Deus Ex: Human Revolution

pixelburp

To play devil advocate, we're clearly seeing the first level (out of context) when you're probably meant to be learning the basic mechanics of the game, so while the video is drab, fairly linear & uninteresting, that's likely because it's meant to be those things. The trend these days is for the tutorial to be the game's first level (as opposed to a dedicated "tutorial" level). I remember there was also a walkthrough of a scene in a nightclub, it seemed more advanced, and more interesting that the above video. So in that respect I'd hold fire before denouncing the game. As mentioned, a number of Deus Ex 1's maps were fairly poor, and quite cramped.

As for the other aspects, while the 3rd person bits are annoying, Deus Ex's cutscenes were all in the 3rd person. The first game was guilty of lengthy, clunky dialogue scenes that could go on forever, so it did feel you spent more time watching JC Denton than actually playing as him.

The takedown animations are very annoying though, there's no doubt about that. Not sure they're simplifying things - after all, the classic gameplay mechanic is that a melee blow from behind is a one-hit-kill (Deus Ex had that, hell even games like Thief had it)

Sarky

A brown-coloured cover-based shooter with a gruff protagonist that drags you into 3rd person with every other button press? I think I just wet myself with excitement.

kermitdfrog

I don't know what people are so worried about after that trailer - it's been widely reported that the first level is not a fair reflection or an indication of the rest of the game. The previews in PCG, for example, having been very wary from the start but gradually more convinced the more they've seen and the latest ones make the game sound hugely promising and like it may deliver on the legacy and potential of the title.

As for the graphics - well, it was the 360 version. You really think the PC one will not look better?

pixelburp

More news. Well sort of news: it seems the PC version is a port done by a 3rd party, albeit "in partnership" with Eidos. Better pray it isn't a sloppy, half-assed port

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/03/23/deus-ex-3-pc-being-co-developed-by-nixxes/

Somnus

Another gameplay trailer here, showing aggressive, stealth and "adaptive" (which is nothing but a buzzword for mixing both by the looks of it)

http://gamevideos.1up.com/video/id/33187

Tusky

Still totally underwhelmed. Dialog is awful and character models are really poor too. The main character in particular, looks like an idiot.

No animations when interacting with things or picking up objects, yet there is silly combat animations when you kill in combat ? The gameplay and graphics look dated to me & it really doesnt look like a next gen game. First one was released 11 years ago - what new gameplay mechanics have been added exactly ?

Somnus

Tusky wrote: »

what new gameplay mechanics have been added exactly ?

You see this is an obvious problem for them. If they introduced tons of new stuff people would say it's not like Deus Ex. If the keep it more similar to the old style then it's got nothing new.

It all depends on what you're looking for from it. I'm mainly interested in a good story and atmosphere, like the original. So similar gameplay mechanics don't bother me too much because I still find the first one fun to play. That said, the improved gun combat is something I'll like because using guns in the original without maxed out skills was terrible (for me anyway)

joe123

Have to say i'm disappointed again with that trailer. It just looks like a remade Deus Ex with better graphics. (and im not even impressed by them, look pretty average and some of the animations look awful).

I already hate the 3rd person stealth kills that take you out of the game and the glowing weapons/ladders/points of interest.

But small touches such as when he was going through the vent, if he just stuck a hand out and lifted it up in some sort of animation (first person one). Have a look at some of Crysis 2 videos and see what I mean regards the little animations they implemented. In that game you can run up behind someone and take them out by sticking a knife in their neck but you stay in fps mode. It keeps you immersed in the game much more imo and looks cool to be boot.

pixelburp

I don't get the comments about "next gen" graphics - is that really important? So what if it doesn't look look "next gen" (whatever that means), Deus Ex first and foremost should be about story, atmosphere, and most importantly - choices.

Now on the subject of choices, I'm beginning to feel a bit wary about this game. I HOPE that choices don't always just boil down to whether you snipe, frag or use a convenient air-vent, because as anyone who played Deus Ex knows, the variation went far deeper than that. But after reading that the PC is low priority for Eidos, I have a horrible feeling that "choice" is going to be a watered down, bland corridor-shooter with lip service paid to the idea of choice.

Going back to the talk of graphics, I actually disagree further on the basis that if nothing else, Human Revoluton seems to have impressive visual (and audio) design. It should just be about animation or poly-counts.

Oafley Jones

pixelburp wrote: »

I don't get the comments about "next gen" graphics - is that really important? So what if it doesn't look look "next gen" (whatever that means), Deus Ex first and foremost should be about story, atmosphere, and most importantly - choices.

Agreed. Also remember the original looked ropey enough when it was first released and it never hurt the game.

DarkJager

pixelburp wrote: »

I don't get the comments about "next gen" graphics - is that really important? So what if it doesn't look look "next gen" (whatever that means), Deus Ex first and foremost should be about story, atmosphere, and most importantly - choices.

Now on the subject of choices, I'm beginning to feel a bit wary about this game. I HOPE that choices don't always just boil down to whether you snipe, frag or use a convenient air-vent, because as anyone who played Deus Ex knows, the variation went far deeper than that. But after reading that the PC is low priority for Eidos, I have a horrible feeling that "choice" is going to be a watered down, bland corridor-shooter with lip service paid to the idea of choice.

Going back to the talk of graphics, I actually disagree further on the basis that if nothing else, Human Revoluton seems to have impressive visual (and audio) design. It should just be about animation or poly-counts.

Why would you think that? PC isn't the be all and end all you know, and not every console gamer just wants to shoot things from a to b.

Zillah

DarkJager wrote: »

Why would you think that? PC isn't the be all and end all you know, and not every console gamer just wants to shoot things from a to b.

Enough of you do for console games to be designed for that.

pixelburp

DarkJager wrote: »

Why would you think that? PC isn't the be all and end all you know, and not every console gamer just wants to shoot things from a to b.

It's about demographics. On average, a console game has to be simpler in design, execution and gameplay mechanics, because its market is a largely casual-gaming one. It's not a coincidence that genres such as flight sims and macro-heavy RTS games continue to thrive on the PC, but can't be found on consoles. Complexity & the requirement to "think" just doesn't play well in the console market. I DON'T mean that to be snobbish, or derisory - so don't think I'm ripping apart console gamers - but it's just the way the market has developed.

No, not every console gamer wants to shoot things from A to be B, but a lot of them do. Complexity in games just gets shunted down the priority list, because it's believed johnny-xbox just wants to shoot aliens for a couple of hours.

And when it comes to Deus Ex - there's already very visible precedent of a Deus Ex game being watered down in execution to pander to a market perceived as disinterested in "complexity"; Deus Ex 2 was mediocrity personified.

I only hope those demo videos are designed for the adreneline junkies & that the final game will have the range of styles present in the first game.

Oafley Jones

pixelburp wrote: »

It's not a coincidence that genres such as flight sims and macro-heavy RTS games continue to thrive on the PC, but can't be found on consoles.

Two words for that - control pads.

Zillah

pixelburp wrote: »

Deus Ex 2 was mediocrity personified

Deus Ex 2 is a person?

BopNiblets

pixelburp wrote: »

I only hope those demo videos are designed for the adreneline junkies & that the final game will have the range of styles present in the first game.

Me too, I'm actually more impressed with the 24 min video without all the choicey actioney stuff, and more of the investigating, meeting people and sneaking around stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TO5CnVvY_wE

Cam footage, but it's decent (at one point someone walked in front of the camera and I thought it was in the game for a sec ), the audio isn't great though.

pixelburp

Oafley Jones wrote: »

Two words for that - control pads.

Ok, specifically for flight sims that's true of course, but the market consoles are aimed at means that games like Deus Ex invariably get watered down. I'm not saying one format's better than the other or anything, I'm just annoyed when a game (potentially) compromises on its core mechanics to pander to a demographic who otherwise wouldn't have any interest in this game. If nothing else, it shows the dev house has no faith that its product can stand on its own merits *shrug*

BopNiblets wrote: »

Me too, I'm actually more impressed with the 24 min video without all the choicey actioney stuff, and more of the investigating, meeting people and sneaking around stuff.
[tootoob vid]
Cam footage, but it's decent (at one point someone walked in front of the camera and I thought it was in the game for a sec ), the audio isn't great though.

Yes, i've seen that video before, I think that sequence is what most journos saw when writing up on Deus Ex 3. It's also the one reason I haven't completely abandoned all hope for this game; that what we're seeing is just the action-jackson garbage, and most of the game is more like your video.

Edit: Actually, just watching that video again, I can hear the announcer talking about being able to talk to all the NPCs, do side-quests etc. I also don't see as much of the target halo'ing. So perhaps, just perhaps ...

Ri_Nollaig

BopNiblets wrote: »

Me too, I'm actually more impressed with the 24 min video without all the choicey actioney stuff, and more of the investigating, meeting people and sneaking around stuff.
<snip/>
Cam footage, but it's decent (at one point someone walked in front of the camera and I thought it was in the game for a sec ), the audio isn't great though.

Must admit that looks much much better. A lot closer to what I was hoping to see. Do you know if that video was before or after the "highlighting everything" one?

joe123

That 24 min video is a million times better than the rubbish they have shown lately. No highlighting absolutely everything is a major bonus as it just makes the game look ridiculous!

Somnus

Yeah the 24 min video looks good. And I'm also quite happy with the part where he says because it's a Deus Ex there's 5 ways into the warehouse. That's what I like to hear!!

Also, the dock area looks open enough, which again is better than the more confined spaces shown in the other videos. I'm quite looking forward to it

D4RK ONION

So, seems a lot of people are hating on the highlighting...

Deus Ex is serious business, and over the past months a lot of fans have been pretty vocal about the amount of highlighting Deus Ex: Human Revolution features for items you can interact with. It would make the game too easy, it would break immersion, too much orange, etc.

Eidos Montreal forum member and superhero "Graeme" has collected a ridiculous amount of these type of comments and created a poll that sits snuggly below the stickied posts on the official forum. Currently the "ON/OFF toggle" and "Only highlight one object in range at a time" options have the most votes.

If you read through the forum thread it becomes clear that while some people want to remove the full highlighting (like in the above video) entirely, having a choice between full highlighting of objects, close-range highlighting like in the original Deus Ex, and the option of having no highlighting at all is something everybody can live with.

I agree with having those three options, because it would offer a choice to hardcore fans without debilitating the experience for other types of players. If you feel strongly about this, pitch in and vote or let your voice be heard. It's just too bad that you can't vote on the "three options" solution. Hopefully Eidos Montreal will keep this in mind with 5 months to go, eh?

Highlighting Poll - What, specifically, should happen? [Deus Ex: Human Revolution forum]

Source

Somnus

Ah I was getting my hopes up that Graeme was a staff member who might hold some influence.

Well, hopefully the developers will have people who actually keep an eye on the forum and bring this to the attention of everyone.
There's a good range of options there. Personally I'd prefer the highlighting only one thing at a time when in range, like in the original. Failing that, a toggle based aug would be my next choice.

Still, it will be interesting to see if they actually listen to what the community has to say about it.

D4RK ONION

Personally I'd be a lot more interested in the game if it wasn't so filled with highlighting. I really amn't a fan of that kind of thing. I have a brain, I do like to use it!

Somnus

AH I completely agree. I mean I think it'd be best to be like the original. Didn't like the stuff shown in the other gameplay trailers at all. It's way too intrusive.

Sisko

D4RK ONION wrote: »

Personally I'd be a lot more interested in the game if it wasn't so filled with highlighting. I really amn't a fan of that kind of thing. I have a brain, I do like to use it!

Unfortunately you'd need a pc only game for that. Half the dumbing down of games on consoles is due to hardware limitations. But the other half is due to where the companies think the 'money' is, ie casual gamers. So they try to turn what would be hardcore deep PC games into action packed, simplified but flashy casual games.

The original Dues Ex is largely considered to be the best PC video game of all time, it tops a lot of those polls at number 1 quite often. But is it the best selling game? No.

But games cost too much to make the gamble these days so they have to bring them down a notch in the hopes of selling more. Its a bizarre scenario when companies are making games to be less good then they could be so they can make more money.

Company's can't make games for the hardcore fans any more without losing out on money, money they can get if they make the game more casual.

Its like setting out to make apocalypse now but realising more people would want to watch a comedy and so they make tropic thunder instead.

Sad times. For those of us who like apocalypse now anyway. Best thing I've seen so far about this game is the cinematic trailer, it was a very well made trailer with good music. But everything else I've seen has this looking like its going to be more of a Dues Ex 2, then Dues Ex

I hope I'm wrong.

pixelburp

Sisko wrote: »

[...]

But games cost too much to make the gamble these days so they have to bring them down a notch in the hopes of selling more. Its a bizarre scenario when companies are making games to be less good then they could be so they can make more money.[...]

Very true; the mainstream studio system has become bloated beyond belief, where the margins are so tiny you just don't see creativity. Funnily enough, the best way Deus Ex 3 could have stayed true to the original was if the IP fell into the hands of a small, dedicated, independent studio who could make the game without the massive overheads of the studio system, while using digital distribution to put the game out.

Sisko

Yeah exactly, its strange times alright in gaming. One would hope these things shift and eventually there'll be a big push for 'Apocalypse Now' games due to over saturation from the 'Tropic Thunder' games. I can't see that happening for awhile though.

If it does , between consoles is the likely time we may see such a thing judging from the past.

pixelburp

Another day, another update: this is a playthrough from PC gamer. It doesn't really reveal anything new, but gives a better idea of the structure of the game as it's played "naturally", rather than the sterilised walkthrough we got in those action-heavy videos:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/04/04/deus-ex-human-revolution-preview-2/

Somnus

pixelburp wrote: »

Another day, another update: this is a playthrough from PC gamer. It doesn't really reveal anything new, but gives a better idea of the structure of the game as it's played "naturally", rather than the sterilised walkthrough we got in those action-heavy videos:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/04/04/deus-ex-human-revolution-preview-2/

That's a very promising review. I cannot wait for this game. No mention of the glowing highlighting system there... I wonder have they toned it down or whether he just didn't mention it.

Some of the demo videos I've seen haven't had it at all

humanji

I'm still fairly wary of this. Some of the things that bother me from the article are:

If a bullet only scrapes you, it takes around 30 seconds to recover from the hit. Even on Normal, health doesn’t regenerate for a significant time after you’re shot. It feels much more serious than a Call of Duty gunshot wound, despite the fact that no one throws jam in your eyes to obscure your vision.

I really hate regenerating health, so hopefully someone will be able to mod it out of the game.

A melee takedown, whether you choose to make it lethal or just a knockout, consumes one cell of power. Other augs drain those cells more gradually, and if you’ve got less than one full cell, you can’t use melee attacks at all.

Which I think is just a f*cking ridiculous idea.

But there are other little touches that make it sound pretty cool, such as

if you take too long to go on the mission, the scientists will be dead by the time you get there.

I'll hold judgement until I see the game in action.