Zipp 404 special edition V Mavic Carbonne SL

jag con

Right so thanks for all the advice i think i should sty away from the Zipps as ive heard a few things about them and as you guys say they are really for racing only

so it looks like it is between these two

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=40319

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/p/cycle/7/Mavic_Cosmic_Carbone_SL_Clincher_Wheelset/5360042824/

hmm i have some thinking to do

Con

Raam

Those Reynolds are real purdy.

Lumen

Raam wrote: »

Those Reynolds are real purdy.

Holiday wheels, definitely.

Planet X

Is that the new Kryptonite New York hanging from the saddle rails or what?

Raam

At a similar price point we also have
FSA RD 488
Pro-Lite Gavia
Token T50 Tubs

Raam

Planet X wrote: »

Is that the new Kryptonite New York hanging from the saddle rails or what?

Looks like a 3T Doric, or a variant.

Lumen

Planet X wrote: »

Is that the new Kryptonite New York hanging from the saddle rails or what?

Looks like a KCNC Ti Pro seatpost. Typical weightweenie issue.

@jag_con, have a read of the reviews on roadbikereview.com if you haven't already.

"Carbon rims are not for everyone" seems a fairly consistent theme w.r.t braking performance, especially in the wet.

So it just comes down to all weather practicality* of the alloy braking surface vs lightweight/bling of the carbon.

If you end up hating either I'm sure you'll be able to offload them, as both Reynolds and Mavic are well respected brands.

* notwithstanding the fact that Quigs has previously reported that his Cosmics fill up with water when it rains. :pac:

Lumen

Raam wrote: »

At a similar price point we also have
FSA RD 488
Pro-Lite Gavia
Token T50 Tubs

The Tokens and FSAs are tubulars, and those Pro-lites weigh over 2.5kg a set. :eek:

The Tokens do look good value though, except that I think they use Gigantex rims (same rim as Planet-X 50s but much more expensive).

uberwolf

jag con wrote: »

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=40319

If CRC had a wish list function, those would now be added. wow.

NM - they do. and added.

sy

These look pretty nice to me

uberwolf

sy wrote: »

These look pretty nice to me

keen price, and allow ordinary brake pads be used.

sy

Also coloured nipples & hubs for $20 extra, as Lumen implied earlier

tribesman

Anyone got any opinions on the SRAM S60? Seems to be a good compromise with the toroidal shape of the zipps, an alu braking surface, and a cheaper price than the 404. Anyone know if they are any more durable than the zipp? How about maintenance?

Sorry to slightly hijack the thread but unless I'm missing something these seem like a good option for the OP.

Lumen

tribesman wrote: »

Anyone got any opinions on the SRAM S60? Seems to be a good compromise with the toroidal shape of the zipps, an alu braking surface, and a cheaper price than the 404. Anyone know if they are any more durable than the zipp? How about maintenance?

Sorry to slightly hijack the thread but unless I'm missing something these seem like a good option for the OP.

I think they are Zipps.

Discussion here.

A quick scan of that indicates that they're rebadged Flashpoints, which are made by Zipp using a simpler process.

60mm is pretty deep, might be a bit of a handful. And they're 1850g, but you get the toroidal rim shape which might make you 0.2kph faster or whatever.

SRAM have other wheels.

Raam

They are also hideous.

blorg

SRAM own Zipp and their wheels are as Lumen says rebadged Flashpoints. Basically the same shape but without the dimples and a hell of a lot heavier. Personally I like the decals.

Lumen

blorg wrote: »

Personally I like the decals.

I'd be trying to get the SRAM logos lined up perfectly at every stop. That's got to add some time to the average sportive.

kerryscoob

jag con wrote: »

Right so thanks for all the advice i think i should sty away from the Zipps as ive heard a few things about them and as you guys say they are really for racing only

so it looks like it is between these two

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=40319

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/p/cycle/7/Mavic_Cosmic_Carbone_SL_Clincher_Wheelset/5360042824/

hmm i have some thinking to do

Con

Kilgrews in Cork have the Cosmic cheaper.

Raam

Lumen wrote: »

I'd be trying to get the SRAM logos lined up perfectly at every stop. That's got to add some time to the average sportive.

Don't underestimate the importance of this. Imagine how stupid you would look in pictures with the decals so obviously out of sync with each other. At least with less obvious decals the situation isn't as drastic.

Lumen

Hub review. Not so relevant to buying factory wheels, but it does include the DT240 which is a very common OEM choice for fancy wheels.

And it has some nice hub porn, like this:

Raam

Lumen wrote: »

Holiday wheels, definitely.

Why do you think that?

Lumen

Lumen wrote: »

Holiday wheels, definitely.

Raam wrote: »

Why do you think that?

Because when I'm on my holidays I want deep section carbon clinchers.

Parking the bike next to my sun lounger will also help explain my farmers cyclists tan.

Seriously, when you Competitive Cyclist selling CCUs on the basis that they don't fill up with water, you have to be sceptical about the sanity of using deep section wheels in all weather (and then there's the brake squeal and rim wear).

CompetitiveCyclist wrote:

..like Lightweight, the Ultimate's tire bed is smooth, no holes. This allows the carbon bed to be both lighter and stronger. It also means the rim is totally sealed from the elements. No water can be forced inside the rim, even on the wettest days

Raam

I gotta say, I quite like the Reynolds Assaults. I had my eye on white decal Carbones for ages, but now I'm changing my mind.

As for filling up with water... honestly, is it really an issue or does just some water accumulate inside?

blorg

To be honest I like the feel of the Zipps so much I am half-considering a deep section clincher for non-race/dodgy race/spare use.

Thing is I am not sure what it is about the Zipps as they are (1) aero (2) light (3) tubular.

So if I got a heavier deep section clincher, would I be losing out a lot compared to the Zipps. I already have a selection of lightweight (1,350-1,500g) clinchers, at least some of which are not horribly non-aero.

Does anyone (Quigs?) have an opinion on that?

To be honest this is fantasy shopping at this stage but I would be interested in anyone who has a comparison between say tubular Zipps, clincher Zipps and Mavic Cosmic Carbone clinchers.

Lumen

Raam wrote: »

As for filling up with water... honestly, is it really an issue or does just some water accumulate inside?

The Mavic Carbones SLs come with drainage holes in the fairing, according to one report I read. So it must be an issue to some extent.

niceonetom

The more this thread progresses the less sure I am about anything...

Lumen wrote: »

The Mavic Carbones SLs come with drainage holes in the fairing, according to one report I read. So it must be an issue to some extent.

Aren't those drainage hole as much the cause of the problem as the solution to the problem though? You know, like beer?

Lumen

niceonetom wrote: »

The more this thread progresses the less sure I am about anything...

Almost all other bicycle components either have a defined service life (chains, cassettes etc) or last almost indefinitely.

Buying fancy wheels is therefore not like buying a fancy frame that will just get slightly tattier over the years. You can spend €1000 or so on a lovely frame that is as light, stiff, and compliant as you will ever want or need.

Wheels wear out. Even with a fairly traditional wheel the bearings go, the braking surface gets worn down, the nipples can seize.

Consequently, it is possible to fill the internet with discussion about which wheel to buy, because there is no right answer. Cheap, light, strong, aero, whatever, wheels are a collection of consumable parts.

niceonetom

Given that wheels are so consumable, and that no one pair is suitable for all occasions, and that price and fragility are strongly correlated, I'm feeling better and better about my 32 spokers...

It's all so perverse. I am never as likely to hit a pothole at 40kph+ without any time to jump or swerve as I am while racing, yet that is when I'm supposed to be on my best wheels... (if I had best wheels that is).

Lumen

niceonetom wrote: »

I am never as likely to hit a pothole at 40kph+ without any time to jump or swerve as I am while racing

...or crash.

niceonetom

Lumen wrote: »

...or crash.

yeah! I can't imagine you're exactly dying to bring your new ardennes to meet the A4s...