02 internet bill 800 euro for 2 months

Theta

Viper_JB wrote: »

Which is ethically wrong in my opinion,

No one ever said any business was ethical, they are there to generate profit for there shareholders and that is what they are doing. A dont say if you were in charge of the company you would do any different.

smellslikeshoes

Second time this has come up here in the last 2 months or so and just like the last time when people respond that it's in the contract that the user has signed up to and O2 have done nothing wrong, they get accused of being O2 representatives.

You signed the contract, you used the service and went over the limit, pretty black and white really. If you didn't read the contract that's not O2's fault.

jimmyendless

Theta wrote: »

No one ever said any business was ethical, they are there to generate profit for there shareholders and that is what they are doing. A dont say if you were in charge of the company you would do any different.

Businesses can be ethical and still make a profit. Being unethical will make more profit though. Fight the power OP.

seafield

if what o2 are doing is so just and so fair and completely within their rights, then why did i get banned off the o2 forum after 20 minutes for posting the exact post i put in the opening post on this forum?
if they are in the right and are not misleading customers then why can't their administrators on their forum defend them publicly?
the company is completely unethical and i don't see how anyone can disagree with that.

NinjaTruncs

spend alerts ftw
http://help.o2online.ie/al/12/4/article.aspx?aid=3828&tab=browse&bt=4&r=0.15488

smellslikeshoes

seafield wrote: »

if what o2 are doing is so just and so fair and completely within their rights, then why did i get banned off the o2 forum after 20 minutes for posting the exact post i put in the opening post on this forum?
if they are in the right and are not misleading customers then why can't their administrators on their forum defend them publicly?
the company is completely unethical and i don't see how anyone can disagree with that.

If you posted something on Boards.ie that was deleted and then posted the same thing again 5 minutes later you would probably be banned too. I'm not saying that they didn't delete your post to shut you up but when you start throwing out lynch mob style accusations referring to a company on their forum for something which is YOUR fault I can see why.

wyrn

Happened me a couple of months back. I went over my limit and my bill trebled. I was shocked to say the least. I've no idea how I managed it as I'd used the net less that month (hence my lack of vigilance on my usage). All of my other bills for the last year have been identical except for that random one.

I rang them up to see if I could get a breakdown (I know it's available online - I didn't realise this at the time) and I explained that I'd automatic updates turned off etc... I wasn't accusing O2 of anything, I was just generally confused seeing as I'd used the net less that month and I didn't change my habits. I was told that Limewire et al are the cause for huge downloads - I don't download music/movies and I don't use torrents or anything like Limewire. It definitely wasn't a virus.
In fact I had just reformatted my laptop (all updates done on an Eircom line) and I'd only the basic programs on it. I tried explaining this and that I'd Steam turned off but they didn't seem to believe me.
Anywho I checked the breakdown and there was a lot of connects/disconnects and I think the cable was faulty. I changed it and touch wood it seems ok so far.

It'd be nice if O2 had your current usage displayed beside the connect/disconnect button! Also a text when you approach your limit. I can't see this happening as I'm sure it's profitable for O2 for accounts to go over their limit.

I can understand going over the limit. It happened to me and I'm not 100% sure how that happened. I think I was 3GB over my limit and I was told that was huge! To get a bill of €800 for two months is unreal esp if you are a student. I would have thought that student plans would have a warning - how many students (or any of us) can afford that. I know T&C's, responsibility and all that jazz but if I had a company and I had a student plan I would not let any students run up a bill (they'd be a credit risk).

Just had to check my monthly usage, Phew I'm ok!

Guy:Incognito

doncarlos wrote: »

Not really I'd easily download that in the space of a couple of days.

On your phone?


All I can do is echo what others have said here. Not O'2 fault the OP did'nt read the contract. Your supposed to be an adult here, if your signing legal documents willy nilly wiht reading what your agreeing too, maybe you should'nt be signign legal documents.

O2_Daryll

seafield wrote: »

by the way, i posted this on the o2 forum and 5 minutes later it was removed. so i posted it again and 5 mins later i was banned!! it said reason unspecified, when ban will be removed-never.
are we living in a communist state? seems like o2 thinks so anyway

Your post was removed because you could not prove you are an O2 customer. I am still willing to look into it either here or on our forum if you can send me on the correct number.

Bosshogg

It's like signing a contract with the Devil, minions and all.

Cabaal

seafield wrote: »

I got the 10 Euro a month student package from o2 with a 3gb usage limit.

O2 is not Broadband, its Midband or so called Mobile Broadband
The network doesn't exist to manage massive amounts of data transfers like the likes of cable or ADSL

after reading through all the t&c's I know now that I will probably never see my money again as they have certainly covered their corporate asses!

Most people have enough sense to read the T&C's BEFORE they sign up to a service, if they didn't bother then they are idiots.

In fact I discussed this with a friend of mine who has ntl internet and she said that her house went over their usage limit of 40gb last month, they actually doubled their usage to 95gb. so did ntl send them an extortionatly priced bill??? no! they fairly and justly moved them up to the next package so they only get billed an extra 10 a month.

NTL is an actual Broadband provider and has a network suitable for bigger data transfers, also thats their policy.

An example of a different policy is eircom can charge for going over the cap but they currently don't

Just because one company does one thing doesn't mean O2 have to do the same

are we living in a communist state? seems like o2 thinks so anyway

right :rolleyes:

Cabaal

fc2060 wrote: »

It is unreasonable to allow a student or anyone to run up a huge bill when it would be so easy to warn the person, particularly when the rate is so high

While he's still a student I'd imagine he's over 18 (he has to be to signup to O2's packagwe) and if he's over 18 he's still an adult.

If he's an adult he needs to take responsibility for what he does in life, this issue included

Theta

seafield wrote: »

if what o2 are doing is so just and so fair and completely within their rights, then why did i get banned off the o2 forum after 20 minutes for posting the exact post i put in the opening post on this forum?
if they are in the right and are not misleading customers then why can't their administrators on their forum defend them publicly?
the company is completely unethical and i don't see how anyone can disagree with that.

They are in no way misleading there customers. You are telling me that when you saw it had a download cap that if you went over it there would be no penalty? If you did you are naive.

LFCFan

Cabaal, in fairness to the OP and others who are getting screwed, not everyone is as internet savy and up to date on all the terminology and when O2 and other providers advertise their services as 'broadband', the majority of people wil accept that. Of course they should know what could happen if they go over their limit but in fairness, O2 should be making these charges a lot more transparent, and not small print about charging whatever for every kb over your limit. Most people wouldn't know a kb from a hole in the ground. O2 should also be ringing/mailing/notifying customers that they have exceeded their limit and tell them what the consequences are. To just sit back and allow people to run up rediculous bill for data smacks of bad customer care and is very bad practice. I don't care if all providers are at it, they are all at fault and it's about time these companies started looking after their customers and quit screwing them into the ground for being naive.

Why can't they implement a system where you can automatically cut off your service once you reach your limit? Why not set up a system where you are warned when coming close to your limit? These are very simple to implement but O2 choose not to because they are making so much money off people going over.

wyrn

I agree. I like to think I'm pretty paranoid about these sort of things, I've read T&C's thoroughly. I did find some of O2's T&C's a bit hard to interpret so I had to call them just to clarify a few things such as charges for going over the limit.

As I said before I keep an eye on my limit but back in November I didn't and I went over my limit and paid for it. It's easily done. Not sure how that happened but it doesn't matter now. I assumed I'd be ok seeing as I'd used it less and I'd just reformatted my laptop & updated (on Eircom) it and I certainly don't download movies or music. My point is, we're only human it can happen. Now I only went over my limit but a few GB's and my bill trebled. I'm not sure how much over you'd have to go to get a bill for €800!

Going back to the ESB & Bord Gais thread perhaps when signing up to these companies we should give a deposit as we are working on a line of credit.

Theta

How much more transparent do you need?

jor el

LFCFan wrote: »

Cabaal, in fairness to the OP and others who are getting screwed, not everyone is as internet savy and up to date on all the terminology and when O2 and other providers advertise their services as 'broadband', the majority of people wil accept that. Of course they should know what could happen if they go over their limit but in fairness, O2 should be making these charges a lot more transparent, and not small print about charging whatever for every kb over your limit. Most people wouldn't know a kb from a hole in the ground.

While it's true that a lot of people won't know what 3GB means in terms of actual Internet usage, they should find out before they go downloading anything they want. It's not good enough for people to just blindly use something when they have no idea what any of the terminology means. Everyone knows at least one person that would know the answer, so it's as simple as asking.

In this case, the OP bought a product where he knew the limit was 3GB (whether he knew what this really amounted to or not, I'm not sure), and didn't check what he was downloading, or what the consequences of that would be. O2 even have a data usage calculator on their product information page. It would be near impossible to buy the product without seeing this.

Some of the blame can be put on O2 (or other providers) but people need to stand up and take accountability for their own actions too. It's simply not good enough to claim ignorance when it takes only a minute amount of effort to find out. You don't even have to wade through unwieldy T&Cs, because their FAQ is quite simple, and easy to understand.

LFCFan wrote: »

Why can't they implement a system where you can automatically cut off your service once you reach your limit? Why not set up a system where you are warned when coming close to your limit?

A simple text warning when you reach 90% of your limit would be very useful. The Vodafone connection software that I use can be configured to warn you when you reach a certain quote, though it only works on calendar months and not the billing period, but it's still useful to keep things level. I'm not sure if the O2 software can do this or not.

Absolutely no effort was made by the OP, and yet he wants O2 to shoulder all the blame. There's at least 50/50 blame here, and I would say it's more like 75% (OP) 25% (O2).

Mimikyu

This post has been deleted.

Popple3

While a I agree it's a rip off, if you were streaming movies on a 3GB limit, you had it coming.

O2 once tried to charge us nearly €400 despite not being even able to properly use it (it was going slower than dial up, with sites timing out too much, and becoming impossible to use).

Even though it was literally impossible to hit the 10GB limit, the only way we got out of it was that the fair usage policy when we signed up said we'd be warned when we go over the limit.

wyrn

Theta wrote: »

How much more transparent do you need?

That is indeed transparent.

If that was aimed at me, I signed up to a different package well over a year ago. That page wasn't there.

In fact I had problems getting connected - took me a week. I had to delete a registry file before I could connect. Only for a post in boards helped me because someone else had ran into that problem. That's why I rang. Also my package wasn't being advertised because they were changing it (made it cheaper!). The lady in the shop had to check with her manager to see if it was still available.

Also sometimes it's nice to ask some these things. I find T&C's stick in my head when someone has told me but that's just me. In fact I wrote them down on the front of my contract and highlighted it.

Just to clarify I don't think the OP is completely blameless - I mean €800 in two months! I thought mine was bad enough at €76! Still kicking myself over being so stupid.

I would say the OP is 95% to blame and O2 5% stupid for allowing a student (or anyone) to run up a €800 bill.

jimmyendless

Captain Morgan wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

The OP was very casual with his usage and wasn't up to date on the T&Cs but my issue is with the cost going up tenfold when over the limit and O2 remaining silent about it. I don't think that's an unreasonable issue to have with O2. They are making big money off user ignorance. Of course from a legal point of view OP doesn't have a leg to stand on.

AdMMM

I find it ironic that you went on the net to try get some free movies. Karma at work I think.

Given that this package is in collaboration with HEAnet, a government funded agency, and is targeted purely at students, I think it's downright wrong that they don't notify users of going over their limit. O2 are well aware of the typical usage pattern of a student (i.e. lots of YouTube etc) and there should be safeguards in place to prevent them from being overcharged or at the very least warn them!

Mimikyu

This post has been deleted.

AdMMM

Captain Morgan wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

While you are technically correct, I don't think that bumhunting students who simply cannot afford to pay much more than €10 a month is fair. Lets not forget that those in full-time education under the age of 24 cannot claim any benefits from the state and may not be able to find a part-time job. Money is extremely tight for most students, especially if their parents can't/won't support them and I'd consider lumping someone with a €800 bill, without warning, is simply preying on the vulnerable members of society.

Theta

AdMMM wrote: »

While you are technically correct, I don't think that bumhunting students who simply cannot afford to pay much more than €10 a month is fair. Lets not forget that those in full-time education under the age of 24 cannot claim any benefits from the state and may not be able to find a part-time job. Money is extremely tight for most students, especially if their parents can't/won't support them and I'd consider lumping someone with a €800 bill, without warning, is simply preying on the vulnerable members of society.

They are not preying on anyone. As I said before if you think that you can go over a DL cap with no penalty or do not have the common sense to police your own usage then you shouldnt be using it in the first place!

Run_to_da_hills

Theta wrote: »

They are not preying on anyone.

Service providers are all like big spiders, they build massive colourful webs to attract their prey and then when their victims get caught up in their web, thats when they make a pounce. :eek:



Do you honestly think a service provider is going to make it crystal clear to the layman how much it will cost if you go over the limit? No, its in the tiny print in a "different language" and poorly explained so a customer will fall for it and then owe them lots of money. :rolleyes:

Service providers should by law have a "government warning" in bold capital letters on the cover of the packet stating that:

IF YOU EXCEED YOUR ASSIGNED 10 GB LIMIT IT WILL COST YOU MORE THAN 10 TIMES WHAT YOU PAY ON YOUR NORMAL RATE.

02 have an excellent system on their bill paid mobile phone service where one can text *101# at any time and find out exactly what your outstanding balance is, the same simplicity should be applied to ALL mobile broadband.

eth0_

The o2 software makes it easy to check your usage and see if you are approaching your cap. You seem to think the terms of the contract do not apply to you.

Seafield - in an ideal world, people who do not possess the intellectual capacity to read and understand a contract would be unable to enter into one. People like...you.

jor el

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Do you honestly think a service provider is going to make it crystal clear to the layman how much it will cost if you go over the limit? No, its in the tiny print in a "different language" and poorly explained so a customer will fall for it and then owe them lots of money. :rolleyes:

If you refer back to post #50, you'll see it explained in plain English, and regular sized font. Not at all complicated, different language or poorly explained.

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

02 have an excellent system on their bill paid mobile phone service where one can text *101# and find out exactly what your outstanding balance is, the same simplicity should be applied to ALL mobile broadband.

And they have a simple system to check your data usage on the website, if people would bother to take the 60 seconds to log in and check it. They don't make it impossible to check, they don't even make it difficult.

What people also fail to understand is that the charges for excess data usage are not actually that high, and contrary to the popular belief, they don't make massive amounts of money on it. Voice traffic on the GSM network is transmit at a rate of 12kbps, and with a typical call package giving 50 minutes for €15 a month, this translates to 4.5Mbytes, or €3.33 per MB. That's a hell of a lot less than the 2c per MB charged on data rates. So, operators make over 150 times more money from voice, than they do from excess data charges.

Data packages are a loss leader on the mobile networks, in order to get you for the lucrative voice and SMS charges. The charges for going over your cap are what you would expect, less even if you consider what they could make from more efficient use of that bandwidth.

Of course, it's a lot easier to ignore all these facts and just jump up and down about how unfair it all is, and how much the operators want you to exceed the cap so you can be charged a fortune.

Honda08

seafield wrote: »

I got the 10 Euro a month student package from o2 with a 3gb usage limit. I did watch a few films through streaming and youtube, etc, but 800 euro for 2 months. that is completely ridiculous!!

after reading through all the t&c's I know now that I will probably never see my money again as they have certainly covered their corporate asses! but I think it should be brought to people's attention that o2's practice is completely misleading and they are ripping off their customers left right and centre. all this from 'a company you can trust'

after searching about this on the internet I have found scores of people that the same thing has happened to so you cannot really say it is the fault of the people. I haven't heard of any other internet provider ripping off their customers like this. this type of billing can really do damage to people in an already struggling economy. I talked to one girl who had got billed over 1000 euro for a month and was really struggling to pay it off. she shouldn't have to!

In fact I discussed this with a friend of mine who has ntl internet and she said that her house went over their usage limit of 40gb last month, they actually doubled their usage to 95gb. so did ntl send them an extortionatly priced bill??? no! they fairly and justly moved them up to the next package so they only get billed an extra 10 a month.

I think i'll be moving to ntl or another internet provider that you can trust. and I would advise anyone not to enter into an internet agreement with o2. we can't let them get away with this.

by the way, i posted this on the o2 forum and 5 minutes later it was removed. so i posted it again and 5 mins later i was banned!! it said reason unspecified, when ban will be removed-never.
are we living in a communist state? seems like o2 thinks so anyway

erm, if they are not busy blocking sites, they are busy billing for over usage.:D

they should have a spend limit on an account, even more so when selling this to students, o2 has a part to play here, seems like a bit laxadasical in the credit control dept. one thing i will say, is that o2 update their call register every few hrs, so you can get an accurate view of what you used by checking unbilled calls... vodafone on the other hand, only update their call details every few days, which is not good enough, so you could get stung badly with the vodafone one as usage stats on the site might not have updated in a few days, contacted comreg about this, basically got fobbed off , as comreg told me that the operators have no obligation to provide usage stats!!:eek: :mad:

the_syco

seafield wrote: »

I got the 10 Euro a month student package from o2 with a 3gb usage limit. I did watch a few films through streaming and youtube, etc, but 800 euro for 2 months. that is completely ridiculous!!

seafield wrote: »

I probably watched one hours streaming or less most nights, but some nights none at all.

You have a 3GB limit, and you watch movies online. Each movie would be around 300MB to 2GB, depending on the movie quality. So, one every night, nut surprised you went over the limit.