PC World refunds?

swallace001

Hi, I bought a laptop in PC World about 6 weeks ago but theres a fault in the screen now. started appearing about 10 days ago. it went and came back a few times so i decided to bring it back, get a refund and pay an extra 50 euro or so for a different model. but they told me that as its 28 days after purchase i cant get a refund, but they will send it away to get fixed. but i need the laptop now for writing essays and projects so cant send it anyway. im pretty sure that i am legally entitled to get a refund, and that 28 days doesnt matter at all.

anyone got any advice on this????
thanks a lot

JDxtra

No, they are right. They can just send it away for repair. You cant just demand a refund if it is the first fault. With PC World that could be a very long and frustrating process though...

swallace001

You sure. on to a solicitor friend now too and he says that the consumer has the right to choose. repair, exchange or refund. but of course they will try do everything in their power to not give a refund, and this is why they always say they have to try repair it first. under a 1980 sale of goods act.
i reckon ill print some stuff off saying they cant refuse a return because its after 28 days and go back in tomorrow with some legal info, and see what happens.

Alanstrainor

No the retailer chooses whether to give a refund, repair or replace. There is a "consumer issues" forum for these kind of threads. I will move it there.

B0X

The legislation does not specify whether it is the retailer/supplier or the customer who chooses the form of redress to be offered.

However, if a repair is offered and accepted, then it should be permanent. If not, and the same fault occurs again, then the buyer is entitled to seek another form of redress from the list.

You can also reject the retailer/supplier's offer if you wish to seek another form of redress. If you do, you may have to take the matter to the courts to have it resolved.

That might help.

swallace001

yeah i dont want them to fix it, cos i cant afford to not have it for the next month or two... id be spending the refund i get and and extra bit of cash in the shop anyway so that might sway them......

jhegarty

swallace001 wrote: »

You sure. on to a solicitor friend now too and he says that the consumer has the right to choose. repair, exchange or refund. but of course they will try do everything in their power to not give a refund, and this is why they always say they have to try repair it first. under a 1980 sale of goods act.
i reckon ill print some stuff off saying they cant refuse a return because its after 28 days and go back in tomorrow with some legal info, and see what happens.

I suggest your friend re-reads the act.

Elessar

Alanstrainor wrote: »

No the retailer chooses whether to give a refund, repair or replace.

This is correct in general, but it's important to remember the consumer also has the right to refuse what he is offering and insist on a different R. If the two parties cannot come to an agreement, you have to go to the small claims court. (If the retailer's offer was reasonable, the consumer has little chance of winning).

In this case, it would be reasonable to allow the retailer the chance to repair the laptop first. The retailer cannot force you down a particular route however. If this laptop came back and the same fault re-occurred, you would be in a better position to get a refund. Let them fix it first.

jhegarty

^ Very good summary in that post.

monkeypants

Elessar wrote: »

In this case, it would be reasonable to allow the retailer the chance to repair the laptop first. The retailer cannot force you down a particular route however. If this laptop came back and the same fault re-occurred, you would be in a better position to get a refund. Let them fix it first.

I think this is spot on. Give them a chance to repair it in a reasonable timeframe. Keep short notes on who you spoke with and when, when the laptop was handed over for repair, when it came back, that kind of thing. May help if, heaven forbid, you need to contact them a second time.

ch750536

Lots of people missing the point here.

The purpose of the purchase was for completing essays etc for studies. If the machine is sent away for repair then this is not suitable as it contravenes the reason for the original purchase, meaning the buyer needs to get a replacement laptop in the meantime.

The buyer has every right to decline a repair & I would state this in writing to PC World.

It is then left to PC World to argue why a replacement is not suitable for them in the small claims court if they chose to take that route.

The two parties need to come to an agreement, if they cant then the one being most reasonable normally wins in the small claims court.

jhegarty

ch750536 wrote: »

Lots of people missing the point here.

The purpose of the purchase was for completing essays etc for studies. If the machine is sent away for repair then this is not suitable as it contravenes the reason for the original purchase, meaning the buyer needs to get a replacement laptop in the meantime.

That's not how the law works.

Pacing Mule

swallace001 wrote: »

You sure. on to a solicitor friend now too and he says that the consumer has the right to choose. repair, exchange or refund. but of course they will try do everything in their power to not give a refund, and this is why they always say they have to try repair it first. under a 1980 sale of goods act.
i reckon ill print some stuff off saying they cant refuse a return because its after 28 days and go back in tomorrow with some legal info, and see what happens.

Please post the name of said solicitor so I can be 100% sure never to employ them. They don't have a clue.

FunnyStuff

If they want to send it away for repair, ask is it possible to have a a machine on loan while yours is away for repair, there are alot of stores that do this.

ch750536

jhegarty wrote: »

That's not how the law works.

Yes it is. When you get to small claims it would be taken into account.

Remedy for breach of warranty
53.—(1) Subject to subsection (2), where there is a breach of warranty by the seller, or where the buyer elects, or is compelled, to treat any breach of a condition on the part of the seller as a breach of warranty, the buyer is not by reason only of such breach of warranty entitled to reject the goods, but he may—
( a ) set up against the seller the breach of warranty in diminution or extinction of the price, or
( b ) maintain an action against the seller for damages for the breach of warranty.
(2) Where—
( a ) the buyer deals as consumer and there is a breach of a condition by the seller which, but for this subsection, the buyer would be compelled to treat as a breach of warranty, and
( b ) the buyer, promptly upon discovering the breach, makes a request to the seller that he either remedy the breach or replace any goods which are not in conformity with the condition,
then, if the seller refuses to comply with the request or fails to do so within a reasonable time, the buyer is entitled:
(i) to reject the goods and repudiate the contract, or
(ii) to have the defect constituting the breach remedied elsewhere and to maintain an action against the seller for the cost thereby incurred by him.

Pacing Mule

ch750536 wrote: »

Yes it is. When you get to small claims it would be taken into account.

No it wouldn't the small claims court is based on consumer law - nowhere in this law does it in anyway mention that the specific use the buyer wanted to use it for should be considered. It is based solely on the specs / merchandable quality of the product. Why would the law differentiate between someone who bought a laptop for very occasional use versus someone who bought it for their exams ?? At the end of the day the product is broken -doesnt matter how much of an impact that product being broken causes.

brian ireland

There are two retailers in Ireland that deal with your problem very professionally. Smyths and Argos . Ok they may not be laptop or computer dealers. But they have the right approach to customers. If you bought it and its stopped working within one year they take it back and replace it. This policy works for them because I try to buy from them when i can.

slimjimmc

Pageant Messiah wrote: »

No it wouldn't the small claims court is based on consumer law - nowhere in this law does it in anyway mention that the specific use the buyer wanted to use it for should be considered. It is based solely on the specs / merchandable quality of the product. Why would the law differentiate between someone who bought a laptop for very occasional use versus someone who bought it for their exams ?? At the end of the day the product is broken -doesnt matter how much of an impact that product being broken causes.

Oh yes it does, Para 14.4, Section 10, Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act 1980

(4) where the seller sells goods in the course of a business and the buyer, expressly or by implication, makes known to the seller any particular purpose for which the goods are being bought, there is an implied condition that the goods supplied under the contract are reasonably fit for that purpose, whether or not that is a purpose for which such goods are commonly supplied, except where the circumstances show that the buyer does not rely, or that it is unreasonable for him to rely, on the seller's skill or judgement.

ch750536 is correct if the OP made it known to the seller that he needed the laptop for a "particular purpose" ie to meet a particular deadline then he would have had some protection. If he didn't then his claim is weakened.

ch750536

Pageant Messiah wrote: »

No it wouldn't the small claims court is based on consumer law - nowhere in this law does it in anyway mention that the specific use the buyer wanted to use it for should be considered. It is based solely on the specs / merchandable quality of the product. Why would the law differentiate between someone who bought a laptop for very occasional use versus someone who bought it for their exams ?? At the end of the day the product is broken -doesnt matter how much of an impact that product being broken causes.

Because you are at the court to deliberate the way forward where 2 parties cannot agree. All relevant aspects have to be raised. Putting this in writing now is a good thing to do.

Pacing Mule

slimjimmc wrote: »

Oh yes it does, Para 14.4, Section 10, Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act 1980 ...........


ch750536 is correct if the OP made it known to the seller that he needed the laptop for a "particular purpose" ie to meet a particular deadline then he would have had some protection. If he didn't then his claim is weakened.

That section refers to what the customer intends to use the product for if it deviates from the as described by packaging / retailer. In this case the OP is using the product for it's commonly accepted purpose. It's like buying a telescopic curtain rail and mentioning you are going to use it as a shower rail instead. If the moisture etc in the bathroom subsequently rusts the pole because it was not treated / designed for bathroom use the customer is still protected.

Nody

slimjimmc wrote: »

ch750536 is correct if the OP made it known to the seller that he needed the laptop for a "particular purpose" ie to meet a particular deadline then he would have had some protection. If he didn't then his claim is weakened.

You've missed the point. The OP need the laptop now, he will NOT get a replacement laptop and he will NOT get a temporary laptop from PC World no matter what he told PC Word. The only way for either to happen is small claims court which would also require that all the companies routes for complaints have been exhausted.

This means in practice no matter what the OP will not have a laptop for a couple of months unless the repair works and he has no way of forcing PC World to change that with out waiting several months for the SSC case to come up. Net result the laptop is not there for when the OP needs it.

ch750536

Nody wrote: »

You've missed the point. The OP need the laptop now, he will NOT get a replacement laptop and he will NOT get a temporary laptop from PC World no matter what he told PC Word. The only way for either to happen is small claims court which would also require that all the companies routes for complaints have been exhausted.

This means in practice no matter what the OP will not have a laptop for a couple of months unless the repair works and he has no way of forcing PC World to change that with out waiting several months for the SSC case to come up. Net result the laptop is not there for when the OP needs it.

Hence the OP buys a new laptop and claims a full refund from PC world. Stating this to them may make them see sense and allow him a credit note to at least buy the new laptop from them.

Is a gamble, don't misunderstand me. However, once in the small claims if he has written proof that he asked for a replacement - declined, then asked for a machine whilst the other was being repaired - declined, causing the OP to buy a new laptop and persue a refund from the courts, this would in my opinion give them a favourable chance at a refund.

swingking

@OP

Pc World have a policy that if your laptop is not retured to you within 28days (working) then head office will issue the store to give you a replacement.

mickoneill30

From

http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/FAQs/Faulty-goods/

"Under the Act, goods should be:

* Of merchantable quality - the goods are of an acceptable standard
* As described - false or exaggerated claims must not be made by the seller
* Fit for intended purpose - be fit for the purpose they were bought for
* Correspond to the sample

Where goods do not conform to the above criteria, you are entitled under the Act to seek a repair, replacement or a refund.

The legislation does not specify whether it is the retailer/supplier or the customer who chooses the form of redress to be offered."

Seems pretty clear. Laptop doesn't meet the intended purpose so he's intitled to seek a repair / replacement / refund. If they don't offer the one he wants then he can take it to the small claims court. I've no idea what they'd do if he refused a repair though.

slimjimmc

Pageant Messiah wrote: »

That section refers to what the customer intends to use the product for if it deviates from the as described by packaging / retailer. In this case the OP is using the product for it's commonly accepted purpose. It's like buying a telescopic curtain rail and mentioning you are going to use it as a shower rail instead. If the moisture etc in the bathroom subsequently rusts the pole because it was not treated / designed for bathroom use the customer is still protected.

The wording "any particular purpose for which the goods are being bought" and "whether or not that is a purpose for which such goods are commonly supplied" does not exclude the situation where you bought something to meet a deadline. The important thing is to tell the seller you are buying it for this purpose and let him confirm it will do it.

Del2005

swallace001 wrote: »

Hi, I bought a laptop in PC World about 6 weeks ago but theres a fault in the screen now. started appearing about 10 days ago. it went and came back a few times so i decided to bring it back, get a refund and pay an extra 50 euro or so for a different model. but they told me that as its 28 days after purchase i cant get a refund, but they will send it away to get fixed. but i need the laptop now for writing essays and projects so cant send it anyway. im pretty sure that i am legally entitled to get a refund, and that 28 days doesnt matter at all.

anyone got any advice on this????
thanks a lot

PC World aren't going to give the OP a new laptop unless they can prove there's a fault with the screen that wasn't caused by the OP, the only way to do that is to send it for repair.

How bad it that fault that you can't use it? Is the whole screen gone dead or just some dead pixels?

Nody wrote: »

You've missed the point. The OP need the laptop now, he will NOT get a replacement laptop and he will NOT get a temporary laptop from PC World no matter what he told PC Word. The only way for either to happen is small claims court which would also require that all the companies routes for complaints have been exhausted.

This means in practice no matter what the OP will not have a laptop for a couple of months unless the repair works and he has no way of forcing PC World to change that with out waiting several months for the SSC case to come up. Net result the laptop is not there for when the OP needs it.

Good points.

Pacing Mule

slimjimmc wrote: »

The wording "any particular purpose for which the goods are being bought" and "whether or not that is a purpose for which such goods are commonly supplied" does not exclude the situation where you bought something to meet a deadline. The important thing is to tell the seller you are buying it for this purpose and let him confirm it will do it.

The OP didn't state this though and in the vast majority of everyday buying and selling something like this doesn't come up. The only way that a small claims court is going to force a refund rather than a repair in a situation like this is if at the time of sale the seller claimed that it would be suitable to meet the deadline etc.

Notwithstanding the above the only way I see the OP meeting his deadline is to bring it to a seperate repair agent who may offer a temporary replacement or a much faster service and then take PC World to the small claims court for the value of that repair which is another option open to a consumer. That repair agent would need to be trusted and professionaly established so that when the case came to court the OP would have a report or similar proving the fault was a manufacturing one rather than user error.

swallace001

i went in to PC world last saturday and got a full cash refund. so there you go, my solicitor friend was correct. i printed off some stuff from consumer rights websites and quoted the sales of goods act, and it was all pretty much hassle free.

ch750536

Fantastic, great news & thanks for coming back to let us know.

hellboy99

I purchased a graphics card from them yesterday evening and it's well broken. PC will not detect it, it just keeps crashing to a blue screen saying hardware failure and the fan sounds like a hoover, turns out there are bearings gone in the fan hench the noise. What happened to quality control checks ?

Should I be ok then to get a refund today when they open as this was the only model of graphics card left in the store ?

ch750536

Since no time has passed since the purchase I would expect them to refund this immediately. They sold something that was not of merchandisable quality.