Man City V Liverpool, Sunday 21st February, 3pm

ilovelamp2000

BastardPrince wrote: »

once again in tactics and ability that team was capable of beating city, from there it is up to the players to do their job. few did.

my only criticism of rafa is not dropping Gerrard at all. i would not like to play in a team that has hit a bad patch with Gerrard, he is a c*ck. when he decided to take the ball of insua, and then got in insua's way, the ball rolled out of play, no apology just a look of you idiot to Insua, a 21 year old, from the club legend. that is not a how a captain acts on the pitch...

You'd drop Gerrard ?

Glico Man

Spiritoftheseventies wrote: »

Just how bad was this game guys. How many minutes will MOTD2 give to it tonight?

Hoping very few. Not really anything of highlight value to the game bar two/three saves

daithijjj

BastardPrince wrote: »

once again in tactics and ability that team was capable of beating city, from there it is up to the players to do their job. few did.

my only criticism of rafa is not dropping Gerrard at all. i would not like to play in a team that has hit a bad patch with Gerrard, he is a c*ck. when he decided to take the ball of insua, and then got in insua's way, the ball rolled out of play, no apology just a look of you idiot to Insua, a 21 year old, from the club legend. that is not a how a captain acts on the pitch...

I think you are over analyzing tbh. They just got in each others way, no big deal.

karma_

magma69 wrote: »

Zabaleta had a good game alright. Masch was far better than De Jong. Liverpool were better in midfield, Masch was at the heart of that. Especially considering how ineffective Lucas was.

Did you watch that game?

Chardee MacDennis

Rosco1982 wrote: »

You'd drop Gerrard ?

he needs a kick up the arse, dropping him for a game might be that kick he needs. he tries to do too much, gives none of his team mates credit, and doesnt lead his team.

Chardee MacDennis

daithijjj wrote: »

I think you are over analyzing tbh. They just got in each others way, no big deal.

gerrard got in insuas way, it isnt the only time he's done this...

ilovelamp2000

He needs a few teammates who can run, dribble, pass and shoot.

magma69

karma_ wrote: »

Did you watch that game?

Yes. Liverpool had more possession of the ball. They did fuck all with but that's beside the point. Did you watch the game?

Chardee MacDennis

Rosco1982 wrote: »

He needs a few teammates who can run, dribble, pass and shoot.

he needs to realise he is not bigger than the team...

daithijjj

BastardPrince wrote: »

he needs a kick up the arse, dropping him for a game might be that kick he needs. he tries to do too much, gives none of his team mates credit, and doesnt lead his team.

He is surrounded by players that are technically very poor, maxi did nothing, kuyt cant hold onto the ball without acres of space etc etc. He also gets no support from midfield in lucas and masch, they never got forward. He is not a miracle worker, allthough we have got used to a few miracles from him over the years.

ilovelamp2000

BastardPrince wrote: »

he needs to realise he is not bigger than the team...

This sort of nonsense does my head in.

We're lucky to have him.

karma_

magma69 wrote: »

Yes. Liverpool had more possession of the ball. They did fuck all with but that's beside the point. Did you watch the game?

And your sure it was the Liverpool v City game?

Reason i ask is because Liverpool's midfield was absolutely dire. The City one wasn't much better but it was better.

daithijjj

BastardPrince wrote: »

gerrard got in insuas way, it isnt the only time he's done this...

It happens, get over it.

Mr Alan

gerrards own passing, shooting and running has been awful all season. he is not immune to criticism.

Chardee MacDennis

daithijjj wrote: »

He is surrounded by players that are technically very poor, maxi did nothing, kuyt cant hold onto the ball without acres of space etc etc. He also gets no support from midfield in lucas and masch, they never got forward. He is not a miracle worker, allthough we have got used to a few miracles from him over the years.

fair enough, but if he is going to be a stroppy c**t then he shouldnt be captain...

Mr Alan

Rosco1982 wrote: »

This sort of nonsense does my head in.

We're lucky to have him.

Not as lucky as he is to captain Liverpool.

Spiritoftheseventies

that table starting to look a bit scary now. Thought Villa were out of the reckoning but race for fourth spot is wide open again.

ilovelamp2000

Mr Alan wrote: »

Not as lucky as he is to captain Liverpool.

Quite. The player who is single-handedly responsible for us winning trophies in the past 5 years is lucky to have that armband.

Chardee MacDennis

Rosco1982 wrote: »

Quite. The player who is single-handedly responsible for us winning trophies in the past 5 years is lucky to have that armband.

yes coz being a sides best (well second now) player means you should be captain. do you know anything about football?

daithijjj

Mr Alan wrote: »

gerrards own passing, shooting and running has been awful all season. he is not immune to criticism.

Of course hes not immune. But when you look to the personnel around him its like telling a sculptor he can only use a hammer to produce a masterpiece. When other players step up to the plate il be happy to criticize gerrard.

copacetic

Xavi6 wrote: »

De Jong was better in midfield, and Zabaleta was the best player on the park..

lollers, you have to be feckin kidding me. :rolleyes:

Glico Man

Rosco1982 wrote: »

Quite. The player who is single-handedly responsible for us winning trophies in the past 5 years is lucky to have that armband.

We're talking about this season...in which he has been, to put it bluntly, crap

Mr Alan

players gerrards surrounded by;dirk kuyt,starting dutch international. mascherano, captain of argentina-on the shopping list of the best team in the world. Riera, regular for spain. Benayoun-one of the most technically gifted players in the league. Lucas,one of our best players this season, young player who is constantly improving, now features in the brazilian squad. Torres-arguably the best striker in the world. I don't know how gerrard does it. The poor kitten.

ilovelamp2000

BastardPrince wrote: »

yes coz being a sides best (well second now) player means you should be captain. do you know anything about football?

I know absolutely nothing about football. I think Gerrard should be dropped and stripped of the captaincy.

rossie1977

Rosco1982 wrote: »

Quite. The player who is single-handedly responsible for us winning trophies in the past 5 years is lucky to have that armband.

maybe liverpool should bring back luis garcia and make him vice captain, i seem to remember him having a hand or 10 in getting liverpool to those european cup and fa cup finals

Xavi6

copacetic wrote: »

lollers, you have to be feckin kidding me. :rolleyes:

I wouldn't dream of even attempting a joke in a Liverpool match thread.

noodler

I have to laugh my ass of when I hear people trying to defending Gerrard's lack of application and form by criticiisng those around him.

He was been one of our least effective players all season.

I personally think he isn't going to age well and we should sell if someone offers 30m in the summer. I know that last bit is controversial b ut if he has another season like this he will be 31 and the asking price will shrink considerably.

daithijjj

Mr Alan wrote: »

players gerrards surrounded by;dirk kuyt,starting dutch international. mascherano, captain of argentina-on the shopping list of the best team in the world. Riera, regular for spain. Benayoun-one of the most technically gifted players in the league. Lucas,one of our best players this season, young player who is constantly improving, now features in the brazilian squad. I don't know how gerrard does it. The poor kitten.

When you bring riera into your argument for this season you are talking BS to be frank. Hes not even a regular for liverpool, nevermind spain. He has been an embarasment on the pitch this season. Kuyt has been woeful for 95% of the season (and plays entire games regardless). I have never criticised lucas once on this forum but he is not the required standard midfielder yet to play 30+ games and challenge.

Chardee MacDennis

Rosco1982 wrote: »

I know absolutely nothing about football. I think Gerrard should be dropped and stripped of the captaincy.

good coz anyone who thinks the captain is just the teams best player is an idiot...

Finical

I think that was a missed opportunity to be honest, City wern't great today. We wern't either though an all familar saying this season. Our next 3-4 games are vital in the chase for 4th.

Tottenham can leapfrog us both now.

ilovelamp2000

BastardPrince wrote: »

good coz anyone who thinks the captain is just the teams best player is an idiot...

Whoever said that ?

Headshot

what is wrong with Gerrard this season ?

daithijjj

Headshot wrote: »

what is wrong with Gerrard this season ?

He kept letting in late sloppy goals.

Chardee MacDennis

Rosco1982 wrote: »

Whoever said that ?

i dunno, but you did say this

Rosco1982 wrote: »

Quite. The player who is single-handedly responsible for us winning trophies in the past 5 years is lucky to have that armband.

CHD

Whichever team makes it to CL will be knocked out early. Terrible.

magma69

karma_ wrote: »

And your sure it was the Liverpool v City game?

Reason i ask is because Liverpool's midfield was absolutely dire. The City one wasn't much better but it was better.

They were very poor. Lucas gave away the ball many times, City gave away the ball just as much. Liverpool won the battle because they were winning all the 50/50s and as the statistics show, they kept more possession of the ball than City. I think Masch only gave away the ball once, trying to thread a through ball. He was fantastic and made more tackles and won possession back more than anyone else in midfield.

You can win the battle and still be poor. You can win a match and still be poor.

Mr Alan

daithijjj wrote: »

When you bring riera into your argument for this season you are talking BS to be frank. Hes not even a regular for liverpool, nevermind spain. He has been an embarasment on the pitch this season. Kuyt has been woeful for 95% of the season (and plays entire games regardless). I have never criticised lucas once on this forum but he is not the required standard midfielder yet to play 30+ games and challenge.

In fairness to Lucas, he played 20 plus games last season iirc and he is a better player this year. I was just pointing out that people are tryin to make out gerrard is playing with a bunch of sunday league players, he's playing wit some of the top players around, granted some aren't in the best of form this season (i think you're being harsh on kuyt) but they cannot be an excuse for his under performance anymore than he can be an excuse for theirs. In fact, i'd argue that out of yossi, torres, lucas, gerrard, kuyt, riera and mascherano-gerrard and albert have been the worst performers by some considerable distance. Yet to say anything negative about steven is not allowed.

magma69

CHD wrote: »

Whichever team makes it to CL will be knocked out early. Terrible.

That's a bit premature no? Liverpool came fifth the year they won the Champions League. A lot can change in 8 months too. Especially with City's spending power.

Eire-Dearg

CHD wrote: »

Whichever team makes it to CL will be knocked out early. Terrible.

The team who you think will win the league will fail to win the CL. Again.

Spiritoftheseventies

Mr Alan wrote: »

In fairness to Lucas, he played 20 plus games last season iirc and he is a better player this year. I was just pointing out that people are tryin to make out gerrard is playing with a bunch of sunday league players, he's playing wit some of the top players around, granted some aren't in the best of form this season (i think you're being harsh on kuyt) but they cannot be an excuse for his under performance anymore than he can be an excuse for theirs. In fact, i'd argue that out of yossi, torres, lucas, gerrard, kuyt, riera and mascherano-gerrard and albert have been the worst performers by some considerable distance. Yet to say anything negative about steven is not allowed.

We are way too reliant on Gerrard. It was mentioned by a pundit recently and i thought this myself that too much is expected of him. Time for other players to step up to the plate and share the burden. Gerrard still remains one of our biggest goal threats and it shouldnt always be this way.

Headshot

daithijjj wrote: »

He kept letting in late sloppy goals.

?

would he still be injured or something, this season must be his worse.

CHD

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

The team who you think will win the league will fail to win the CL. Again.

Might do but at last they will be there or thereabouts.

ilovelamp2000

Mr Alan wrote: »

In fairness to Lucas, he played 20 plus games last season iirc and he is a better player this year. I was just pointing out that people are tryin to make out gerrard is playing with a bunch of sunday league players, he's playing wit some of the top players around, granted some aren't in the best of form this season (i think you're being harsh on kuyt) but they cannot be an excuse for his under performance anymore than he can be an excuse for theirs. In fact, i'd argue that out of yossi, torres, lucas, gerrard, kuyt, riera and mascherano-gerrard and albert have been the worst performers by some considerable distance. Yet to say anything negative about steven is not allowed.

I just have the decency to recognise everything he's done for the club. I don't like to have a go at him because of that.

Has he been great this year ? No.

Am I going to criticise him and say he should be dropped and stripped of the captaincy ? No.

He should be playing in midfield alongside Mascherano, because without a decent ball playing midfielder in the team he's wasted in the AM position.

Mr Alan

other players have stepped up. kuyt, ngog, lucas and mascherano have all stepped up big time in the last couple of months. at some point gerrard has to do a bit of standing himself again.

Mr Alan

Rosco1982 wrote: »

I just have the decency to recognise everything he's done for the club.

Perhaps i'm confusing you with someone else, but aren't you the lad who really dislikes rafa and wants him sacked cause of our form this season?

Kess73

Rosco1982 wrote: »

Quite. The player who is single-handedly responsible for us winning trophies in the past 5 years is lucky to have that armband.

Yeah because no other players had a hand in what we won in 2006 and 2005. All season I have seen and heard comments about how he was so important in 2005 and 2006. Shame the same cannot be said in 2010, four years since the last trophy he, not the club, won

Yes he has been immense for us in the past, but he has not been that way once this season, and as such is not above being criticized for a poor spell of personal form that has lasted months.

Yes he has had injuries, but so have other players, and I would argue that his lack of desire and effort are a mental thing rather than the result of an injury.

I personally think that the guy has peaked, and is now a year or two past that peak and knows it. The media is who, imho, keep alive the notion that he is still turning in good performances this season.

I totally see where people are coming from when they defend him to the hilt, and will not knock a person for doing so. I would love to have him prove me wrong as it would mean good things for the club if he did.

While I have an obvious love for seeing local boys in the team, I do think this summer is the time to weigh up offers for him, and if a club wants to offer silly money for him, then I would take it as I think Liverpool have gotten the best out of him and that trying to fit teams around him now is to the detriment of the team, whereas years ago it made sense.

I hold fast to my belief that there will be a decent sized clearout at the club this season, regardless of whether Rafa stays or not, and that there will be one or two of the bigger names gone, along with the likes of Babel, Degan, Aurelio, and probably Mascherano.

ilovelamp2000

Mr Alan wrote: »

Perhaps i'm confusing you with someone else, but aren't you the lad who really dislikes rafa and wants him sacked cause of our form this season?

I've wanted him sacked ever since he signed Keane.

Mr Alan

but yet have the audacity to claim you have decency to stand by gerrard for wat he's done for the club?wow.

Chardee MacDennis

Rosco1982 wrote: »

I've wanted him sacked ever since he signed Keane.

you'd think you would have some decency and recognise what he has done for the club :rolleyes:

daithijjj

Mr Alan wrote: »

In fairness to Lucas, he played 20 plus games last season iirc and he is a better player this year. I was just pointing out that people are tryin to make out gerrard is playing with a bunch of sunday league players, he's playing wit some of the top players around, granted some aren't in the best of form this season (i think you're being harsh on kuyt) but they cannot be an excuse for his under performance anymore than he can be an excuse for theirs. In fact, i'd argue that out of yossi, torres, lucas, gerrard, kuyt, riera and mascherano-gerrard and albert have been the worst performers by some considerable distance. Yet to say anything negative about steven is not allowed.

Yes, lucas did play a good portion of games last season, (and he was rank awful for the first 7 or 8 at least, we had a 10 point lead at the top when he started getting matches, maybe the same run would benefit babel like i pointed out to you before), and came good away at united in his best match imo.

I disagree that he is playing with some of the top players around, these top players you speak of have all had injuries and gerrard has taken injections before games just to be able to turn out in october/november, he is that important to us and this is why benitez picks him regardless of being unfit. Our attacking players apart from torres and benny (who have not played) are technically poor. Riera was so bad at blackburn benitez took him off 10 mins into the second half, unusual for rafa. Look, gerrard has not been his old self but he hasnt had benny or torres for large portions of the season and he has been playing while not 100%. Lucas and masch have done well but they dont go forward enough, hence the purchase of a box to box player in aquilani (who also has barely played). Gerrard needs help, its a team game, and this team this season around him has been very very poor. Gerrard didnt let in all those sloppy goals at the back in the first 4 months if i can use this as a case in point.