16yr old refusing to go to school

LegacyUser

Hi
hopefully someone has experience in this and can help me - apologies for long post..

I have a 16yr old daughter in her 4th year in secondary school, not surprisingly she failed her junior cert - was a bit bothered and promised to make effort in 4th year to prepare for the leaving cert.

Since she started secondary school her attendance in school is appalling, i can honestly say it's a battle every single schoolday to get her to go to school... it's hit and miss with her.. mostly miss - Every day it's the same... at this stage after 4yrs of this battle to get her to go, even do homework - she refuses and there's a battle - nothing works with her - i'm both physically and mentally drained from the early morning battles everyday - i have tried everything... talking/explaining the consequences of having no qualifications; gone to the school and talked to teachers with her- taken all her privilages/phone/ even took the quilt off her bed - even threatened her with boarding school; tried appealing to her good nature that the school can ring social services and i will get into serious trouble if she doesn't attend school.. Nothing works... she doesn't care - she says she's sick - i've taken her to doctors - they found nothing physically wrong with her. She can be extremely abusive and hurtful; has even attacked me on occasion - I seperated from her father 9yrs ago and every argument we have she blames the break up - then she says she's depressed i've booked counselling for her - and she attended a couple of sessions but gave up as she didn't relate to counsellor so i got another and same story - refused to go... and so on. I have even tried reverse psychology and let her off - but she seem's to love this.. would prefer to stay in bed all day and up all night.

I've told her today that if she won't even make the effort she can go and live with her dad as i can't do this anymore. (they have a very volatile relationship)

I went to the school last week again and explained what's going on... they spoke to her aswell and explained that it's very serious - and that she need's her education - she agreed she'd make the effort at least and they said they'd help her catch up... but the very next day she refused to go and and hasn't been in since she refuses to go - this is the 47th school day this year she has missed - i've spent 1.5hrs trying to get her to go. All i'm getting is abuse name calling.

I've tried to get her father to talk to her.. she refuses to answer his call's/texts. I've tried family members and she's same with them... says "i'm sick" "i didn't sleep last nite"..... and then blames me for ruining her life....

I guess what i'm asking here... what can i do? is there a truancy officer or something i can contact to scare her into it or something? I can't stand by and let her throw away her future...

She says i don't care but i have tried everything to help her.. but how can u keep trying if someone is battling you all the way and will do Nothing to help themselves?

Thanks for taking time to read

Please help?

Nevyn

Start taking away her privileges.
Bring her to an appointment with one of the local youth out reach officers.
Find a new counselor for her and for you to help you cope.
You need to stop letting her press your emotional buttons.

Is her Dad still in her life?
Does he have any influence?

me_right_one

Do this:



That was an everyday occurance in my house, and other people's houses during the 80's, for things as simple as talking out of turn. Now I can count the number of school days I missed on one hand.

seanybiker

A few years back when my father was a guard he called to one gir friends house (his friend asked him to) and gave the son a good stern talking to. Dont know what he said but it worked.
Call into your local station and explain your problem to the JLO and see if he/she could help you out. Its worth a shot.

LegacyUser

Thaedydal wrote: »

Start taking away her privileges.
Bring her to an appointment with one of the local youth out reach officers.
Find a new counselor for her and for you to help you cope.
You need to stop letting her press your emotional buttons.

Is her Dad still in her life?
Does he have any influence?

Hi Thaedydal,
thanks for reply,

in total i've book appointments with 5 different counsellors - she point blank refuses to go in. (i can't physically drag her in.. she's bigger/stronger than me)

her dad is around but not much - he's also very abusive to me.. he doesn't do much to help us - i've gotten him to talk to her and she agree's she'll make the effort - tells him what he wants to hear but comes home to me and it's same thing everyday.

I've taken everything from her. she's happy to lay in bed all day and go without

thanks for response

LegacyUser

seanybiker wrote: »

A few years back when my father was a guard he called to one gir friends house (his friend asked him to) and gave the son a good stern talking to. Dont know what he said but it worked.
Call into your local station and explain your problem to the JLO and see if he/she could help you out. Its worth a shot.

my sister has suggested this to me also.. i am ringing them today - thought they wouldn't get involved but it's worth a shot..

thanks

Slydice

I'd say it's impossible to offer decent advice on this thread.

All I see is: daughter bad, daughter problem, daughter this, daughter that...

with this hidden in the middle: oh and I broke up with her dad when she was 7

I reckon you're describing the results of something else or maybe she just magically decided out of no where to stop going to school.

More background to your story might get you better advice.

Also, if you don't know what is/has happened that is resulting in yer daughter mitching school, then I think that should be something you try and find out... unless of course... something magical happened.

Otherwise all I see happening is someone going: Oh look, a problem exists and I don't know what it is, I'll fix it by throwing bandages around the results rather than try and find out or fix the actual problem.

Nevyn

me_right_one Do not advocate violence or child about on this forum ever!
There is a zero tolerance policy for trolls next time you will just be banned outright.

Nevyn

In fairness Slydice it looks like the daughter is using the fact that her parents split up as a reason to blame all her woes on and to abuse her mother. She's 16 and needs to learn that life isn't fair and she can't just stay in bed cos she doesn't like her life and blame her mother.

Have you any other adults who are in her life who can talk to her.

Give that she is just staying in bed all day, I would be taking her to the dr or call the dr to the house, if there is a chance it is a medical issue. If that is the case then at least it is happening in 4th year rather then when she is in the leaving cert program.
Start with the dr.

Have you done any parenting classes yourself?
Would you consider going to your local health clinic to chat to the socail workers there and see what supports they can offer for you both?

LegacyUser

Slydice wrote: »

I'd say it's impossible to offer decent advice on this thread.

All I see is: daughter bad, daughter problem, daughter this, daughter that...

with this hidden in the middle: oh and I broke up with her dad when she was 7

I reckon you're describing the results of something else or maybe she just magically decided out of no where to stop going to school.

More background to your story might get you better advice.

Also, if you don't know what is/has happened that is resulting in yer daughter mitching school, then I think that should be something you try and find out... unless of course... something magical happened.

Otherwise all I see happening is someone going: Oh look, a problem exists and I don't know what it is, I'll fix it by throwing bandages around the results rather than try and find out or fix the actual problem.

Dear Slydice,

You have completely misread / or failed to read properly - but prefer to make assumptions?
Your comment :- "All I see is: daughter bad, daughter problem, daughter this, daughter that..." - is offencive and so completely wrong. How can you make this about me using this as a "bandage" rather than finding out what the problem is. as i said i have tried talking to her - taken her to family mediation/ numerous counsellors - close family her friends have spoken to her - I've sat down with her and asked her and got her to open up to me - and it's the same thing.. she has no interest in school - there is no issue of bullying etc she has lots of friends there - Also the only reason the break up was even mentioned was because my daughter throws that in my face. Nothing "Magical" as you put it, happened. That's the background there in a nutshell.

LegacyUser

Thaedydal wrote: »

In fairness Slydice it looks like the daughter is using the fact that her parents split up as a reason to blame all her woes on and to abuse her mother. She's 16 and needs to learn that life isn't fair and she can't just stay in bed cos she doesn't like her life and blame her mother.

Have you any other adults who are in her life who can talk to her.

Give that she is just staying in bed all day, I would be taking her to the dr or call the dr to the house, if there is a chance it is a medical issue. If that is the case then at least it is happening in 4th year rather then when she is in the leaving cert program.
Start with the dr.

Have you done any parenting classes yourself?
Would you consider going to your local health clinic to chat to the socail workers there and see what supports they can offer for you both?

Hi,
thanks for that - that's exactly how it is. I brought her to the doctor last thursday - he has checked everything - bloods, full medical check up. just awaiting the results of thyroid now... but everything came back clear. I myself thought it may be depression or something.. but he's reluctant to give medication to someone so young and i agree, he also recommended revisiting counselling but she told him also she doesn't need it. All of my family have spoken to her aswell - but to no avail.

I haven't tried parenting classes myself - its certainly something i will look into today. I will also try the social worker and JLO - but i fear it'll be same thing as in the past - she'll tell them what they want to hear but won't go

But thank you for taking time to read the post and seeing the situation as it actually is

Little My

Just thought I'd reply as I went through something very similar when I was at school. When I was 16 I was supposed to be sitting my GCSE's in May and I dropped out of school in Feb.

I had appointments with the principle and it was all 'oh we want to see you back in your uniform next week' and I point blank refused to go. I said I'd sit my exams and I did, and didn't actually do too badly given that I hadn't been in school for 4 months.

There were problems at home which were probably affecting me more than I realised, and I hated the culture of the school. It was a very cliquey all-girls school. I was bullied a bit in junior school, but at the time I just thought no one liked me so it was my own fault. Some teachers were really good and gave friends the notes to give me, some didn't.

Another thing was that I was convinced I was going to do really badly in the exams, so just didn't really see the point of trying. I went as far as applying to secretarial courses as I thought I was going to fail anyway and wouldn't be able to sit my A-Levels.

When it turned out I did okay in my exams, I was delighted and agreed to go back to the same school for my A-Level's, and in hindsight this was the biggest mistake I made. It was obvious I wasn't happy at the school, so why I went back I don’t know.

But it meant that during my two years of A-Levels I was averaging 40% attendance. I made friends out of school and had no interest in going, and it just got worse and worse. I had 3 teachers, 1 who was very supportive, 1 who wouldn’t have known if I was there or not, and 1 who reacted in a way which made it even harder for me to go.

When I did go, she would make lots of sarcastic remarks; 'nice to see you here today', 'did you find your way in okay or did you need a map?' and if I answered questions in class correctly it would be 'see how much you can learn when you bother to show up?' etc.

So it turned into a horrible spiral of not going, then not going because of what she would say. She even accused me of skipping classes with one of the girls who bullied me a little (she had v.bad attendance too - the days were bound to overlap!)

So, back to your daughter.

You can't make her go to school, you can encourage her to go, but you can't make her. Try to see if there are any problems at school with other kids or teachers. Consider changing schools - it would have helped me a lot I think as I would have had to prove myself to new teachers.

I was very active in my youth club and learned a lot from it. Does she have interests and hobbies out of school?

The other thing is that while getting a good education at school is the easiest way to do it, it is not the only way. There will always be opportunities to go back or do courses.

Just to let you know, despite doing only ok in my GCSE's and pretty poorly in my A-Levels, I still went on to uni and did pretty well, and I am now considering applying for a Phd.

Just thought I'd add in that I had battles every day with my mother, but she couldn't physically force me to go. She went as far as calling the police in the morning when I wouldn't go. That didn't work either.

Slydice

Thaedydal wrote: »

In fairness Slydice it looks like the daughter is using the fact that her parents split up as a reason to blame all her woes on and to abuse her mother. She's 16 and needs to learn that life isn't fair and she can't just stay in bed cos she doesn't like her life and blame her mother.

Well if that's the case, then best of luck working with the rule of:
life ain't fair
and then thinking that you can fix something:
because it's not fair

I'm think that making sure you know what the actual problem is and sorting that out would probably go a long way towards helping the situation.

Nevyn

Slydice wrote: »

Well if that's the case, then best of luck working with the rule of:
life ain't fair
and then thinking that you can fix something:
because it's not fair

Oh please, it's more the fact that there are things which can't be changed,
those have to be accepted and the things which can be changed worked on
rather then focusing on things which can't.

You can waste time and energy bitching about the hand that life had dealt you or you can do you best with what you have.

WorriedMom wrote: »

Hi,
thanks for that - that's exactly how it is. I brought her to the doctor last thursday - he has checked everything - bloods, full medical check up. just awaiting the results of thyroid now... but everything came back clear. I myself thought it may be depression or something.. but he's reluctant to give medication to someone so young and i agree, he also recommended revisiting counselling but she told him also she doesn't need it. All of my family have spoken to her aswell - but to no avail.

I understand his reluctance and there are frankly sod all mental health services for those who are under 18 but that being said it's not something which should be over looked due to hoping it isn't the case. I have know teens who ended up in very dire situations which could have been prevented due to lack of early invention.

WorriedMom wrote: »

I haven't tried parenting classes myself - its certainly something i will look into today. I will also try the social worker and JLO - but i fear it'll be same thing as in the past - she'll tell them what they want to hear but won't go

But thank you for taking time to read the post and seeing the situation as it actually is

You need support while dealing with this so you have to look to access that for you as well as what supports are there for her.

Little My

One other thing I would say...

Encourage hobbies and a social life. If she is happy in life outside school it might tip the balance to allow her to put up with or even start enjoying school.

Make sure she is aware of the alternatives of not going to school. Not just by telling her, but by getting the prospectus and lists of courses in your area so she can see for herself. Maybe encourage applying for summer work?

If she realises the courses and jobs she would like to do are not open to someone without junior / leaving cert she might be able to motivate herself a little more.

I know school/offical certs are seen as the be all and end all of everything, but they aren't. I know plenty of people who didn't get the certs and have found their own way and have very happy lives.

Slydice

Thaedydal wrote: »

Oh please, it's more the fact that there are things which can't be changed,
those have to be accepted and the things which can be changed worked on
rather then focusing on things which can't.

You can waste time and energy bitching about the hand that life had dealt you or you can do you best with what you have.

Yeah and you can waste a bunch more time fixing something which isn't broken than taking some time out to find out the actual problem and fixing that.

dark crystal

WorriedMom wrote: »

Hi
hopefully someone has experience in this and can help me - apologies for long post..

I have a 16yr old daughter in her 4th year in secondary school, not surprisingly she failed her junior cert - was a bit bothered and promised to make effort in 4th year to prepare for the leaving cert.

Since she started secondary school her attendance in school is appalling, i can honestly say it's a battle every single schoolday to get her to go to school... it's hit and miss with her.. mostly miss - Every day it's the same... at this stage after 4yrs of this battle to get her to go, even do homework - she refuses and there's a battle - nothing works with her - i'm both physically and mentally drained from the early morning battles everyday - i have tried everything... talking/explaining the consequences of having no qualifications; gone to the school and talked to teachers with her- taken all her privilages/phone/ even took the quilt off her bed - even threatened her with boarding school; tried appealing to her good nature that the school can ring social services and i will get into serious trouble if she doesn't attend school.. Nothing works... she doesn't care - she says she's sick - i've taken her to doctors - they found nothing physically wrong with her. She can be extremely abusive and hurtful; has even attacked me on occasion - I seperated from her father 9yrs ago and every argument we have she blames the break up - then she says she's depressed i've booked counselling for her - and she attended a couple of sessions but gave up as she didn't relate to counsellor so i got another and same story - refused to go... and so on. I have even tried reverse psychology and let her off - but she seem's to love this.. would prefer to stay in bed all day and up all night.

I've told her today that if she won't even make the effort she can go and live with her dad as i can't do this anymore. (they have a very volatile relationship)

I went to the school last week again and explained what's going on... they spoke to her aswell and explained that it's very serious - and that she need's her education - she agreed she'd make the effort at least and they said they'd help her catch up... but the very next day she refused to go and and hasn't been in since she refuses to go - this is the 47th school day this year she has missed - i've spent 1.5hrs trying to get her to go. All i'm getting is abuse name calling.

I've tried to get her father to talk to her.. she refuses to answer his call's/texts. I've tried family members and she's same with them... says "i'm sick" "i didn't sleep last nite"..... and then blames me for ruining her life....

I guess what i'm asking here... what can i do? is there a truancy officer or something i can contact to scare her into it or something? I can't stand by and let her throw away her future...

She says i don't care but i have tried everything to help her.. but how can u keep trying if someone is battling you all the way and will do Nothing to help themselves?

Thanks for taking time to read

Please help?

You poor thing - my heart goes out to you, it really does.

I was in a very similar situation with my daughter, who's 15, but thankfully she seems back on track now, thank God. Not perfect by any means, but much better than it was.

Myself and her father, who are seperated but still get on very well, took the hard line with her and told her we could do no more and if her attitude didn't change fast, we would have to look at putting her into foster care. We then called social services and arranged for a counciller to have a chat with her. She only went once, but it did seem to do the trick.
If your daughter refuses to go to councilling, you could always ask a social worker or perhaps a community liaison garda out to your home to have a chat with her.

Have you tried Parentline? Even if they can't help with your daughter, they can be a tremendeous support to yourself.

Best of luck to you.

Slydice

WorriedMom wrote: »

Dear Slydice,

You have completely misread / or failed to read properly - but prefer to make assumptions?
Your comment :- "All I see is: daughter bad, daughter problem, daughter this, daughter that..." - is offencive and so completely wrong. How can you make this about me using this as a "bandage" rather than finding out what the problem is. as i said i have tried talking to her - taken her to family mediation/ numerous counsellors - close family her friends have spoken to her - I've sat down with her and asked her and got her to open up to me - and it's the same thing.. she has no interest in school - there is no issue of bullying etc she has lots of friends there - Also the only reason the break up was even mentioned was because my daughter throws that in my face. Nothing "Magical" as you put it, happened. That's the background there in a nutshell.

right so, are you saying the problem is your relationship breakup with her dad?

if so, then I think sorting that out with her might get you better results than trying to sort out her school with her.

if not, then I'd say it'd help with the discussions about school later, something like the difference between:
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about the breakup
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about the breakup
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about the breakup
etc...

versus
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about going to school
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about going to school
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about going to school

do you see how one has something that isn't about school in it?

SLUSK

Take her to an area with many addicts, prostitutes and so on and show her what her future could be like if she does not change her ways. Find a way to scare her straight.

LegacyUser

Slydice wrote: »

right so, are you saying the problem is your relationship breakup with her dad?

if so, then I think sorting that out with her might get you better results than trying to sort out her school with her.

if not, then I'd say it'd help with the discussions about school later, something like the difference between:
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about the breakup
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about the breakup
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about the breakup
etc...

versus
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about going to school
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about going to school
you: argument about going to school
her: argument about going to school

do you see how one has something that isn't about school in it?

Dear Slydice,

With respect ... are you even reading my posts? - I did not say my relationship with her dad is the problem - my relationship with her dad is completely irrelevant to this. the breakup is not the issue here. If anything My daughter and i live better lives since the break up. My daughter only uses this as an excuse for her behaviour when i comes to not going to school and the argument that follows - the rest of the time it's not an issue.

Nevyn

Slydice enough already, she has said she is addressing that issues or has been trying to get the daughter to address that issue with counselling, she isn't ignoring it and badgering her about it isn't helpful.

Do you have anything constructive to suggest?

LegacyUser

Thaedydal wrote: »

Slydice enough already, she has said she is addressing that issues or has been trying to get the daughter to address that issue with counselling, she isn't ignoring it and badgering her about it isn't helpful.

Do you have anything constructive to suggest?

thank u

Slydice

Thaedydal, in light of your post and that:
I'm not a parent
You're the moderator
I thought I was being constructive

I'll stop posting on this thread. Best of luck with it.

Phibsboro

I would second the change of school idea - especially with a natural break for LC cycle coming up. If you can afford it and you are in Dublin maybe even get her into somewhere like the institute where there is a more "adult" approach to 5th/6th. Its not something I would have recommended before tbh (I always thought of the students as slightly brattish ) but I know someone who couldn't get into the leaving at all and the institute worked wonders for him.

Beyond that, is she into sport at all? If I look back to my own youth I think the one thing I regret is not having a sporty hobby. I jog now and the difference it makes in my life is amazing. It would be especially good at breaking the stay in bed all day/up all night habit. Try to get her out jogging with you - maybe aim to do a fun run together before the summer. If you can't jog yourself, there are a number of techniques to get started (e.g. http://www.c25k.com/) - I couldn't jog for 100m when I started a couple of years ago

Doing an active sport clears the head, paradoxically gives you more energy and improves your self esteem as you make progress. Doing it together with your daughter also allows a natural opportunity for conversation.

Good luck

c

me_right_one

Slydice wrote: »

I'd say it's impossible to offer decent advice on this thread

Thats for sure! A bit of tough love is all you need, and if you dont dish it out, then your child's failings are your fault

LegacyUser

Phibsboro wrote: »

I would second the change of school idea - especially with a natural break for LC cycle coming up. If you can afford it and you are in Dublin maybe even get her into somewhere like the institute where there is a more "adult" approach to 5th/6th. Its not something I would have recommended before tbh (I always thought of the students as slightly brattish ) but I know someone who couldn't get into the leaving at all and the institute worked wonders for him.

Beyond that, is she into sport at all? If I look back to my own youth I think the one thing I regret is not having a sporty hobby. I jog now and the difference it makes in my life is amazing. It would be especially good at breaking the stay in bed all day/up all night habit. Try to get her out jogging with you - maybe aim to do a fun run together before the summer. If you can't jog yourself, there are a number of techniques to get started (e.g. http://www.c25k.com/) - I couldn't jog for 100m when I started a couple of years ago

Doing an active sport clears the head, paradoxically gives you more energy and improves your self esteem as you make progress. Doing it together with your daughter also allows a natural opportunity for conversation.

Good luck

c

hi,
yes, she plays camogie (is just back training now) and plays football also. I've suggested changing schools to her but this she completely shoots down; she says she's lots of friends there. I don't live in dublin, but that said - i think it's a good idea to change the environment and maybe try and get her into an alternative form of learning like you suggested.

Ash.J.Williams

I think not having a Junior cert and heading towards no leaving cert means that school is not suitable. Has she any idea what she would like to do? Unfortunately Most vocasional training requires junior cert. I know people who brought their kids to drug rehab clinics and homeless shelters to show them the horrors of what can happen when you fall out of the system, (which sadly is what's happening). Personally i would have got my ass kicked and would have accepted that to be honest.
I cannot focus on academic work at all, i have failed at all attempts at a degree (not actually failed but lost interest) but knew what i wanted to do and just went and did it. To do that the kid must have a clear goal.
Having been though the system i felt that some kids i was in school with were wasting their time (and others through disruption) and should have been encouraged to take up a training course and do something more interesting.
Right now the worst thing possible that can happen is to fail school and not have a backup plan. That always end bad. WHat would she like to do?

Nevyn

me_right_one wrote: »

Thats for sure! A bit of tough love is all you need, and if you dont dish it out, then your child's failings are your fault

me_right_one had been banned from the forum for trolling.
This forum is a supportive place for parents and their remarks
and statements about children need to be physically abused are not welcome here.
This forum has a zero troll tolerance policy.

flynnlives

Take away all allowances, pc, internet, tv, take them outta the house if needs be.

go and ask the biggest burly Garda you can find to call to your house and have a sturn talking too. If that fails follow it up quickly with the foster care angle. Short sharp wake up calls are the only way to get to her.

If that all fails well its off to work you go, shes 16, she can get a job, if your not gonna go to school your not gonna ly in bed all day, take away her allowances and tell her if she wants to live in your house she has to pay rent and pay her way.

She has alot of anger directed towards you, i reckon she blames you for the fact that her dad is not in the house. I could be totally wrong tho. Its just a thought.

zuppycool

hi felt I had to reply to this, had a very simular situation with my daughter same thing wouldnt go to school and there wasnt any real reason for it just total lack of interest. In the end I think she was using school as a tool as it was the one thing that she had real control over and knew how mad it made me that she wouldnt go. But the maddder I got the more she dug her heals in.
I tried moving her school but couldnt get her in anywhere but the fact that i tried seemed to work with her and she realised that she had no option but to stick with that one I also did a parenting course and that helped with me not flying off the handle so quickly but its really hard when your trying to get out to work and get other kids to school and they start this
shes still not great but goes most of the time and if she starts i just say fine but you know you wont be going outside for the rest of the week if you dont and she knows i mean it
I really do sympathise with you and hope you work something out for your own sanity

silja

I think a new school may well help, too. You mention in your first post that you threatened her with boarding school... maybe it should become a reality. Not as a punishment, but because a break from eachother during the week may just be what you both need, and boarding schools are used to dealing with teenagers and have lots of study time in the evening to help her catch up.