A Question of Time (Lapse Photography)

homerun_homer

I’m going doing my first time lapse shoot tonight to edit into a video and I was just wondering from people who have done this before if you shoot RAW or Jpeg?

If you shoot RAW is it a case that you process the shot and save the action in Photoshop and apply it to the whole set (a lot of work and PC space to use) or is Jpeg good enough (possibly using the same batch process if necessary)?

PopeBuckfastXVI

Sorry to not be able to answer your question, and instead throw one back at you, but how are you planning to trigger the camera?

.Longshanks.

...speaking of which i just ordered one of these remotes that can includes an interval timer. €25 all in.
http://cgi.ebay.ie/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280461141353&ssPageName=ADME:L:COSI:IE:1123#ht_3567wt_1018

pixbyjohn

The Nikon D700 has timelapse facility built in to the camera

Ghost Train

I'd do a test run first, just with a few shots, jpeg or raw or both, if you can adjust the camera to give you jpeg files you're satisfied with then might make things a bit quicker to work with jpeg and at reduced resolution, especially if using a laptop which might be a bit slower

stunt_penguin

I personally just shoot full res JPEGs for this kind of thing.

The thing with RAW is that you'll be looking at about 10mb or so per shot thereabouts- that's 250mb per second of footage, which is pretty steep even by my standards.

If you go for a JPEG setting that's around 2000 pixels wide (probably the 'M' setting on whatever camera), then your files will come down to 1-2mb and you've still got more than enough resolution for 1080p video.

If you do shoot RAW then yes, you'll need to batch convert those to JPEGs with lightroom (or similar) then sequence your JPEGs again in Lightroom or something like After Effects.

homerun_homer

I'll be using a Canon 7D with the Canon Utility which I checked out last night. I was a bit miffed to see that the software won't snap under 5 seconds between shots but for what I'll be doing later it'll do.

Cheers Longshanks for the ebay link, saw one of them last night while browsing Time Lapse links and just ordered one.

.Longshanks.

I hope you made sure to order one specific to your 7D? (the link is to one compatible with canon 400d etc, but not my 40d...I had a close call!)

homerun_homer

Longshanks100 wrote: »

I hope you made sure to order one specific to your 7D? (the link is to one compatible with canon 400d etc, but not my 40d...I had a close call!)

Don't worry, I searched after clicking the link. Cheers.

sineadw

Shoot Raw (much better for control), process one in LR, then copy/paste settings (including WB, brush settings, spot removal etc - everything) to the rest in the sequence. Then export as a small jpeg and use Photolapse to process 24 fps to Avi or whatever Ta da!

Manual everything!

air

stunt_penguin wrote: »

The thing with RAW is that you'll be looking at about 10mb or so per shot thereabouts- that's 250mb per second of footage, which is pretty steep even by my standards.

I don't think a frame rate of 25fps is generally considered time lapse.

sineadw

air wrote: »

I don't think a frame rate of 25fps is generally considered time lapse.

24 fps for classic european animation, 25 fps for TV. So, yep.

air

Ok bit of confusion here possilby, I thought that stunt_penguin was proposing the o.p. would TAKE the images at 25fps. Of course 25fps is a standard frame rate for playback but I don't know of anything that will play back high res RAW images at 25fps.

Back to the original point, shoot JPEG & try MonkeyJam for creating the video.

sineadw

air wrote: »

Ok bit of confusion here possilby, I thought that stunt_penguin was proposing the o.p. would TAKE the images at 25fps. Of course 25fps is a standard frame rate for playback but I don't know of anything that will play back high res RAW images at 25fps.

Back to the original point, shoot JPEG & try MonkeyJam for creating the video.

You shoot raw - you then export as Jpeg. Or I do anyway. Nothing will play raw images in sequence. I don't really get why you'd shoot jpeg in this instance over any other? Ok its a bit more HDD space, but sure just back up or get rid of them when you're happy. Why compromise on what you can do?

air

All depends on what you're trying to achieve I guess.
I just can't see someone going through the hassle of individual adjustments on every frame of a time lapse for each and every frame of a video.
If you're not going to adjust every frame then it's hard to see any major benefit in shooting raw especially for something as low res/quality as video.

sineadw

air wrote: »

All depends on what you're trying to achieve I guess.
I just can't see someone going through the hassle of individual adjustments on every frame of a time lapse for each and every frame of a video.
If you're not going to adjust every frame then it's hard to see any major benefit in shooting raw especially for something as low res/quality as video.

You shoot RAW, then you make adjustments on the FIRST frame only. Then you copy those settings in Lightroom (right click - copy settings), select all other frames (using shift/click) and then paste the settings. Done. There's no issue with going to each frame. And it would be the same process with jpegs anyway. You then export as Jpegs in whatever resolution and size you want.

The reason I shoot RAW with timelapse stuff is exactly the same reason I shoot RAW with any other type of photography - I have a LOT more control over the image. The only issue I can see with raw versus Jpeg is teh usual one of space, but as I said, just back up or delete the RAW images once you've exported if you're that pushed for megabytes.

air

Would the adjustments you make in RAW not be specific to the lighting conditions which would in turn be variable throughout the typically long period over which time lapse's tend to be shot?

sineadw

That's why you shoot everything in manual - including WB - that way the differences are consistent throughout. You adjust your exposure and wb in the first frame, copy/paste and then it's all consistent with what actually happened. Easy

air

Deadly, I guess it would work great for a scene that doesnt change enough to warrant automatic settings. I've only ever played with things that go from dawn to dusk etc so have always shot them in auto.

joeKel73

If it was me I'd shoot JPEG as you'll probably be dealing with lots of files. Try get your settings right before you start, and sure if you do need to batch-tweak them, you can still do this with JPEG.

...at least that's what I'll be doing when I get an intervalometer for the Nikon D60. I still can't understand why every camera doesn't have this option built in, wouldn't take much programming.

sineadw

Gah! No - never auto! No matter *how* long the exposure time or time lapse your WB at *least* should always be the same! Otherwise it looks jumpy! Ideally, manual everything as I said.

It's precisely the changes that warrant manual over automatic!

Hugh_C

Sinead, you're beginning to sound like me

Yeah, shoot RAW, manual everything and underexpose by a stop. Shoot RAW because (1) you have more control and (2) you might be able to sell it (I have) and you get a better price for RAW (or tiff) seqs. It could also be used at film res at a push. Assess well in advance what sort of frame rate you want. Shoot 250 frames per sequence at least.

I use Mac so I'm prob not much use to you software-wise. I use Lightroom, After Effects, QuickTime and FCP for what it's worth.

air

White balance fair enough yeah but how are you going to use a manual shutter speed / aperture & expect to get good exposure at both dawn and midday?

Hugh_C

air wrote: »

White balance fair enough yeah but how are you going to use a manual shutter speed / aperture & expect to get good exposure at both dawn and midday?

you can't, but there again, seeing the exposure bounce up and down every time a cloud comes and goes isn't acceptable to me

sineadw

Hugh_C wrote: »

you can't, but there again, seeing the exposure bounce up and down every time a cloud comes and goes isn't acceptable to me

That's exactly it Air - and besides, it SHOULD be dark at dawn and dusk and bright in the middle.

homerun_homer

sineadw wrote: »

You shoot RAW, then you make adjustments on the FIRST frame only. Then you copy those settings in Lightroom (right click - copy settings), select all other frames (using shift/click) and then paste the settings. Done.

I'll be using CS3, don't have Lightroom which seems a lot handier for batch processing.

Hugh_C wrote: »

I use Mac so I'm prob not much use to you software-wise. I use Lightroom, After Effects, QuickTime and FCP for what it's worth.

I have a new Mac and an XP laptop, time lapse will be done with the camera connected to the Mac and all editing done from there unless something on my laptop turns out to be easier to put the pics together with.

I'm annoyed now, I was sitting in all day after a bad day at work waiting to get it all set up and running and just been told to hold off on doing what I need to do until tomorrow. Wasted evening.

sineadw

homerun_homer wrote: »

I'll be using CS3, don't have Lightroom which seems a lot handier for batch processing.

You can do it in CS3 no probs Create an action with all your adjustments, then go to file>scripts> image processor and apply that action in the dialog box (its at the bottom I think?). LR *does* make this stuff simpler though. I'd recommend getting it if you're doing TimeLapse. Even if you're working in jpeg you'll want to make adjustments.

alexlyons

Longshanks100 wrote: »

...speaking of which i just ordered one of these remotes that can includes an interval timer. €25 all in.
http://cgi.ebay.ie/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280461141353&ssPageName=ADME:L:COSI:IE:1123#ht_3567wt_1018

Ordered a similar one for my D90 the other day

homerun_homer wrote: »

I have a new Mac and an XP laptop, time lapse will be done with the camera connected to the Mac and all editing done from there unless something on my laptop turns out to be easier to put the pics together with.

Find it very hard to believe that anything could be easier than quicktime 7 for making an image sequence! If you're running Snow Leopard you may need to install it off one of the discs. All you have to do is hit File>Open Image Sequence. Then select the first file in the folder (name them numerically) then choose the frame rate and you're done! Import to iMovie or whatever you're using (FCP for me) and add music or whatever.
One thing to note, quicktime doesn't like huge dimensions of 4000 odd pixels in width, but its fine with anything near enough to 1080p.

The other thing I learnt on here was to use manual focus. I have a thread on here about a problem of the images jumping and that was the issue, so make sure you're on manual!

Example of jumping with auto focus (look at the rocks): Killiney Bay Time Lapse

homerun_homer

Cheers for the tips Alex, I only shoot Manual so no worries there.

thatsnotmyname

Interesting subject guys
i have shot a load of images for a time lapse but have'nt got around to uploading them to a software package.
i was going to buy quicktime pro for this but have been putting it off as the pennys are a bit tight at the mo
Thanks to Sinead i will try out the photolapse link and see how i get on

Does it work on a mac tried downloading it there and didnt seem to work

sineadw

I think it's windows only? Not sure.. Sorry bout that.

ThOnda

Only? What else would you need if you already have windows?

Hugh_C

ThOnda wrote: »

Only? What else would you need if you already have windows?

OS X

sineadw

Hugh_C wrote: »

OS X

Worms, can, open.

:pac:

homerun_homer

So here is the result. I decided to shoot Jpeg since I was taking near 3,000 photos and I didn't need to worry too much about what I could achieve with RAW processing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhlmD3EYibw

alexlyons

looks very cool a few questions

I know I could work it out, but whats the frame rate?
what program(s) did you use
how long did it take in real time?
is the bobble head a kit or what? you're pretty good at it!
love the different camera angles

I found that mainly for the first section of making the head, the frame rate was nearly to quick and it messed with my eyes if i looked at your hands for to long, but that could just be me!

homerun_homer

alexlyons wrote: »

looks very cool a few questions

I know I could work it out, but whats the frame rate?
what program(s) did you use
how long did it take in real time?
is the bobble head a kit or what? you're pretty good at it!
love the different camera angles

I found that mainly for the first section of making the head, the frame rate was nearly to quick and it messed with my eyes if i looked at your hands for to long, but that could just be me!

First thing - it's not me in the video:) That's my friend/housemate who makes them. He made me one for my birthday last year and I bugged him that he should do it and try make a few quid on the side. The Facebook page is here.

The quality of the video is a bit off at the minute because youtube is still processing it so it will look less pixelated soon.

I shot it automatically with the 7D Utility software. Resized all the Jpegs to 1080 pixels and processed each step seperately at 24 frames a second with Photolapse which was mentioned on this thread - link is there too. I didn't get to check if my Mac installation cd had the Quicktime Pro 7 on it so I was swapping between computers constantly.
I put it together on iMovie on the Mac.

alexlyons

homerun_homer wrote: »

First thing - it's not me in the video:) That's my friend/housemate who makes them.

well he's still pretty good! how'd you/he put together the it at the end?

homerun_homer wrote: »

The quality of the video is a bit off at the minute because youtube is still processing it so it will look less pixelated soon.

ye i noticed that, figured it was an uploading issue alright!

homerun_homer wrote: »

I shot it automatically with the 7D Utility software. Resized all the Jpegs to 1080 pixels and processed each step seperately at 24 frames a second with Photolapse which was mentioned on this thread - link is there too.

sounds good, I'm sure the quality is top notch. It'd be difficult to have two frame rates in the same movie as it could look weird, I guess it's just the nature of the subject.

homerun_homer wrote: »

I didn't get to check if my Mac installation cd had the Quicktime Pro 7 on it

Think I mentioned in your thread on the mac forum that it doesn't

homerun_homer wrote: »

I put it together on iMovie on the Mac.

great program, very simple and has a solid amount of features for beginners. FCP or express (you're getting into big money if QT Pro's price is putting you off!) is good and add's a few extra features and ease of use, although not that much tbh. I have it for other uses and find it really great! do a few more and post them up here, I love seeing them! if I don't reply within a few hours, hit me with a PM if you can, wouldn't want to miss it!

homerun_homer

alexlyons wrote: »

well he's still pretty good! how'd you/he put together the it at the end?

That'd be telling:D He glues the head and body to a spring.

Slidinginfinity

homerun_homer wrote: »

That'd be telling:D He glues the head and body to a spring.

Why can I not read this without 'Buffalo Bill" from 'Silence of the Lambs' in my head?

alexlyons

homerun_homer wrote: »

That'd be telling:D He glues the head and body to a spring.

sorry that was meant to say "bit" not "it" but was also worded horrifically. the bit(;)) I meant was the text at the end (think is says "bobblehead me") that is written across the screen.

homerun_homer

alexlyons wrote: »

sorry that was meant to say "bit" not "it" but was also worded horrifically. the bit(;)) I meant was the text at the end (think is says "bobblehead me") that is written across the screen.

Aha, I stuck a piece of paper to the wall and got my housemate to write a little bit and I'd take a photo. After a few minutes of that he handed me some markers and told me to start marking the page, then he started draing other stuff as I took each photo. I wanted to do something quirky like that instead of just shoving in a title card from the editing software.

alexlyons

homerun_homer wrote: »

Aha, I stuck a piece of paper to the wall and got my housemate to write a little bit and I'd take a photo. After a few minutes of that he handed me some markers and told me to start marking the page, then he started draing other stuff as I took each photo. I wanted to do something quirky like that instead of just shoving in a title card from the editing software.

ah that sounds good! heard of that before, never new it looked that good when its done tbh! small bit of stop motion! which reminds me of a great video an old teacher of mine made, I'l see if i can dig it out and post it up!

alexlyons

Finally found it, sorry for the long wait, theres actually two of them!
not a major fan of the music, but the stop motion is incredible.

joeKel73

This is the best time lapse I've ever come across, and it's Irish:
http://vimeo.com/4827796

The shot of the stone walls and fields is class!