Waterford/Rosslare Strand Railway reaches the buffer stops (again)!

topnotch

The EU money is not as easy to get hold of as people think. Look at dell in Limerick, they only ended up claiming a fraction of the money for retraining staff that they potentially could have. Due primarily to red tape.

topnotch

As regards the MK3, paint them green and silver quick and bring them back into service:pac:. I have to say i love their current livery, but have heard it said by non rail enthusiasts so many times "those orange yokes" just because the service was so Shi*e at the time. They are mentally scarred by the colour:P.

foggy_lad

those are for scrap JD and well you know it:) irish rail is done with all those nasty orange noisy carriages that required a locomotive and a train guard and other staff if a DVT was not being used, too expensive in todays climate

these have all been lying idle so long now that they will never be able to be used again! there is no point raking over it though think of the locoless future and move on:)

schemingbohemia

purplepanda wrote: »

I was under the impression from discussions a while back on the Facebook campaign page that EU funding was potentially available for the line!

So it's conditional on freight traffic running?

Therefore I'm assuming that the WRC has had actuualy had no grants from the EU transport budget & the Government / taxpayers have paid the complete costs of the project?

Other parts of the national railway network certainly have had EU funding, there's enough signs around the regional stations telling us so, so it appears very strange that one rail line is the execption to the rule!

Or maybe IE & / or the government transport department couldn't be bloody bothered to fill out a claim form????

EU funding is very rarely 100% (mostly a lot less than 50%) so there would have to be Exchequer funding also which couldn't be justified to keep this line open. Plus the EU also like things like proper CBAs which this wouldn't have so wouldn't get the funding anyway.

dowlingm

JD - maybe, if you turned them into Class 150s. Locohaul isn't much use on a 40mph frequent stop service. (We could turn the rest into 1500VDC class 318s when the Dept of Finance refuses cash for new EMUs)

steamengine

save the rail wrote: »

Dont get me wrong any help is appreciated including letters, forum threads ect. I dont dont like the sarky remarks being made against the campaigners, they did everything they could and are still doing it, it was a tough battle and to get the result they did is great news because now they can get someone who is interested in running a decent service.

Assuming you are closely connected with the campaign, would you consider it beneficial to start a second thread dealing with the issue from here on in ? Just an idea !

Judgement Day

dowlingm wrote: »

JD - maybe, if you turned them into Class 150s. Locohaul isn't much use on a 40mph frequent stop service. (We could turn the rest into 1500VDC class 318s when the Dept of Finance refuses cash for new EMUs)

Well they could be put onto routes such as Connolly/Rosslare where the 22000s are inadequate for the level of traffic and the 22000s thus released used on the Sth.Wexford. The point is that the MkIIIs have 20-30 years life left in them if overhauled and somebody should be jailed for their premature demise - Lynch, Fearn and Dempsey being good candidates. Every cent those useless bastards cost us leads to more people lying on hospital trollies, ward closures, removal of special needs assistants etc.etc. When are people going to wake up?

Judgement Day

steamengine wrote: »

Assuming you are closely connected with the campaign, would you consider it beneficial to start a second thread dealing with the issue from here on in ? Just an idea !

Good idea, and leave 'my' thread for people to post sarky pictures and bitch about fossils and chicken dinners. What about it Tanya?

save the rail

Judgement Day wrote: »

Good idea, and leave 'my' thread for people to post sarky pictures and bitch about fossils and chicken dinners. What about it Tanya?

Excellent Idea, Goodbye David Parks aka JD

Lenny Lovett

Judgement Day wrote: »

Well they could be put onto routes such as Connolly/Rosslare where the 22000s are inadequate for the level of traffic and the 22000s thus released used on the Sth.Wexford. The point is that the MkIIIs have 20-30 years life left in them if overhauled and somebody should be jailed for their premature demise - Lynch, Fearn and Dempsey being good candidates. Every cent those useless bastards cost us leads to more people lying on hospital trollies, ward closures, removal of special needs assistants etc.etc. When are people going to wake up?

There's a load of the MKIIIs parked up behind Connoly Stn(Behind the Point) as well. It seems a shame to just leave them to rust. Can they not be sold off and funds raised used usefully?

foggy_lad

Lenny Lovett wrote: »

There's a load of the MKIIIs parked up behind Connoly Stn(Behind the Point) as well. It seems a shame to just leave them to rust. Can they not be sold off and funds raised used usefully?

they could be used as sea wall defences along the wexford line to stop the railway being washed away!

Judgement Day

save the rail wrote: »

Excellent Idea, Goodbye David Parks aka JD

Don't depend on it.

topnotch

Your just jelous jd because you didn't get to print your own t-shirts and start a campaign of your own.
http://toonboy.tumblr.com/post/838438101/silly-cartoon-chicken-t-shirt-fat-chicken-cartoon-t

dermo88

Lads lads.....put the handbags down. Its not the George.

Reinstating the Mark III fleet is not going to happen, and there are two key mitigating factors against them, even when they were replaced.

But then I read that the new 22000 weighs 63 tonnes. PER COACH????

Jesus......its as heavy as a 121 class loco. I'd expect and accept 53 tonnes at the very most even with all the extra air conditioning, steel bodyshell, and other extras thrown in compared to previous builds of Irish DMU, but 63 tonnes....

Does'nt seem to match, and almost immediately, one asks if Iarnrod Eireann were (yet again) sold a lemon at our expense, and "Seouled" their Souls on Rotem's corporate entertainment expense account.

Even Irelands old inefficient heavy 201 with guards van begin to look a bit better with that kind of weight. After all - lets look.

6 piece 22000 weighs in at 378 tonnes
6 piece Mk III weighs in at 362 tonnes (excluding 201 Class loco and EGV)

6 piece 22000 has 2155 Kw of power
6 piece Mk 3 has 2385 Kw of power

5.7 kW /tonne vs 6.6 KW / tonne

It does seem a shame to let an excellent vehicle like the Mark III rust before its time. I mean, its got a good 15 to 20 years of life left in it, if its maintained well. The costs of refurbishing each coach, and fitting it out for Push/Pull working, as I recall were estimated by IE to be over 1/2 Million Euro per coach, which based on comparable UK figures seems wildly inflated. I'd say 300,000 at most is closer to the mark, and that includes a full internal refurb to bring them up to Mk IV, 22K standards.

Even 5 or 6 sets employed on the likes of Dublin-Galway, Dublin-Tralee (direct), Dublin-Westport would be adequate. The problem with IE was an obsession with having

"The youngest fleet in Europe"

Old is not bad, once its maintained and looks good. The Mark III's....well, Ireland will be hard pressed to find anything as good again.

They are however, overspecced for the Dublin-Rosslare, thats a commuter, regional and mock Intercity rolled into one. The problem with Dublin-Rosslare is that it pretends to be all things to all people and ends up being none of them.

Judgement Day

According to this post: http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=67885756&postcount=15 on the CR_P thread September 18th is the closure date. That's a negative enough item for this thread. Looks like I will be getting out my screwdriver for that sign at Wellington Bridge after all. The staff instruments have probably already been flogged to the Fitzpatrick's Grand Central Hotel in Chicago.

topnotch

You'd want to be careful there JD the save the rail campaign have links to the 3rd reich.
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=1292468&fbid=1461554819602&op=6&o=global&view=global&subj=367387502018&id=1255405424

lord lucan

topnotch wrote: »

You'd want to be careful there JD the save the rail campaign have links to the 3rd reich.
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=1292468&fbid=1461554819602&op=6&o=global&view=global&subj=367387502018&id=1255405424

It'd be more impressive if it was orange & black!:pac:

foggy_lad

dermo88 wrote: »

But then I read that the new 22000 weighs 63 tonnes. PER COACH????

Jesus......its as heavy as a 121 class loco. I'd expect and accept 53 tonnes at the very most even with all the extra air conditioning, steel bodyshell, and other extras thrown in compared to previous builds of Irish DMU, but 63 tonnes....

Does'nt seem to match, and almost immediately, one asks if Iarnrod Eireann were (yet again) sold a lemon at our expense, and "Seouled" their Souls on Rotem's corporate entertainment expense account.

Even Irelands old inefficient heavy 201 with guards van begin to look a bit better with that kind of weight. After all - lets look.

6 piece 22000 weighs in at 378 tonnes
6 piece Mk III weighs in at 362 tonnes (excluding 201 Class loco and EGV)

6 piece 22000 has 2155 Kw of power
6 piece Mk 3 has 2385 Kw of power no power without loco and generator van

5.7 kW /tonne vs 6.6 KW / tonne

can you recalculate taking the weight of the locomotive and generator van into account for the mark3 set.

did it myself and it works out much closer to 4.6 KW/tonne for the mark3's with 201 and generator van!

dowlingm

+1 foggy lad and there's also the small matter of distributed weight and more powered axles. Well, when all the engines are serviceable anyway...

Edit: a class 150 is just short of 36 tonnes according to Mr Wiki (for whatever that's worth).

foggy_lad

time i think for the old reliables to accept that the 22000 DMU units are a great improvement except for the awful blue polkadot colour scheme!

they are more reliable
more servicable
more in line with a modern railway syatem as well as
more powerfull
easier on rails and
much cheaper on staffing resources, they are also
much more comfortable and
less noisy and so far any i have been on have had
excellent airconditioning

but there are a few bugs in the toilet smoke detectors which i would have suspicions have been sabotaged by maintenance staff to make the shiny new trains look bad compared to their much adored clunky mark3 fossills.

topnotch

Foggy what have you been smoking in the jax.
More reliable and serviceable rubbish. Come back in another 10 years and they'll be in bits. In forty years time they'll have been replaced three times over.
More powerful no sorry there not.
More in line with a modern railway yeah terrific plastic fantastic.:rolleyes:
How can they be less noisy if there's an engine up ur bum.:P
More comfortable suspension yes seats no.
Excellent airconditioning ok
Easier on the rails yea
Cheaper on staffing resources, they'll blow the money they save on something stupid so what's the point.

dermo88

Correction to my previous post

6 piece 22000 has 2155 Kw of power
6 piece Mk 3 has 2385 Kw of power and also add two non passenger carrying vehicles to the consist, (Locomotive and Gen)

6 x 63 = 378 tonnes. But it has 6 powered axles spread out.
6 x 35 = 210 tonnes + 112 tonnes + 40 tonnes = 362 tonnes (Loco hauled). Also 6 powered axles, but 14 unpowered.

The operating doctrine has changed since also. The whole idea behind locomotive haulage was that it worked passengers in the day, and freights at night, which was fine. Utilisation of the GM locomotive fleet was very high.

Once its 6 coaches or less, the economics come down on the side of DMU's. But there was undue haste in removing the Mark III fleet from service, especially as the 201 class locos are only 16 years old, which is middle aged by the standards of a Diesel.

shamwari

Hamndegger wrote: »

Creating a profile to have a few cheap unfunny digs at people and to impress the "banned"; fair play to you; fair play:rolleyes:

Yep. There's two things that always keep coming back no matter what. One is a bad penny, and the other is a "banned" troll.

Our man in Havana

Irish Rail have announced 18th Sept as last day they will run the service.

The IRRS will get their chicken dinners after all.

topnotch

I dare say, which banned troll am i supposed to be.:pac:

topnotch

It's going to be some session.:D
Hoo-ray, the harbour view hotel is saved.

Transportuser09

Could we not leave the IRRS out of this, it's not their fault. It's IÉ's doing, perhaps the NTA, but certainly not the IRRS. Most of us that can understand plain English can work out the nature of the Irish Railway Record Society by reading it's name. And to be honest continually re-registering under different usernames to make unjustified swipes at a group is just sad. Surely there's better ways to fill time, like, I don't know, painting for instance.

-Chris-

@topnotch - please post constructively or don't post at all. Most of your posts so far in this thread have been "jokes".

topnotch

Okay

foggy_lad

http://irishrail.ie/news_centre/news.asp?action=view&news_id=900

General News

Waterford to Rosslare line - service termination and bus replacement details by Corporate Communications

Waterford to Rosslare Europort line rail services will continue operating up to and including Saturday 18th September.

From Monday 20th September, rail services will be terminated, and customers can avail of the new Bus Éireann schedule operating from that date – full timetable details below.

Existing rail season tickets will be accepted on bus services, and fares on the Bus Éireann services will replicate existing rail fares.

Iarnród Éireann and Bus Éireann thank customers for their cooperation with these arrangements.
Please click here for the Bus Éireann Timetable

http://www.irishrail.ie/upload/370.pdf

the game is up for the rasslare waterford line now.