Willie O'Dea resigns as Minister for Defence

Macroom Man

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

Yes, Limerick is much better off now that we have no Minister at the cabinet table :rolleyes:

Check out http://www.thepost.ie/commentandanalysis/odeas-real-shame-ignored-by-our-pathetic-leaders-47488.html for comment from a Limerick native.

"The Minister, who attempted mediation talks four years ago, disclosed that he had been asked to intervene again. "

and he had the cheek to attack Quinlivan over crime!!

Kess73

Aidric wrote: »

People blaming O Dea for the Dell pullout would want to go and lie down for a while.

Nobody is blaming the waffler for Dell pulling out. What was being commented on was his BS talk about Dell.

He was one of the first to go running to the media and claim he had spoken to Dell and that there was no chance of them leaving Limerick.

Then when that lie was found out and it was announced that they were looking to make a serious amount of people jobless, he was off and waffling again how he was heading to Texas to protect the jobs. He made a big deal about it when he got back and about how confident he was that the jobs were safe. Again he was just saying in the local media what a lot of people wanted to hear, and as usual painting himself as a go getter doing stuff for Limerick.

Ask any ex Dell worker how long did they know of coming cuts before O'Dea flew to Texas.

My point was if Dell had been approached by O'Dea and Coughlan when the talk of them leaving first surfaced, then maybe some incentive could have been put in place to keep Dell. Maybe it would have worked, maybe not, but by leaving it to the last minute there was no chance at all.

Kess73

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

AL and the Banks are completely different and you know it.
Bailing out the banks was in the national interest, AL moving to Belfast was in the commercial interest of AL
BTW The Govt didn't bail out any developers. Name one please ?

There was no long term future in connecting bits of computers together in a high cost economy like Ireland. It didn't matter when WOD went to Dell, they were going to pull out anyway. It was a minor miracle they stayed in Limerick for as long as they did.

The regeneration has already started, the Govt were never going to foot bill for knocking and building a load of houses. Private investment in the project didn't live up to expectation, we all know the reason why.

Credit for having some level of intelligence. Again if 40 % of the population in a 5 seat constituency considered him good enough to represent them then he must have done a lot of things right. All these people aren't stupid.

I'm not going to continue this argument with you, we have a difference of opinion, so I think we should leave at that, instead of hogging the discussion

You say you want to end the discussion, yet you ask me to name one developer that the government bailed out.

I suggest you go to the Politics forum here on Boards and see the thread where the first ten people who will be availing of NAMA.

Six of the ten are known FF supporters. Three of the ten are part of the Anglo Irish golden circle. One of the ten does not even live in Ireland, instead he lives in Switzerland, and all his earnings here in Ireland have been tax free, yet he is receiving aid from NAMA as set up by the current government.

These men will be saving millions and millions on repayments for loans that they, not the general public, took out. Really interesting that the first ten have such close links to the current government and to Anglo Irish bank.



Below is a link to the Irish Times where all ten, many of them developers, are named

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2010/0218/1224264715434.html


As for your comment about regeneration, well another poster has posted a link where that gets mentioned, and in that link there is a reference to what O' Dea said in 2007 to the Limerick Leader just before the general election about money being no object for the Limerick regeneration scheme and that all was in place for it to start.

You say that the governement was never going to foot the bill for regeneration? Then why was Willie telling all that would listen that the government, the one he held a cabinet position in, had 1.7 billion euro put aside for it, and that 1.7 billion was for between 2009 and 2018.

Gee maybe it was Willie lying again and looking to get a big return in votes in the general election that happened soon after his comments. Going by his vote tally, it worked a treat on a lot of people.

mike kelly

Whatever way you look it it, it is a loss for Limerick. Could be while before there is a Limerick representative in cabinet again.

Kess73

mike kelly wrote: »

Whatever way you look it it, it is a loss for Limerick. Could be while before there is a Limerick representative in cabinet again.

A Limerick representative in cabinet is only of use if that representative actually does something for Limerick. If getting medical cards and similar are what the man does, then being a local TD is all he needs to be.

Dealing with bigger issues and getting them addressed at Dail level seemed beyond either his ability or his inclination.

No doubt he will be making some noise about today's murder as well, with claims of how he will get every resource used against the scum that did it. Either that or he will play the "I will do what I can, but could have done more if I was still in the cabinet" card.

grenache

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

He did, he retracted his statement and apologised to the court :rolleyes:

''Sorry'' doesn't cut it when you're a cabinet minister and a barrister by profession. Even then, he only apologised when he was found out. As far as i am concerned, he is a perjurer. I don't want liars in any elected government.

Casperbhoy

grenache wrote: »

''Sorry'' doesn't cut it when you're a cabinet minister and a barrister by profession. Even then, he only apologised when he was found out. As far as i am concerned, he is a perjurer. I don't want liars in any elected government.

We better sack the lot of them then:rolleyes:

This government are a joke, FG are no better though

bacon&cabbage

grenache wrote: »

''Sorry'' doesn't cut it when you're a cabinet minister and a barrister by profession. Even then, he only apologised when he was found out. As far as i am concerned, he is a perjurer. I don't want liars in any elected government.

Is an apology not an admission of guilt ?

He said he was mistaken, apologised, paid the Councillor damages and ultimately paid with his Job.

BTW he approached the court as soon as he found out he was mistaken

bacon&cabbage

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Are you seriously putting that forward as an excuse to vote the wrong way and not represent your constituents ?

If he voted against and the rest of FF shafted us, then fair enough.

But he joined them in shafting us, despite talking about doing the opposite.

Once again, It was going to happen regardless.
If he had voted against the party he would alienated himself and probably have lost the party whip. How much use would he be then as an independent ?
Every other party is the same, you vote with the party, I don't like it either
Are you that naive to think it works any other way ?
It called politics for a reason.

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Again, 100% irrelevant. He should at least have tried. He didn't bother. Despite being on €1,500 a day.

I can just see it, the Dell Boardroom
Michael Dell: I'm going to keep uncompetitive manufacturing in Limerick open because of the intense pressure from WOD.

Get real please.

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Hopefully they'll evaluate the fact that he hasn't represented us and vote accordingly next time out.

If he goes again, he'll get in again, no problem

mysterious

I'm not getting into the bitchfest. I don't have much time, respect or any feeling about the man to even want to comment.

But as a minister in his position on the front bench for god knows how many years. He has done nothing for this city. The fianna fail government has never done anything for this city. RTE the government owned station has pumped milions into airing the bad crime and ganglands situation, but has done little to promote anything good about the city. Limerick is a city and its a normal city by national standards.

I just don't understand how this man got to be in the postion and not ever promoted this city in the respect it deserves...

Look at the Front bench T.Ds who are all corrupt anyway did for their own consitenucies at least. I mean come on like...

There is no loss in him been removed. Infact I don't think there will be any loss if they all lose their power at this stage.

People should be standing up to their life and position in the world rather than putting these yobs in position and then blame them when they can't fix our lives..

flutered

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

Once again, It was going to happen regardless.
If he had voted against the party he would alienated himself and probably have lost the party whip. How much use would he be then as an independent ?
Get real please.

jackie healy rea is not doing too bad for his constituents as an independant,
there is a guy just across the border in north tipp doing extreamly well for his constituants as an independant,
it is you bacon and cabbage that needs to get real, on this forum we do not apologists for dandruff willie, he is usefull enough with verbal outbursts to stand up for himself, unless of course you and him are one and the same.

Liam Byrne

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

Once again, It was going to happen regardless.

Once again, that is irrelevant.

If you have conviction and want to earn the respect of those you claim to represent, then you - well - represent them.

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

If he had voted against the party he would alienated himself and probably have lost the party whip. How much use would he be then as an independent ?

I dunno - maybe as much as Jackie Healy-Rae ?

Because the only way to keep FF on their toes seems to be as an independent, where they can't force you to shut the fu*k up and defend the indefensible via the party whip.

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

Every other party is the same, you vote with the party, I don't like it either
Are you that naive to think it works any other way ?

No, I'm not naieve; but that doesn't mean that I have to agree with this method of abdicating responsibility.

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

It called politics for a reason.

"Poly" = "many"
"tics" = "blood-sucking parasites"

Yup, it's called that for a reason.

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

Get real please.

I can assure you that I am real, and that someone who makes no effort is a waste of space.

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

If he goes again, he'll get in again, no problem

If some of the people of Limerick choose to vote for a lying, ineffective, uncommitted individual, then I can't stop them.

But at least I'll point out the facts and highlight his track record of promising everything and delivering nothing.

His promises were as fictional as his affadavits and accusations.

Kess73

mysterious wrote: »

I'm not getting into the bitchfest. I don't have much time, respect or any feeling about the man to even want to comment.

But as a minister in his position on the front bench for god knows how many years. He has done nothing for this city. The fianna fail government has never done anything for this city. RTE the government owned station has pumped milions into airing the bad crime and ganglands situation, but has done little to promote anything good about the city. Limerick is a city and its a normal city by national standards.

I just don't understand how this man got to be in the postion and not ever promoted this city in the respect it deserves...

Look at the Front bench T.Ds who are all corrupt anyway did for their own consitenucies at least. I mean come on like...

There is no loss in him been removed. Infact I don't think there will be any loss if they all lose their power at this stage.

People should be standing up to their life and position in the world rather than putting these yobs in position and then blame them when they can't fix our lives..

What? What? Who are you? You cannot be Mysterious because I find myself agreeing with what you said there.

bacon&cabbage

Kess73 wrote: »

What? What? Who are you? You cannot be Mysterious because I find myself agreeing with what you said there.

I was thinking earlier, jeez I'm the mysterious of this tread; the controversial one

mysterious

The immaturity on this thread shows that some of you are no better than Willie O dea...

Liam Byrne

mysterious wrote: »

The immaturity on this thread shows that some of you are no better than Willie O dea...

Please explain.....what immaturity are you talking about ?

Kess73

mysterious wrote: »

The immaturity on this thread shows that some of you are no better than Willie O dea...

Ahh that's better. Welcome back. Sorry but I cannot argue with you on this thread. It is your fault though, for posting something I could not disagree with.:p

mysterious

Kess73 wrote: »

Ahh that's better. Welcome back. Sorry but I cannot argue with you on this thread. It is your fault though, for posting something I could not disagree with.:p

Dude take responsibility for your carry on this thread, and stop blaming others for your own immaturity. It's lowly.

Mr E

mysterious wrote: »

Dude take responsibility for your carry on this thread, and stop blaming others for your own immaturity. It's lowly.

Dude, stop trolling.

flutered

Mr E wrote: »

Dude, stop trolling.

with a thread on dandruff willie one has to expect trolling

mike kelly

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Please explain.....what immaturity are you talking about ?

Willies immature recollection, perhaps?

gaf1983

What do you make of Fintan O'Toole's take on the Willie saga in today's Irish Times?

(It must be noted that Fintan clearly doesn't visit the Limerick City forum on boards.ie, as plenty of people here have wondered why roughly 20,000 people voted for him in 2007.)

Limerick's champion left people powerless

Tue, Feb 23, 2010

Paradoxically it is the failure of Willie O’Dea’s advocacy for Limerick that makes the city so dependent on him, writes FINTAN O'TOOLE

IN ALL the talk about Willie O’Dea over the last week, one question has scarcely been asked – why did almost 20,000 people vote for him in the 2007 general election? Answering that question gives us some idea of the depth of the problems in Irish political culture.

We know, at least, where the answer does not lie. It is not Willie’s irresistible charm, which teams of intrepid explorers have so far failed to locate. It is not the allure of his sexy moustache. And it is not his inner nobility.

If Willie were the captain of the Titanic, he would have been the first man in the lifeboat, dressed in bonnet and frock. He was, after all, quite prepared to see a journalist lose his job in order to save his own skin. (If Mike Dwane of the Limerick Leader had, as Willie implied, invented the smear that created all the trouble, no media outlet would employ him.) He even suggested in his last-ditch interview with Seán O’Rourke that he would consider naming the garda who allegedly gave him the false information – another potential sacking to save his own job.

So, what is it about Willie that makes him so extraordinarily successful in Limerick? Here we get to the heart of the paradox that is Fianna Fáil. It is not the success of Willie O’Dea’s advocacy for Limerick that makes the city so dependent on him. It is its failure. The relationship between the ultimate clientelist politician and his clients depends on the continuation of powerlessness. Instead of being punished for Limerick’s underdevelopment, O’Dea has thrived on it. The worse the city’s problems, the greater its need of a supposed champion.

I do not wish to indulge in the crude caricatures of Limerick as Stab City. The proportion of the Limerick workforce in professional occupations is higher than the national average. It has an innovative university on a magnificent campus and a very good third-level educational infrastructure. There is a thriving, sophisticated, beautiful middle-class Limerick.

But there is also the Limerick that is a national disgrace, that, for all Willie O’Dea’s supposed prowess as its political champion, benefited least from the boom and has been hurt most brutally by the recession.

Of the 18,900 houses in the city area, 8,000 were built as social housing. Even at the height of the boom, Moyross and Southill had an unemployment rate five times the national average and were among the most disadvantaged areas in the State. (In 2005, just 16 per cent of Limerick City Council’s tenants were in paid employment and youth unemployment stood at 62 per cent.) About a third of the houses in Moyross and half of those in Southill are effectively unfit for human habitation – so much so that John Fitzgerald, in his report on regeneration in Limerick, reckoned that they were beyond repair.

The drug problem in Moyross, O’Malley Park, Ballinacurra/ Weston and St Mary’s Park, both in terms of addiction and of the vicious gangs that feed off it, is worse than anywhere else in Ireland. Intimidation and constant, low-level threats of violence have made life hard for the vast majority of decent people trying to raise good families. A third of those over 65 in O’Dea’s constituency have a disability – way above the national average. There is also a significantly higher proportion of single-parent families.

The boom passed most of these people by. Even property mania did not take off in Limerick’s estates – people who put everything they had into buying their council houses got nothing back on their investment. Uniquely in Ireland, commercial rents in Limerick city centre remained substantially lower than those in the suburbs – a pattern more typical of devastated American cities like Baltimore.

John Fitzgerald, who was hardly an innocent abroad after his years as Dublin city manager, found conditions in the Limerick estates “quite shocking” and described the overall quality of life as “extremely poor”.

As “Mister Limerick”, therefore, Willie O’Dea has been a spectacular failure. The State that he embodies has not produced the goods for those of his constituents who most depend on it. The Fitzgerald report pointed out, damningly, that “it would be hard to conclude that public funding is achieving an acceptable, let alone optimum, level of direct benefits to the communities concerned”.

Time and again, Willie O’Dea, for all his local bluster, failed to deliver for those communities. The function of his moustache has always been to prevent anyone seeing that he is talking through both sides of his mouth at once. Just a few days before he was overtaken by the scandal that did for him, O’Dea was letting it be known, in his usual sidling manner, that the desperately needed regeneration programme for the city will not be delivered.

And yet O’Dea will probably get his 20,000 votes again. Our political culture is such that the worse things get, the more we look for a fixer to do us a few little favours. The more powerless we feel, the more we cling to those who keep us that way.

© 2010 The Irish Times

bacon&cabbage

TBH, I think mysterious is right, silly references to "Dandruff Willie" etc are childish and don't add anything to this discussion

After Hours is the place for that.

gaf1983

Can we call him a Political Pinnochio though? (Brian Hayes' words, not mine!)

In fairness Willie has always been a great man for dishing out the nicknames, he famously called Pat Rabbitte the Woody Allen of Marxism.

flutered

bacon&cabbage wrote: »

TBH, I think mysterious is right, silly references to "Dandruff Willie" etc are childish and don't add anything to this discussion

but has he not more white flakes on his shoulders that there is snow on the galtees at the moment.
could you not buy him a bottle of head and shoulders, plus a clothes brush , which would make more sense that some of your statements.

flutered

one cannot but wonder if he will feel the heat from the garda investigation announced today, or will the carpet be lifted and swept under.

Kess73

flutered wrote: »

one cannot but wonder if he will feel the heat from the garda investigation announced today, or will the carpet be lifted and swept under.

Yeah was listening to that announcement on the radio. If the media highlight it, then there will be no chance of it being brushed under the carpet.

Will be interesting to see the outcome of it as it has to be pretty clear cut.

Either a garda was handing out sensitive or false information to a then cabinet minister who was prepared to use it to discredit another person by passing the information onto a local newspaper.


or


No garda gave out information and it was made up by a then cabinet member to discredit another person.


Regardless of outcome, O'Dea comes out of it very badly.

flutered

as far as i can figure out f.f. have one hell of a big carpet, after his defence of aherne and o donaghoue, surely they have to defend the dandruff one.

streetsweeper

what a suprise. someone in fianna foul telling a lie.. thats never happened before.... NOT! the scumbag Dertie Aherne was a lying scumbag of the highest degree... dont you agree guys??

bacon&cabbage

flutered wrote: »

could you not buy him a bottle of head and shoulders, plus a clothes brush , which would make more sense that some of your statements.

oh dear ! :rolleyes: