Yet another which bike thread...

whittey

Just looking into the bike to work scheme & thinking of getting a first road bike for commute / training with the aim of doing the Gael Force adventure race & having a semi decent bike to go on some weekend rides, charity cycle or maybe even attempt a triathlon or two.

Current options of:

Lapierre Audacio 200 @ €795
http://www.cyclesuperstore.ie/shop/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=35&idproduct=31007
Lapierre Audacio 400 @ €1045
http://www.cyclesuperstore.ie/shop/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=35&idproduct=31019

Felt Z100 @ €759 (note link below is cheaper, price is from LBS in Galway)
http://eurocycles.ie/Felt_Z100_-_2010/3603_p.aspx
Felt Z85 @ €959
http://eurocycles.ie/Felt_Z85_-_2010/3602_p.aspx

Giant Defy 3 @ €770
http://www.cyclesuperstore.ie/shop/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=35&idproduct=31168

Also noticed a couple of older model Giant SCR 3 mentioned on another thread...
Giant SCR 3 2007 @ €669
http://www.wheelworxbikes.com/product_info.php?cPath=1_17&products_id=46
Giant SCR 3 2008 @ €669
http://www.wheelworxbikes.com/product_info.php?cPath=1_17&products_id=554

Note that I'm small, 5'6, and having sat on a Small Giant, feel that its probably the right size.

I honestly know that I won't get big into racing, I'm 33, so it will only be fitness/commute cycles, adventure & maybe some triathlon once I have the bike to take part.
Based on that, should I shell out a bit more on the bike, get the accessories at a later stage, or go with the slightly cheaper bike & get the extra pieces within the €1000 bike to work scheme?
Would really appreciate any opinions as I really don't know what the best option is.

CheGuedara

Well from what you've linked I'm inclined to eliminate the Lapierres and Felts from the running on the basis that you don't get as good value as the Giants which give you better drivetrain components for (at close to) equivalent price.

Looking at the Giants first preference goes to the Defy 3 due to it being 27 speed (9 speed cassette & 3 front rings) - will be easier to find replacement parts as things wear out over time.

Taking second place on the podium is the 08 SCR, due to it having a more useful crank (30.39.50) set up for someone with you plan of use. Its essentially a compact with a bailout 30t ring.

The 07 Giant is only slightly different with a 32.42.52 chainset which will be slightly harder to push.

Even at e770 the defy will give you enough leeway to get good accessories; helmet, lights, shorts, jersey, jacket would be a good start with cycling shoes & clipless pedals a suggestion to consider in the future if you're not already familiar with them.

If pursuing the bike to work scheme don't forget you can only use it once every 5 years so make the best benefit of it you can afford - it'll be 2015 before you'll have the opportunity again even if you don't go to the e1000 limit!

Billy Whizz

I'd disagree about the Defy having better componentry than the Audacio 200 or Felt Z100, it's got an FSA crankset which are to be avoided at ALL costs!

It's a pity it's the only bike with 9-speed though, as I do agree it will be easier to replace parts.

How much is the entry level Allez in Cycleways? That'd be my recommendation if it's ~€800.

CheGuedara

Audacio 200 @ e795

• Shifters, Chainset & Derailleurs (F & R) - Shimano 2300
• 8 speed

Felt Z100 @ e699

• Shifters, derailleurs (F & R) chainset - Shimano 2303/2300
• 8 speed

Giant Defy 3 @ e775

• Shifters, derailleurs (F & R) - Shimano Sora,
• Chainset (FSA omega - a pricier spec than 2303/2300 & using external bearings not an old, heavy square taper bb)
• 9 speed

Cant see how they fare better than the Giant... try again?

Billy Whizz

CheGuedara wrote: »

Audacio 200 @ e795

• Shifters, Chainset & Derailleurs (F & R) - Shimano 2300
• 8 speed

Felt Z100 @ e699

• Shifters, derailleurs (F & R) chainset - Shimano 2303/2300
• 8 speed

Giant Defy 3 @ e775

• Shifters, derailleurs (F & R) - Shimano Sora,
• Chainset (FSA omega - a pricier spec than 2303/2300 & using external bearings not an old, heavy square taper bb)
• 9 speed

Cant see how they fare better than the Giant... try again?

Read my post... FSA crankset.

bbosco

What's wrong with FSA cranksets?

Billy Whizz

Cranks aren't stiff.
Rings are flexy and not durable.
MegaExo BB cups are terrible.
Notoriously easy to wear down the interface splines between spindle and crankarm.

CheGuedara

Never had one shift worth of trouble from an FSA Team carbon chainset... not one.

Perhaps you had a monday morning crank. Never the less, everything else is better, fact, and thus Giant > Lapierre or Felt in this instance. QED

Edit: out of curiosity where are they notorious? Is it from an online review, word of mouth or personal opinion?

bbosco

I've used an FSA Energy isis interface crankset and Platinum Pro BB for about 4 years. Never a hint of trouble.

Billy Whizz

That's good to hear I suppose.

FSA cranks (and everything else they make to be honest) have a very poor reputation. I've never owned any FSA stuff and never will.

Maybe they've got their act together, I don't know.

Never the less, everything else is better, fact, and thus Giant > Lapierre or Felt in this instance. QED

Ah here, that's just not true:
Formula hubs are junk, especially the rear (freehub body will last about 6 months). I'd take the Lapierre wheelset every day.
Finishing kit on the Lapierre is better.

Look, there are pros and cons to each bike. Try them out for size and pick which one takes your fancy. There is nothing "fact" or "QED" about the decision though...

Plastik

Entry level Allez 16 is for €615 in Cycleways.

Raam

I agree about the cheaper FSA cranksets. I got one with my Allez a few years ago. Brutal, doesn't even begin to describe it. I got it swapped out for Shimano Ultegra in double quick time.

Billy Whizz

CheGuedara wrote: »

out of curiosity where are they notorious? Is it from an online review, word of mouth or personal opinion?

All three to be honest.

Mate of mine stripped the interface between the spindle and crankarm (road crankset). Another had an MTB crankset. Both reported the cranks were super-flexy when putting the power down.

I picked up a set of cheap enough handlebars in the CRC sale for the winter bike. Weight was 310g, (claimed 225g - not that it bothered me too much), but the decals weren't even put on evenly!

Very high proportion of "bad experience" stories compared to other manufacturers: http://roseyscot.blogspot.com/2009/02/three-strikes-youre-out.html
Some horror stories on roadbikereview: http://www.roadbikereview.com/cat/drivetrain/cranksets/PLS_2491_700crx.aspx

There'll be plenty of positive reviews out there and many people like their stuff. All comes down to your personal experience I suppose, just though I'd give you mine!

blorg

I think you are a little biased there Billy in saying that "all" FSA stuff is crap. I have lots of FSA bars and stems, over half my bikes have them, and they are quite nice, the stems in particular do an admirable job of keeping the bars and steerer tube just the right distance away from each other.

I must confess to not having that much experience of FSA cranks but I know several people who use them without issue, they came with a lot of PXes. I do have a FSA BB on my cross bike with Ultegra cranks (sold the FSA ones) but not enough use on that to make a judgement.

If choosing between those bikes specifically I too would go for the Giant and I would prefer those external bearing FSA cranks over square taper 2300.

However I would go for a Specialized Allez above the Giant.

Entry level Allez would also be a good option, but better the Sport @€;770 with triple Sora or indeed even better still the Elite at €979, with Tiagra and a compact chainset.

Billy Whizz

FSA stems?! Issues with carbon steerers...

http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/index.php/t-355484.html

Once again, there are people who will ride FSA stuff for years and have no problems. However I personally know of very few.

Just my two cents at the end of the day...

edit: +1 on the Allez sport by the way.

CheGuedara

Billy Whizz wrote: »

FSA stems?! Issues with carbon steerers...

http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/index.php/t-355484.html

Been running that stem in question for 2 1/2 years - thousands of miles (or kms if you like) later and no sign of any damage to my bikes carbon steerer. Maybe FSA have upped their game in the years since that thread was written...

Not entirely pro FSA though - wouldn't buy a K-force crankset after seeing a guy pull the pedal insert out of his drive side crank arm halfway up the Conor Pass on the Tour de Munster.... a bad advertisment for that particular piece of hardware!

blorg

Oooer- I have FSA OS-150 stems on three bikes with carbon steerer tubes... Will check out the steerers but in fairness that one person on that one thread seems to be the only report of this, plenty of other stems with a similar open-back design (most of them, I would think.) Always use a torque wrench.

Raam

CheGuedara wrote: »

Been running that stem in question for 2 1/2 years - thousands of miles (or kms if you like) later and no sign of any damage to my bikes carbon steerer. Maybe FSA have upped their game in the years since that thread was written...

You are going to die from stem failure.

whittey

Seems I sparked a bit of a debate here.

Have to say I'm tempted towards the Defy 3, though it did help that the shop had it in my size & it just felt good. Also liked the look of it - really striking.

Anyone care to comment on the fact that the older SCR 3 @ €100 cheaper has a Tiagra rear derailleur (sp?) - are the 27 gears on the Defy worth the extra money?

Also - as I said I won't be getting very serious into my cycling, I won't be doing any crazy mileage, so again are the better components worth the extra money at my level?

blorg

What the rear derailleur is doesn't really make a lot of difference. The main benefit to Tiagra is in the shifters rather than the rear derailleur.

I think I'd go for the newer bike. But I would go for an Specialized Allez over a Defy, same price for the same Sora bike and Specialized tend to have better quality finishing kit in my experience.

Billy Whizz

Sorry, we kind of hijacked you thread. I'd highly recommend the Specialized Allez also.

Raam

Another one for the Allez. I've had one for 4 years now.

DirkVoodoo

I've heard this before about FSA stems causing trouble and cracking because of the clamp design. Frankly it sounds like bollocks. There are a huge number of pro team bikes with the "cut away" clamp design, I don't believe FSA would invest in designing something that couldn't even perform the basic requirement of a stem. I think these are cases of people not using the specified torque, overtightening stuff and then blaming the design when they crack a steerer.

I do have FSA vero cranks on my commuter and I agree with you there, awful awful things.

I'd get the allez too, I've always liked them.

CheGuedara

Raam wrote: »

You are going to die from stem failure.

LMAO!!

Wooo - ominous!! There should be a cycling predictions thread

On a separate note - those Allez bikes are worth a look at as an alternative alright, good machines and usually look the business too.

I hope I survive long enough to hear what you eventually go for whittey!

blorg

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

I do have FSA vero cranks on my commuter and I agree with you there, awful awful things.

Actually now that you mention it I have FSA Vero singlespeed cranks on my Bowery. They are OK I guess, they do the job of going around and pulling the chain. Square taper BB. Wouldn't be getting overly excited about the things but they haven't given me any particular bother either.

DirkVoodoo

blorg wrote: »

Actually now that you mention it I have FSA Vero singlespeed cranks on my Bowery. They are OK I guess, they do the job of going around and pulling the chain. Square taper BB. Wouldn't be getting overly excited about the things but they haven't given me any particular bother either.

Mine are terrible, tightened to the right torque and I still get noises from them. They do the job alright, but my bike sounds crap.

blorg

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Mine are terrible, tightened to the right torque and I still get noises from them. They do the job alright, but my bike sounds crap.

They are an entry level square taper crankset, I've had similar noises from other square taper cranks. Also be sure it is the cranks, I had a suspected crank noise once that turned out to be my handlebars.

DirkVoodoo

blorg wrote: »

They are an entry level square taper crankset, I've had similar noises from other square taper cranks. Also be sure it is the cranks, I had a suspected crank noise once that turned out to be my handlebars.

No it's definitely the cranks, they are quiet for one ride after being tightened and then it starts again "Click....click....creak.....click". I'm not tightening crank bolts before every spin, PITA.

abcdggs

Have the same problem with my current ss crankset, which were purchased as a stop gap... that's about a year ago now

whittey

Thanks for the advice - so the general consensus is...

from those I listed, go with the Defy 3.

OR

the Specialized Allez Sport would be a better setup for the same price.

Anything else I should be considering ?

DirkVoodoo

Go with whichever fits you better when you sit on it.

And definitely get a good helmet, lock, lights and shorts under the scheme as well.

Captain Havoc

Oh no, not this thread again but oh yes, it's the resurection of the which bike thread.

Buddy is looking at getting this Giant Defy 2 I reckon that this Boardman or this Trek 1.5 would be better bang for the buck or am I just wrong?

blorg

Captain Havoc wrote: »

Buddy is looking at getting this Giant Defy 2 I reckon that this Boardman or this Trek 1.5 would be better bang for the buck or am I just wrong?

The Boardman is substantially the best spec and is the one I would be going for.

Of course there is another option...

Captain Havoc

blorg wrote: »

The Boardman is substantially the best spec and is the one I would be going for.

Of course there is another option...

You mean one of these or these don't you?

papac

p

papac

x

Sarunas

Captain Havoc wrote: »

Oh no, not this thread again but oh yes, it's the resurection of the which bike thread.

Buddy is looking at getting this Giant Defy 2 I reckon that this Boardman or this Trek 1.5 would be better bang for the buck or am I just wrong?

Cheapest 1.5 I found was with J Mc http://www.jmccycles.com/ in Newry, £675

DirkVoodoo

Captain Havoc wrote: »

Oh no, not this thread again but oh yes, it's the resurection of the which bike thread.

Buddy is looking at getting this Giant Defy 2 I reckon that this Boardman or this Trek 1.5 would be better bang for the buck or am I just wrong?

What size is he looking for? My sister bought a 2009 Trek 1.2, used it a few times for short jaunts around Dun Laoghaire, moved around due to work and has decided she has no time for cycling and I am to sell the bike for her (the second sibling this has happened with!). It's a man's bike, 52cm.

Captain Havoc

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

What size is he looking for? My sister bought a 2009 Trek 1.2, used it a few times for short jaunts around Dun Laoghaire, moved around due to work and has decided she has no time for cycling and I am to sell the bike for her (the second sibling this has happened with!). It's a man's bike, 52cm.

A well believable and likely story, *cough* I'll ask my buddy what size he needs, he's based in Dublin so if he's intereseted I'll put the two of ye in contact.

fguihen

sorry to open up this thread again, and take it slightly off course but i purchased the Lapierre Audacio 200 from cycle superstores a few months back, on their recommendation. i actually had the giant defy 3 in my hand but he straight up said the Lapierre was a better bike and gave a bunch of reasons.

Was I played by him, just to shift stock?

spurscormac

To bring back this thread from the dead...

I am looking at the bike to work scheme again, and thinking of blowing the full 1000 on the bike, for the sake of €100 after the tax back compared to getting a €750/800 Sora bike.

Options as follows:

Corratec Dolomiti
http://www.corratec.de/en/bikes2010/road/race/dolomiti_tiagra_scb.php

Felt Z85
http://www.wheelworxbikes.com/product_info.php?cPath=1_17&products_id=2041

Cube Peleton
http://www.cube-bikes.de/xist4c/web/peloton_id_36201_.htm

As usual, they look pretty similar to a newbie like me - anyone willing to give their opinion on the pros & cons of the 3?

Lumen

spurscormac wrote: »

As usual, they look pretty similar to a newbie like me - anyone willing to give their opinion on the pros & cons of the 3?

They are pretty similar. Some previous discussion...

Cube Peleton
Felt Z85

blorg

The Cube is a triple and uses an outdated BB standard. The other two are compacts with external bearing BBs. That is the substantial difference (more the triple vs compact than the BB standard, incidentally.)

Test ride and see what you prefer but looking at them I would probably go for the Corratec as it is a bit different. Felt looks good as well though and the brakes are probably a bit better.

Lumen

blorg wrote: »

The Cube is a triple and uses an outdated BB standard. The other two are compacts with external bearing BBs. That is the substantial difference (more the triple vs compact than the BB standard, incidentally.)

The other substantial difference is the geometry.

For the 560mm ish top tube models, the head tubes measure:

- Corratec M (50): 140mm
- Cube 58: 165mm
- Felt 56: 180mm

That is a massive difference.

Still, other than the geometry, the gearing and the bottom brackets they're all pretty much identical

spurscormac

Thanks guys - I know they're all pretty similar, think I'll just try each of them out and pick from there.

With regards to the geometry, I'll be getting fitted in the LBS whichever one I go with, so I think I can trust him to match me up well.

Is there anything specific that one geometry over another would lean towards?
I'll be using it for Gael Force & probably in and out of work a few days a week, some training spins, but not serious club cycling.

blorg

Basically the longer the head tube the more "relaxed" the fit.

spurscormac

Called in last Friday and out of the 3, I just preferred the Corratec.
Chosen the white version, similar to this:-
http://www.corratec.de/en/bikes2010/road/race/dolomiti_tiagra_wro.php

Only difference I can see is the graphics on the fork.
Quote will be sent to the Finance dept at work & hope to have the bike in the flesh in a couple of weeks.

jwshooter

kennys for bikes in enniscorthy .

have started selling fuji bkes .they have a full carbon 105/ultegra mix for 1290 euro .its the pro teamFC 770 .

lovely looking bike with the carbon showing .

spurscormac

jwshooter wrote: »

kennys for bikes in enniscorthy .

have started selling fuji bkes .they have a full carbon 105/ultegra mix for 1290 euro .its the pro teamFC 770 .

lovely looking bike with the carbon showing .

Have a Fuji Nevada MTB myself, they are lovely looking bikes alright.
Its a bit over my budget - but a good one for someone looking at that price range.

Bigron78

Hi,
I too am looking at the Fuji Team bike for approx. same price. It should be noted that the head tube and seat post are NOT carbon. As Im buying it on the BTW Scheme I'm using it as my entry level bike.

www.fujibikes.com/Road/Carbon-Race/Team-(1).aspx


Is the spec/frame good value for money? Am I better off spending extra on a FULL carbon bike. Maybe I am better off with alloy/carbon frame/forks mix with a better groupset?