You are a Bar/Late Night Venue/Night Club Owner

abouttobebanned

Now..there could have been 2 ways to do this:

1. You have tons of money and can run the bar however you want.
2. The venue has been left to you in a will so it's yours...but you will still have to pay the current rent, and exemptions if you want to stay open late. Among your costs will be DJs, Bands, Dancers, Staff, whatever you want to have in your bar really.

So, your objective is to pick a location in the city (it can be empty at the moment, something else - like a book shop - or in can be a venue atm), and tell us what you would do to make it Waterford's Premier night spot

How would you decorate it - internal & external
Would you have loads of screens like masons? Or none like Geoffs?
Would you have bands like Ruby Lounge? Or none like Geoffs?
Would you have Djs like Rubys, Harveys or Escape? Or none like Geoffs?
Would you serve food like Revolution or Geoffs? Or none like Harveys?

It's your venue now, you can do what you want with it...but it has to make money. If your bar sounds like a good one, that the reader would frequent, then your post will get a thanks. If not, it won't.

Give your venue a name as well...in a few weeks time, Sully or Aquos can add a poll and we'll see who's venue is the best.

Now remember, if your bar is going to be wall to wall rock...you're probably not going to get the hen nights or big groups of girls or a lot of factory - what we call occasional diverse groups.

Go on...create the best damn venue you can. But remember, I'll be after ya all the way with annoying questions about how you plan to pay your security and exemptions and all that...

Enjoy

ziedth

This is going to be a bit of a laugh. I'll think about it! Would anyone working in the industry know what kind of margins they get on beer on spirits? IE if I sell a pint for €4 it costs me what?

abouttobebanned

Based on a €4 pint

Government €1.16
Brewery €1.14
Wages and PRSI €0.52
Utilities, rates, insurance, repairs, waste €0.41.
Entertainment and Professional... €0.33
Other costs €0.15
Publican Net Profit/Rent €0.29.

rayc

abouttobebanned wrote: »

Wages and PRSI €0.52
Utilities, rates, insurance, repairs, waste €0.41.
Entertainment and Professional... €0.33
Other costs €0.15
Publican Net Profit/Rent €0.29.

How can you have a flat rate per pint on these though, surely they are completely dependent on how many pints you sell per week/month!? Might be better to just factor the beer-related charges and then calculate the other costs separately...?

ziedth

I guess for the purpose of this thread we will say they are the costs regardless of stock/sales/size etc

make it so we are all signing off the same hymn sheet.

nkay1985

abouttobebanned wrote: »

Based on a €4 pint

Government €1.16
Brewery €1.14
Wages and PRSI €0.52
Utilities, rates, insurance, repairs, waste €0.41.
Entertainment and Professional... €0.33
Other costs €0.15
Publican Net Profit/Rent €0.29.

Are those numbers plucked from thin air or what? Like say I want to charge €4 for a pint, how much of that is mine after I've paid for it and paid the government duty?

rayc

Ziedth. wrote: »

I guess for the purpose of this thread we will say they are the costs regardless of stock/sales/size etc

make it so we are all signing off the same hymn sheet.

I understand, not trying to be awkward, but if you used the profit margins assumed above these include, for instance, entertainment at 33c per pint. There's a big difference between a stereo in the corner and a live band every night under 'Entertainment'. Surely just sticking to the base price (cost + tax) and letting people work out the additional costs would be a better approach??

south

you'd wonder how the cove and the likes are selling it for €3.25 so :eek:

ziedth

Good point.

I guess of you want to run a quiet pub you can cut that 0.33.

GP from that niall would be if we sell a pint for 4 it's costing us 2.30!

abouttobebanned

nkay1985 wrote: »

Are those numbers plucked from thin air or what? Like say I want to charge €4 for a pint, how much of that is mine after I've paid for it and paid the government duty?

Not really plucked from the air..but really not far off. It will depend on the venue.

We don't have to get too specific about these things....just go with what you want and we can perform the autopsy afterwards. We can also consider things like Sky boxes and setanta boxes etc. (The cost of Sky differs from venue to venue also - it's determined by the value of your licence. The bigger the venue usually means the higher price you pay for a sky sub)

mozattack

Lads,

Accountant here with experience of doing the audit on all of the major pubs in Waterford as I have worked in three different accountancy firms who had them as clients.

Rule of thumb really is that overall drink margins for rural pubs or pub without a late licence (so less spirits are sold) is around 55% - 59%. Margin for the other forms of pubs (e.g. Harvey, Muldoons, Rubys etc) should be in the region of 65%.

Therefore, sales of €100, gross profit of €55 - €59 for "rural" pubs and €65+ for others.

mozattack

I like this idea by the way - quiet fun. Maybe Bob Tweedy could enter, but then again, maybe not!

abouttobebanned

Thanks for that Mozattack.

Still waiting for the first application for a licence

nkay1985

mozattack wrote: »

Lads,

Accountant here with experience of doing the audit on all of the major pubs in Waterford as I have worked in three different accountancy firms who had them as clients.

Rule of thumb really is that overall drink margins for rural pubs or pub without a late licence (so less spirits are sold) is around 55% - 59%. Margin for the other forms of pubs (e.g. Harvey, Muldoons, Rubys etc) should be in the region of 65%.

Therefore, sales of €100, gross profit of €55 - €59 for "rural" pubs and €65+ for others.

Cool. So taking Ziedth's original question of how much of the €4.00 from a pint is his it's:
€2.20 @ 55%.
€2.60 @ 65%.

@abouttobebanned: You said this pub/club/whatever has to make money yeah?

abouttobebanned

Oh yeah

ziedth

I'll do it up tonight!

Do we have a cap on start up money? It will be to easy I'd money is no object

abouttobebanned

Ziedth. wrote: »

I'll do it up tonight!

Do we have a cap on start up money? It will be to easy I'd money is no object

Ok - this isn't going to be easy. If we put a cap on your money we'll then have to put a price on security, renovations, rent entertainment etc...and that will be a bit time consuming.

However, there's nothing stopping people from saying they'll have LED walls and a big fcuk off aquarium behind the bar...any ideas on how we can put a leash on this?

Fajitas!

Right, I'll bite.

Buy John Hearns on the Quay. You've got a decent amount of room, two floors up, and afaik, there's a basement. That's the keg room sorted in the basement. AFAIK, there's only one toilet on the first floor, but plenty of room on the second, along with room for stock.

First bar is the main room as you enter. Bar opens at 1300. Soup of the day served, along with toasted sandwiches 'til 6. Good quality, but a decent profit is still managable. Bar can be run by one person. Good coffee...scratch that, the best coffee you'll get in the town. Purely because it'll save me making the best coffee in town at home :pac:

Basic renovations. Somewhat like Geoffs, but not because it's anything like Geoffs. Nearest example. Music? Nothing loud, nothing intrusive, nothing offensive. If I have to raise my voice to talk over it, it's too much.

Second area opens up on the right as you go in. One projector/screen for matches. Not every match, not any match, it's not a sports pub. Space availible if someone did want to play a set there. Again, nothing too loud, too intrusive, or offensive.

The second bar can open up down the very back, from Thurs/Fri/Sat/Special occasions.

License only wanted/needed 'til standard closing hours.

Drinks availible? Standard affair of beers/wines/spirits, as per the rest of town. A few speciality beers on tap that can change seasonally, along with a house beer/ale from an Irish microbrewery. Drink prices set to standard. If the average price goes down, so be it. If it goes up, it goes up.

Oh. Name. Couldn't change that. Hearns Hardwear.

The only thing it couldn't have is a smoking area.

slavetothegrind

Now to be sucessful hire only friendly efficient professional staff.

You will pay a little more but he ( or she) will earn it several times over by keeping customers.

Or you could have topless barmaids but there goes the demographic....

Also. Aforementioned sandwiches are of the batch ham and cheese toastie in plastic.
This is your classic irish special, special to you because no-one does it anymore. served with a few crisps on the side.

Then after say 6.00 you will periodically come out with baskets of unbelievably salty cocktail sausages and chips to keep punters happy and thirsty but full so no need to go home.

In with this add an experienced professional security team to keep out the dreggs who will try to infest the place with their barred arses on opening.

Give us a classic pub for fecks sake!
We are not in an episode of Miami Vice, we want to feel like we are in a pub!
So keep it classic, clean, and pubby. Feck off with your neon ****e!

Oh and finally, try and keep the jacks respectable!

NOw let me know when you open and i'll grace the nearest barstool with my hairy arse and declare my need for a pint of plain and a classic toastie!

ziedth

abouttobebanned wrote: »

Ok - this isn't going to be easy. If we put a cap on your money we'll then have to put a price on security, renovations, rent entertainment etc...and that will be a bit time consuming.

However, there's nothing stopping people from saying they'll have LED walls and a big fcuk off aquarium behind the bar...any ideas on how we can put a leash on this?

I guess just keep it in reason, like you can't turn around and say I'd buy the old cinema and put in 6 bars with 6 different types of music. Which would be cool though

abouttobebanned

Fajitas! wrote: »

Right, I'll bite.

Buy John Hearns on the Quay. You've got a decent amount of room, two floors up, and afaik, there's a basement. That's the keg room sorted in the basement. AFAIK, there's only one toilet on the first floor, but plenty of room on the second, along with room for stock.

First bar is the main room as you enter. Bar opens at 1300. Soup of the day served, along with toasted sandwiches 'til 6. Good quality, but a decent profit is still managable. Bar can be run by one person. Good coffee...scratch that, the best coffee you'll get in the town. Purely because it'll save me making the best coffee in town at home :pac:

Basic renovations. Somewhat like Geoffs, but not because it's anything like Geoffs. Nearest example. Music? Nothing loud, nothing intrusive, nothing offensive. If I have to raise my voice to talk over it, it's too much.

Second area opens up on the right as you go in. One projector/screen for matches. Not every match, not any match, it's not a sports pub. Space availible if someone did want to play a set there. Again, nothing too loud, too intrusive, or offensive.

The second bar can open up down the very back, from Thurs/Fri/Sat/Special occasions.

License only wanted/needed 'til standard closing hours.

Drinks availible? Standard affair of beers/wines/spirits, as per the rest of town. A few speciality beers on tap that can change seasonally, along with a house beer/ale from an Irish microbrewery. Drink prices set to standard. If the average price goes down, so be it. If it goes up, it goes up.

Oh. Name. Couldn't change that. Hearns Hardwear.

The only thing it couldn't have is a smoking area.

Suppose my main concerns would be how much it would cost to renovate the place and also its location. The nearest bars to you would be the Belfy and somewhere like Jordans. For the average saturday night punter it would be a bit of a trek in the rain to get there and then move onto the next spot. For that reason alone I'm afraid your bar would probably fail. :mad:

slavetothegrind wrote:

Now to be sucessful hire only friendly efficient professional staff.

You will pay a little more but he ( or she) will earn it several times over by keeping customers.

Or you could have topless barmaids but there goes the demographic....

Also. Aforementioned sandwiches are of the batch ham and cheese toastie in plastic.
This is your classic irish special, special to you because no-one does it anymore. served with a few crisps on the side.

Then after say 6.00 you will periodically come out with baskets of unbelievably salty cocktail sausages and chips to keep punters happy and thirsty but full so no need to go home.

In with this add an experienced professional security team to keep out the dreggs who will try to infest the place with their barred arses on opening.

Give us a classic pub for fecks sake!
We are not in an episode of Miami Vice, we want to feel like we are in a pub!
So keep it classic, clean, and pubby. Feck off with your neon ****e!

Oh and finally, try and keep the jacks respectable!

NOw let me know when you open and i'll grace the nearest barstool with my hairy arse and declare my need for a pint of plain and a classic toastie!

First off...where would you locate this bar?

kryogen

isnt there some sort of market research forum elsewhere on this site?

abouttobebanned

kryogen wrote: »

isnt there some sort of market research forum elsewhere on this site?

?

Fajitas!

abouttobebanned wrote: »

Suppose my main concerns would be how much it would cost to renovate the place and also its location. The nearest bars to you would be the Belfy and somewhere like Jordans. For the average saturday night punter it would be a bit of a trek in the rain to get there and then move onto the next spot. For that reason alone I'm afraid your bar would probably fail. :mad:

It depends what crowd you want tbh. You're looking at it from the 'everyone's for a mad one for the weekend' point of view.

As for renovation, you're not going to need too much if you're going for a bar 'full of character'. It's a structurally sound building. The installation of a cool room, dumbwaiter for crates and kegs, tap system and a good till system, along with furniture are going to be the most part. Still far cheaper than building your own. Or installing fish tanks in every wall, and lining them with LEDs...

It's target audience isn't the average saturday night punter. As for location, look at T&H's, Jordans, Murphy's, etc. Or maybe Nells......

ziedth

My theory:

Building: The Old Stand

Has the ground work already, nicely spaced, upstairs area, IIRC there is a yard at the back that could be converted into a smoking area.

Style: Mixed

First floor, Cross between hotel lobby and sports bar. IE comfy seats few plasma screens dotted around and a projector.

I would have a rectangular bar in an island like harveys front bar and here is the hook on one side i'd have it traditional but on the other i'd have a system of constanly moving (kinda like in a concert) for when it gets busy.

Upstairs, I'd cater for live discos. this wold have a simialr style to ruby lounge. I'd limit the seating as much as possible and keep it to vsrious standing areas and stools.

Running the place:

I would undercut all nightclubs by at least .20c if not .50c a drink and encourage buying rounds kinda like that promotion red bull were doing with the weel for €20. I would keep downstairs free of loud music but still a decent vibe and have it somewhat relaxed while upstairs basically everything I hate about harveys on a sat night(to bring in the money).

On a friday I would have a live band. The best pub band I could get at the time Play them dowstairs in the evening and same setup as saturday night later on.

For student nights I would operate the strictest door policy known to man.

Always let in the attractive (thats right I said it) ladies but not all men if they are in anyway messy. this would hopefully give the place a classy look on a student night and word would quickly spread that this is where all the fit wans go.

I would have a zero scumbag policy all nights, you know the kind.


What I would hope to get out of this is people to have the option to have a quiet pint downstairs but still keep everyone else happy going to their harveys clone upstairs.

I wouldn't bother with food, to much competition. Maybe for matches downstairs I would do sausages and goujons to order at a crazy high markup.

Aquos76

This is turning out to be a good thread after all, when I first say it I thought to myself, abouttobebanned on another bashing mission on the nightlife scene in Waterford(or lack of, as the case actually is)

abouttobebanned

:-(

baronflyguy

To me, The Left Bank in Kilkenny is topic notch with all its zones (loud music, no music chill out, TVs zone to watch sports, large open smoking area, class toilets etc), its size and layout. It would be great to something similar in Waterford.

I cant think of any venue here in Waterford where you could mimic it :-(

Ledger

ok so i'll throw me name into the hat too.


Location: The Toddle. Lower Yellow Road.
Perfect location for people on their way into town and going home to all the areas up round there and perfect for those trying to stay away from the toen centre on a saturday night.

Layout:

Keep the current leyout pretty much as is except for a few changes:

• Remove small dingy off licence from left of the bar and move to a side entrance on laneway at the left into that old kitchen at the back of the bar.
• Front bar will be kept as is there will be a smal LCD screen on the right for horse racing during the day and when there is not a major sports event on. There will then be a larger screen in the main area for sport.
• The back bar will remain as is also, keeping the pool table, dart board and jukebox as i think they are just not enough of them round anymore and can be very popular. This area can also then be used for functions.
• The smoking area at in the back will be completely re-roofed and some kind of sectioning off of the rest of the yard stopping too much of a draught coming in through there. There will also be a big wood burning stove with a grille all arond to stop anyone leaning on it and getting burned.

Services:

• During the week opening time will be at one o clock hopefully gaining some of the horsey crowd during the slow weekday afternoons.Weekend opening will be twelve catering for the early premiership matches.
• Drinks served will be all the regulars with a "Beer of the Month" kind of offer where a certain obscure beer will be sold at a discount price, perhaps around 20% off the regular price, when bought in a round of 5 or more.
• Simple tasty bar food seved everyday, from opening till 7 o clock in the evening. This will include;chips; sausages; chicken goujons; panninis; plain and toasted sanwiches and two soups of the day.
• The Off licence will be operated by a bell or buzzer therefore requiring only one person to operate the bar during the day.
• Special prices on drinks and food will be offered to anyone who wishes to use the back bar for a function.
• Live band every saturday night in the back bar and DJ every friday night with the pool table being moved and setting up there. Music will not be too loud but will create an atmospehe in the background anyone who wants a quieter drink can remain in the front bar away from the music.
• Late licence on a saturday and friday night only.
• One member of security on the door on friday and saturday nights keeping out any undesirables who may be passing.

Prices:
Prices will be reasonable and will be regular prices for a pub nothing like nightclub prices.
Also, food will be cheap and a certain ammount of complimentary food will be served up during big matches etc...
No fee for booking a function.



Ledger

ROCKMAN

Sorry the take away buzzer/bell is the most annoying thing ever to grace a pub , After one or two hours listening to one randomly go off , as a punter you'll go mad and feel like killing someone ..... trust me .

Ledger

hmmmm you could have a point there actually. . . . .