Will house prices drop anymore?

james finn · 20-03-2010 7:24pm

Amhran Nua wrote: »

The banks are lending if you have the deposit. If you haven't the deposit you should save until you have one to get used to the expense.

No, the banks have the house, all they have is debt until the last red cent is paid off. If they don't pay it all off, they lose the house. Also with interest rates rising soon, the amount they need to repay will be increasing, which would be less of an issue if they had saved enough of a deposit.

I'm afraid that's circular logic, based on the fallacy that mortgages are currently unavailable.

eh no i have my house not the banks, friends cant buy cause they cant get a loan so who is better off, ME

Benedict · 20-03-2010 7:30pm

One reason people can't get a loan is that the banks know that the loan is for an overpriced property. If they give a loan of 80% on a property which is overpriced, they know that they will not recoup their money in the event of a default. The banks have a vested interest in property so they won't tell you that though.

Would you give someone a loan of 300K to buy a property which will be worth 200K this time next year?

No. Because in the event of a default, you could kiss goodnight to your money.

Amhran Nua · 20-03-2010 7:34pm

james finn wrote: »

eh no i have my house not the banks, friends cant buy cause they cant get a loan so who is better off, ME

Once again, you don't have a house. You have a debt. Assuming you just didn't buy the house from your own pocket.

Benedict wrote: »

One reason people can't get a loan is that the banks know that the loan is for an overpriced property.

There are several posters in this forum that have gotten mortgage approval in the last few weeks.

james finn · 20-03-2010 7:39pm

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Once again, you don't have a house. You have a debt. Assuming you just didn't buy the house from your own pocket.

There are several posters in this forum that have gotten mortgage approval in the last few weeks.

dont buy a house then cause you wont own it, dont give out about people who cant buy a house cos if they could get a loan they wouldnt own it. whats your point,

im better off than my friends cos i have my house, thats my point, your trying to say im not

Amhran Nua · 20-03-2010 7:49pm

james finn wrote: »

im better off than my friends cos i have my house, thats my point, your trying to say im not

So tell us, what happens when you stop making payments to the bank, do you get to keep "your" house? You're renting it until you have it paid off, and the rent is the interest that you are paying. Which means your rent will be going up while everyone else's will be going down.

james finn · 20-03-2010 8:03pm

Amhran Nua wrote: »

So tell us, what happens when you stop making payments to the bank, do you get to keep "your" house? You're renting it until you have it paid off, and the rent is the interest that you are paying. Which means your rent will be going up while everyone else's will be going down.

so tell me what happens to people who wont buy a house because they have to pay it back,

you should post an add in anger asking people never to buy a home because they have to repay the banks.

people who cant get a loan are pissed off cos they cant get a home now, im not cos i got mine and im happy to have it so im lucky.

The_Conductor · 20-03-2010 8:08pm

Folks- calm down and think twice before hitting the post button.
Do not personalise posts- if you disagree with what someone posts- refute the post without attacking the person.

Shane

james finn · 20-03-2010 8:12pm

smccarrick wrote: »

Folks- calm down and think twice before hitting the post button.
Do not personalise posts- if you disagree with what someone posts- refute the post without attacking the person.

Shane

im one of the happy home owners and it seems to be a bit of a shock to some people that not all is bad ere in this country.

Amhran Nua · 20-03-2010 8:21pm

james finn wrote: »

so tell me what happens to people who wont buy a house because they have to pay it back,

Oh I didn't say not buying a house at all was a good idea. I said that you don't own your house.

james finn wrote: »

im not cos i got mine

So you've your mortgage paid off in full?

james finn · 20-03-2010 8:25pm

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Oh I didn't say not buying a house at all was a good idea. I said that you don't own your house.

So you've your mortgage paid off in full?

whats your problem with people who have a house and happy, does it upset you that much,

people like you never will cos your time is spent given out about bankers and when you get a chance to buy you wont, so whats your point, buy or never buy???????????????????

Amhran Nua · 20-03-2010 8:32pm

james finn wrote: »

whats your problem with people who have a house and happy, does it upset you that much

Not at all, I'm delighted you are satisfied with your situation. Comments like this however

james finn wrote: »

the people who didnt buy think they are smart but not really smart

would indicate that you are upset with people who didn't buy during the bubble. Why would that be?

AARRRRGH · 20-03-2010 8:34pm

james finn wrote: »

im one of the happy home owners and it seems to be a bit of a shock to some people that not all is bad ere in this country.

Me too. There are probably a hell of a lot of us. I bought mine in in the 90's and its all paid off.
I live in a mews at the back now whenever im in Ireland, as im hardly in the country with my job, so might as well get some rent for it. If i travel less with my job in future, which will happen when i get married this year, i'll move back in and stop renting it.

But i still hope house prices keep falling. Id like to buy a mansion for my retirement

james finn · 20-03-2010 8:37pm

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Not at all, I'm delighted you are satisfied with your situation. Comments like this however

would indicate that you are upset with people who didn't buy during the bubble. Why would that be?

show me the link were i said im upset with people who didnt buy, we dont have to make up lies ere just because we missed the boat do we.

james finn · 20-03-2010 8:42pm

AARRRRGH wrote: »

Me too. There are probably a hell of a lot of us. I bought mine in in the 90's and its all paid off.
I live in a mews at the back now whenever im in Ireland, as im hardly in the country with my job, so might as well get some rent for it. If i travel less with my job in future, which will happen when i get married this year, i'll move back in and stop renting it.

But i still hope house prices keep falling. Id like to buy a mansion for my retirement

house prices dropped bigtime in the 80s and many missed the boat cos they complain about how they get done by bankers, these are people who will never have a home or a loan and still give out about bankers

Amhran Nua · 20-03-2010 8:46pm

james finn wrote: »

just because we missed the boat do we.

This is like a time machine taking the thread back to 2005.

Plenty of people bought alone or as couples and now have tremendous cause to regret that decision. Bankruptcy, unemployment, seperation, children on the way while being stuck in a shoebox apartment, these are just a few of the unpleasant situations people are experiencing in large numbers at the moment. Obviously this isn't in reference to people who bought in the 90s or earlier, and have their mortgages paid off, fair play to those that have, although there are so many factors at play in that statement its not worth pursuing.

What it is in reference to is your continuous derogatory comments toward people who didn't buy during the boom period, such as "not really smart" or "missed the boat", which says a lot really. And the entire course of this extended sneer is underlined by the simple fact that your basic premise is wrong - banks are lending at the moment.

ei.sdraob · 20-03-2010 8:48pm

james finn wrote: »

im one of the happy home owners and it seems to be a bit of a shock to some people that not all is bad ere in this country.

i was a happy renter and saver

now im one of the "happy" house owners who paid 200K euro less for a house similar to the ones next door where the "happy" housedebt owners reside :P

i have a house and no debt, they have (well their bank has) a house and they also have debt

tell me who is better off?

saving and being prudent paid itself of

james finn · 20-03-2010 8:52pm

Amhran Nua wrote: »

This is like a time machine taking the thread back to 2005.

Plenty of people bought alone or as couples and now have tremendous cause to regret that decision. Bankruptcy, unemployment, seperation, children on the way while being stuck in a shoebox apartment, these are just a few of the unpleasant situations people are experiencing in large numbers at the moment. Obviously this isn't in reference to people who bought in the 90s or earlier, and have their mortgages paid off, fair play to those that have, although there are so many factors at play in that statement its not worth pursuing.

What it is in reference to is your continuous derogatory comments toward people who didn't buy during the boom period, such as "not really smart" or "missed the boat", which says a lot really. And the entire course of this extended sneer is underlined by the simple fact that your basic premise is wrong - banks are lending at the moment.

my point is they had a chance to buy in the good times, they cant buy now so who is better off, the person who has a home and happy or the people who complain about bankers till they die in a rented flat,

i see it everyday complain complain complain the bankers the bankers, get over it and buy a house

AARRRRGH · 20-03-2010 8:52pm

ei.sdraob wrote: »

i was a happy renter and saver

now im one of the "happy" house owners who paid 200K euro less for a house similar to the ones next door where the "happy" housedebt owners reside :P

i have a house and no debt, they have (well their bank has) a house and they also have debt

tell me who is better off?

saving and being prudent paid itself of

You should have waited a while

You might have thrown a lot of money down the toilet there. I suppose we'll know in a few years

james finn · 20-03-2010 8:56pm

ei.sdraob wrote: »

i was a happy renter and saver

now im one of the "happy" house owners who paid 200K euro less for a house similar to the ones next door where the "happy" housedebt owners reside :P

i have a house and no debt, they have (well their bank has) a house and they also have debt

tell me who is better off?

saving and being prudent paid itself of

you had a happy landlord paying his morgage, lets say 1.000euro a month, thats 12.000 a year, thats 60.000 euro in 5 years, HAPPY LANDLORD

Amhran Nua · 20-03-2010 8:57pm

james finn wrote: »

my point is

Your point is you thought you'd wander in and make yourself feel better for having overpaid for a house by sneering at those who didn't make the same mistake, and ignoring the reality that banks are lending at the moment when it is brought to your attention several times.

james finn wrote: »

i see it everyday complain complain complain the bankers the bankers, get over it and buy a house

In a hurry to sell are we?

james finn · 20-03-2010 8:58pm

i would rather pay 5 years 60.000 euro off my house than give dead money to a landlord 60.000 euro?

Amhran Nua · 20-03-2010 8:58pm

james finn wrote: »

you had a happy landlord paying his morgage, lets say 1.000euro a month, thats 12.000 a year, thats 60.000 euro in 5 years, HAPPY LANDLORD

Oddly enough rents were usually well below the interest (your rent) on mortgages during bubble years. So the landlord was probably subsidising his lifestyle.

AARRRRGH · 20-03-2010 9:01pm

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Your point is you thought you'd wander in and make yourself feel better for having overpaid for a house by sneering at those who didn't make the same mistake, and ignoring the reality that banks are lending at the moment when it is brought to your attention several times.

In a hurry to sell are we?

Do you know when or where he bought his house or how much he paid? If not how can you tell if he overpaid?

Amhran Nua · 20-03-2010 9:06pm

AARRRRGH wrote: »

Do you know when or where he bought his house or how much he paid? If not how can you tell if he overpaid?

If he didn't has only to say as much. If he didn't it would make the whole smart/not smart thing a bit mad, though, wouldn't you say? Plenty of people were just leaving higher education or starting off in lower paid positions as the bubble got started twelve odd years ago, that doesn't make them stupid, since there is no way they could have bought in the 90s like yourself.

Pittens · 20-03-2010 9:08pm

you had a happy landlord paying his morgage, lets say 1.000euro a month, thats 12.000 a year, thats 60.000 euro in 5 years, HAPPY LANDLORD

Well he is not so happy now if he is in debt. That the "rent is dead money" meme still continues in 2010 is hilarious, were it not tragic.

Just to set up my situation. Saved money, and will have enough at the end of this year or next to buy a cheap house in Ireland, if I choose. Pay small rent because I can share with people happily enough. I set that up because James Finn personalises the debate here all the time.

so. To be clear, I can afford to buy and could easily get a loan now. But I am still waiting.

Back to the claim that rent is dead money. The cost of a house in the last 5 years is really the difference between the cost of what the house cost 5 years ago, and what it will cost now, multiplied by the interest on the difference ( which would be 100% for a 40 year loan).

In that scenario Rent was not dead money. Paying money to the Bank is dead money.

AARRRRGH · 20-03-2010 9:08pm

Amhran Nua wrote: »

If he didn't has only to say as much. If he didn't it would make the whole smart/not smart thing a bit mad, though, wouldn't you say? Plenty of people were just leaving higher education as the bubble got started, that doesn't make them stupid, since there is no way they could have bought in the 90s like yourself.

So he didnt say, you dont know, so you just assumed for the sake of it and derided him for your assumptions.
Nice one.

Im not saying he didnt buy during the bubble but making assumptions like that just so you can pontificate is just childish.

The_Conductor · 20-03-2010 9:12pm

Guys- seriously- everyone- either quit personalising this debate- or take a holiday from the forum. If people are not in a position to be civil towards each other- perhaps this is not the right venue for you.

Regards,

SMcCarrick

ei.sdraob · 20-03-2010 9:14pm

Pittens wrote: »

Well he is not so happy now if he is in debt. That the "rent is dead money" meme still continues in 2010 is hilarious, were it not tragic.

tragic is understatement, this guy seems to have been transported from 2005

and 1000 euro a month rent! :O jebus even at the peak i didnt pay close to that much in rent

Amhran Nua · 20-03-2010 9:14pm

AARRRRGH wrote: »

So he didnt say, you dont know, so you just assumed for the sake of it and derided him for your assumptions.
Nice one.

So either he was raining derision on others for his own bad decision, or he was raining derision on others for not having been lucky enough to be born earlier, is that it?

AARRRRGH wrote: »

Im not saying he didnt buy during the bubble but making assumptions like that just so you can pontificate is just childish.

I guess some people don't like the sound of reality, which doesn't bother reality one way or the other.

London Irish · 20-03-2010 9:18pm

james finn wrote: »

my point is they had a chance to buy in the good times, they cant buy now so who is better off, the person who has a home and happy or the people who complain about bankers till they die in a rented flat,

i see it everyday complain complain complain the bankers the bankers, get over it and buy a house

Hmm, i think this is a troll, but I'll take the bait. You're missing the point by not realising all the choices....

A person who has a home and happy is *probably* better off than someone in a rented flat; I say this because I presume they are happy because their mortgage is small in relation to pay, or their mortgage is paid off.

Then there are those who have a home and are happy because they believe that they'll always be better off than someone who rents, even if they have a crippling mortgage. I won't pop their bubble. Everyone needs a straw to hang onto sometimes.

Then there are those who have a home and are unhappy. You may not believe that these people exist but these probably number in the 10s of thousands (I presume those going to MABS or begging the bank to work out their arrears are not happy). And I could make the argument that they are worse off than those in rented accommodation - because they are now stick with that debt for life and those in rented accommodation can, will and are buying for less and less.

I'm not too sure if there was ever any "good times" in Ireland during the boom years, considering the long-term hangover that is playing out in the economy.