Ongoing religious scandals

Nodin

The leadership group of U.S. Catholic nuns charged by the Vatican with promoting radical feminism and being out of touch with church teachings rejected those charges Friday, asserting the Vatican had its facts wrong.

The meeting in Rome is planned with Cardinal William Levada, an American who leads the congregation, and Seattle Archbishop Peter Sartain, appointed by the Vatican to take authority over the group.
Sartain will oversee rewriting the group's statutes, reviewing all its plans and programs - including approving speakers - and ensuring the organization properly follows Catholic prayer and ritual.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-57445490/nuns-reject-vatican-charges-of-radical-feminism/?tag=exclsv

Of course the Vatican isn't wrong ......if the definition of "radical feminism" has "wimminz thinking for themselves" written in.

Bannasidhe

THE NATIONAL BOARD for Safeguarding Children in the Catholic Church (NBSCCC) received 237 new abuse allegations in the 12 months from 31 March 2011 to 1 April this year.
The organisation’s annual report, launched today, highlighted a fall in the level of abuse reporting in 2011/12 compared to the previous year. The corresponding period in 2010/2011 saw 272 reports made.
The new abuse allegations involve 196 priests and are predominately adults reporting abuse that happened in childhood. However, six complaints relate to incidents which occurred after 2000.

http://www.thejournal.ie/over-230-new-abuse-allegations-received-by-catholic-church-475251-Jun2012/

6 complaints relate to incidents which occurred after 2000....hmmmm wonder if any were after 2002 a.k.a within the last 10 years.....

robindch

Well, it fits the thread title and this one looks like it's going to run and run:

"Prosecutors investigate Vatican Bank mafia link"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/vaticancityandholysee/9323288/Prosecutors-investigate-Vatican-Bank-mafia-link.html

The Telegraph wrote:

The official request was made more than a month ago but so far the Vatican Bank, known as the Institute for Religious Works, has refused to disclose any records of the account held by father Ninni Treppiedi – who is currently suspended from serving as a priest. Investigators want to know more about vast sums of money that are said to have passed through his account to establish if they were money laundering operations by on the run Mafia Godfather, Matteo Messina Denaro.

The reports emerged in the Italian media and came just two weeks after the head of the Vatican Bank, Ettore Gotti Tedeschi, was sacked amid claims of power struggles and corruption within the Holy See which have been linked to the leaking of sensitive documents belonging to Pope Benedict XVI. More in line with a Dan Brown thriller, it is not the first time that the Vatican Bank has been embroiled in claims of Mafia money laundering. Thirty years ago this month financier Roberto Calvi was found hanging under London's Blackfriars Bridge with cash and bricks stuffed into his pockets.

Initially City of London police recorded the death as suicide but Italian authorities believe it was murder after it emerged Calvi, known as God's Banker because of his links to the Vatican Bank, had been trying to launder millions of pounds of mob money via its accounts and through his own Banco Ambrosiano which had collapsed spectacularly. Father Treppiedi, 36, was serving as a priest in Alcamo, near Trapani, said to be the richest parish on the Mafia's island stronghold of Sicily, and he was suspended after a series of questionable transactions of church funds and which has also led to his local bishop Francesco Micciche being sacked.

Trapani prosecutor Marcello Viola made the request six weeks ago for details of the account held by Father Treppiedi at the Institute of Religious Works to be disclosed but according to reports in Italian media, as yet the go ahead has still not been given by the Vatican. In particular prosecutors are said to be looking at financial transactions made through Father Treppiedi's account at the Vatican Bank between 2007 and 2009 and which came to almost one million euros but paperwork explaining the source of the money is said to be missing. Attention is also focusing on several land and property deals made by the parish which is in Messina Denaro's heartland in the area around Trapani and where he still commands fear and respect.

There is speculation that Gotti Tedeschi was aware of the possible Mafia link and was about to name names and police seized paperwork from his home which is said to detail his suspicions and which he had prepared for a handful of trusted sources as he feared his life was possible in danger. In a statement prosecutor Viola said:"We have made a request for information to the Vatican City State in the spirit of collaboration with regard to an investigation into sums of money in financial transactions undertaken by the Diocese of Trapani."

Transactions by the Vatican Bank are already under the spotlight with leading Italian newspaper Corriere della Sera saying Gotti Tedeschi was aware of accounts held by "politicians, shady intermediaries, contractors and senior (Italian) officials, as well as people believed to be fronts for Mafia bosses." Of particular interest are said to be property investments and property sales that could potentially have been used to disguise money transfers and launder money – all this in the light of report earlier this year that the Vatican Bank was not completely transparent in its dealings despite efforts to be so. The latest development comes as prosecutors in the Vatican continue to question the Pope's butler Paolo Gabriele, 46, in connection with the leaking of documents which then ended up in a whistle blowing book published by an Italian journalist called His Holiness.

No-one from the Vatican was immediately available to comment.

UDP

Pope To Irish: Child Abuse By Clergy A 'Mystery' That Shook Faith

VATICAN CITY — Pope Benedict XVI told Irish Catholics on Sunday it is a mystery why priests and other church officials abused children entrusted in their care, undermining faith in the church "in an appalling way."

By describing the decades of child abuse in Catholic parishes, schools and church-run institutions and parishes in Ireland as a `'mystery," the pontiff could further anger rank-and-file faithful in Ireland.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/17/pope-to-irish-child-abuse_n_1603923.html

Wow, a "mystery" eh? Great to have such a leader who can continue to "protect" the children indoctrinated into his organisation.

Penn

UDP wrote: »

Pope To Irish: Child Abuse By Clergy A 'Mystery' That Shook Faith

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/17/pope-to-irish-child-abuse_n_1603923.html

Wow, a "mystery" eh? Great to have such a leader who can continue to "protect" the children indoctrinated into his organisation.

Yeah, the whole child abuse thing... that's a mystery. Transubstantiation, Immaculate Conception, Supernatural Deity, resurrection, ascension, changing water into wine, walking on water etc etc... that all makes perfect sense.

Bannasidhe

Penn wrote: »

Yeah, the whole child abuse thing... that's a mystery. Transubstantiation, Immaculate Conception, Supernatural Deity, resurrection, ascension, changing water into wine, walking on water etc etc... that all makes perfect sense.

Take a group of sexually frustrated adults belonging to a secretive and authoritarian organisation which is obsessed with controlling and demonising human sexuality. Place them in positions of authority and power over people conditioned to obey them. At all costs strive to protect the reputation of the organisation even if this means placing rapists in positions where they can continue their crimes.... what on earth could possibly go wrong?

Sarky

When put like that, it doesn't seem all that mysterious. Perhaps, and I know how crazy this will sound to any religious folks watching, and I apologise in advance for the butthurt this might cause, but... Perhaps the pope is a lying scumbag?

Bannasidhe

Sarky wrote: »

When put like that, it doesn't seem all that mysterious. Perhaps, and I know how crazy this will sound to any religious folks watching, and I apologise in advance for the butthurt this might cause, but... Perhaps the pope is a lying scumbag?

Or he can't do joined up thinking.

robindch

This has got to be the sickest one yet -- Circumcision of minors as sadistic fetish:

http://freethinker.co.uk/2012/06/13/circumcision-turned-into-porn-by-catholic-paedophile/

If true as written, then words etc fail.

Sarky

And yet, all I can do is sigh in disappointment, and wonder how long it is before something even worse becomes public.

Perhaps the Catholic Church is trying to desensitise us to scandals about sexual abuse in the hopes that we'll end up accepting it?

jank

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0620/report-says-deaths-of-children-in-care-preventable.html

A report into the deaths of children who died in State care, or who were known to the child protection services, has concluded that the majority of children did not receive an adequate child protection service.

It also recommends that a root-and-branch reform of the child protection system in Ireland is required.
It concludes that while many of the cases reviewed were deaths from natural causes, others were unnatural and may have been preventable.
The report covers the period 2000-2010 and 196 separate cases in which a child or young person died.
The report divides the cases into three distinct categories; those who died in care, those who died while in aftercare services and those who died who were known to the HSE.
Of these, 112 died as a result of non-natural causes, while 84 deaths were brought about by natural causes.
The report, by Dr Geoffrey Shannon and Norah Gibbons, finds that many of the children had experiences and difficulties before coming into contact with the HSE which are not encountered to the same extent in the general child population. It says cognisance must be taken of this fact when evaluating the case summaries.
The report recommends that a Child Death Review Unit be established and should be independent from the HSE. It says this unit should automatically have the power to investigate the death of any child or young person in care or known to the HSE
It also recommends that the operation of the in camera rule must be addressed so as to allow for transparency and accountability in the child care cases.
The group examined the files of 36 children who were in the direct care of the HSE at the time of their deaths. 17 of these deaths were due to non natural causes. Over 80% of these were aged 14 or over.
It says ultimately and tragically the efforts to protect these children failed. A key issue to be emphasised is the vulnerability of these children, it says.
The report says while good practice was adhered to in some cases, the fact remains that its application was sporadic and inconsistent.
It says earlier and more consistent good practice would have increased the chances that these children might have overcome their vulnerabilities, although it is not possible to conclude that their deaths would have been ultimately prevented.
In 12 of the 36 files, there was evidence of delay in taking the child into care. In many of the cases there was no care plan drawn up for the child. In 15 out of the 36 cases, there was evidence of a poor standard of record keeping and incomplete records.
Also, the group examined the files of 32 young people who were in aftercare at the time of their death, 27 of whom died from non-natural causes. The majority of those, 14, were killed in drug-related deaths. Seven were suicides.
In some cases no aftercare at all was provided to young persons who left the case of the HSE. This is a very serious concern, the report says.
The report states that there is a fear that when young people leave the care of the HSE and go into aftercare that they are almost forgotten about.
The report also looks into the cases of 128 children and young people who were known to the HSE before their deaths. 60 of these died of natural causes, 68 died of non-natural causes.
It says that often the support offered by social workers to families is resisted by parents despite what might be in the best interests of the child.
It praised the work of some, saying that the persistence of individual social workers is to be commended.
The report says the lack of resources within the HSE to provide appropriate support and services to these children is evident. A particular concern is the lack of out-of-hours social work services.
It says these files demonstrate an evident problem with communications within the HSE and between the HSE and others.
The report also concludes that in many of the cases reviewed, the authors have noted the absence of the voice of the child. There are notable exceptions but in many instances the professionals involved in the lives of many of these children have not recorded the wishes and feelings of the children.
The Minister For Children Frances Fitzgerald said the report shows what happens when children are failed.
She says what the report has found is a disgrace and it shows how crucial missed interventions can lead to childhoods destroyed and in some instances lives lost.
The Minister said the report shines a light on a dark often uneasiness and tragic corner of Irish life and she believes that in any previous administration a report such as this might have been withheld or redacted.
The Minister also said the findings are deeply disturbing.

Bannasidhe

jank wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0620/report-says-deaths-of-children-in-care-preventable.html

Yes. I already read the article. What is your point?

UDP

jank wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0620/report-says-deaths-of-children-in-care-preventable.html

Don't see how that has anything to do with religious scandals.

Penn

UDP wrote: »

Don't see how that has anything to do with religious scandals.

Don't you get it? By pointing out that the Catholic Church (the organisation founded on teaching the works of Jesus Christ) weren't the only type of organisation to have failed to protect children, that excuses the fact that priests f*cked kids and other priests helped cover it up, even though priests are supposed to be the most moral and trusted people in society.

Well played, jank. I think the mods can close this thread now.

Nodin

jank wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0620/report-says-deaths-of-children-in-care-preventable.html

O the church is off the hook then so. Somebody from atheist central will send out an apology later.

jank

Why should the article above NOT be posted. Children under the states care have died FFS! Just as inexcusable as the Church's past indiscretions.

The abuse of children is sick, no matter if its the RCC or the failure of the state to protect them. Surely we are all in agreement with that?

Delirium

shame on you, jank, for reducing the deaths of young people in the care of the state to a crass display of whataboutery.

Sonics2k

jank wrote: »

Why should the article above NOT be posted. Children under the states care have died FFS! Just as inexcusable as the Church's past indiscretions.

The abuse of children is sick, no matter if its the RCC or the failure of the state to protect them. Surely we are all in agreement with that?

It is a terrible thing.

But this thread is "Ongoing religious scandals", and that has nothing to do with the Religion, but the state.

Discuss that in Politics, or possibly AH.

oldrnwisr

jank wrote: »

Why should the article above NOT be posted. Children under the states care have died FFS! Just as inexcusable as the Church's past indiscretions.

The abuse of children is sick, no matter if its the RCC or the failure of the state to protect them. Surely we are all in agreement with that?

Is this story terrible and inexcusable? Absolutely.

However, this is a catch-all thread for "religious" scandals to avoid clogging up the rest of the forum, so posting this in here, despite the intent, really just smacks of whataboutery as koth points out.

The key difference between this story and the others in this thread though is that the state does not present itself as a moral guardian of society. I think Stephen Fry explains the point well:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGFS_hkHfCc

Sarky

How petty does one have to be to use horrible stories like that for the sake of scoring points in a game nobody else is playing? What is wrong with you, jank?

fitz0

Penn wrote: »

Well played, jank. I think the mods can close this thread now.

If the mods close every thread that jank or someone else tries to derail then we'll have no threads left given the recent trend.

jank

koth wrote: »

shame on you, jank, for reducing the deaths of young people in the care of the state to a crass display of whataboutery.

No, Shame on you for cherry picking. If this was a report dealing with abuse centered around the RCC then there would be a few dozen posts here condemning the actions. I don't understand why the same disgust and indignation cannot be found when the state and the HSE has failed in its stature to protect children. Or are people only interested when the perpetrators wears a clerical collar?

If the aim of this thread is to singularly bash the RCC for abuse it has carried out then can I get the mods to move my piece to a new thread here, in this forum.
This thread can then get on with its agenda and the world will be right again.

Sonics2k

jank wrote: »

No, Shame on you for cherry picking. If this was a report dealing with abuse centered around the RCC then there would be a few dozen posts here condemning the actions. I don't understand why the same disgust and indignation cannot be found when the state and the HSE has failed in its stature to protect children. Or are people only interested when the perpetrators wears a clerical collar?

If the aim of this thread is to singularly bash the RCC for abuse it has carried out then can I get the mods to move my piece to a new thread here, in this forum.
This thread can then get on with its agenda and the world will be right again.

And shame on you for blatantly cherry picking from this very thread.

This is Ongoing Religious scandals, dealing with any religion you choose to mention and can provide stories too.

The State, however, is not a religion, and therefore does not belong in this thread.

I'm growing weary of your desperate attempts at trolling and causing arguments, as I always am of the woefully ignorant.

Take that topic to another forum, as it is not based on Religion. Or is this thought process a little too complicated for you to handle?

jank

oldrnwisr wrote: »

Is this story terrible and inexcusable? Absolutely.

However, this is a catch-all thread for "religious" scandals to avoid clogging up the rest of the forum, so posting this in here, despite the intent, really just smacks of whataboutery as koth points out.

So, in truth Atheist are only interested in abuse carried out by religious organisations? Quite telling that comment.

oldrnwisr wrote: »

The key difference between this story and the others in this thread though is that the state does not present itself as a moral guardian of society. I think Stephen Fry explains the point well:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGFS_hkHfCc

Your wrong, the state does that by passing legislation. In the eyes of the state its illegal to **** a goat. Personally I don't care for 4 legged mammals.

Delirium

jank wrote: »

No, Shame on you for cherry picking. If this was a report dealing with abuse centered around the RCC then there would be a few dozen posts here condemning the actions. I don't understand why the same disgust and indignation cannot be found when the state and the HSE has failed in its stature to protect children. Or are people only interested when the perpetrators wears a clerical collar?

If the aim of this thread is to singularly bash the RCC for abuse it has carried out then can I get the mods to move my piece to a new thread here, in this forum.
This thread can then get on with its agenda and the world will be right again.

you're just proving my point. It is a truly tragic failing of the HSE with regards to the children that died. But you weren't attempting to discuss the report honestly, becuase you wouldn't have posted in this thread if you were. It was a shameless display of whataboutery.

Dades

jank wrote: »

So, in truth Atheist are only interested in abuse carried out by religious organisations? Quite telling that comment.

Really?

Because this thread exists about religious scandals within the Religion & Spirituality section of boards "Atheist are only interested in abuse carried out by religious organisations?"

That's a poor, poor response and you should know it.

oldrnwisr

jank wrote: »

So, in truth Atheist are only interested in abuse carried out by religious organisations? Quite telling that comment.

OK, first of all, the stories of abuse that have been posted here are the most prominent facet of a much larger scandal that has played out here and across the world. The abuse of children, however is not the scandal. Like it or not, there are some sick people out there and try as we might it may never be possible to eliminate such stories of abuse. The real scandal is that this abuse was covered up. The church and other religious communities made the problem worse by hiding it from the civil authorities and subverting the justice system. That cuts way deeper than the abuse itself.

Secondly, as I explained already, this thread was opened because lots of different posters kept opening threads about this abuse story or that one. To prevent the forum being clogged up, the mods wisely opened a catch-all thread for all "religious" stories just as they did for hazards and the funny side. Anything you're reading into that is only in your own head.

jank wrote: »

Your wrong, the state does that by passing legislation. In the eyes of the state its illegal to duck a goat. Personally I don't care for 4 legged mammals.

No, you seem to be confusing legality with morality. The fact that a state sanctions or prohibits something is not a commentary on its morality and the state is not making a moral judgement in doing so. The state makes no soteriological or eschatological claims unlike the church and does not hold itself out to a higher moral standard. The church does.

jank

Dades wrote: »

Really?

Because this thread exists about religious scandals within the Religion & Spirituality section of boards "Atheist are only interested in abuse carried out by religious organisations?"

That's a poor, poor response and you should know it.

Shame then people are brainwashed into forgetting the other 97%. The impression one would have is that only religious organisation abuse children.

Sarky

No, seriously, is there something wrong with you?

The Mad Hatter

jank wrote: »

Shame then people are brainwashed into forgetting the other 97%. The impression one would have is that only religious organisation abuse children.

No.