Seperate Club Forums

monkey9

This is something that hasn't been answered. A while ago, a seperate Liverpool forum request was turned down, yet a Spurs one exists.

Now, while i understand the Liverpool one being turned down for certain reasons, it's ridiculous that a Spurs one exists.

Why is this?? Surely, the Spurs forum should be scrapped as it's completely unfair that this is the only club forum in existence while other club ones are banned.

How did this even come about. Why not a Villa one? Or an Everton one?

Eliot Rosewater

From the Forum Guidelines for Requests, the sticky at the top of the request forum:

Existing forums do not set precedence for another forum request

If there is already a forum for something that is of similar nature of your request, but your request may be for example another soccer club, you cannot argue a request on the basis that "club X&Y have a forum, so there should be a forum for club Z".

However if there is reason enough for the forum. Example: Too much discussion taking over from the main discussion of a forum, then your request will be taken on board.

manutd

Fully agree with the OP. There is not even trffic on the Spurs Forum.

Daemos

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

From the Forum Guidelines for Requests, the sticky at the top of the request forum:

Existing forums do not set precedence for another forum request

If there is already a forum for something that is of similar nature of your request, but your request may be for example another soccer club, you cannot argue a request on the basis that "club X&Y have a forum, so there should be a forum for club Z".

However if there is reason enough for the forum. Example: Too much discussion taking over from the main discussion of a forum, then your request will be taken on board.

Yeah but that's a fairly poor excuse to be honest, IMO it's basically an admition that forums like the Spurs and Mustard ones were bad ideas and shouldn't have been given the go-ahead, why else put a stop to similar ones?

Eliot Rosewater

Don't shoot the messenger

I read the original post as a general query into that whole issue, but on re-reading it it seems to be more specific.

Anyway, isnt the purpose of the Hosted category to be a "trying out" place where new forums are put to see if they work out? Looking at it it doesn't seem that empty. Especcially compared with some of the Arts one like Harry Potter.

Daemos

Not shooting you, just the quote

And no, the Hosted section isn't a section for trial forums, all forum requests are either rejected or accepted, there's never a middle-ground

Plus there are numerous private forums there that you can't even visit unless you have permission

Time Magazine

The growth of the site makes club-specific fora almost inevitable imho.

That growth is something that should be embraced rather than the current policy of clinging on to a single Soccer forum for dear life.

Headshot

this was put forward by Mike65 iirc in the request forum and it was rejected

I see where liverpool fans are coming from, I to am sick and tired of the trolls that are on the man utd thread but this separate club forum wont happen

would I want it to happen, I not so sure, i like genuine rival club posters posting about utd, there's some great liverpool fans that post on utd and I wouldnt want that to stop

concerning the spurs thread, from what I heard there was an admin who was a spurs fan and it got a separate forum(not sure is that true or not)

mike65

I've got over the rejection but the continued exisitence of the Spurs Supporters Forum does rankle a bit I must say. Sauce for the goose and all that (I believe an Admin or senior Mod type got a concession at some point, If thats correct it was wrong then and its still wrong)

Zaph

The Spurs forum is a hosted forum that was created back in 2006. It is specifically the Spurs Supporters Club forum, as opposed to the Spurs forum, and it was intended that it would be used mainly for supporters club activities such as tickets and travel arrangements. Despite assurances to the contrary, inevitably it ended up being a forum for everything Spurs related, to the detriment of the main soccer forum imo. The Spurs superthread in the main soccer forum hasn't had a post in over 2 months, and if individual forums for other teams were created this would further take from the main forum. Should there ever be a complete reorganisation of the soccer forum in the future it is possible that separate club forums may be considered, but under the current structure it's not going to happen.

Dub13

Time Magazine wrote: »

The growth of the site makes club-specific fora almost inevitable imho.

That growth is something that should be embraced rather than the current policy of clinging on to a single Soccer forum for dear life.

I agree that we we have out grown the one forum for everything model we currently use,I have been saying this for sometime.

But we are different in that the boards soccer forum is a mixed forum,if we got club specific forums this would change in a instant and the boards soccer forum would just become like so many others on the net.This is not the direction we (the mods & users) want to take the forum.

Overheal

Time Magazine wrote: »

The growth of the site makes club-specific fora almost inevitable imho.

That growth is something that should be embraced rather than the current policy of clinging on to a single Soccer forum for dear life.

A forum I might add that has already imploded a few times already. It does need breathing space.

Jazzy

white wash man

Time Magazine

Dub13 wrote: »

I agree that we we have out grown the one forum for everything model we currently use,I have been saying this for sometime.

But we are different in that the boards soccer forum is a mixed forum,if we got club specific forums this would change in a instant and the boards soccer forum would just become like so many others on the net.This is not the direction we (the mods & users) want to take the forum.

The current mods and users, at the present time. You're ignoring those that don't post more because of the current set up and the site is growing and the site is changing.

Besides, I think yizzers are wrong already. I have hundreds and hundreds of posts on the Soccer forum, 95% of them on the Villa thread. If I wanted to get into Ronaldo v Messi debates I would, whether it's on the main Soccer forum or whether it's on the only Soccer forum. But I'm mostly interested in claret and blue, so instead of Boards getting my "business", I spend a lot of time on villatalk.com. The total number of posts would increase if there was further categorisation and I don't think anyone doubts that. The value of the banter that's had is what's debated and if people really enjoy and value that banter, I simply refuse to accept it will go away just because there's a bit more categorisation.

Fair enough you guys think otherwise and that's the admins' call and all is well and good. But I've heard this debate a million times over. I heard it about college-specific forums, I heard it most vocally before the county forums were made, before AH got the Cool Links forum, before the Biz category got spread out, before separate Budget/EU Politics forums... you get the picture. There are almost no instances in Boards' recent history where new forums just didn't work, joke forums like Chuck Norris aside.

pickarooney

Make a superthreads forum or a 'big clubs forum'. I find it off-putting that the whole first page is permanently cluttered up with these threads that I have no intention of reading (I disagree with the superthread idea as it makes it impossible to discuss any single point even vaguely related to a club without trawling through hundreds of pages of irrelevant posts, but that's another issue).

I realise I could just click through to page 2 and beyond or set my display to 100 threads per page, but I have a feeling that any threads that make it off the first couple of pages tend to die out due to lack of visibility.

Time Magazine

pickarooney wrote: »

Make a superthreads forum or a 'big clubs forum'. I find it off-putting that the whole first page is permanently cluttered up with these threads that I have no intention of reading (I disagree with the superthread idea as it makes it impossible to discuss any single point even vaguely related to a club without trawling through hundreds of pages of irrelevant posts, but that's another issue).

I realise I could just click through to page 2 and beyond or set my display to 100 threads per page, but I have a feeling that any threads that make it off the first couple of pages tend to die out due to lack of visibility.

Excellent point. This would even cause a bit more real inter-club debate on the Soccer forum because instead of seeing the uninteresting United and Liverpool superthreads, I see the Interesting Inter-Club Topic threads.

But, anyway, academic argument. Specific club forums will mostly likely be made in the next year or two, just not yet.

Xavi6

I for one look forward to the creation of the Wigan and Bolton forums.

Time Magazine

Xavi6 wrote: »

I for one look forward to the creation of the Wigan and Bolton forums.

People said the same thing about the Leitrim forum.

Besides, you're blissfully ignoring the rule that "Existing forums do not set precedence for another forum request." Simply because there wouldn't be demand for a Bolton forum does not mean that a Liverpool forum is a bad idea for boards.ie.

Dub13

Time Magazine wrote: »

The current mods and users, at the present time. You're ignoring those that don't post more because of the current set up and the site is growing and the site is changing.

Besides, I think yizzers are wrong already. I have hundreds and hundreds of posts on the Soccer forum, 95% of them on the Villa thread. If I wanted to get into Ronaldo v Messi debates I would, whether it's on the main Soccer forum or whether it's on the only Soccer forum. But I'm mostly interested in claret and blue, so instead of Boards getting my "business", I spend a lot of time on villatalk.com. The total number of posts would increase if there was further categorisation and I don't think anyone doubts that. The value of the banter that's had is what's debated and if people really enjoy and value that banter, I simply refuse to accept it will go away just because there's a bit more categorisation.

Fair enough you guys think otherwise and that's the admins' call and all is well and good. But I've heard this debate a million times over. I heard it about college-specific forums, I heard it most vocally before the county forums were made, before AH got the Cool Links forum, before the Biz category got spread out, before separate Budget/EU Politics forums... you get the picture. There are almost no instances in Boards' recent history where new forums just didn't work, joke forums like Chuck Norris aside.

We have no way to gauge what the users who left the forum want,all we can and did was ask the current users what they want and they came back with no club specific forums.

Your total number of posts may increase if we had a Villa forum but you would have to weigh that up against how many posters would post less.We have all ready established that the majority of the forum would more than likely post less.

In fairness you cant (and thank god) compare soccer fans to college posters,after hours posters,Biz or Politics posters.Football fans are by there very nature tribal.

Dub13

I would support a sub forum for the super threads,a forum were you cant make new threads.This would give the main forum a lot more space.

Time Magazine

Dub13 wrote: »

We have no way to gauge what the users who left the forum want,all we can and did was ask the current users what they want and they came back with no club specific forums.

Your total number of posts may increase if we had a Villa forum but you would have to weigh that up against how many posters would post less.We have all ready established that the majority of the forum would more than likely post less.

Obviously both of us are making projections and my claims are backed up by less evidence than yours, so point taken.

In fairness you cant (and thank god) compare soccer fans to college posters,after hours posters,Biz or Politics posters.Football fans are by there very nature tribal.

All the more reason for forums tbh.

pickarooney

I pity the fule who has to move them across though... from my fleeting knowledge of such things, I reckon that might cause a major slowdown.

Spud83

pickarooney wrote: »

I pity the fule who has to move them across though... from my fleeting knowledge of such things, I reckon that might cause a major slowdown.

New ones could just be started, like they are in the summer anyway.

ShiverinEskimo

Seperate Liverpool Forum?

NO!! STOP ASKIN!!

Dub13

Time Magazine wrote: »

All the more reason for forums tbh.

But you see this is one of my main points against club specific forums,boards is different because of the mix of fans if you take that away we will just become like Villatalk.com,red cafe,RAWK etc etc.

Some fans prefer there club only view on the footballing would,these will always find it more comfortable to post on there teams sites.Why should we move into this market especially since its so well catered for..?

Dub13

alanmurphy83 wrote: »

New ones could just be started, like they are in the summer anyway.

Yes if the Admins think it would cause a bit of hassle we could just start new ones,who reads the start of superthreads 3/4 of the way through a season anyway.

I have to say this idea is growing on me it would really give the main forum back a lot of space.

Time Magazine

Dub13 wrote: »

But you see this is one of my main points against club specific forums,boards is different because of the mix of fans if you take that away we will just become like Villatalk.com,red cafe,RAWK etc etc.

Some fans prefer there club only view on the footballing would,these will always find it more comfortable to post on there teams sites.Why should we move into this market especially since its so well catered for..?

Why would Boards have a Soccer forum at all since there's foot.ie (or whatever)?

Boards is going to be the biggest communication vehicle in Ireland. If it's big enough to simultaneously host an Adoption forum, an Accountancy forum and an Archery forum, it's big enough for a Liverpool forum, a Man United forum and a general Soccer forum.

Aside from the obvious profit motive, Boards should move into this market because its users (like me) would like it. I want a Villa forum here. You want to force me to stay in one forum. When there's a critical mass of posters that want to break-out, then who are you (or I) to force them to stay somewhere? It's a very elitist attitude. I don't think that's really your call, to be honest.

The Recliner

Dub13 wrote: »

But you see this is one of my main points against club specific forums,boards is different because of the mix of fans if you take that away we will just become like Villatalk.com,red cafe,RAWK etc etc.

Some fans prefer there club only view on the footballing would,these will always find it more comfortable to post on there teams sites.Why should we move into this market especially since its so well catered for..?

I think the idea of a Super thread sub forum is a good one, it would free up the main forum for other discussion which sometimes gets lost with the other bigger threads

As for club forums I think that would lead to further aggro, people would start to believe that there should be fans of that club only posting there or want that to happen (which is a large part of the call for seperate forums I believe), it would lead to a ghettoisation of the forums and I wouldn't like to see that happen

--amadeus--

I really can't see the issue with having club specific sub forums in teh soccer forum.

I find the superthread pretty much unreadable - it's so long and detailed that you need to go back three or four pages to find the original post that's been quoted on the last page. But that is in response to something from a page or two back, etc. Unless you read the thread every day it's a jumble.

And they do smother the main forum, more generic content is pushed off because of the superthreads and content that would justify it's own thread often doesn't get it because it's "better" or "belongs in" a club thread.

If you are going to segregate the superthreads into a sub forum then go he whole hog. Generic discussion can still happen in the main forum and with an existing culture of opposition fans interacting it wouldn't be unusual or unexpected to see the likes of ntlbell or headshot in an LFC forum (and if that is a good thing or not isn't for me to say )

The main objection to club sub-forums seems to be that interclub interaction is to be encouraged. And you're right you don't get that on club specific forums like irishkop. But then why would you - they are boards that are only visited by Liverpool fans. Boards soccer forum gets a multitude of cross club traffic so you aren't comparing like with like.

Zaph

A sub-forum for the superthreads is an interesting idea. Obviously the load on the servers in moving the existing threads would be too much to do it now, but it's something that could be looked at when it's time to create next season's threads during the summer.

_blank_

--amadeus-- wrote: »

The main objection to club sub-forums seems to be that interclub interaction is to be encouraged. And you're right you don't get that on club specific forums like irishkop. But then why would you - they are boards that are only visited by Liverpool fans. Boards soccer forum gets a multitude of cross club traffic so you aren't comparing like with like.

Yes, the Soccer Forum is one of the largest boards on Boards.ie, dilute it out to team specific forums, and that will be gone.

There are already people who think the Team Threads are exclusively for supporters of that team, when they aren't.

Some people can't handle criticism of their team by rival supporters, in any way shape or form, why should Boards provide that when every team has it's very own dedicated fansites and forums. Why do people want yet another one on Boards?