*Limerick GAA news/discussion thread*

donfers

Let the battles and workers frustrate, torment and tire out Tipp's backs for 50 minutes then send on the artillery of ailis, moran, downes and dowling between 50 - 60 for all four forwards except hannon and mulcahy and try to nick it late on

make it a low-scoring, intense war for 50 minutes

after 50 minutes score: Limerick 0-8 Tipperary 0-9

after 70 minutes: Limerick 2-14 Tipperary 1-13

....then again their bench isn't too bad either so may not work but we'll see

Fireball07

^Let's hope something like that plays out.


Tonight, I watched highlights of some of our 07 games- Waterford semi-final, the 2 Tipp replays.

Now, not all of those players were hugely talented (obviously some were). But they were extremely passionate...as Richie Bennis himself said "they would die for Limerick". They gave absolutely everything and played to a gameplan that worked. It involved high-pressure being applied all over the pitch, never letting opposition have time on the ball, and it was quick, direct hurling...relying on a high ball to Begley and a diagonal ball to Shaughs/Ryan, with Ollie Moran sweeping up anything that broke.

Mike O'Brien was never the most skilful hurler but when we beat Tipp in the Gaelic Grounds, he was absolute fantastic, he just worked and worked, swept up everything in the middle third.



I don't think Allen is the type of manager who inspires the same kind of passion as Bennis, he's more cool-headed and tactical.....and these players are probably more skilful in many areas, but that doesn't mean high-intensity/aggression/extreme pressure should be absent......and I reckon that's why he's gone for the half-forward line that he has picked. Hope it works.

(If you can't tell, I am very very excited for this game.....)

grenache

In order to win on any given day, the correct positioning of players is vital. I really don't know what Allen is at playing Hannon at 14 and Hickey on the 40. Hannon is wasted at full forward and Hickey is not a forward full stop.

As for Paul Browne at midfield - the boy will get picked no matter how much of a passenger he is. Hickey is a much better option there. Defence looks settled enough, but it's the forwards and the odd positioning that concerns me.

With that line up, Allen has made Tipp's job much easier than it should be. I really cannot see us doing anything on Sunday. Anything other than a comfortable Tipp victory would be a surprise.

Fireball07

I still retain hope.

As for Hannon & Hickey, I really doubt Hannon will remain at 14 for the 70 mins. And again, I can see the theory of playing Hannon there (most dangerous forward close to goal), but there are obvious downsides too...mainly as he's just better at half-forward and we need him to create chances.

Still, I expect him to drop back early enough.

glasagusban

grenache wrote: »

In order to win on any given day, the correct positioning of players is vital. I really don't know what Allen is at playing Hannon at 14 and Hickey on the 40. Hannon is wasted at full forward and Hickey is not a forward full stop.

As for Paul Browne at midfield - the boy will get picked no matter how much of a passenger he is. Hickey is a much better option there. Defence looks settled enough, but it's the forwards and the odd positioning that concerns me.

With that line up, Allen has made Tipp's job much easier than it should be. I really cannot see us doing anything on Sunday. Anything other than a comfortable Tipp victory would be a surprise.

Expect Hannon to play deep, essentially as a half forward. His positioning may have something to do with the poor form of Moran and dowling too, unfortunately.

I keep hearing hickey not a forward but he's no longer a back either and is too loose to be trusted in the full back line. Maybe a half back or alternatively midfield but if he is effective at half forward then that's fine.

I'm not a huge fan of Browne but one of the other players spoke very highly of him to me recently and in fairness he covers an amount of ground getting up and down the pitch.

Lads, compare the team to last year, its about equally as strong. I'm not inspired by this selection but if we show up as good as last year then we have 5 strong subs to come in, as opposed to none last year. We are also a year longer together and should be more developed as a team... The performance last year came almost out of nowhere, lets hope we have another one in us this year. Tipp will be stronger this year too but if we can at least stay with them we can finish strong with the downes, Dempsey, allis, Moran, and dowling coming in for a the final shoot out.

paddy no 11

I think its all been covered on here lads, the merits of a gameplan and 15(20) players to execute it versus not having your best team on the pitch.

Personally i think tipp have the better hurlers across the park and will prevail (bookies have em by 5 points too), realistically mulcahy would be the only fella guaranteed to walk into the tipp side.

Hopefully we can get a 25k crowd in sunday and make a good intense atmosphere and get a performance out of this side, and the gameplan works. We'll need 3-4 goals from mulcahy and tobin to win this, and have to take advantage from 50 yards if they drop in a sweeper.

Not a lot more to be said except good luck to everyone involved.

premierstone

grenache wrote: »

With that line up, Allen has made Tipp's job much easier than it should be. I really cannot see us doing anything on Sunday. Anything other than a comfortable Tipp victory would be a surprise.

glasagusban wrote: »

Tipp will be stronger this year too but if we can at least stay with them we can finish strong with the downes, Dempsey, allis, Moran, and dowling coming in for a the final shoot out.

paddy no 11 wrote: »

Personally i think tipp have the better hurlers across the park and will prevail (bookies have em by 5 points too), realistically mulcahy would be the only fella guaranteed to walk into the tipp side.

Lads no matter what the respective line up's ye will always have a chance against Tipp as do all the big hurling counties, it is something that has been missing from Tipp hurling since the 60's - the ability to consistenly beat inferior teams and to ''finish off'' teams, like Kilkenny do, with the exception of the 2011 Munster Final I would struggle to recall another Cahmpionship game where we really went for the jugular like Kilkenny do when on top.

paddy no 11

I seem to remember a 17 point hiding in croke park not so long ago

So yes any outcome is possible

Fireball07

http://www.hoganstand.com/Limerick/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=193857


Eamonn Cregan has supported Allen's decision to drop Dowling and Downes.


I think that's fair enough but I don't think the form of Walsh/Browne/Breen has been better than the above. (Bar maybe Walsh but both Dempsey and Carmody have been in top form).

And what he says about the length of time the ball takes to go into full-forward, that is definitely true. If we're to have any chance against Tipp, the ball has to go in quick.

Rightwing

Well I did say the footballers wouldn't go very far, and I don't think the hurlers will either.

If we they stay within 10 points I'd view it as a success.

Vanolder

This is Munster Championship and our boys will be well up for it. That team picked will run themselves into the ground and the young lads will come on and carry us home. Get out on Sunday and get behind the lads and believe!!

Mountainlad

donfers wrote: »

Let the battles and workers frustrate, torment and tire out Tipp's backs for 50 minutes then send on the artillery of ailis, moran, downes and dowling between 50 - 60 for all four forwards except hannon and mulcahy and try to nick it late on

make it a low-scoring, intense war for 50 minutes

after 50 minutes score: Limerick 0-8 Tipperary 0-9

after 70 minutes: Limerick 2-14 Tipperary 1-13

....then again their bench isn't too bad either so may not work but we'll see

Tipperary 1-13...when was the last time that happened? Even we scored at least 1-15 on Sunday and we were shocking in the second half and don't have a forward line like Tipp's. Corbett is certainly a loss though, was expecting big things for him this year.

Think Richie McCarthy will have a very testing afternoon. Midfield ye could match them, but I don't really like the look of yer half forward line. Expecting a better Tipp than last year but with low expectations and several talented hurlers, you'd have to give Limerick a chance.

premierstone

Mountainlad wrote: »

Tipperary 1-13...when was the last time that happened? Even we scored at least 1-15 on Sunday and we were shocking in the second half and don't have a forward line like Tipp's. Corbett is certainly a loss though, was expecting big things for him this year.

Think Richie McCarthy will have a very testing afternoon. Midfield ye could match them, but I don't really like the look of yer half forward line. Expecting a better Tipp than last year but with low expectations and several talented hurlers, you'd have to give Limerick a chance.

Shane McGrath is struglling to regain he's 2008-2011 form, but neither of the two selected midfielders for Limerick is anywhere near the class of Brendan Maher, if McGrath performs anyway satisfactorily I think its one area we should win.*

*thats assuming we start with McGrath and Maher, personally I wouldnt.

jordainius

paddy no 11 wrote: »

I seem to remember a 17 point hiding in croke park not so long ago

So yes any outcome is possible

It was 24 points actually

Rightwing

We don't really know how good Tipp are, they have to be an improvement on last year. I don't think we've come on much.

Mountainlad

premierstone wrote: »

Shane McGrath is struglling to regain he's 2008-2011 form, but neither of the two selected midfielders for Limerick is anywhere near the class of Brendan Maher, if McGrath performs anyway satisfactorily I think its one area we should win.*

*thats assuming we start with McGrath and Maher, personally I wouldnt.

Sorry that's true Maher is class in fairness, I was thinkin he'd be wing back though and Noel McGrath would be in midfield with Shane McGrath. He's not particularly pacy to be honest, and dunno what his defensive capacity is like. Shane McGrath is not captain material to be honest and just about making the team, fortunate that his replacement seems to be Woodlock.

And if Paudie O Brien went to midfield I think that Limerick would be better off. Not seen much of him, but saw him twice recently (once against Dublin) and have to say I was very impressed. Browne is a libaility though on current form.

Fireball07

Brendan Maher is pure class, but I'd still expect DOG and Browne, along with Ryan/Hickey to get a decent amount of ball.

Fireball07

Tipp team named:

Brendan Cummins; Paddy Stapleton, Paul Curran, Michael Cahill; Kieran Bergin, Conor O'Mahony, Padraic Maher; Brendan Maher, Shane McGrath; Jason Forde, Patrick Maher, John O'Brien; Shane Bourke, Seamus Callanan, Noel McGrath


No Lar, no Eoin Kelly, no Pa Bourke.....


Don't think it's the strongest possible Tipp team, still very formidable of course. Hopefully Callanan isn't on form....we do know how dangerous Forde can be....and all Maher & McGrath will certainly do damage up front. Brendan Maher is a class act too, and the backline looks very strong. I dunno, just have to hope we can pull something off.

Rightwing

Fireball07 wrote: »

Tipp team named:

Brendan Cummins; Paddy Stapleton, Paul Curran, Michael Cahill; Kieran Bergin, Conor O'Mahony, Padraic Maher; Brendan Maher, Shane McGrath; Jason Forde, Patrick Maher, John O'Brien; Shane Bourke, Seamus Callanan, Noel McGrath


No Lar, no Eoin Kelly, no Pa Bourke.....


Don't think it's the strongest possible Tipp team, still very formidable of course. Hopefully Callanan isn't on form....we do know how dangerous Forde can be....and all Maher & McGrath will certainly do damage up front. Brendan Maher is a class act too, and the backline looks very strong. I dunno, just have to hope we can pull something off.

Are they on subs bench?

I was going to back Tipp -5, not so sure now, that team doesn't look great. KK would wipe the floor with them again.

Fireball07

Rightwing wrote: »

Well I did say the footballers wouldn't go very far, and I don't think the hurlers will either.

If we they stay within 10 points I'd view it as a success.

The footballers could still have a good year, we don't know yet. I'd fancy their chances of beating anybody bar Tyrone and Derry.


And as for the hurlers, staying within 10 points would not be a success. It's really win or nothing at this stage......I mean we might still have a decent qualifier run but considering the talents of this team, how we did last year, and it's Allen's 2nd year in charge, building on a year with O'Grady....by now, we should be putting it up to Tipp.

Rightwing wrote: »

Are they on subs bench?

I was going to back Tipp -5, not so sure now, that team doesn't look great. KK would wipe the floor with them again.

I don't know, I assume they are.....Bourke isn't playing that well apparently, bit surprised Kelly's not there and Corbett could be injured, I'm not sure. Haven't seen a bench named anywhere yet.

Rightwing

Fireball07 wrote: »

The footballers could still have a good year, we don't know yet. I'd fancy their chances of beating anybody bar Tyrone and Derry.


And as for the hurlers, staying within 10 points would not be a success. It's really win or nothing at this stage......I mean we might still have a decent qualifier run but considering the talents of this team, how we did last year, and it's Allen's 2nd year in charge, building on a year with O'Grady....by now, we should be putting it up to Tipp.





I don't know, I assume they are.....Bourke isn't playing that well apparently, bit surprised Kelly's not there and Corbett could be injured, I'm not sure. Haven't seen a bench named anywhere yet.

Thanks.

Kelly is well past it imo.

I'm not a fan of Allen & his selectors. If O grady was in charge I'd be giving us every chance of beating Tipp.

shawnee

Fireball07 wrote: »

The footballers could still have a good year, we don't know yet. I'd fancy their chances of beating anybody bar Tyrone and Derry.


And as for the hurlers, staying within 10 points would not be a success. It's really win or nothing at this stage......I mean we might still have a decent qualifier run but considering the talents of this team, how we did last year, and it's Allen's 2nd year in charge, building on a year with O'Grady....by now, we should be putting it up to Tipp.





I don't know, I assume they are.....Bourke isn't playing that well apparently, bit surprised Kelly's not there and Corbett could be injured, I'm not sure. Haven't seen a bench named anywhere yet.

Seems a bit like last year when Tipp picked what didn't look like their best known players on the first team. We all know what happened when they introduced them with 20 minutes to go

Limerick need to play with intensity and pride from the start and take the game to Tipp. Form etc can go out the window when you do this and get the home crowd behind you.;)

glasagusban

Rightwing wrote: »

Thanks.

Kelly is well past it imo.

I'm not a fan of Allen & his selectors. If O grady was in charge I'd be giving us every chance of beating Tipp.

Allen massively improved the team last year. O'Grady failed massively to fill problem positions 3 and 6, persisting with O'Mahony and hickey when any fan could tell you they were not full backs. Allen immediately identified the need to fill these positions and foun players to do so. Allen also has limerick playing a far better style of hurling for the players we have than the short passing game O'Grady imposed.

Rightwing

glasagusban wrote: »

Allen massively improved the team last year. O'Grady failed massively to fill problem positions 3 and 6, persisting with O'Mahony and hickey when any fan could tell you they were not full backs. Allen immediately identified the need to fill these positions and foun players to do so. Allen also has limerick playing a far better style of hurling for the players we have than the short passing game O'Grady imposed.

Allen needs to win a proper match.

Let's look at his record:

2 division playoffs: 2 losses.
No win in munster, 1 q/f loss.

glasagusban

Rightwing wrote: »

Allen needs to win a proper match.

Let's look at his record:

2 division playoffs: 2 losses.
No win in munster, 1 q/f loss.

What did O'Grady win?

Rightwing

glasagusban wrote: »

What did O'Grady win?

O Grady won the league but they changed the rules. He also picked the team up of the floor after McCarthy, a very solid foundation. Was competitive in the championship.

jordainius

Rightwing wrote: »

O Grady won the league but they changed the rules. He also picked the team up of the floor after McCarthy, a very solid foundation. Was competitive in the championship.

O'Grady won a relatively easy D2, twice beating a Clare side who Ger O'Loughlin failed to get the best from in 2011. In 2012 D2 was a much stronger group than O'Grady won, and Clare were much improved under Davy Fitz, so John Allen's task in the league is a step above what Limerick faced in 2011. And we lost to Dublin this year but many people seem to have forgotten that Dublin have been a better team than us in recent years, and in 2011 they ruthlessly exposed the fact that DO'G failed to address our full back problem in the All-Ireland quarter final, they cut our disorganised full back line to shreds with three first half goals.

Allen has addressed the full back issue. As for picking the team up the floor- there aren't many managers who wouldn't have done that, 2011 was always going to be an improvement over 2010 for obvious reasons.

And we have been competetive under both Allen and O'Grady in championship hurling. 2011 and 2012 were near identical in championship terms; a defeat in Munster after a spirited performance in which we were the better team for long spells followed by a successful/impressive qualifier run before a defeat in the All-Ireland quarter final.

We were no more or no less competetive in 2011 than we were in 2012, Allen and O'Grady are pretty much neck and neck in terms of what they have gotten from Limerick.

Personally I hope it is Allen's final year, nothing against him but I'd like to see a Limerick man in charge again, it has been 5 years of Cork men now!

Rightwing

jordainius wrote: »

O'Grady won a relatively easy D2, twice beating a Clare side who Ger O'Loughlin failed to get the best from in 2011. In 2012 D2 was a much stronger group than O'Grady won, and Clare were much improved under Davy Fitz, so John Allen's task in the league is a step above what Limerick faced in 2011. And we lost to Dublin this year but many people seem to have forgotten that Dublin have been a better team than us in recent years, and in 2011 they ruthlessly exposed the fact that DO'G failed to address our full back problem in the All-Ireland quarter final, they cut our disorganised full back line to shreds with three first half goals.

Allen has addressed the full back issue. As for picking the team up the floor- there aren't many managers who wouldn't have done that, 2011 was always going to be an improvement over 2010 for obvious reasons.

And we have been competetive under both Allen and O'Grady in championship hurling. 2011 and 2012 were near identical in championship terms; a defeat in Munster after a spirited performance in which we were the better team for long spells followed by a successful/impressive qualifier run before a defeat in the All-Ireland quarter final.

We were no more or no less competetive in 2011 than we were in 2012, Allen and O'Grady are pretty much neck and neck in terms of what they have gotten from Limerick.

Personally I hope it is Allen's final year, nothing against him but I'd like to see a Limerick man in charge again, it has been 5 years of Cork men now!

Would Allen have beaten that Clare team? I doubt it very much.
Allen has failed to build on the progress made by O Grady. There is simply no disputing that fact.
Dublin were there for the taking in the div 2 final this year, and he was found wanting,,,,,again.

Mountainlad

Personally I think O'Grady is as cute as they come. Came into the Cork job in 2003 (admittedly did a very good job in fairness) on the back of the disaster that was 2002.

In 2008, after Offaly beat Limerick by 10 points, he proclaimed that he was very worried for Limerick hurling and could only see it sliding further due to a lack of underage success. Then Justin had the Croke Park horror show in 2009, followed by the calamity that was 2010. And who steps in to be the knight in shining armour? The same man who said they were going nowhere but down from a pretty low ebb anyway, just three years previous.

I like John Allen, think he's a very intelligent person. Think he has definitely gotten the raw deal drawing Tipp twice, especially as they now have Eamon O Shea back with them and will almost certainly be a better team than last year.

Rightwing

Mountainlad wrote: »

Personally I think O'Grady is as cute as they come. Came into the Cork job in 2003 (admittedly did a very good job in fairness) on the back of the disaster that was 2002.

In 2008, after Offaly beat Limerick by 10 points, he proclaimed that he was very worried for Limerick hurling and could only see it sliding further due to a lack of underage success. Then Justin had the Croke Park horror show in 2009, followed by the calamity that was 2010. And who steps in to be the knight in shining armour? The same man who said they were going nowhere but down from a pretty low ebb anyway, just three years previous.

I like John Allen, think he's a very intelligent person. Think he has definitely gotten the raw deal drawing Tipp twice, especially as they now have Eamon O Shea back with them and will almost certainly be a better team than last year.

I've nothing against him either, just think he's out of his depth. We beat Carlow by a goal in the league, that tells us all we need to know.