Was Rachel Corrie Murdered

Brown Bomber

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Did she get up, clean all the rubble off her self and lie back down again?

Because for that explination the blade must of pushed the rubble over her as well.

That is the version of events from Human Rights Watch, who had people on the ground which is the closest to an honest, transparent and neutral investigation that there has been. I have no reason to doubt their results.

PirateShampoo wrote: »

I mean come on, even in top gear it only goes 7mph, its not like she was caught unaware. The more i read about it the more it seems it just was a tradgic accident, which certain people are trying to twist to further there own means.

I haven't ruled out that it was an accident. You won't believe this but that was actually my motivation for starting the thread - to try to see the event from a different perspective. That is why I opened the thread with an open question. Obviously it is impossible to say for definite if he intended to kill her or not. That is why an open and honest investigation was needed, is needed. Even if it was an accident, it was still the drivers fault. The driver should have been disciplined and Israel should have been held accountable and apologised.

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Its funny that with all the cameras they had, that theres no actually pictures or videos of the accident happening. Or they just havent published them?

In all honesty if you witnessed a friend or colleague getting trampled by a bulldozer would you be taking photos or trying to help in some way?

PirateShampoo

Well i will agree with you that it was the drivers fault.

PirateShampoo

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Well i will agree with you that it was the drivers fault.

Just want to expand on my post.

If this had happened in Ireland the driver would more than likely looking at a Manslaughter charge no matter which version of the events posted turned out to be true.

the_syco

Brown Bomber wrote: »

It has recently been announced that the family of Rachel Corrie will sue the state of Israel for intentional murder of their daughter.
http://www.middle-east-online.com/english/?id=37464

Rachel Corrie was an American peace-activist who was killed by an Israeli bulldozer in 2003 while acting as a human-shield

Uh-huh. I stopped reading at "human shield". Terrorists have a habit of using human shields as protection, but someone offering to be a human shield is a bit daft.

If a friend was offering to die for a cause like this, I'd throw into a crazy house.

joesoap007

yekahs wrote: »

BB, I think its obvious why people have claimed you are anti-israel. You continuously claim you are not anti-israel but rather just anti human rights abuse. However, you haven't made a single thread about Angola, Burundi, Central African Republic, Chad, Cote d'Ivoire, Democratic Republic of Congo, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Guinea, Kenya, Liberia, Niger, Nigeria, Rwanda, Senegal, Sierra Leone, Somalia, South Africa, Sudan, Tanzania, Uganda, Zambia, Zimbabwe.etc. etc. Thats just in Africa.

You have probably started about 10-15 threads so far, and to my knowledge every single one of them has been about israel. You also seem to be able to bring any topic back around to Israel. There was a thread about an earthquake in Haiti, and you suggested the only reason the Israelis were there offering aid, was to either harvest organs or steal children.

Perhaps you are just interested in the middle east, and in that case why do you not raise issues about the human rights abuses in most(if not every) arab nation? You have never raised issues of palestinian abuses. What about 2 weeks ago when a British journalist was arrested and detained simply for defending and exonorating a person on trial for alleged spying for Israel. What about Hamas' butchering of the opposition party, after the election?...

So given that you often claim that it is just human rights violations you are against, yet every thread you start, and almost every post you make is exclusively attacking Israel, then yes I would have to say that it appears you are anti-israel.

anti-israeli is just like been anti nazi


QUOTE=the_syco;64736879]Uh-huh. I stopped reading at "human shield". Terrorists have a habit of using human shields as protection, but someone offering to be a human shield is a bit daft.

If a friend was offering to die for a cause like this, I'd throw into a crazy house.

[/QUOTE]its not daft.without people like rachel corry black people in the US would not have had there rights..south africa..ireland to name but a few. without them the world would not be a nice place

Yitzhak Rabin

joesoap007 wrote: »

anti-israeli is just like been anti nazi

WTF is peoples obsession with comparing Israel to the Nazis? Seriously?? If you believe they are a despostic regime, then fair enough, but there are dozens upon dozens of comparisons that can be drawn to other countries, or better yet, don't bother with the comparisons at all.

Israel does not systematically round up palestinians, send them off on trains, work them to the bone, without pay, carry out sick human experiments on them, separate them from their children and spouses, and despite what the sensationalist claim here, they are not committing genocide.

The only reason I can think of for the Nazi comparison is to piss Jewish people off and try and trivialise the unbelievable and sick injustice that occured less than a lifetime ago.

(Also before someone here starts saying that Gaza is a concentration camp, and they do seperate families because the wall goes through ths families farm, that is not even close to what the nazis did.

Brown Bomber

the_syco wrote: »

Uh-huh. I stopped reading at "human shield". Terrorists have a habit of using human shields as protection, but someone offering to be a human shield is a bit daft.

If a friend was offering to die for a cause like this, I'd throw into a crazy house.

Daft maybe in a self-absorbed materialistic world. Cause like what exactly? You don't think standing between a sniper rifle and an innocent child so he can walk to school safely is of any value?

Brown Bomber

joesoap007 wrote: »

its not daft.without people like rachel corry black people in the US would not have had there rights..south africa..ireland to name but a few. without them the world would not be a nice place

Good point, well said. It seems to me that the world thinks that Palestinians are not worthy of basic human rights. Gandhi - Hero, Mandela - Hero, Civil Rights activists in the North - All heroes. Peacefully protest illegal demolitions of families homes in Palestine then your some "daft" anti-semitic, radical who deserve everything they get, including death.

the_syco

Brown Bomber wrote: »

Good point, well said. It seems to me that the world thinks that Palestinians are not worthy of basic human rights. Gandhi - Hero, Mandela - Hero, Civil Rights activists in the North - All heroes. Peacefully protest illegal demolitions of families homes in Palestine then your some "daft" anti-semitic, radical who deserve everything they get, including death.

Protests are not daft. Being a human shield is.

joesoap007

yekahs wrote: »

WTF is peoples obsession with comparing Israel to the Nazis? Seriously?? If you believe they are a despostic regime, then fair enough, but there are dozens upon dozens of comparisons that can be drawn to other countries, or better yet, don't bother with the comparisons at all.

Israel does not systematically round up palestinians, send them off on trains, work them to the bone, without pay, carry out sick human experiments on them, separate them from their children and spouses, and despite what the sensationalist claim here, they are not committing genocide.

The only reason I can think of for the Nazi comparison is to piss Jewish people off and try and trivialise the unbelievable and sick injustice that occured less than a lifetime ago.

(Also before someone here starts saying that Gaza is a concentration camp, and they do seperate families because the wall goes through ths families farm, that is not even close to what the nazis did.

Both the nazi and the zionists believed they were a superior people
Created 4 million + refugees
Holds world's record for the most Un violations
69+
Killed more innocent civilians per capita than any other country 50,000 +
Has imprisoned more civilians per cap 250,0000.
Has rendered more civilians handicapped per cap 50,000+
Demolished more homes than any other country 60,000 +
Outlawed marriage to non-Jews
Destroyed 350 Christian churches + mosques
6 wars in 60 years
254 km of apartheid wall, 562 checkpoints
Has ethnically cleansed 500 + villages
genocide
land grabs
and gaza is a concentration camp their just about giving them enough food to live
same as poland

after ww2 people said never again,

shame on anyone here who backs israel

Brown Bomber

the_syco wrote: »

Protests are not daft. Being a human shield is.

That doesn't answer the question. It was - " You don't think standing between a sniper rifle and an innocent child so he can walk to school safely is of any value?"

Some people don't have a choice in the matter, like these human shields.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2009/mar/23/israel-gaza-human-shields
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJa_vMbKllk

Both must-watch short news stories.

Brown Bomber

Brown Bomber wrote: »

Good point, well said. It seems to me that the world thinks that Palestinians are not worthy of basic human rights. Gandhi - Hero, Mandela - Hero, Civil Rights activists in the North - All heroes. Peacefully protest illegal demolitions of families homes in Palestine then your some "daft" anti-semitic, radical who deserve everything they get, including death.

I decided to look into these two internationally respected statesmen whom I view as essentially honest and ethical to gather their views on the conflict. Here is what they had to say:

Nelson Mandela

A "murderous black Marxist terrorist" or "black Nazi" according to the Jewish Task Force :rolleyes: http://www.jtf.org/israel/israel.black.nazi.nelson.mandela.htm

"Israel should withdraw from all the areas which it won from the Arabs in 1967, and in particular Israel should withdraw completely from the Golan Heights, from south Lebanon and from the West Bank."

I have come to join you today to add our own voice to the universal call for Palestinian self-determination and statehood. We would be beneath our own reason for existence as government and as a nation, if the resolution of the problems of the Middle East did not feature prominently on our agenda.

We know too well that our freedom is incomplete without the freedom of the Palestinians

When in 1977, the United Nations passed the resolution inaugurating the International Day of Solidarity with the Palestinian people, it was asserting the recognition that injustice and gross human rights violations were being perpetrated in Palestine. In the same period, the UN took a strong stand against apartheid; and over the years, an international consensus was built, which helped to bring an end to this iniquitous system.

http://www.anc.org.za/ancdocs/history/mandela/1997/sp971204b.html

---

"There has always been close collaboration between the Zionist entity and South Africa. We have not ceased to condemn this cooperation loudly and clearly and to call for putting an end to it. We all know that both racist systems lend each other a helping hand in the areas of economic and military affairs."



"The ANC has, on numerous occasions, maintained that the PLO is our comrade in arms in the struggle or the liberation of our respective countries. We fully support the combat of the Organization for the Liberation of Palestine for the creation of an independent Palestinian State."

http://www.mathaba.net/info/mandela.htm

Gandhi
Article 1: September 1938

he cry for the national home for the Jews does not make much appeal to me. The sanction for it is sought in the Bible and the tenacity with which the Jews have hankered after return to Palestine. Why should they not, like other peoples of the earth, make that country their home where they are born and where they earn their livelihood?

Palestine belongs to the Arabs in the same sense that England belongs to the English or France to the French. It is wrong and inhuman to impose the Jews on the Arabs. What is going on in Palestine today cannot be justified by any moral code of conduct. The mandates have no sanction but that of the last war. Surely it would be a crime against humanity to reduce the proud Arabs so that Palestine can be restored to the Jews partly or wholly as their national home.


The nobler course would be to insist on a just treatment of the Jews wherever they are born and bred. The Jews born in France are French in precisely the same sense that Christians born in France are French.

And now a word to the Jews in Palestine. I have no doubt that they are going about it the wrong way. The Palestine of the Biblical conception is not a geographical tract. It is in their hearts. But if they must look to the Palestine of geography as their national home, it is wrong to enter it under the shadow of the British gun. A religious act cannot be performed with the aid of the bayonet or the bomb. They can settle in Palestine only by the goodwill of the Arabs. They should seek to convert the Arab heart. The same God rules the Arab heart who rules the Jewish heart

. There are hundreds of ways of reasoning with the Arabs, if they will only discard the help of the British bayonet. As it is, they are co-sharers with the British in despoiling a people who have done no wrong to them.

Article 2: May 1946

But, in my opinion, they have erred grievously in seeking to impose themselves on Palestine with the aid of America and Britain and now with the aid of naked terrorism.

No wonder that my sympathy goes out to the Jews in their unenviably sad plight. But one would have thought adversity would teach them lessons of peace. Why should they depend upon American money or British arms for forcing themselves on an unwelcome land? Why should they resort to terrorism to make good their forcible landing in Palestine?

http://gandhifoundation.org/2009/01/14/the-question-of-palestine-by-mohandas-k-gandhi/

Brown Bomber

Speaking in Geneva before the UN Human Rights Council on Thursday Tutu said, “The response of a largely secret internal military investigation is absolutely unacceptable from both legal and moral points of view.
He said, “No verifiable explanation has been offered, no independent impartial and transparent investigation has been held, no one has been held to account.

"This unjust and illegal action by Israel has vastly increased the suffering of a population which, being under occupation, is legally entitled to look to Israel for protection and support. The occupation remains the root cause of incidents such as the shelling of Beit Hanoun."

http://english.pnn.ps/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3582&Itemid=1

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Following an internal investigation, Israel concluded that "a rare and grave technical error"[/FONT]

Brown Bomber

Just joking, the above is when Israel shelled homes at night killing 19 people as they slept. I was shocked how well it fits with the Corrie situation, and then after the internal "investigation" they describe it as yet another "grave error", unbelievable. Anyway, onto Martin Luther King Jr.

Torakx

Unfortunatly after the latest nobel peace prize i think for myself the nobel prizes have had a shadow cast on them and the name tainted(almost to a point where it could be seen as a joke prize).
Wether that was done on purpose to take away from the previous award nominees i dont know,but thats what it would have done for me if i wasnt rechecking my thinking every now and then.

Brown Bomber

Martin Luther King Jr

"Moreover, I am cognizant of the interrelatedness of all communities and states. I cannot sit idly by in Atlanta and not be concerned about what happens in Birmingham. Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."

http://www.stanford.edu/group/King/frequentdocs/birmingham.pdf

"the struggle for freedom forms one long front crossing oceans and peoples".

http://www.anc.org.za/ancdocs/history/solidarity/mlking01.html

The determination of Negro Americans to win freedom from all forms of oppression springs from the same deep longing that motivates oppressed peoples all over the world. The rumblings of discontent in Asia and Africa are expressions of a quest for freedom and human dignity by people who have long been the victims of colonialism and imperialism.

http://www.anc.org.za/un/loh02.html

joesoap007

Torakx wrote: »

Unfortunatly after the latest nobel peace prize i think for myself the nobel prizes have had a shadow cast on them and the name tainted(almost to a point where it could be seen as a joke prize).
Wether that was done on purpose to take away from the previous award nominees i dont know,but thats what it would have done for me if i wasnt rechecking my thinking every now and then.

mr aipac obama even been in the top 100 to get the nobel peace prize was a joke.never mind winning it..

take a look at obama talking pure sh1t in this link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qhhrz2OqEx0

Torakx

joesoap007 wrote: »

mr aipac obama even been in the top 100 to get the nobel peace prize was a joke.never mind winning it..

take a look at obama talking pure sh1t in this link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qhhrz2OqEx0

O.M.G hahaha I cant believe he got owned so bad!
I actually couldnt watch the whole thing because he had nothing to say and it was awkward to watch!

Brown Bomber

Torakx wrote: »

O.M.G hahaha I cant believe he got owned so bad!
I actually couldnt watch the whole thing because he had nothing to say and it was awkward to watch!

Did you notice how often and frantically the lying bakstard blinked, he's scum of the highest order.

bonkey

We see, to have left any semblence of a conspiracy theory long behind us, and are now just engaging in what - at best - could be described as a Political discussion.

Closed.