Ongoing religious scandals

Corkfeen

Newaglish wrote: »

I have no idea what this dressing to the left or on the right or whatever means.

Concisely, WTF?!

Phew, I thought it was just me. I assumed it was some rite of passage that all men had completed yet I had somehow missed out on. :mad:

robindch

See sense (5):

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dress#Verb

...though "on" is missing as a variant

Newaglish

robindch wrote: »

See sense (5):

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dress#Verb

...though "on" is missing as a variant

I see... no tailor has ever asked me that question!

Bannasidhe

Newaglish wrote: »

I see... no tailor has ever asked me that question!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmwQD1Y2k6g

recedite

robindch wrote: »

...though "on" is missing as a variant

Is Sir tentatively admitting that he was wrong, then?

Nodin

A high-ranking Philadelphia Roman Catholic Church official has been found guilty of endangering the welfare of a child in a sex abuse case.
Monsignor William Lynn was acquitted of two additional charges.
Prosecutors alleged that Lynn, who supervised hundreds of priests, helped cover-up child sex abuse, often by transferring priests to new parishes.
He is now the highest-ranking US Roman Catholic official convicted in connection in a wider scandal.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-18560069

MrPudding

koth wrote: »

shame on you, jank, for reducing the deaths of young people in the care of the state to a crass display of whataboutery.

I have said it before, and they continually prove it to be the case, whataboutery is all they have.

MrP

Pantech

Hi all,

I just joined, so hi!

This does not seem to have been reported in Ireland yet, but over the weekend in Philadelphia, PA, a former cardinal's aide was convicted of covering up clerical child abuse in his dioseces. It was shown that he moved offending priests to a new parish, not telling anyone in the new parish the reason for the move, not informing the police, etc etc. Standard MO that we have heard before...

Significant though in that this will be the first time a senior clergy member has been prosecuted for cover-up.

.
PHILADELPHIA — Msgr. William J. Lynn, a former cardinal’s aide, was found guilty Friday of endangering children, becoming the first senior official of the Roman Catholic Church in the United States convicted of covering up sexual abuses by priests under his supervision.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/23/us/philadelphias-msgr-william-j-lynn-is-convicted-of-allowing-abuse.html

I don't get why there is so much talk of bishops in Ireland who covered up abuse in a similar fashion, e.g. Brady, and all that is talked about is that they should resign, when the real issue is that they should be tried, convicted on the evidence and sent to jail.

Do you foresee any implications of this trial in Ireland? Will it inspire the DPP to bring action against those who covered up crimes in Ireland?

Jon

MrPudding

Pantech wrote: »

Hi all,

I just joined, so hi!

This does not seem to have been reported in Ireland yet, but over the weekend in Philadelphia, PA, a former cardinal's aide was convicted of covering up clerical child abuse in his dioseces. It was shown that he moved offending priests to a new parish, not telling anyone in the new parish the reason for the move, not informing the police, etc etc. Standard MO that we have heard before...

Significant though in that this will be the first time a senior clergy member has been prosecuted for cover-up.



http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/23/us/philadelphias-msgr-william-j-lynn-is-convicted-of-allowing-abuse.html

I don't get why there is so much talk of bishops in Ireland who covered up abuse in a similar fashion, e.g. Brady, and all that is talked about is that they should resign, when the real issue is that they should be tried, convicted on the evidence and sent to jail.

Do you foresee any implications of this trial in Ireland? Will it inspire the DPP to bring action against those who covered up crimes in Ireland?

Jon

This is an excellent verdict. Unfortunately I don't know if it will have any impact here. I don't believe what this buy was charged with is an offense here, or if it was an offense at the time.

That is one of the arguments frequently put forward in respect to the lack of prosecutions.

MrP

Dades

Pantech wrote: »

I just joined, so hi!

Hi Pantech, welcome.

I've moved your thread to this sticky which you'll note from the charter is the home for such discussion.

robindch

recedite wrote: »

robindch wrote: »

...though "on" is missing as a variant

Is Sir tentatively admitting that he was wrong, then?

Sir, right or wrong, is going to stick to his preferred usage for the reason given

Bannasidhe

robindch wrote: »

Sir, right or wrong, is going to stick to his preferred usage for the reason given

Apparently Sir was incorrect but Ma'am was correct.
:pac:

recedite

Pantech wrote: »

Do you foresee any implications of this trial in Ireland? Will it inspire the DPP to bring action against those who covered up crimes in Ireland?

Even if we bring in "mandatory reporting", the law won't apply retrospectively.
A quick search of the US offense "child endangerment" shows that it requires mandatory reporting of any known abuse by other third parties ;

By 1970, every state had enacted laws requiring certain professionals, such as teachers and doctors, to report incidents of suspected child abuse to law enforcement agencies. In 1974, the Federal Child Abuse Prevention and Treatment Act (42 U.S.C.A. §§ 5105–5106) became law, authorizing federal funding for states to identify child abuse and to offer protective services for abused children.
Statutes make up one component of a state's child-protective services; another component, the child-protective services agency, implements the statutes. Reporting statutes, which vary from state to state, require that certain professionals report suspected child abuse, whereas others, such as neighbors, are entitled but not required to do so

source

Here in Ireland we are still being urged by others to stop the talking and just bring in the law

AN INTERNATIONAL expert on child protection has urged Ireland to proceed with introducing mandatory reporting of child abuse and neglect as a progressive and important means of ensuring the safety and welfare of children...............she said she was surprised by Ireland’s delay in introducing a constitutional provision guaranteeing the rights of children.

In late 2010 the Greens were desperately trying to stay on in government long enough to pass a climate change bill and set a definite date for a childrens rights referendum, but as the economy collapsed around them they ended up resigning. Since then these matters have been "put on the back-burner" somewhat but AFAIK mandatory reporting will be enshrined in law, if we ever get round to holding the childrens rights referendum.

Bannasidhe

I am beginning to suspect that the Vatican has a cunning plan to rid the world of Atheists - it is going to induce strokes in us all by repeatedly causing our blood pressure to shoot up.

Today's Gem:

Making a woman a priest is as sinful as abusing a child, the Roman Catholic Church declared yesterday.
New religious rules published by the Vatican set both sins at the same level of gravity and recommended the same punishment for guilty priests.
Church officials in Rome insisted that the new version of Canon Law showed it was 'very, very serious in its commitment to promote safe environments'.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1295012/Vatican-labels-ordination-women-grave-crime-par-sex-abuse.html#ixzz1yo3R9KA3


:mad::mad::mad:

recedite

robindch wrote: »

Or is it, perhaps, related to size? With "to" suggesting that one simply doesn't stretch as far as an "on". Without wishing to seem to boast unduly, as above, I've always dressed "on".

Clearly, The Good Lord has endowed Sir with physical perfection in compensation for his grammatical (ahem) "shortcomings"
The Lord giveth, and the Lord taketh away.

robindch

recedite wrote: »

Clearly, The Good Lord has endowed Sir with physical perfection in compensation for his grammatical (ahem) "shortcomings"
The Lord giveth, and the Lord taketh away.

Not only hath the Lord seen fit to endow Sir with an extent of physical dimension which is the rightful object of envy of men the world over, but also the ability to add usefully to the Queen's English.

I will write and let her know.

fitz0

Not quite ongoing but this seems the most appropriate place for this.

http://johnjonesartist.blogspot.ie/2011/05/blog-post.html

We Exercise the Power is a project I have been researching for the last six months through regular visits to the Irish Censorship Office to view the official Register of books that were banned in Ireland under the Censorship of Publications Act of 1930-. When a book was deemed unfit for Irish readers, due either to themes of general indecency, obscenities, religious views, the issue of abortion or for other such reasons, it would automatically be prohibited by the Board for twelve years. When the twelve years passed the Board could then reconsider the book and prohibit it again for a further twelve years. In this way some authors found their books being banned over and over again in Ireland by the Board. The censorship of authors and books was particularly severe in Ireland, a country greatly influenced by the power of the Catholic Church and the Board would not think twice about banning any author’s who dared point the finger at the Catholic Church. In 2010, we saw for the first time no new books banned in Ireland after the twelve-year ban was lifted on a number of books. The only real issue that still seems to cause controversy being that of abortion.

We Exercise the Power is comprised of 100 watercolour paintings of 100 books by 100 author's who have at one time or another been banned in Ireland throughout the last century. The project will be traveling to a number of libraries around the country over the coming months, each time showing a selection of works from the series.

The banning of books was greatly influenced by the RCC hierarchy to shut out any dissenting voices and is, in my mind, a great shame in our history. Thankfully the internet guarantees that no book can ever be banned again.

Also of interest is the former Index Librorum Prohibitorum, the RCC forbidden books register maintained until 1966.

Galvasean

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1295012/Vatican-labels-ordination-women-grave-crime-par-sex-abuse.html#ixzz1yo3R9KA3


:mad::mad::mad:

It's like they're playing a game of 'faith chicken', seeing how crazy/backwards they can behave before laypeople cop on to themselves and admit that Catholicism really isn't for them.

Bannasidhe

Galvasean wrote: »

It's like they're playing a game of 'faith chicken', seeing how crazy/backwards they can behave before laypeople cop on to themselves and admit that Catholicism really isn't for them.

I suppose if faith can move mountains then turning back time should be a doddle. If I wake up some morning and it's the 12th century I'm getting my Atheist arse to liberal Moorish Spain or the Whest of Ireland as according to Gerald of Wales the people there had never heard of Christ.

recedite

Bannasidhe wrote: »

I....or the Whest of Ireland as according to Gerald of Wales the people there had never heard of Christ.

It seems that people there "followed" a fertility god called Crom, and even after converting to Christianity continued to honour his festival at the time of first harvest, just to be on the safe side. They also continued the tradition of carrying some fruits/grain/sacrifice up to the top of "his" mountain; Crom Cruach mountain (now called Croagh Patrick) on the particular day towards the end of summer. After the mountain was officially re-dedicated to St Patrick, Crom apparently became known as Crom Dubh (Black Crom- the bad guy).
Even today on Reek Sunday Christian pilgrims still go up there for no apparent reason. Oddly enough the old name for the day Domhnach Crom Dubh (Black Crom Sunday) is still widely used in the Gaeltacht areas of Connemara, despite those people being some of the most "hard-core Catholics" to be found anywhere in the country.

Sarky

Croooooooooooom!

Nodin

Sarky wrote: »

Croooooooooooom!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_et1rgL3e5s&feature=related

Sonics2k

Sarky wrote: »

Croooooooooooom!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRnSnfiUI54

robindch

The story so far: a woman feels a bit peculiar and goes to a priest to sort her out. The priest allegedly diagnoses an infestation of evil spirits and spends two years trying to exorcise them by demanding she undress, touching her inappropriately and "blowing the Holy Spirit into her" by means of passionate kissing. He denies "taking part in the sexual act".

Added bonus: the accused is a man named Thomas Euteneuer, president for ten years of an organization named Human Life International, an EWTN favourite and an outfit which is busy spreading love, warmth and kindness amongst the sad individuals who read the "Alive" agitmag:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/va-woman-sues-catholic-diocese-of-arlington-claims-sexual-abuse-during-2-year-exorcism/2012/06/27/gJQAQwpz5V_story.html

recedite

Euteneuer was not named in the lawsuit because he and the woman previously reached a financial settlement. However, he said that settlement did not release the diocese or HLI from claims.

So she has already claimed off him, and now wants to claim off the diocese as well. I'm inclined to think that what two nutcases "get up to" behind closed doors is their own business. Don't get other people involved in it.

Seth Brundle

Rather poignant letter from yesterday's Irish Times:

Sir, – Moved by Eamon Reid’s letter (June 26th), I too wish to share my experience of the 50th International Eucharistic Congress (IEC) in Dublin.

I am a priest and a survivor of sexual abuse. I had paid my subscription and registered to attend the IEC. As the time drew nearer, however, and despite being asked to attend a meeting by three Irish bishops on May 10th, 2011, it became clear to me that survivors of clerical sexual abuse were not seriously on the agenda of the congress. I decided, therefore, that I could not attend. Nevertheless, on Friday June 15th, I went to the RDS as an observer – not a participant.

The entire experience left me desolate and full of sorrow. Eamon Reid’s analysis is exactly correct: no place of welcome or comfort for any survivor of clerical sexual abuse; the blessing of a lump of Wicklow granite, as a so-called “gesture” towards victims, the irony of which is entirely lost on the bishops and organisers, indicative of their utter detachment from our pain, their inability to understand our plight; a clandestine and unverifiable meeting, between the Papal Legate, Cardinal Marc Ouellet and “some survivors”, near Lough Derg. The aversion of eyes and expressed hostility of some participants towards the protest, as described by Mr Reid, sums it all up.

There is a total absence of the compassionate Heart of Christ towards survivors. The dreadful experience of being there was underpinned, for me, by a chance encounter with one Irish bishop, to whom I attempted to express my sense of alienation and distress: he shrugged his shoulders and walked off in a huff. No blessing, no renewal, will follow that congress. For Christ was once again betrayed, by a callous and careless “Church”, in His wounded sisters and brothers.

A precious opportunity for some meaningful pastoral engagement with victims and, perhaps, some healing, was lost forever. Indeed, “Jesus wept” and He continues to weep. – Yours, etc,

Fr PATRICK McCAFFERTY,

Lower Rathmines Road,

Dublin 6.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/letters/2012/0628/1224318886769.html

FouxDaFaFa

kbannon wrote: »

Rather poignant letter from yesterday's Irish Times:

The poor man. Fair play to him for saying something.

UDP

How can that priest remain part of such an organisation rotten to the core. It beggers belief.

fitz0

http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/06/28/3535079.htm

More RCC abuse out of Australia, including cover ups and the ongoing legacy of the abuse. Video of the investigation after the jump. It has some pretty rough testimonials from survivors.

The Catholic Church says its response to cases of child sex abuse should be compassionate, that abusers should be brought to justice and that concealing the truth is unjust to victims.

But does it follow those principles?

Coming up, Four Corners reporter Geoff Thompson investigates a shocking case of abuse involving many children, committed over several years. The abuse in itself is horrifying, the impact on the victims devastating, but perhaps the most alarming revelation is the fact that the Church turned a blind eye to the priest's crimes. Four Corners asks why, despite clear evidence of abuse, the Church allowed him to move from parish to parish, apparently without alerting the police. The program reveals that even now the Church will not admit the full extent of what it knew about the priest's activities.

The program also tells the story of the young men and their families, whose lives were devastated by the abuse. And details how the crimes committed led to the early death of several victims.

"It would have been no different if he had taken a gun and shot him, it just took longer." Relative of an abused child

From extensive research it's now clear that child sex abuse victims are more likely to take their own lives, are more prone to drug abuse and the possibility of early death. It's also true that the torment for an abused child is made worse when the abuser is not brought to justice.

In Victoria the Government is holding a joint party inquiry into the way religious and other non-government organisations respond to sex abuse cases. The Government was pressured into holding the inquiry after the release of a police report that criticised the Catholic Church's handling of abuse issues. The confidential police report revealed that the Church had known about a shockingly high rate of suicides and premature deaths but had "chosen to remain silent".

There is now a growing demand for the Federal Government to hold a national inquiry to assess the true extent of sexual abuse by all church groups and to assess the programs that have been put in place to assist victims and deliver them compensation.

Kivaro

From: http://www.philly.com/philly/news/pennsylvania/20120702_Ex-Philadelphia_Archdiocese_CFO_pleads_guilty_in__900_000_theft.html

The former CFO of the Archdiocese of Philadelphia admitted on Friday in Philadelphia Common Pleas Court to stealing more than $906,000 from the Archdiocese beginning in 2004 until the summer of 2011.

Anita Guzzardi, 43, of Barrington, Camden County, could face up to a maximum of 10 1/2 to 21 years in prison when she is sentenced Aug. 24, the District Attorney's office said Monday.