Dublin Metrolink (just Metrolink posts here -see post #1 )

Sam Russell

CatInABox wrote: »

Someone finally did the grunt work and made a map that I've been way to lazy to do.

https://twitter.com/yimbydublin/status/1101621955936092165

Really brings home the ridiculousness of those arguments asking for a southwest metro, or that a southwest metro will reduce demand on the Green Line.

There are 704 properties in purple for the SW route, and more properties in Sandyford alone in the green part, not including the thousands of others.

That shows the SW line is not needed nearly as much as the upgrade to the GL, assuming the data is correct. We know that there is a lot of development planned for the GL route, not sure how much in the SW area.

CatInABox

Sam Russell wrote: »

There are 704 properties in purple for the SW route, and more properties in Sandyford alone in the green part, not including the thousands of others.

That shows the SW line is not needed nearly as much as the upgrade to the GL, assuming the data is correct. We know that there is a lot of development planned for the GL route, not sure how much in the SW area.

There is an element of "if you build it, they will come" about all this, i.e. all that development along the green line is happening because the Green Line is there, and if the Metrolink was magically built all the SW corridor tomorrow, we'd see a spike in development along there similar to what we're seeing along the Green Line.

There just isn't as many green and brown field sites along that south west route though, they're pretty much finished as residential areas. Sure, there'll still be development out there, but at no where near the scale that's possible along the length of the green line, and no where near the scale that's needed for Dublin to tackle the housing crisis.

As to the accuracy, I believe it's a manual trawl through the applications for those areas:

Sources are searches of DCC/DLRCC/ABP planning documents.
Kilternan-Glenamuck is a ? because I couldn't find the quantity of units, but there will be large-scale development here.

Marcusm

Surely it is the size of the housing stock not the planned increase which would be used to evaluate the usefulness of a chosen route?

CatInABox

Marcusm wrote: »

Surely it is the size of the housing stock not the planned increase which would be used to evaluate the usefulness of a chosen route?

In that case, the green line wins there too.

an_fathach

It is understandable that the SW would also want one.

https://www.arcgis.com/home/webmap/viewer.html?webmap=016a1af631734f38a8c469ae7e5e93f8

jd

Two pieces in the IT today. One a colour piece by Rosita Boland about College Gate

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/homes-and-property/apartment-dwellers-awaiting-demolition-you-can-t-help-but-feel-trapped-1.3807113

Residents at the apartment block received letters in March last year from Transport Infrastructure Ireland, which clearly indicated that the future of their homes was uncertain. Explaining the reasons for the proposed route, Transport Infrastructure Ireland stated: “This is the route that we feel offers the best solution in terms of maximising the long-term benefit to the city, while minimising the overall negative impact on communities in the shorter term, particularly during construction.”

For the owner-occupiers and tenants of College Gate, there is no way that any “overall negative impact” could be minimised, should the proposed MetroLink route result in the disappearance of their homes. They are campaigning to try and save their homes.

These are some of the stories of the people who live there..

And an opinion piece by McWilliams touches on Metrolink

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/david-mcwilliams-contented-classes-could-be-biggest-threat-to-irish-economy-1.3810055

‘Contented classes’ could be biggest threat to Irish economy

..
What if the most significant threat to Irish prosperity is much closer to home, hidden in plain sight? Could the real menace to Ireland come from what could be called the “contented class”, not from those who want to shake things up?

Consider those people who have done well over the past few decades as the economy has grown. The contented class is a class that is prepared – even though they don’t see it this way – to fight tooth and nail to preserve the privileges they and their families enjoy in the property market, education and the professions.
..

Local opposition to major infrastructural initiatives – for example Dublin’s MetroLink, whose southern component has unofficially been shelved because of the disruption its construction would cause to the operation of the Luas Green Line in Ranelagh and other suburbs – retards economic growth and threaten Ireland’s future.

At the vanguard of this threat are some of the people who have benefited most from the economic surge. The contented class, having secured their gains, are pulling up the drawbridge.
..
As we watch opposition to the building of the Metro in south Dublin, opposition to new residential developments, opposition to road building, opposition to social housing, opposition to almost any communal initiative that will help the majority in the medium term but may inconvenience a vocal minority, we are witnessing threats to Irish prosperity
..

Busman Paddy Lasty

CatInABox wrote: »

In that case, the green line wins there too.

And the business case as well. Plenty of well paying jobs already exist in Sandyford and Cherrywood. Microsoft expanded last year.

Far more scope for new taxpayers on MetroLink than crayon routes.

Idbatterim

Fair play to that Dublin yimby effort. No mention of the plan there though for six hundred apartments on Dundrum old shopping center site. Hundreds will be built on Jesuit land in Milltown close to a luas stop too , think land is in process of being sold. There are loads of other small scale developments being built or planned , but numbers probably to low to bother putting on that map...

Look a route to sw while great. Would Hoover up nothing like the traffic compared to the Dublin metro and green line upgrade. It’s not going to happen for decades and it’s not like it’s a two billion project and green line upgrade is two billion and we have a choice to make. It’s actually just off topic in my opinion... no doubt if this pipe dean got traction, it will be used to shelve or dilute bus connects in that area. That isn’t a pipe dream , can be delivered far quicker and far cheaper !!!

How big is the site required in sq m roughly that they need to build this Tara street stop?

CatInABox

an_fathach wrote: »

It is understandable that the SW would also want one.

https://www.arcgis.com/home/webmap/viewer.html?webmap=016a1af631734f38a8c469ae7e5e93f8

Totally understandable, and I'd even go so far as to say it's vital.... for a Metro2 to go out there.

This time around, there's just too many pluses in the Green Line upgrade column to ignore.

Rulmeq

More emotive inflammatory language from the Irish Times

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/homes-and-property/apartment-dwellers-awaiting-demolition-you-can-t-help-but-feel-trapped-1.3807113

100 properties face wrecking ball, awaiting demolition, trapped.

jd

There is another (not entirely clear) article in the Irish Times


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/metrolink-uncertainty-puts-gaa-club-plans-in-jeopardy-1.3811552?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

MetroLink uncertainty puts GAA club plans in jeopardy
Ballymun Kickhams’ designated site may by needed as depot for rail project




The club had been aware the rail line was likely to run under the Ballymun site, but this was not expected to affect the above-ground development. However it was recently indicated its move was on hold pending a reassessment of the needs of the metro at the site.

prunudo

Really getting a pain in my ar$e with the Irish times and their anti metro articles.

an_fathach

jvan wrote: »

Really getting a pain in my ar$e with the Irish times and their anti metro articles.

Its Ireland's fake news paper.

prunudo

an_fathach wrote: »

Its Ireland's fake news paper.

Whether it is or isn't doesn't matter, an awful lot of people wil believe it as fact.

marno21

There must be some demand for cigarettes in the NTA & TII offices at the minute, I can't understand how anyone could not be at their wits end having to respond to this repeated nonsense.

"As part of the regeneration of the suburb, Dublin City Council had identified a site to the west of the main road in Ballymun, south of Ikea and the M50, to bring the club into the community."

Since when is the Metro planned to route to the west of the main route through Ballymun?

jd

A TBM could be launched from west of the Ballymun Road, something like this. That would mean an excavation depot would be there.



The TBM launched north of the airport would intersect it a bit down the Ballymun road. It woudn't be only launch site option

marno21

By the way, for those you who like facts and were head scratching at McDowell's "€170m spend to date", the total spend to date on Metrolink has been €9m.

https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2019-02-28a.539

Sam Russell

marno21 wrote: »

By the way, for those you who like facts and were head scratching at McDowell's "€170m spend to date", the total spend to date on Metrolink has been €9m.

https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2019-02-28a.539

That answer says nothing about the GL south of Charlemont - only that the NTA are preparing a preferred route.

strandroad

Apologies because I'm sure the answer is somewhere up thread already, but could someone in the know help me: where exactly would the current Broombridge Luas line terminate on the southside, if Metrolink upgrade takes over the tracks from Charlemont to Sandyford?

salmocab

strandroad wrote: »

Apologies because I'm sure the answer is somewhere up thread already, but could someone in the know help me: where exactly would the current Broombridge Luas line terminate on the southside, if Metrolink upgrade takes over the tracks from Charlemont to Sandyford?

Well it’s up the in the air but in your scenario it’s Charlemont

Dats me

marno21 wrote: »

By the way, for those you who like facts and were head scratching at McDowell's "€170m spend to date", the total spend to date on Metrolink has been €9m.

https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2019-02-28a.539

Both Clare Daly and Róisín Shorthall's questions there were very encouraging.


He does specifically address Green Line Capacity which is what's needed, I'm sure there are some very intelligent people at Jacob's working on it maybe there'll be something there we hadn't even though of that could have been misinterpreted as "cancelling" the Southside bit

marno21

Sam Russell wrote: »

That answer says nothing about the GL south of Charlemont - only that the NTA are preparing a preferred route.

Yes, Ross has repeatedly stated he wouldn't be giving away information on the revised route until its published by the NTA - it's not his job.

I was simply correcting the claim by Michael McDowell that Metrolink has cost €170m to date - it's actually €9m.

Stephen Strange

marno21 wrote: »

Yes, Ross has repeatedly stated he wouldn't be giving away information on the revised route until its published by the NTA - it's not his job.

I was simply correcting the claim by Michael McDowell that Metrolink has cost €170m to date - it's actually €9m.

I'm assuming that to bolster his figures and make them more shocking, he was including the estimated €150m that was spent on the scrapped MN plan.

marno21

Stephen Strange wrote: »

I'm assuming that to bolster his figures and make them more shocking, he was including the estimated €150m that was spent on the scrapped MN plan.

It would appear so, but that kind of gerrymandering can be used to inflate any figure to your needs.

He uses the usual NIMBY techniques of doubling any negative figure and halving any positive figure, along with longer times for inconveniences.

murphaph

dubhthach wrote: »

Having recently (well last October) used the Amsterdam Noord-Zuidlijn metro line I can say that it was a great service and really helped getting around Amsterdam, I doubt thought ye have an opinion piece in SBP talking about how much it ran over budget (40%) and that it took 16 years to complete! I remember been in Amsterdam with Dutch colleague back in 2012 and at that time they thought it was mad how long it was going on (it took another 6 years to finish!).

Only 16 years? If we moved at that pace we'd have had Dart Underground in 1994.

BonnieSituation

Well this is great...

https://www.thejournal.ie/cycling-quietway-for-dublins-southside-revived-after-metrolink-route-scrapped-4515123-Mar2019/?amp=1

It is important that the southside has some cycleways now that Metrolink is cancelled. I mean, really...

marno21

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Well this is great...

https://www.thejournal.ie/cycling-quietway-for-dublins-southside-revived-after-metrolink-route-scrapped-4515123-Mar2019/?amp=1

It is important that the southside has some cycleways now that Metrolink is cancelled. I mean, really...

It's a waste of time any of this stuff until Metrolink's revised route is confirmed.

MetroLinker

Is there any update on the release of the new information?

The last I read was 'early March' so that would potentially be this week.

CatInABox

MetroLinker wrote: »

Is there any update on the release of the new information?

The last I read was 'early March' so that would potentially be this week.

That changed to late March recently, I believe Shane Ross revealed that one

cgcsb

Closing Dunville to cars was never going to prevent a pedestrian/cyclist overpass though, was it?