Shell to Sea TV three doc

Spiritoftheseventies

Anyone see it last night. Thought it was very one sided. No mention of environmental hazards. This could be the big story of the year given we are approaching end game soon and i think we deserved better to be honest. Reminds of Lisbon debate where certain yes campaigners attacked bass element of NO side to make their case.

Sleepy

Forgive me if I'm wrong but isn't the deal done? Hasn't it been done for quite a long time?

Burke is a very dodgy character who should never have been let near power but as far as I'm aware, he was legally representing our nation at the time he did the deal and there's nothing we can do about it bar renege on a contract with a huge multinational at a time when we're desparately in need of the other multinationals that are propping up our shambles of an economy...

It may be a bitter pill for some to swallow but I don't see an alternative to swallowing it.

Spiritoftheseventies

from what i can gather no pipes have been laid yet unless that doc is an old one. talk that Shell will sue state for millions if this doesnt go ahead. will be Worse than NAMA claims a councillor. But again anti shell protesters adamant that no pipes will be laid. Worth a look if you get a chance to see doc. assume its available to watch online

epgc3fyqirnbsx

I'm not too sure what the situation is with pipe laying on the actual peninsula but there cartainly has been pipes laid in the rest of the county, Castlebar is ready to receive gas, and there has been a terminal built.

It's a done deal, the majority of the people are happy with it, and seeing as this is a democracy that is what matters.

Spiritoftheseventies

Jenny Clever Army wrote: »

I'm not too sure what the situation is with pipe laying on the actual peninsula but there cartainly has been pipes laid in the rest of the county, Castlebar is ready to receive gas, and there has been a terminal built.

It's a done deal, the majority of the people are happy with it, and seeing as this is a democracy that is what matters.

not sure if its a done deal. When you a protester like Kilduff lodging himself under a truck you can see how far these protestors are prepared to go. I think they will take this protest to the very end.

Tabnabs

A pretty disturbing piece on the RTE website today:

Judge likens Shell to Sea to 'secret police'
http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0211/corrib.html

I know someone who was working up near there and got "hassled" by a load of young English girls. Unfortunately I can't repeat his response to them

Spiritoftheseventies

Dyflin wrote: »

A pretty disturbing piece on the RTE website today:

Judge likens Shell to Sea to 'secret police'
http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0211/corrib.html

I know someone who was working up near there and got "hassled" by a load of young English girls. Unfortunately I can't repeat his response to them

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversies_surrounding_Royal_Dutch_Shell

This is disturbing really

Nigeria
See also: Petroleum in Nigeria

Shell operates a joint venture with the government in Nigeria under the name Shell Petroleum Development Company (SPDC). In the early 1990s, Ken Saro-Wiwa, president of the Movement for the Survival of the Ogoni People (MOSOP), led a non-violent campaign against environmental damage associated with the operations of multinational oil companies, including Shell and British Petroleum, in the Ogoni homelands of the Niger Delta. In January 1993, MOSOP organised peaceful marches of around 300,000 Ogoni people – more than half of the Ogoni population – through four Ogoni centres, drawing international attention to his people's plight. That same year, Shell ceased operations in the Ogoni region. Shell's involvement in Nigeria came to the fore again in October 1990 when a peaceful protest in Umeuchem escalated. Eighty people were killed by the police and 495 homes were destroyed. Shell claims that it merely asked for police protection. In 1995 Ken Saro-Wiwa and eight others were executed. Ken Saro-Wiwa had implicated Shell during his “treason” trial by saying “…the ecological war that [Shell] has waged … will be called to question sooner than later and the …crime of the Company's dirty wars against the Ogoni people will also be punished.” Shell was also found to be providing money and supplies to the Nigerian military.[9] When Saro-Wiwa was executed, much of the worldwide condemnation of the act was aimed at Shell, which was implicated by its association with the Nigerian government's activities.

In February 2002, a judge ruled that a case brought against Royal Dutch Shell by close relatives of Ken Saro-Wiwa could proceed in the United States District Court for the Southern District of New York under the Alien Tort Claims Act, the Torture Victim Protection Act of 1992 and RICO Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act (RICO).
Further information: Wiwa family lawsuits against Royal Dutch Shell

Shell has continued to be condemned by bodies such as Christian Aid, who reported that despite Shell claims of "honesty integrity and respect for people" it had "failed to use its considerable interest in Nigeria to bring about change in the Niger delta".[10] The report also found evidence of failures to clean up oil spills, pollution of rivers and water courses, and non-completion of promised projects for community improvement. In 2001 a study into the community projects was leaked to The Economist. It reported that of 81 claimed projects visited by the reviewers of the scheme, 20 did not exist, 36 were partially successful and only 25 were working.

dardevle

.....


2 things-


the documentary was an old one from last year, a paul williams special.


and yes, the doyen of the republican movement Maura Harrington was recently convicted in court, where the judge likened the shell to sea campaign to the "secret police".


...

banthebrick

Dyflin wrote: »

A pretty disturbing piece on the RTE website today:

Judge likens Shell to Sea to 'secret police'
http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0211/corrib.html

I know someone who was working up near there and got "hassled" by a load of young English girls. Unfortunately I can't repeat his response to them

The judicial system in this country isn't infallible...so i wouldn't worry about how an individual who lives their life in a detached bubble sees the world. has this guy ever been in contact with secret police? (i really doubt the kgb would appreciate being compared to shell to sea )

the same force that brought this (http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2005/06/05/story5407.asp) case forward are responsible for giving evidence against the local mayo folk.

its time an independent national publication started reporting this issue in depth, as the shell to sea http://www.corribsos.com/ and, indymedia http://www.indymedia.ie/ propaganda agents seem to be the only sources of info that report on a regular basis.(if i'm missing one please inform)

donvito99

IMO, the Shell to Sea bunch have to be the most annoying lot of protesters I've ever seen.

From what that documentary showed, the vast majority of the people want it.

All the protesters seem to be from Dublin.

And that Maura Harrington one is a witch, she used to be a school principle...

PomBear

donvito99 wrote: »

IMO, the Shell to Sea bunch have to be the most annoying lot of protesters I've ever seen.

From what that documentary showed, the vast majority of the people want it.

All the protesters seem to be from Dublin.

And that Maura Harrington one is a witch, she used to be a school principle...

How do they annoy you? By campaigning for their rights and exercising one of their human rights, the bastards...

The vast majority sown in what has already said to be a very bias documentary

trapsagenius

PomBear wrote: »

How do they annoy you? By campaigning for their rights and exercising one of their human rights, the bastards...

The vast majority sown in what has already said to be a very bias documentary

They annoy people because they're holding up progress because of some misguided attitude that they're on the "right" side.They're a complete disgrace.

PomBear

trapsagenius wrote: »

They annoy people because they're holding up progress because of some misguided attitude that they're on the "right" side.They're a complete disgrace.

They have every right to be concerned about something which could compromise their safety and by the way, i'm impartial either but I believe they should be allowed protest without ridicule from people like you

simonj

The 'documentary' was one of the worst pieces of reporting I have seen, it was misleading and incredibly biased.

The current deal with Shell, set up by Bertie, Frank Fahy and Ray McSharry is giving away a national resource for peanuts, it needs to be looked at again.

Several countries have re-negotiated oil, gas and mineral deals, we need to do the same

Having a corporation dictate policy is very risky, and Shell have been very dodgy in the past

Spiritoftheseventies

simonj wrote: »

The 'documentary' was one of the worst pieces of reporting I have seen, it was misleading and incredibly biased.

The current deal with Shell, set up by Bertie, Frank Fahy and Ray McSharry is giving away a national resource for peanuts, it needs to be looked at again.

Several countries have re-negotiated oil, gas and mineral deals, we need to do the same

Having a corporation dictate policy is very risky, and Shell have been very dodgy in the past

Not the first time government have done that. whole business about having to buy back with West Link toll booth was laughable.

the_syco

PomBear wrote: »

They have every right to be concerned about something which could compromise their safety and by the way, i'm impartial either but I believe they should be allowed protest without ridicule from people like you

None of them seemed to be local. Lots of the main figures have been shown to be not local.

PomBear

the_syco wrote: »

None of them seemed to be local. Lots of the main figures have been shown to be not local.

Fair enough but even still, you have the right to be concerned about it

simonj

donvito99 wrote: »

IMO, the Shell to Sea bunch have to be the most annoying lot of protesters I've ever seen.

From what that documentary showed, the vast majority of the people want it.

All the protesters seem to be from Dublin.

And that Maura Harrington one is a witch, she used to be a school principle...

Well, giving any credence to the misinformation and bending of facts in that documentary is a mistake.

seamus

I haven't seen the documentary, but the whole "Shell to Sea" campaign has shown themselves to be eco-nutjobs with little interest in the local people and more interest in being anti-Shell and in "protecting" the local environment.

It's the same thing that happened at the Glen of the Downs - protestors, many of whom aren't even from Ireland, let alone the local area, with no qualms about breaking the law and wilfully damaging property under some misguided ideals.

These people have no respect for the law, so that law should be applied rigorously on them.

Yes, the whole deal is a complete sham which stinks of Fianna Fail brown envelopes, but if you don't like something that the government has done, then you oppose it using legal means and when those legal means fail, you put up with it and vote in someone else at the next election.

You don't chain yourself to things and break the law to get your way. That's not democracy.

Spiritoftheseventies

Would help if Gardai weren't so condescending. Came off very badly in that doc. end of the day the Rossport five spend 94 days in jail. Thats a lot of liberty to be giving up for anyone.

Tabnabs

Spiritoftheseventies,simonj etc. did you protest when the Marathon Oil Corporation came to Ireland? When does you protest against Providence Resources Irish operations take place?

What about Irish companies who have rigs and platforms in third world countries, have you saved any ire for them?

Or is Shell to Sea just the cause du jour?

simonj

Well, I was too young when marathon came, but it did create Irish jobs in terms of supply vessels, rig work etc.

Tullow, an Irish company, came to a very equitable deal with Ghana that we could learn from.

As for cause du jour, I have been very unhappy with the Shell deal for a long time, bought it up with Frank Fahy years ago.

As for Shell, they are just doing what is best for their shareholders - my ire is that the politicians let them ride roughshod over the interests of the state, and none of the three main parties appear willing to do anything about it, but what would you expect from them.

simonj

Sleepy wrote: »

Forgive me if I'm wrong but isn't the deal done? Hasn't it been done for quite a long time?

Burke is a very dodgy character who should never have been let near power but as far as I'm aware, he was legally representing our nation at the time he did the deal and there's nothing we can do about it bar renege on a contract with a huge multinational at a time when we're desparately in need of the other multinationals that are propping up our shambles of an economy...

It may be a bitter pill for some to swallow but I don't see an alternative to swallowing it.

Its straight forward - renegotiate as several other countries have done, the current taxation system and support contract - of a FINITE resource (we only get one shot at this) is a real shambles.

As for relying on multinationals to prop up the economy - most of them will leave anyway for cheaper labour - they have done so already, particularly with EU expansion.

We have to get out of thinking like some economic colony

And - if you pardon the pun on colons - is more than a bitter pill - this is the biggest enema in the history of the state, and it is of no real benefit

Tabnabs

simonj wrote: »

Well, I was too young when marathon came, but it did create Irish jobs in terms of supply vessels, rig work etc.

Tullow, an Irish company, came to a very equitable deal with Ghana that we could learn from.

As for cause du jour, I have been very unhappy with the Shell deal for a long time, bought it up with Frank Fahy years ago.

As for Shell, they are just doing what is best for their shareholders - my ire is that the politicians let them ride roughshod over the interests of the state, and none of the three main parties appear willing to do anything about it, but what would you expect from them.

Tullow's deal with Uganda appears to have been very favourable to Tullow Oil, also their policy in Uganda is even murkier than Ghana. But they are a successful Irish company, so that's ok.

Marathon's site has created a handful of jobs of course, but nothing compared to what the Corrib field should create. The kinsale field is at the end of it's shelf life,those jobs are not going to continue for much longer.

But there is a large interest in the development potential of the offshore industry in Irish waters, whilst I would agree that our successive governments (of every political shade) have been lax in the terms and conditions of licences given to oil majors, we need a foothold and a template before we can successfully exploit these assets to our own advantage.

IrishTonyO

Anyone know if this documentary is going to be repeated??

the_syco

PomBear wrote: »

Fair enough but even still, you have the right to be concerned about it

But I don't have the right to:
attack people who work there
attack the Gardai
damage other peoples property.

=-=

Can someone give the name of the doc, and I'll see if I can find it. I need the name to find it, though.

nacho libre

http://www.tv3.ie/videos.php?video=9707&locID=1.2.141&page=116

IrishTonyO

Just watched the documentary now, found it very interesting and informative.

Spiritoftheseventies

Dyflin wrote: »

Spiritoftheseventies,simonj etc. did you protest when the Marathon Oil Corporation came to Ireland? When does you protest against Providence Resources Irish operations take place?

What about Irish companies who have rigs and platforms in third world countries, have you saved any ire for them?

Or is Shell to Sea just the cause du jour?

this is shell to sea thread. which is why we are discussing them. And brought up the case with Shell and Nigeria earlier on in thread

donvito99

PomBear wrote: »

How do they annoy you? By campaigning for their rights and exercising one of their human rights, the bastards...

The vast majority sown in what has already said to be a very bias documentary

Na, its mainly the cowardly acts of provoking Gardaí, and then when any sort of contact is made its, "Oh, number MY123" and such.

I have no problem with people execising there human rights. But when they disrupt others rights such as, to work etc, thats what annoys me.

donvito99

Spiritoftheseventies wrote: »

Would help if Gardai weren't so condescending. Came off very badly in that doc. end of the day the Rossport five spend 94 days in jail. Thats a lot of liberty to be giving up for anyone.

I don't see how the Gardaí came off badly in that. I was happy with the way they handled it. Rather than there usual stand off approach, they got stuck in and removed the "protesters".