Transformers 3: Dark of the Moon [** SPOILERS FROM POST 823 ONWARD **]

Otacon

BlitzKrieg wrote: »

you mean Don Simpson who was involved in both bad boys and The Rock

Bruckheimer has to explain Armageddon, Pearl Harbour and The Island not to mention the craptastic bad boys 2

There was nothing wrong with Armageddon! As for the others... I concede

BlitzKrieg

I mean when you think about it, the things people really dislike about Bay films really started to creep in after the rock (though some of it is in the rock anyway). The Jingoism in the rock is bareable (cause the us army is both the goody and the baddy and the jingoism tied really well with Ed Harris's character being a niave moron who thinks too highly of the army) and racist stereotypes is kept for one minor character during a chase scene. After The Rock it just got worse and worse with each passing movie.


But changing topic quickly. On the notion of brain dead action films...when did they get so much plot?

I dont mean they are too intellectual. I mean alot of action films (especially Bay's current crop)seem to try too hard to put alot of story into their films and seeing how people responded clearly nobody wants them to.

What happened to keeping the plot simple to allow more energy on the atmosphere, the tension and the set pieces. Say for example Die Hard. There's not alot of plot in that, just really fun characters and some brillaint set pieces.

Action movies need strong likable characters and edge of your seat set pieces, really everything else should be supporting these two points.

don ramo

BlitzKrieg wrote: »

Action movies need strong likable characters and edge of your seat set pieces, really everything else should be supporting these two points.

thats the nail on the head right there, not one caratcer in the transofrmers series is likeable, at least john mclane and rocky were fighting for something they didnt wanna do, but they just got on with it and didnt bitch till it was over,

Sad Professor

I think convoluted plots are often a consequence of the script being written around the action scenes rather than the other way around. In the case of a sequel the story/plot is often the last thing anyone turns their attention to. It's not unusual in Hollywood for the director to be building sets and drawing storyboards while the writer is still trying to fix the script.

_Kaiser_

By the sounds of this I'll wait till it comes out on DVD then

I think I've seen better action movies in the last week then with the classic Arnie flicks The Running Man and Total Recall on Sky

(think I'll watch Predator tonight...)

Mr. K

Saw this last night, it was alright. Better than Revenge of the Fallen at least. Megatron was criminally underused and

was killed way too easily

. The action was all great, but the film was much too long; I was kinda dozing off 'til the last half an hour.

Cantona's Collars

One thing Bay got spot on was the 3D, it was the best use of it since Avatar,he didn't feel the need to throw things out of the screen for the sake of it unlike other movies.
My mate was disappointed by this until I explained that's how 3D movies should be.

One thing,Chicago was wrecked but the Autobots managed to find a clear road to the city centre????

johnny_ultimate

Sad Professor wrote: »

I think convoluted plots are often a consequence of the script being written around the action scenes rather than the other way around. In the case of a sequel the story/plot is often the last thing anyone turns their attention to. It's not unusual in Hollywood for the director to be building sets and drawing storyboards while the writer is still trying to fix the script.

Pirates of the Caribbean 2/3 are the most extreme version of this. Didn't they start shooting before the script was even finished? Hence the absolute farce that emerged.

TBH, JJ Abrams is the only person I think is still making the simple, tightly plotted blockbusters of ye olden times. Time travel stuff aside, of course. Christopher Nolan makes the argument for more complicated material, but there's a deep lack of the simple thrills a summer movie should provide. It's why Thor and Iron Man for all their flaws at least tried to be simple fun and succeeded in creating silly, enjoyable entertainment in the process.

Galvasean

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

By the sounds of this I'll wait till it comes out on DVD then

To be honest the best thing in the film is the 3D so if you're in any way curious cinema is teh only way to go (unless 3D TVs / BluRays become common and affordable in the next year or so).

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Pirates of the Caribbean 2/3 are the most extreme version of this. Didn't they start shooting before the script was even finished? Hence the absolute farce that emerged.

Jurassic Park 3 is another example. There was no finalised script when they started shooting (hence why the film doesn't really have a proper ending). In fact the main dinosaur in the film, Spinosaurus is not even in the storyboards! :eek:

MisterAnarchy

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

By the sounds of this I'll wait till it comes out on DVD then

I think I've seen better action movies in the last week then with the classic Arnie flicks The Running Man and Total Recall on Sky

(think I'll watch Predator tonight...)

3 absolute classics ,they knew how to make summer blockbusters back then,not the garbage we get nowadays.

Goldstein

Galvasean wrote: »

Jurassic Park 3 is another example. There was no finalised script when they started shooting (hence why the film doesn't really have a proper ending). In fact the main dinosaur in the film, Spinosaurus is not even in the storyboards! :eek:

Anyone else just hear that ring tone in their heads?

brianregan09

I loved it but one of the above posters hit the nail on the head my one gripe

Megatron and also Starscream and even Shockwave were all barely in the movie and were just used as cannon fodder near the end very dissapointing

And the fact that Sam of all bloody people killed Starscream did my ****ing nut it in my favourite character from transformers all those years ago killed by bloody Indiana Jones Jnr.. Was sickend

Where do they go with this franchise now ? Galvatron, Unicron, also was that a sharkticon that was with Megatron little pet thing

Overheal

The Autobots are selfish pricks.

Think about it.

They basically comitted genocide and destoryed an entire (albeit mechanical, but to them..) Planet. And for what? So like a dozen Autobots could say they fought for freedom? Okay, douchebags.. I mean, seriously.

Overheal

zerks wrote: »

One thing Bay got spot on was the 3D, it was the best use of it since Avatar,he didn't feel the need to throw things out of the screen for the sake of it unlike other movies.

Even Avatar fell prey to those kind of shots though. If you go back and watch it, you'll find a couple. One that sticks out is when they're like in the command center and the CEO dude is panning around the 3D display of the planet showing you where all the unobtainum (lol) is. I mean, it looked absolutely visceral in 3D, this quirky little hologram he was playing around with, but seriously, you can tell it's just there to show off 3D.

BlitzKrieg

BlitzKrieg wrote: »

Otacon wrote: »

Bruckheimer certainly got the best out of Bay. Maybe he should go back to him for his next project.

you mean Don Simpson who was involved in both bad boys and The Rock

Bruckheimer has to explain Armageddon, Pearl Harbour and The Island not to mention the craptastic bad boys 2

Simpson was so out of his mind in the last few years of his life that I doubt he was in any way coherent for either Bad Boys or The Rock. Bruckheimrt may make commercial as hell cinema but he knows what sells and works toward that. Armageddon is pure unadulterated fun, a film which will always remind me of the summer. It was an event movie, back when they were only a handful each year.

Bad Boys 2 is pure balls to the Walls insanity and immensely rewatchable, a film so far out there that in order to top it Bay is going to have to destroy enough sports cars to endure a two year waitingust for ferraris. Its s film at which ends around the 100 minute Mark only for another film to start, I always thought that originally they planned the section in Cuba to be part of the screenplay for part 3 and someone just said screw it, let's just film it now.

Bruckheimer wasn't involved in The Island, that was the film that Spielberg coaxed Bay away.

BlitzKrieg

Deleted User wrote: »

Bruckheimer wasn't involved in The Island, that was the film that Spielberg coaxed Bay away.

I thought it was the one they had the falling out over during the production?

BlitzKrieg

BlitzKrieg wrote: »

Deleted User wrote: »

Bruckheimer wasn't involved in The Island, that was the film that Spielberg coaxed Bay away.

I thought it was the one they had the falling out over during the production?

I think the falling out was over the fact that Bay went to work for Dreameorks and in doing so ended his partnership with Bruckheimer.

Beefy78

Overheal wrote: »

The Autobots are selfish pricks.

Think about it.

They basically comitted genocide and destoryed an entire (albeit mechanical, but to them..) Planet. And for what? So like a dozen Autobots could say they fought for freedom? Okay, douchebags.. I mean, seriously.

I'm not sure that really stands up.

We've been told several times that Cybertron is dead so was possibly deserted, we don't know if the Autobots knew that destroying the red shaft would destroy it rather than send it back and anyway had they left it there then its gravitational pull would have likely destroyed the Earth.

Not that I think that any of that factored at all into the writers' reasoning for that set piece.

faceman

Im very surprised at all the comments saying that the action was great. What was so great about it?

We had another highway battle scene.
Another battle scene in a city centre

And as for the glass building nonsense.

And we still dont know who 85% of the transformers were!

johnny_ultimate

Actually, what's the story with that weird old bearded Transformer who was in some of the production stills knocking around? Is there actually a wizened Transformer in this?

Draupnir

My big problem with this entire franchise has been the cheapness of it all, despite the amount of money being spent on it. We've had three movies of Transformers with there ever being a meaningful conversation between any two Transformer characters, not even Megatron and Optimus ever really have a discussion of any great gravitas.

The biggest wish I have is that someone reboots the franchise entirely and actually creates characters of the Transformers instead of making them shape shifting extras in some pro America propaganda bulletin.

This movie had it's moments of decent action and at one point looked like it might have a reasonable storyline, then things started to happen that made absolutely no sense when judged alongside the earlier movies.

How can they explain the Decepticons who start popping out of the surface of the moon when the space bridge is activated? Did I miss something here?

Galvasean

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Actually, what's the story with that weird old bearded Transformer who was in some of the production stills knocking around? Is there actually a wizened Transformer in this?

The Einstein robot guy? I think his name is 'M'. He's basically an Autobot scientist/inventor dude. He just shows up in the hanger with a bunch of other new Autobots. No explanation as to where they came from. Well, nothing beyond "Much time has passed..." or something.
Later in the film as the big battle is about to kick off he

gives the G.I. Joes some weaponry/inventions (which I assume he just carries around for the craic). Next time we see him he is being exocuted by a mob of Decepticons.

irish_stevo815

I was actually disappointed by this movie, and agree with a lot of the criticism here. Once again, it all just ended waaaaaaay to quickly, and just like The Fallen from ROTF,

Megatron was killed off far too easy, for something who was classed as the Bringer of death.

Also, why the hell was he

just sitting the alley like a drunken hobo when Generic Blond Chick ripped the piss out of him??

The general story behind it was utter $hit3, but the effects were pretty good, and the 3D was well used in places. One of my main gripes was

Iron-hide, one of the main Autobots throughout the trilogy, gets killed off half way through and no one even mentions it after wards.

Even Jazz got a mention by Optimus in the first one :eek:

krudler

Deleted User wrote: »

Simpson was so out of his mind in the last few years of his life that I doubt he was in any way coherent for either Bad Boys or The Rock. Bruckheimrt may make commercial as hell cinema but he knows what sells and works toward that. Armageddon is pure unadulterated fun, a film which will always remind me of the summer. It was an event movie, back when they were only a handful each year.

Bad Boys 2 is pure balls to the Walls insanity and immensely rewatchable, a film so far out there that in order to top it Bay is going to have to destroy enough sports cars to endure a two year waitingust for ferraris. Its s film at which ends around the 100 minute Mark only for another film to start, I always thought that originally they planned the section in Cuba to be part of the screenplay for part 3 and someone just said screw it, let's just film it now.

Bruckheimer wasn't involved in The Island, that was the film that Spielberg coaxed Bay away.

Bad Boys 2 is anothr victim of being overlong, the first is 90-odd minutes of enjoyable action comedy, the 2nd is over 2 and a half hours of bad comedy and overdone action, the freeway ferrari/car carrier chase is superb though, the highlight of the movie by far. Bay is one of the directors that gets that low angle tracking shots look the balls in car chases, if he just stopped editing them so quickly.

constitutionus

well went to see it again at the weekend, 3D this time, and i have to say.

its much MUCH better in that format.

in fact i'd go so far to say its the best use of it since avatar.

the fight scene with starscream and sam for instance improves immensely in that format, with sam flying out of the screen at one stage and that took me back to the ol 3D films i seen in my youth in the 80s.

the driller looked great in 3D too.

its STILL too long but its not as dragging in 3D as it is in 2 .

having been let down BIG time with the first viewing i found the second far better as i knew what to expect and bizarrely found myself enjoying it much more the second time around though there are still things that bug me.

dino for instance.

was he the iraqi ministers car in disguise near the beging of the film, who then drops his hologram (which is probably why he's called mirage eleswhere) and transforms attacking the boarder guards ?

the reason i ask is it all happened so bloody fast im not sure what happened there.

also as fun as the final battle was once again generibots filled the screen. worst it had more of a feel of "terminator" than transformers. which is criminal considering all it really needed was a splash of some colour.

one thing i will say though.

was watching the original on telly and the quality is palpably different. its a much leaner , tighter film , with genuine drama in it. somewhere along the way bay lost all that .

at the mo the flims made just shy of 400 million worldwide and its only two weeks in so i reckon were getting a fourth.

i can only hope bay keeps his word and stays away though.

now that the world actually can accept transformers on the big screen this is the best time ever for a reboot that focus's more on the bots and cons as characters than sam and his wacky family. looking at the franchise as a whole the thing that stands out most to me is how little character they got which is just criminal in nearly 8 hours of film time.

EDIT.

by way just wanted to say. the scene with megs sitting on the lincoln memorial seat looked FANTASTIC in 3D. you could literally see the individual layers of his damaged head from the outside in with the angle they chose. its only a small thing but looked great.

Galvasean

Based on the amount of people saying it's better the second time when all niggling hope of it being good is gone.. I amy be tempted to check it out again before it leaves the cinema.

BlitzKrieg

Galvasean wrote: »

Based on the amount of people saying it's better the second time when all niggling hope of it being good is gone.. I amy be tempted to check it out again before it leaves the cinema.

such a weak willed child...

Rick Deckard

Galvasean wrote: »

Based on the amount of people saying it's better the second time when all niggling hope of it being good is gone.. I amy be tempted to check it out again before it leaves the cinema.

For the love of god, no. Give the money to SVdP instead!!

Beefy78

constitutionus wrote: »

by way just wanted to say. the scene with megs sitting on the lincoln memorial seat looked FANTASTIC in 3D. you could literally see the individual layers of his damaged head from the outside in with the angle they chose. its only a small thing but looked great.

I actually thought the best shot was of Optimus Prime

right at the end of the battles with Megatron & Sentinal - with his arm ripped off and that side of his bottle all twisted and broken

it really looked like he was right there in front of me.

Galvasean

Rick Deckard wrote: »

For the love of god, no. Give the money to SVdP instead!!

Didn't realise the St. Vincent de Paul took Cineworld Unlimited card as payment...