Sleeping with your female friends

BumbleB

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

Whats normal and weird in a social context is to a large extent subjective.

The above dialogue is an example of a man who has his reality dicatated to him. Part of your reality is what you consider normal.

If a woman told me she thinks there is something wrong with me, Id say I think its weird you think a man liking sex and finding a woman attractive is wrong. IE. Dictate the things in life which are subjective to my own beliefs and not have them dictated by someone else to me.

Oh I get this bit, me Tarzan you Jane .

mikom

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

Whats normal and weird in a social context is to a large extent subjective.

The above dialogue is an example of a man who has his reality dicatated to him. Part of your reality is what you consider normal.

If a woman told me she thinks there is something wrong with me, Id say I think its weird you think a man liking sex and finding a woman attractive is wrong. IE. Dictate the things in life which are subjective to my own beliefs and not have them dictated by someone else to me.

Now to see how much a load of bollox this is..... simply change the word woman for the word child.

If a child told me she thinks there is something wrong with me, Id say I think its weird you think a man liking sex and finding a child attractive is wrong. IE. Dictate the things in life which are subjective to my own beliefs and not have them dictated by someone else to me.

It's not all about your own beliefs.

liah

Dude.. they're your friends. They're supposed to be able to feel safe around you, to be able to trust and confide in you. If a mate of mine turned around and said something like that to me I'd be well creeped out and I wouldn't really be able to look at him as a mate again knowing he was thinking stuff like that. Probably think of him as a complete slimeball who's only my friend because he wants to get in my pants.

Would completely make me uneasy and shoot down any trust both parties had worked to build.

Maybe if it was a girl with whom you'd tried a relationship with in the past that had good sexual chemistry but ultimately failed. Or a fantastic one night stand. Or someone you really don't know that well. But not a girl you've been friends with for years with whom you've no sexual/relationship history and who most likely sees you as a brother type figure. That's just all kinds of wrong.

Blech. Whole topic gives me the creeps. Won't even get into the rest of it.

Novella

Yeah, this whole thing just isn't cool.

You don't sleep with your friends for a reason - they are your friends. Sure, you can have sex with someone and not be in a relationship with them, but that pretty much always gets a bit messy eventually. The whole point of being friends with someone is not so that you can get close enough to them to say, "Oh, hey, you're pretty hot, so now that we're friends, wanna fcuk?".

Like liah said, if any of my guy friends ever told me they thought I was 'sexy' or whatever and asked me to sleep with them, on the basis that we had a friendship and I could trust them, I would actually run miles in the opposite direction. That is really saying something, because I do not run. Ever.

If you want to sleep with someone, cool, great, go for it! Get a fcuk buddy. Don't hit your friends with utter BS about them being so lovely and how you two could sleep together and talk and ugh... It just creeps me out!

CDfm

liah wrote: »

Dude.. they're your friends. They're supposed to be able to feel safe around you, to be able to trust and confide in you. .

+1

That needed saying. I am very close to several women. One of them was extremely supportive to me a few years ago. Its a relationship I value highly.

You cant play fast and loose with your real friendships.

opinion guy

CDfm wrote: »

You cant play fast and loose with your real friendships.

Truest thing said all thread

Scanlas The 2nd

Novella wrote: »

Yeah, this whole thing just isn't cool.

You don't sleep with your friends for a reason - they are your friends. Sure, you can have sex with someone and not be in a relationship with them, but that pretty much always gets a bit messy eventually. The whole point of being friends with someone is not so that you can get close enough to them to say, "Oh, hey, you're pretty hot, so now that we're friends, wanna fcuk?".

Like liah said, if any of my guy friends ever told me they thought I was 'sexy' or whatever and asked me to sleep with them, on the basis that we had a friendship and I could trust them, I would actually run miles in the opposite direction. That is really saying something, because I do not run. Ever.

If you want to sleep with someone, cool, great, go for it! Get a fcuk buddy. Don't hit your friends with utter BS about them being so lovely and how you two could sleep together and talk and ugh... It just creeps me out!

I don't remember anyone mentioning in this thread that the point of having friends with someone is so you can ask them for a fcuk. To be honest most people just wouldn't be suitable for this type of scenario because most people can't get past their ego. The ego usually brings jealousy and possessiveness and feelings of inferiority/superiority which can be harmful to all types of relationships.

CDfm

but sisters friends could fill the gap. My sister used to almost pimp me to her friends:p

Sofaspud

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

Whats normal and weird in a social context is to a large extent subjective.

The above dialogue is an example of a man who has his reality dicatated to him. Part of your reality is what you consider normal.

You strike me as one of those people that will call anyone who disagrees a "sheep", but "reality" isn't based on someone's perception . . . . . it's based on that thing . . . . reality!

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

If a woman told me she thinks there is something wrong with me, Id say I think its weird you think a man liking sex and finding a woman attractive is wrong. IE. Dictate the things in life which are subjective to my own beliefs and not have them dictated by someone else to me.

So why haven't you tried it yourself yet, if it's such an airtight way to get sex?

Will

A lot of off topic rubbish and bickering. Although the sea lion(?) pic was funny.

It's a fairly null and void topic to begin with. You don't try bang your mates, as other's have pointed out before, they're your friends, you are friends with someone because you like them as a person not because you wanna go and pork em.

Scanlas the 2nd, it is perfectly normal to have sex. Basic human instinct, it's in all of us but what separates us from neanderthals is that we can control our urges, recognise a friendship, nurture it and grow. Not disrespect it and the woman (your friend!) by basically saying "here fancy a quick ride no strings attached", you can sugar coat it all you want but it is what it is. Lame.

opinion guy

Sofaspud wrote: »

So why haven't you tried it yourself yet, if it's such an airtight way to get sex?

Yeah I'd really like to know more about why you are posting this stuff if you aren't testing it out for yourself ? Makes your motives seem questionable to be honest

Giselle

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

. To be honest most people just wouldn't be suitable for this type of scenario because most people can't get past their ego. The ego usually brings jealousy and possessiveness and feelings of inferiority/superiority which can be harmful to all types of relationships.

This is just a neat way of avoiding blame or rejection.

If you're turned down its not your fault because its only the other persons awkward ego preventing them from jumping at the chance?

No, its because you shouldn't ask, and you weren't a real friend if you do. Female friends are more than an untapped sexual resource.

Jumpy

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

, IE you have learned to love yourself,

HA! I learned that at 13.

Herbal Deity

Whoa, each to their own. People can define what a friendship means to them whatever way they like. If people want to ride their friends, they can. Some of the above posts read like complete and utter bigotry.

southsiderosie

As regards the PUA stuff. IMHO its purely purely purely a numbers game. You try and try and try. Thats called practice. Sometimes things work, sometimes they don't -thats call experience. THats all it is.

I do think thou that it possibly works to an extent in the US.....mainly cause i think Americans have such codified dating rules and mentality compared to europeans. But thats just a hunch I could well be wrong

I don't think it's that Americans have codified rules. I think it's the ULTIMATE numbers game there - people hit on each other wherever and whenever, whereas here it seems to be limited to the pub scene (based on several threads on boards anyway).

As for sleeping with your female friends, I think what the OP suggests is problematic for many of the reasons outlines above (it's creepy, broken trust, etc). But to me, the saddest thing about this approach is that often enough, really rich romantic relationships can develop out of friendships - not by saying "hey, let's ****", but through a more organic process. I had a friend who lived in my building who I used to constantly argue about politics with. After a few months of this we realized that we'd rather argue with each other than be civilized with anyone else. Yet there are often HUGE risks involved in shifting a close friendship to this level - risks that don't seem to be worth taking for a f--- buddy.

fishtastico

Seems like if you want a "transaction" or some other instant gratification (which I'm not condemning), it's probably best to go to outside circles, rather than possibly ruining a friendship.

Dr Galen

Will wrote: »

Scanlas the 2nd, it is perfectly normal to have sex. Basic human instinct, it's in all of us but what separates us from neanderthals is that we can control our urges, recognise a friendship, nurture it and grow. Not disrespect it and the woman (your friend!) by basically saying "here fancy a quick ride no strings attached", you can sugar coat it all you want but it is what it is. Lame.

agreed

I have female friends that I'd find attractive or would have at one time or another. No harm in that, but I'd not even consider getting into bed with them in the manner being suggested here. Maybe as you say Will its about having some control, I value the friendships much much more than any need for sex.

It actually sounds like a lazy mans way to get sex. It smacks a a bit of couldn't be arsed finding someone new for the night, sure I'll ask my buddy. Shes got the right bits and bobs needed, lets rock. I'm not trying to come across prudish here either, as has been described in another post in this thread, I was a bit of a "hound" in my single days, so casual sex isn't and wasn't a no-no for me. Casual sex with my mates would be though, unless I didn't really value the friendship in the first place.

Bolibompa

What you are talking about is just the old and tried FB situation. Sometimes it works, sometimes not. I’d say friends will take the chance every time they think it would work. If they want to that is. If they don’t, they are not interested, and no matter what you say will make her/him change your mind. No point using PUA techniques.

I know which ones of my male friends who fancy me. They have either just told me, or I can tell myself. I know who I could go to if I fancied a FB and which ones would not work because there would be feelings messing stuff up. I am not awkward with any of them, attraction is human. You can’t dump friends because you know they think you’re hot.

I really can’t stand PUA. In the last year or so I and my friends have started to recognize these pick up lines more and more. For a good while I was really confused why so many men seemed to use the exact same “unusual” lines. Like how many times do you think it’s normal to be asked if it’s ok for a man to be carrying an umbrella or if he looks gay etc? After getting these and a few others for a while, I did a google search and found this whole “secret”. After looking it up a few other weird things that have been happening lately were explained.

Do you not realize that women eventually will see through your act? And the fact that the whole thing is famous for helping men scoring does not help either.

A friend of mine was approached by a really nervous looking guy while out walking. He asked her for advice on a blind date he was having the next day. Now, she was really confused and gave him a few tips but really just tried to get away as soon as possible from this crazy person. She felt sorry for the girl looking forward to this date. And because he was asking for advice on another woman she just assumed he was not interested in her! I have since heard this line a good few times.

Another one that is even more common is asking for an opinion on something, or getting us to come up with a name for a product etc. Most memorable here was a guy (and all his mates behind him) asking what would be a good name for a shampoo based on bear semen…. This guy was quite funny though, still no attraction however.

“Hey guys, I need to get your opinion on something. It’s very important, and we need a woman’s perspective. It’s a matter of life and death. My friend and I were having a debate and your answer could completely change my entire life.” (http://www.pualingo.com/pua-openers/)

Bla bla bla. It gets old.

I know some guys have no idea what PUA is and just actually ask you questions like this. Problem for me is that because they are so famous for PUA I will assume that’s where they got them from and try and get away, in my case even from men I do find physically attractive.

Call me mad but what is wrong with just going up and introduce yourself as you would in any other setting outside a pub. We’re human ffs. Pretend I’m a man or family member or whatever and just be fun and friendly and NORMAL. Don’t sleaze, snap my bra strap or ramble on about umbrellas. Puffy, drunk, sweaty faces are not helping either.

I am frustrated and waffling. :pac:

CDfm

It does sound a bit Austen Powerish.

Scanlas The 2nd

Giselle wrote: »

This is just a neat way of avoiding blame or rejection.

If you're turned down its not your fault because its only the other persons awkward ego preventing them from jumping at the chance?

No, its because you shouldn't ask, and you weren't a real friend if you do. Female friends are more than an untapped sexual resource.

I was actually refering to men, most men couldn't handle it because of their ego.

Why would you blame yourself for trying to have sex with someone when you never made any promises you wouldnt do that. I wouldnt blame a female friend for trying to have sex with me. There's no blame required.

Define a real friend Giselle?

mikom

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

I wouldnt blame a female friend for trying to have sex with me.

Fair play.
I've a funny feeling you'll be waitin' though.

fishtastico

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

I wouldnt blame a female friend for trying to have sex with me.

You're all giving Scanlas a hard time. This man is a selfless hero

Giselle

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

I was actually refering to men, most men couldn't handle it because of their ego.

That wasn't exactly clear was it?

Why would you blame yourself for trying to have sex with someone when you never made any promises you wouldnt do that. I wouldnt blame a female friend for trying to have sex with me. There's no blame required.

You never made any promises you wouldn't try to have sex with your female friend? Thats funny!
Do you promise your male friends you won't try to either?

Good to know you won't blame anyone for trying to have sex with you. I don't think it'll be much of an issue though.

Define a real friend Giselle?

Well, apart from many other factors, a real friend is someone who won't try and score you because he's not having any sucess with the general population. Because if you were, you wouldn't be risking a friendship, would you?

fishtastico

Giselle wrote: »

Well, apart from many other factors, a real friend is someone who won't try and score you because he's not having any sucess with the general population. Because if you were, you wouldn't be risking a friendship, would you?

I dunno, by the sound of it, he seems to be more interested than getting it "on tap" minus the commitment of a relationship rather than it being a last resort

Giselle

fishtastico wrote: »

I dunno, by the sound of it, he seems to be more interested than getting it "on tap" minus the commitment of a relationship rather than it being a last resort

I still don't think a real friend would treat you like a potential shag of convenience!:p

Scanlas The 2nd

Sofaspud wrote: »

You strike me as one of those people that will call anyone who disagrees a "sheep", but "reality" isn't based on someone's perception . . . . . it's based on that thing . . . . reality!

We all have that "sheep" side to us, even those who criticise the sheeps, its what helped us become a successful species. It helps us learn socially. But there are drawbacks to it too. Like when a fire alarm goes in an office people could burn to death because they only leave if they see others leave.

Back to the reality discussion, there are things, which are set in stone as reality like the earth revolves around the sun, but there are many things which are subjective and are determined by the person or number of people who are most certain about it and act certain about it. Like whats cool, whats normal/weird, fashionable, whats rude, morals etc.......

Sofaspud wrote: »

So why haven't you tried it yourself yet, if it's such an airtight way to get sex?

I don't think I said its an airtight way to have sex. I actually don't want to have sex with any of my friends and probably would never want to. But I've noticed people here making a lot of assumptions.

fishtastico

Giselle wrote: »

I still don't think a real friend would treat you like a potential shag of convenience!:p

Haha, I agree. I think the main issue is approaching a friend with a proposal, like some sort of investment opportunity. Pie-charts and all

Scanlas The 2nd

Giselle wrote: »

That wasn't exactly clear was it?


You never made any promises you wouldn't try to have sex with your female friend? Thats funny!
Do you promise your male friends you won't try to either?

Good to know you won't blame anyone for trying to have sex with you. I don't think it'll be much of an issue though.



Well, apart from many other factors, a real friend is someone who won't try and score you because he's not having any sucess with the general population. Because if you were, you wouldn't be risking a friendship, would you?

Assumptions assumptions, I could be gay for all you know.

mikom

fishtastico wrote: »

Haha, I agree. I think the main issue is approaching a friend with a proposal, like some sort of investment opportunity. Pie-charts and all

Yes indeed girl, you seem like an upscaled Blue-Sky thinker.
Let's touch base regarding how we can go forward together and pick off some low hanging fruit.
I know it's a paradigm shift, however my door is always open on this issue.

Giselle

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

Assumptions assumptions, I could be gay for all you know.

The Op did centre on a man asking his female friends to be a convenient source of sex, so my assumptions are reasonable ones in that context.

But if I'm wrong, let me know.:)

Scanlas The 2nd

The OP was a general post, not some personal issue. As for my sexual orientation, I may or may not love the cok, I wanna keep this topic general.

Most boyfriends don't even make their girlfriends feel comfortable enough to fully be herself around him be it emotional,sexual, intimate thoughts etc.... so when most women think of this friend situation Im not too surprised that if creeps them out, but when you come across a rare guy who makes you feel like you can "fully be yourself" around him because he is nonjudgmental, the chances are it won't seem as creepy as your average guy who puts out this offer. Your average guy "counts". A guy "who doesn't count" is less likely to creep you out. When you imagine this scenario unfolding you are probably imagining it with a guy who counts. Id say a lot of women would be familiar with the "he doesn't count" notion.

mikom

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

A guy "who doesn't count" is less likely to creep you out.

Where does that leave "rainman"?

Giselle

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

The OP was a general post, not some personal issue. As for my sexual orientation, I may or may not love the cok, I wanna keep this topic general.

Most boyfriends don't even make their girlfriends feel comfortable enough to fully be herself around him be it emotional,sexual, intimate thoughts etc.... so when most women think of this friend situation Im not too surprised that if creeps them out, but when you come across a rare guy who makes you feel like you can "fully be yourself" around him because he is nonjudgmental, the chances are it won't seem as creepy as your average guy who puts out this offer. Your average guy "counts". A guy "who doesn't count" is less likely to creep you out. When you imagine this scenario unfolding you are probably imagining it with a guy who counts. Id say a lot of women would be familiar with the "he doesn't count" notion.

I don't know most boyfriends so I can't comment on how their girlfriends feel. I don't know how you can either.

To be honest I can't discern any truth or meaning in that post, it just seems like a lot of soundbitey ideas that actually have no basis in peoples real lives.

A guy who doesn't count?

My friends count, or they wouldn't be friends.

Bolibompa

Judging by the grandeur of your delusion and your rather lacking social skills you remind me of SLUSK.. If you're not him then you should definitely meet. He is also looking for a cheap and easy shag.

Novella

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

I don't remember anyone mentioning in this thread that the point of having friends with someone is so you can ask them for a fcuk. To be honest most people just wouldn't be suitable for this type of scenario because most people can't get past their ego. The ego usually brings jealousy and possessiveness and feelings of inferiority/superiority which can be harmful to all types of relationships.

Most people wouldn't be suitable because most people are intelligent enough to realise it is utter crap. Call it whatever you want but all it is, is dressing up a fcuk buddy situation with a few nice lines. I've no problem with fcuk buddies, no problem at all. My only problem is with guys trying to be smooth operators. Seriously, give it a rest. I'd honestly rather hear, "Look, I think you're pretty hot, so if you're ever a bit lonely, gimme a shout"! The "You're so pretty", "You can be yourself around me", pass me the sick bag.

Scanlas The 2nd

Novella wrote: »

Most people wouldn't be suitable because most people are intelligent enough to realise it is utter crap. Call it whatever you want but all it is, is dressing up a fcuk buddy situation with a few nice lines. I've no problem with fcuk buddies, no problem at all. My only problem is with guys trying to be smooth operators. Seriously, give it a rest. I'd honestly rather hear, "Look, I think you're pretty hot, so if you're ever a bit lonely, gimme a shout"! The "You're so pretty", "You can be yourself around me", pass me the sick bag.

I never said to tell women "you can be yourself around me", people just kind of realise that themselves around non judgemental people. Where are you gettin this from, seriously, you are making up stories in your head.

It is a fcuk buddy situation, when did I say it wasn't. Who says you can't be friends with your fcuk buddy.

Whats this "your so pretty" nonsense you are on about. You don't seem to get it.

I don't recall any smooth operating discussion in my original post. Your imagination seems to be runnning wild again.

vicecreamsundae

isn't the OP just about bring the topic of a **** buddy arrangement up with a friend?
i know that site he linked to was a PUA-ish, but the actual post was just about being upfront with a female friend about it...it's not like he's talking about trying to manipulate a friend into sex by fake flattery or digging away at her self esteem or putting pressure on her. he's just talking about being straight up and suggesting a **** buddy situation and making it clear you wouldnt stop being friends because of it. nothing wrong there.

if a friend i found attractive brought this up with me, i wouldn't be so weirded out, even if i didn't want to take him up on it. but if a friend i was very much unattracted to suggested it...i think i'd be pretty grossed out and feel awkward around them afterwards. double standard, but that's how i'd feel.

but anyway, in general i just think **** buddy arrangements evolve more naturally...for me, you both have to be really attracted to each other and in that case it will probably just happen. my view would be that if you have to actually suggest it to someone...they are most likely not interested.

opinion guy

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

I don't think I said its an airtight way to have sex. I actually don't want to have sex with any of my friends and probably would never want to. But I've noticed people here making a lot of assumptions.

Ok if you don't want to have sex with your friends and would never want to then why are you advising others to do it ? Again your motives seem highgly questionable ? Is the website you linked guy giving you money per click or something ? Why do you keep avoiding answering what you motivation behind all this is ?

Scanlas The 2nd

opinion guy wrote: »

Ok if you don't want to have sex with your friends and would never want to then why are you advising others to do it ? Again your motives seem highgly questionable ? Is the website you linked guy giving you money per click or something ? Why do you keep avoiding answering what you motivation behind all this is ?

I'll answer that in the "Scanlas The 2nd's motivation" thread.

As for the me not wanting to do it but sharing advice, I don't like cherry flavour lolly pops but it wouldn't be fair to tell everyone not to eat them.

I don't think I advised others to do it. It just wont be some people's cup of tea.

Dr Galen

ok so was there an actual point to this thread then or am I totally missing it?

Scanlas The 2nd

Mystik Monkey wrote: »

ok so was there an actual point to this thread then or am I totally missing it?

The point of the thread is that it's possible to have a sex with your friends and for it to work if you go about it properly.

Giselle

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

The point of the thread is that it's possible to have a sex with your friends and for it to work if you go about it properly.

But most people responding have disagreed with that.

And you haven't tried it out yourself, so you can't speak from experience.

But some guy on a website said it works so thats all the proof you need?

I think you're going to have more conclusive evidence to back up your statement Scanlas, and I don't think you know women nearly as well as you think you do.

Website guy definitely doesn't, but if he's convinced his readership he does thats all that matters. It seems to be all it took to have you promoting it.

spider guardian

What a load of incoherent nonsense.

This sounds like a really cynical way of asking a friend to agree to be your sex toy. Do you seriously think any girls would fall for this?

Man we'd all love to be able to relentlessly bang all our hot female friends but this sounds like something out of a stupid Gerard Butler rom-com. Get real

mood

Giselle wrote: »

But most people responding have disagreed with that.

And you haven't tried it out yourself, so you can't speak from experience.

But some guy on a website said it works so thats all the proof you need?

I think you're going to have more conclusive evidence to back up your statement Scanlas, and I don't think you know women nearly as well as you think you do.

Website guy definitely doesn't, but if he's convinced his readership he does thats all that matters. It seems to be all it took to have you promoting it.

+1

This thread is so ridiculous it's funny IMO.

Nevyn

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

The point of the thread is that it's possible to have a sex with your friends and for it to work if you go about it properly.

And please give the chapter and verse of the PUA Bible that is from. :rolleyes:

fishtastico

Thaedydal wrote: »

And please give the chapter and verse of the PUA Bible that is from. :rolleyes:

Ezekiel 23:20

mikom

fishtastico wrote: »

Ezekiel 23:20

No silly..... it's psalm 69.

P.C.

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

The point of the thread is that it's possible to have a sex with your friends and for it to work if you go about it properly.

You say that - but you don't actually know if it is possible.

opinion guy

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

I'll answer that in the "Scanlas The 2nd's motivation" thread.

Very drole. So basically you are not going to tell us what you are getting out of this ? Frankly I just think we can all assume you are gaining materially out of it somehow.

As for the me not wanting to do it but sharing advice, I don't like cherry flavour lolly pops but it wouldn't be fair to tell everyone not to eat them.

Do you go around telling random people all about cherry flavour lolly pops then ? No, I didn't think so. So why do so with this stuff ?

I don't think I advised others to do it. It just wont be some people's cup of tea.

If you are not advising others to do it then why are you posting it ?

Snowie

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

The point of the thread is that it's possible to have a sex with your friends and for it to work if you go about it properly.

where in your sence of logivc do you see this fitting in... ...

Having to sleep with your friends or trying to make it look incoent well thats.....

If you lack the cabilitys to wooing such Unlucky ladys to be your friends well then bye all means work away but is it really wanted or needed ?