibly off putting for regulars let alone say a newbie coming into a thread. These warnings houldnt be necessary but at the moment they are.

Good point, buts it more relates to the extreme level of hand holding which is now common place throughout boards.

KnocKnocKnock wrote: »

Completely agree with this too. To another poster who said the women had probably innocently posted themselves in revealing clothes etc, I have to say, although I have just created this account, I have been a lurker for years. To me it seemed like many of the posters knew exactly what they were doing when they were posting a picture and it was less about letting people know who you are, more about getting more thanks under your post. I think this kind of thing brings down the credibility of a thread and derails the purpose.

Well that is the other side. Some women obviously desired the male attention they received and actively encouraged. If I started a thread on the LGB forum linking to the "know your nerds" thread, where gay guys could post up "Hot, beaut, yer deadly" in response to the male posters, I think many of the guys would be deeply uncomfortable.

shellyboo

I agree. I think it's misleading and unfair to suggest that it's men who are causing the problem - tbh, the flirting and sleazing I see are mostly in response to posts/pics that were set up in such a way as to attract such comments. Hence why I am reluctant to report - some women come here to flirt and get attention, as many women as men I'd say.

But as Boston says, I see no way of elimiating this without squeezing *all* the fun out of the place. Having a crackdown on 'banter' outside chat threads would be a major pain - seems like we'd be cutting our nose off to spite our face when it really is a certain set of posters who keep doing it.

Dudess

Jules wrote: »

It does bug me how the majority of threads turn into back and forth chat. And I will be honest the my boyfriend this and that threads bugged me, maybe I'm just bitter and twisted single person

Well I found those threads (and the Valentine ones) just as painfully boring when I was in a relationship as I do now (single).

sam34

the pics thread creeps me out i have to say

i think the majority of women who psot revealing pics in it are deliberately doing so, and know full well what theyre doing

the barrage of thanks afterwards is quite sleazy ans veeeeeeeeeeeery offputting

Dudess

I think it's all about context though - the odd flirtatious, even "sleazy" tongue-in-cheek comment can be funny if well timed and witty... but much more so on the likes of After Hours/Noc/BGRH than here.

Boston

Dudess wrote: »

I think it's all about context though - the odd flirtatious, even "sleazy" tongue-in-cheek comment can be funny if well timed and witty... but much more so on the likes of After Hours/Noc/BGRH than here.

Like that time I made reference to us having the love which I dare not speak it's name.

The problem is perception, its not how you read the post, nor how the poster read it, it's how the lurker reads the post.

Nervous Wreck

sam34 wrote: »

the pics thread creeps me out i have to say

i think the majority of women who psot revealing pics in it are deliberately doing so, and know full well what theyre doing

the barrage of thanks afterwards is quite sleazy ans veeeeeeeeeeeery offputting

Well, let's also not get into a "she was asking for it" type of mindset either. Plenty of women post pics of themselves where some cleavage may be showing but it's unfair to assume (even passively) that they're just looking for attention...

MoodeRator

jeeze just let people do what people wanna do! Is that not the whole idea/concept of boards like this? FFS there is enough oppression from the "pc" community! . I for one love this place for the wit and identity that people of Ireland portray! I feel disgusted by people that feel the need to compalin and protest by any means possible whenever an individual tries to express themselves however they wish!!!:mad: FFS everyone, yez everyone is entitled to thier soapbox or their exhibtion or whatever! By a LARGE majority I believe the poeople Ireland portay themselves VERY wel on here and very freely, so b0ll0cks to one's the feel a need to critisise!

ok sorry for rambling but...

shellyboo

But sometimes they *are*, NW. And I'm not saying it's ok to sleaze on women who are "asking for it", it shouldn't happen at all no matter what the pic or comment - but the attention-seeking posts are equally if not more annoying than the sleaze. It totally undermines the posters who come here for discussion rather than attention and craic and to plan their social lives.

People should be able to post what they like without getting leched on, and the no chat in the pics thread achieves this - *and* it weeds out the people who were only posting for thanks and an ego boost. How to get rid of the same crap from other, non-pic-based threads?? No idea where you'd even start, tbh.

Boston

Whatever they want you say? How about I make you cry for my own amusement? I'd rather not contribute to a forum where everyone are free to post whatever moronic thoughts pop into their head. Believe it or not you need some order, you need some boundaries and ethics. When I go to the local pub I don't just "do what I want" if I did I would spoil it for everyone else by urinating in the corners.

MoodeRator

ok, thanks! it ookk me an age to write that in my current state! and then you go and reply in secs with a very well articulated response that I think shalll just retire to the bedrom. THOUGH... if anyone was expected to reply as such....you were in the top five

MoodeRator

fcek, i should have been lecherous ibn some way,,,just to see where it would have gone