Munster vs Glasgow Warriors, Thomond Park, Friday 26 March 8pm. Setanta Sports 1

buck65

Co45 wrote: »

In fairness Leinster have the same restrictions in place and seem to do fine. I think Munster need to get more quality depth to be honest.

I agree totally. We also have had serious injury (and suspension) problems this season too with our forwards. We have been like a raggle taggle team tbh. One thing it did show up was the lack of real quality in our ranks.
Too many of our squad are decent players but not really good enough to take over from Quinlan, Wallace, Horan, Hayes. Players like Ronan, Coughlan, Brugnaut, Fogarty, MOD are good players but nowhere near HCup standard I think.

JustinDee

buck65 wrote: »

I agree either side of the 6 nations the are entitled to a week off

Well there you go then. No worries so.
This is one week the 6N so its actually okay to take the rest week.

thomond2006

justin, do you know how many more appearances the likes of POC, Wallace, Hayes and ROG can make for Munster this season under the Player Agreement?

Amazotheamazing

Our captain has started two or three league games this season, how anyone can defend that system is beyond me. I've always said I don't really rate the league, and tbh, it's clear my mindset is supported by the IRFU, preferring to focus on a comp held every four years which we have virtually no chance of ever winning to a league which should be increasing rugby's popularity in Ireland. I really don't understand why the IRFU give up everything to try and compete in the RWC, we'd be far better off focusing on winning HEC's and leagues with our provinces and focusing pretty much solely on the six nations.

thomond2006

Success in the RWC would do far more for Irish Rugby than a more competitive league.

IMO the IRFU are going a bit too far but I can see their point of view.

JustinDee

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

I really don't understand why the IRFU give up everything to try and compete in the RWC, we'd be far better off focusing on winning HEC's and leagues with our provinces and focusing pretty much solely on the six nations.

International rugby is what funds the sport. More than any other level of the game. It is the single largest source of revenue bar none.
If an international player thinks they're not good enough to compete in RWC games then they should just give up playing the game professionally.

Co45

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Our captain has started two or three league games this season, how anyone can defend that system is beyond me.

In fairness that was only due to the Lions series.

I've always said I don't really rate the league, and tbh, it's clear my mindset is supported by the IRFU, preferring to focus on a comp held every four years which we have virtually no chance of ever winning to a league which should be increasing rugby's popularity in Ireland. I really don't understand why the IRFU give up everything to try and compete in the RWC, we'd be far better off focusing on winning HEC's and leagues with our provinces and focusing pretty much solely on the six nations.

I disagree. I think the IRFU hold the ML highly I just feel they are prioritising the World Cup which is absolutely the right thing to do. Also you forget that Leinster are bang on target to win the league (well reach the play offs) despite this so its not impeeding them at all. The problem is not the IRFUs play management scheme for the World Cup (which is brilliant in my eyes) but as I have already stated Munster's lack of depth. Its a brilliant idea and it gives young players behind the likes of O'Driscoll who would probably never see game time barring injury some opportunities.

buck65

Competing and winning are two different things though. Some here on boards feel that Ireland have very little chance of winning a world cup and I am among them.
I think Ireland has benefitted in the past few years with a less taxing home fixture list than England and France as we have a smaller player base. But I think we have gone too far this year.
The Lions tour had Munster missing something like 7 players for a month. Then the IRFU decreed that they still needed time off after 6 games and more time before and after the 6 nations.
The result of this is a Munster team that has had to deal with all this disruption along with a spate of injuries.
I think there has to be a better balance going forward as next year there are 4 more ML games.
I know for most of these players that the Lions is a once off thing but fans travelling to Magners League games should be entitled to see the "stars" of the game more than 3 or 4 times a year.

PS re the Leinster comparison, Leinster do have a stronger squad than Munster granted but were not disrupted in the same way as Munster due to the Lions. Remember we were missing POC, DOC, ROG, TOL injured, Fla injured, Earls. Then Horan got sick, Hayes was suspended rightly.

Amazotheamazing

JustinDee wrote: »

International rugby is what funds the sport. More than any other level of the game. It is the single largest source of revenue bar none.
If an international player thinks they're not good enough to compete in RWC games then they should just give up playing the game professionally.

My issue isn't with the RWC, or players wnating to play in it. I think we have a very, very small chance of winning it, ever.

On the otherhand, I think one of our provinces could win the HEC or league or both every year. I think we could win a Championship every year. Obviously we won't win these things every year, but it's realistic to think we can win them in any given year.

Why are we deluding ourselves by going for an unwinnable goal when we could be going for winnable goals every year? It's possible that either Munster or Leinster will do the double this year, but that will be in spite of the system, not because of it, imo.

I also don't agree Munster lacks squad depth, we have plenty of depth, what we don't have is the freedom to play our players as we choose and freedom to drop who we want to drop. Munster's game has alway been based around cohesion moreso than individual flair, I think it's impossible to really build cohesion when you can't always pick the team you want to pick. People seem to think players can slot in and slot out of the team like they are interchangeable. They can't.

Sangre

thomond2006 wrote: »

I agree with justin.

We don't want players getting burnout when it really counts.

The internationals who played all through the Six Nations were always going to rested once before the HEC, better against Glasgow than Leinster IMO.

Pride aside, Munster should be targetting this game not the one against Leinster if they're worried about play-off qualification. It is unlikely Munster will be fighting Leinster for their spot but its possible with Glasgow.

Amazotheamazing

The problem with the Leinster game is both coaches will treat it as a warm-up match for the HEC the next week and will be very cagey. Even if Munster had to win to stay in the league, the management would sacrifice it to have a slightly better chance against the Saints.

buck65

Amazo that post actually sums it up well , I'd be all day trying to say the same thing.

Co45

buck65 wrote: »

PS re the Leinster comparison, Leinster do have a stronger squad than Munster granted but were not disrupted in the same way as Munster due to the Lions. Remember we were missing POC, DOC, ROG, TOL injured, Fla injured, Earls. Then Horan got sick, Hayes was suspended rightly.

I understand what you're saying but Leinster were missing Fitzgerald, O'Driscoll, D'arcy, Heaslip, Kearney, Elsom left, Contepomi left, Jackman injured, Whitaker left. That was 9 of Leinster starting 15 from last year gone from the starting line up at the start of the season. Then Leinster had Fitzgerald's injury, O'Brien's injury, CJs continued injury, Kearney's injury etc.
What got Leinster through all this so far is their depth.

Co45

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

My issue isn't with the RWC, or players wnating to play in it. I think we have a very, very small chance of winning it, ever.

On the otherhand, I think one of our provinces could win the HEC or league or both every year. I think we could win a Championship every year. Obviously we won't win these things every year, but it's realistic to think we can win them in any given year.

Why are we deluding ourselves by going for an unwinnable goal when we could be going for winnable goals every year? It's possible that either Munster or Leinster will do the double this year, but that will be in spite of the system, not because of it, imo.

I also don't agree Munster lacks squad depth, we have plenty of depth, what we don't have is the freedom to play our players as we choose and freedom to drop who we want to drop. Munster's game has alway been based around cohesion moreso than individual flair, I think it's impossible to really build cohesion when you can't always pick the team you want to pick. People seem to think players can slot in and slot out of the team like they are interchangeable. They can't.

Not right now we can but if we improve over the next 18 months then its very possible we can beat Australia in the group stages, avoid NZ and get to the semis where anything is possible. Thats IF we improve.
I'd take a WC runners up over a grand slam to be honest. I would love to get to a world cup final.

Amazotheamazing

Co45 wrote: »

I understand what you're saying but Leinster were missing Fitzgerald, O'Driscoll, D'arcy, Heaslip, Kearney, Elsom left, Contepomi left, Jackman injured, Whitaker left. That was 9 of Leinster starting 15 from last year gone from the starting line up at the start of the season. Then Leinster had Fitzgerald's injury, O'Brien's injury, CJs continued injury, Kearney's injury etc.
What got Leinster through all this so far is their depth.

Again it comes down to cohesion, yes Leinster lost players, but imo, the hardest units to build cohesion in are the forwards, not the backs, where Leinster lost comparitively few. For example, we all know Denis Fogarty can't throw the ball, it's just that simple, isn't it? Or, for greater depth, how often has he played with our lineout leader, O'Connell, or played with the same lineout unit two or three games in a row? People see the lineout going wrong and and blame Fogs, rather then step back and ask what is actually going wrong. There's a tendancy on messageboards to assume you can construct teams like lego, you can't. Each facet of play takes hours upon hours to get right, and it can't be done while you have limited choice in the players you can pick.

Amazotheamazing

Co45 wrote: »

Not right now we can but if we improve over the next 18 months then its very possible we can beat Australia in the group stages, avoid NZ and get to the semis where anything is possible. Thats IF we improve.
I'd take a WC runners up over a grand slam to be honest. I would love to get to a world cup final.

Different dreams I guess. I not saying we'll never win the RWC, we could, but it's not a gamble we should throw the house on.

buck65

Well we're hardly throwing the house on it either as we have won the last 2 European cups and Magners Leagues with game management. It's just the inflexibility of the whole thing that annoys me. You "have" to do this rather than we recommend this.

I'm just wondering how the 4 extra games are going to affect teams next year?
Even if players played most of the games with a few weeks break they would still be playing a lot less than English and French internationals.
It must drive coaches crazy.

damoz

Anyone know of any streams of the match tonight. Appreciate any working links.

Risteard

Tony Buckley out due to illness according to the Munster Twitter.

http://twitter.com/munsterupdate

Co45

Buckley seems to be constantly out with illnesses.

castie

really? I never noticed. Any examples? other than tonite

danthefan

The topic title is wrong I think, it's on Setanta Ireland according to the Setanta website.

Co45

castie wrote: »

really? I never noticed. Any examples? other than tonite

Can't think of any specific examples but hes been out for loads of games with colds and flu's. Apparently two seasons ago he was actually sick for months but it went undiagnosed

thekid9

Any other channel besides setanta 1 thats showing this?

Juwwi

thekid9 wrote: »

Any other channel besides setanta 1 thats showing this?

its on setanta lreland.

if u have eircom broadband u will get it on eircom site

thekid9

Cheers

Micky Dolenz

Oh no

Judgement Day

Still 0-0 ROG just missed a penalty.

Micky Dolenz

Hurley try

ScrubsfanChris

Great pass by Dowling to Hurley there for the try.

Judgement Day

Hurley in for a try. "Quinlan at his rampaging best." ROG misses conversion. 5-0

ScrubsfanChris

Penalty ROG 8-0

Aidric

Game is still scrappy after 25 mins. I think that was Mafi's first involvement in the game with the try there. Scrum poor again.

Crash

Cracking solo run by Barclay.

Aidric

Stupid from ROG, plain and simple. He didn't even look up before throwing that pass.

ScrubsfanChris

Another ROG penalty from 40+ (11-10)

Howlett on for Hurley.

Micky Dolenz

Thought Mafi has just gonna get him.

Mr.Applepie

Something really needs to be done about the scrum. How many resets have there been now? It's ruining what could otherwise be a good game

ironingbored

How did it go from 8-0 to 11-10?

Intercept and run in from Barclay?

ScrubsfanChris

11-10 to Munster at half time.
Glasgow have the scrum, but Brugnaut is a LH playing TH.
Lineouts are pretty even with Munster losing 1 and another not straight with Glasgow losing 1 just before half ti

Alot of stops and starts because of injury and reset scrums, no real patern from either side able to form.

thomond2006

FT:

Cardiff

19

Ulster

09

Scrappy game so far.

That was stupid by ROG, didn't look up before he gave the pass.

The ref is doing us a few favours in the scrums, we are getting destroyed there.

durkadurka

Scrum is becoming a joke. Not just this game.

Aidric

Sublime period of play.

ironingbored

Who? What? How?

duckysauce

the ref;)

Crash

Surely Munster shouldn't have gotten away with that one - fairly blatant.

edit: the ruck there, in case anyones wondering.

anyone else's coverage gone?

thomond2006

Deleted User wrote: »

anyone else's coverage gone?

Yup. :mad:

jamieh

Deleted User wrote: »

anyone else's coverage gone?

Yup :mad:

marcbrophy

Deleted User wrote: »

anyone else's coverage gone?

Yeah!! :mad: