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16yr old refusing to go to school
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If she wants to stay in bed let her. She'll have no job, money or anything. She won't be able to buy her pink tracksuit. Let her lie in bed. She will be sorry. Ignore her for as long as possible. You say it best when you say nothing at all.0
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Nothing theoretical about what I proposed. It worked on my own child in particularly difficult and time-pressed circumstances, as I have seen it work for many other children in many differing circumstances.
Children seek stability, which comes with regulation and a firm structure in their lives. They will only respect authority if they see it acting in their best interests and are involved in the process.
However, being consistent in such an approach is difficult, as is sustaining the patience and calmness required to see it through to a successful conclusion.
That's why I see parents give up and give in. But that approach never solved the underlying issues that all children who effectively go on strike like this are experiencing.
Without getting to the core of the problem, you have no chance of resolving it.
Frankly, proposals to medicate children who act inconveniently, or indeed to outsource the parenting to a boarding school or bootcamp, strike me as the exact opposite of responsible parenting.
Those options all share the common theme of wanting to make the problem something or someone else's.0 -
My mam had the exact same issue with my younger brother after his junior cert' she had real issues getting him to go to school! She tried everything and i mean everything !!! The counseling didn't work , the family members talking didn't work. in the end she advised him that he had to get a job before he could leave school. He has done this and is thriving ever since. Its hard to be a parent and kids will always throw their emotions towards you . Hold tough and good luck.. you can only do your best
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Cavehill Red, it is a theoretical approach. And it works wonderfully when put to practice. On a majority of children. I'm so glad it worked with your daughter.
However it also implies that, on a minority of children/teenagers, this will not work.
I work with teenagers.
They're all different (thank goodness), just like you and I are different.
Take the situation where a boss offers, in a very diplomatic way, constructive criticism to an employee, on a past mistake they made.
Your reaction, my reaction, and somebody else's reaction might be different. The boss' approach is the same, the response is different.
Kids will not all respond to authority, or praise/encouragement, or talk, or making deals and contracts, in the same manner. Kids may have different issues, not always connected to their parents educational approach. We all as humans have personal issues.
The whole process of growing up involves learning how to resolve your issues, or deal with them. Since you are well versed in this regard, you obviously understand the common teenage issues : "who am I really ?" "Should I be like her/him ?" "Do I have a choice ?" "Am I good enough ?", etc... etc...
Parents can (and should, of course they should !) support, surround, help, guide, but they will not resolve these issues for the kids.
Sometimes parents may actually unwillingly hamper the kid's progress in that regard. Sometimes the teenager just needs to be away from the family cell for a while, to process what's happening to him/her, and make their own decisions, come to their own conclusions, achieve their own, unfacilitated, victories.
When your child moves on to school from a home environment, you let go of a great number of things you had control over, as a parent, because you know that your child will make their own way in the new environment, that they even need to make their own progress. Some children need more support, some less. Some will appeal to you for help, others won't.
A parent who is willing to let go, so their child might progress, learn, experience new things, in a bootcamp, in a boarding school, on a school trip, on a sleep-over or an outing away, is not necessarily a parent who refuses to face his/her responsibility.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 25439
hi op,
could bullying in school be a factor?
i was bullied throughout primary, secondary was better, but by that stage, i had no interest and just coasted. the only reason i went in every day was i had a very strict dad (old-fashioned) and if i became problematic he would come down on me like a ton of bricks. i scraped a leaving cert, and went out working as soon as i could.
i regret now not going to college- i think that aside from a qualification, social interaction and maturing are things i could have benfitted from, but in my thirties now, im studying accountancy. basically, while its not ideal, she can always get her qualifications, even if its a longer, harder road.
it might be hormonal (mine were all over the place) or depression, or even about a boy, or maybe someone in school is making her life a living hell.
i hope it works out for both of you *hugs*0 -
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hi op,
could bullying in school be a factor?
i was bullied throughout primary, secondary was better, but by that stage, i had no interest and just coasted. the only reason i went in every day was i had a very strict dad (old-fashioned) and if i became problematic he would come down on me like a ton of bricks. i scraped a leaving cert, and went out working as soon as i could.
i regret now not going to college- i think that aside from a qualification, social interaction and maturing are things i could have benfitted from, but in my thirties now, im studying accountancy. basically, while its not ideal, she can always get her qualifications, even if its a longer, harder road.
it might be hormonal (mine were all over the place) or depression, or even about a boy, or maybe someone in school is making her life a living hell.
i hope it works out for both of you *hugs*
Firstly, i just want to thank evreyone for their responses, and Mountainsandh described exactly my thoughts on one particular suggestion.
I rang the JLO yesterday to see if they can help - but they won't get involved in a situation like this as my daughter hasn't been referred to them through the normal channels... ie the courts or the guards... but she did give me the name of counsellor in our area that is supposed to be very good with troubled teens.. so i booked an appointment... my daughter hasn't said NO.... but not committed to this either.... i suppose she'll go if she feels she needs it... at least we know it's there if need be..
I've spent yesterday evening and today talking at lenght with my daughter about what's really going on with her and yes, she has told me one huge problem - basically she's spent months alone in school with no-one to talk to there- she has fallen out with friends - one girl accused her of lying and the rest of the group followed suit.. so they have all dropped her - she doesn't have anyone to go on breaks or lunch with and sits alone all day - on the school bus/class and in school canteen or just waiting in cubicle in toilets until it's time to go back to class; she's devasted and feels they are all ganging up on her and no one likes her. she doesn't know why they don't believe her and apparently they have been taunting her and making fun of her for months now- she goes to an all girls school - and they have their own groups which they hang around together with, so now she's been dropped from her group she feels she hasn't got one friend in the school, her confidence is at an all time low at the minute and doesn't feel she can get new set of friends there. This broke my heart and i cried most of the day today thinking how alone she must feel because she doesn't have friends her own age where we live either.. She said she didn't tell me as she didn't want to upset me (i care for my elderly mother going through chemo at the moment, and have been pre occupied/worried about my mum too)
I have rang the principal today again and we are meeting with her after easter break to see if they can help with trying to catch up on subjects (small goals for now) and weekly study plans etc,, The principal says she will keep an eye on how she is getting on with breaks etc but feels that it's not a huge problem... i think this is a very big problem..but don't know how i can reconcile her with her friends.. and by the sounds of them.. their not much friends anyway by the way they are treating her over the last few months.
I have suggested she changes schools.. and repeats 4th year (by way of a fresh start, Not to move the problem elsewhere) and would also give her some breathing space and alleviate some of the pressure of the upcoming leaving cert... and she's considering this.. whether she will or not will remain to be seen...
she also feels overwhelmed because she's missed so much time.. she can't concentrate in class - and she can't catch up. she want's to get into acting as she's always had an interest in drama/music/dance etc..... but i've explained that's extremely difficult to into and she needs some back up plan.. plus to be honest.. i wouldn't have a clue where to start getting her on the right track there.. i've looked up agents etc but havnt' followed it up yet.. as i said don't have a clue where to start with that.
So that's where we're at at the moment.... she vented a lot of anger at me last night... but i remained calm... and took it... as though it didn't matter... i had to bite my tongue but it was worth it when she opened up... i've explained to her that because she's not in school these girls don't see it as a problem and have moved on with their own lives... but she needs to go back and start from there.
thanks for everyones responses0 -
Mountainsandh wrote: »Cavehill Red, it is a theoretical approach. And it works wonderfully when put to practice. On a majority of children. I'm so glad it worked with your daughter.
However it also implies that, on a minority of children/teenagers, this will not work.
I work with teenagers.
They're all different (thank goodness), just like you and I are different.
Take the situation where a boss offers, in a very diplomatic way, constructive criticism to an employee, on a past mistake they made.
Your reaction, my reaction, and somebody else's reaction might be different. The boss' approach is the same, the response is different.
Kids will not all respond to authority, or praise/encouragement, or talk, or making deals and contracts, in the same manner. Kids may have different issues, not always connected to their parents educational approach. We all as humans have personal issues.
The whole process of growing up involves learning how to resolve your issues, or deal with them. Since you are well versed in this regard, you obviously understand the common teenage issues : "who am I really ?" "Should I be like her/him ?" "Do I have a choice ?" "Am I good enough ?", etc... etc...
Parents can (and should, of course they should !) support, surround, help, guide, but they will not resolve these issues for the kids.
Sometimes parents may actually unwillingly hamper the kid's progress in that regard. Sometimes the teenager just needs to be away from the family cell for a while, to process what's happening to him/her, and make their own decisions, come to their own conclusions, achieve their own, unfacilitated, victories.
When your child moves on to school from a home environment, you let go of a great number of things you had control over, as a parent, because you know that your child will make their own way in the new environment, that they even need to make their own progress. Some children need more support, some less. Some will appeal to you for help, others won't.
A parent who is willing to let go, so their child might progress, learn, experience new things, in a bootcamp, in a boarding school, on a school trip, on a sleep-over or an outing away, is not necessarily a parent who refuses to face his/her responsibility.
I don't get the impression that the OP has followed through the suggestions I made fully.
I also work with youngsters, and I see this all the time. Parents are keen to find alternate caregivers, and are keen to offload the responsibilities.
While I agree with much of what you say, in dealing with an 16 yo in protest against, effectively, their entire life, then to use IT terminology a full reboot is necessary.
It's possible even this won't resolve the matter. I myself had problems with my father and moved out at 16. That resolved the matter for me. Parental engagement at that point wasn't working and was unlikely to work given previous experience.
But that really isn't very common. And what I proposed fulfils both remits. If the child won't engage, they'll do their own thing, and sink or swim on their own merits and that's their choice.
If they do engage, even in part, then it's down to the parents to make it happen. But that's as I said generally too difficult for many parents, who often have other children, or other reasons to give up or give in.0 -
Yes, I like that phrase.
Maybe the full reboot, and resolving one's issues away from family and previous environment is more common than we think, I myself, although legally an adult, was mentally a teenager, until I moved out and away from my family in my late teens and twenties. I love them dearly and we all get on great, I miss them sometimes, and go back home often, but I am happier some distance away. Well, an ocean and a thousand miles away in fact
(I am French).
I know exactly what you're saying about parents shifting the responsibility onto someone else, every day business for me too, and infuriating. Very much in your face sometimes as in : "My Johnny just defaced the bench in the park, what are the guards doing ?". Or more insidious.
But I do think the OP seems to have given it a good go. Maybe the OP just needs a bit of a break from it all, a bit of perspective or recharging the batteries.
OP I hope these titbits of discussion may help you look at things from different perspectives. You know best. Maybe you have hit a brick wall, and letting go, giving your daughter space might be the next thing on the agenda. Maybe it was a moment of discouragement and now you feel you might have it in you to try again. It's tough being a concerned parent. No harm in pausing and re-assessing the situation sometimes, no harm in starting all over, even giving previous tactics another try. What didn't work 4 months ago might just work this week, that's the nature of teenagers.
The very best luck with it !0 -
Cavehill Red wrote: »I don't get the impression that the OP has followed through the suggestions I made fully.
I also work with youngsters, and I see this all the time. Parents are keen to find alternate caregivers, and are keen to offload the responsibilities.
While I agree with much of what you say, in dealing with an 16 yo in protest against, effectively, their entire life, then to use IT terminology a full reboot is necessary.
It's possible even this won't resolve the matter. I myself had problems with my father and moved out at 16. That resolved the matter for me. Parental engagement at that point wasn't working and was unlikely to work given previous experience.
But that really isn't very common. And what I proposed fulfils both remits. If the child won't engage, they'll do their own thing, and sink or swim on their own merits and that's their choice.
If they do engage, even in part, then it's down to the parents to make it happen. But that's as I said generally too difficult for many parents, who often have other children, or other reasons to give up or give in.
I think your work is colouring your views on parents in general and I suggest you do not judge posters based on the dealings you have in work.0 -
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Would a TY programme in a new school be a good idea, maybe one that has a drama programme or club? It could be an incentive for her to attend school.
Maybe look into youth theatre groups in your area. She is only 16 so I wouldn't worry too much about the back-up plan just yet. Time enough for that when shes back in school maybe.0 -
Cavehill Red wrote: »I think you know nothing about me at all and should rein in your own rush to judgement.
I think you should apply to yourself also when placing judgement on me and others0 -
Join Date:Posts: 25439
WorriedMom wrote: »what's really going on with her and yes, she has told me one huge problem - basically she's spent months alone in school with no-one to talk to there- she has fallen out with friends - one girl accused her of lying and the rest of the group followed suit.. so they have all dropped her - she doesn't have anyone to go on breaks or lunch with and sits alone all day - on the school bus/class and in school canteen or just waiting in cubicle in toilets until it's time to go back to class; she's devasted and feels they are all ganging up on her and no one likes her. she doesn't know why they don't believe her and apparently they have been taunting her and making fun of her for months now- she goes to an all girls school - and they have their own groups which they hang around together with, so now she's been dropped from her group she feels she hasn't got one friend in the school, her confidence is at an all time low at the minute and doesn't feel she can get new set of friends there. This broke my heart and i cried most of the day today thinking how alone she must feel because she doesn't have friends her own age where we live either..
this is a GREAT breakthrough.. well done you both. i think your approach is a great one here, and breaking it down into managable issues to deal with together one by one is key..look at all the options with her, and see which one suits you both.
of course the principal doesnt think bullying is a big deal - clearly shes never been bullied herself. i endured years of it and because the bullies were from affluent families in the area, principal never did a single thing to help. its very hard to deal with - any 'official' attempts to solve it from the school may take it outside of the school area, or escalate it and make the situation worse. even though you would love to give those little b**ches a piece of your mind, be guided by your daughter on what she thinks might work or not. she is living it after all.it affected various areas of my life, so you are right to take this seriously. dont be convinced by the school otherwise.
it all probably had a knock on effect, the bullying caused her to miss school which caused her to fall behind which causes anxiety, with noone to talk to builds up and all she can do is try to avoid the horrible situation and unleash her frustration in the one safe space (you)
but there is light at the end of the tunnel - school is not forever, college is way different. having my mum as a sympathetic ear helped me get through it.
a move to another school, repeating a year might be all it needs - i hadnt that option but would have loved a fresh start at the time. immediately, can she do something else on her breaks - eg leave the school for lunchtime, help out in the tuckshop or something that she doesnt have to hide in a toilet? repeating a year is no big deal, and removes the 'catchup' pressure she is under at the moment
counselling will help her come to terms with her feelings on the issues, and give her great coping skills to deal with her bullies, as well as build her confidence. i wouldnt let her give this up just yet.
in light of the bullying, i dont think a boot camp will do anything to solve her anger, it only adds another stressor into the mix to deal with, and she doesnt deserve it. but there still needs to be ground rules that she needs to abide by.
she is also probably very lonely, can you hang out with her doing girlie stuff on a weekend or something? any kind of hobbies that might interest her?
school work can always be caught up on - im proof of that, but first the bullying issue needs tackled and you might be surprised what falls into place after that.:D0 -
WorriedMom wrote: »Hi
hopefully someone has experience in this and can help me - apologies for long post..
I have a 16yr old daughter in her 4th year in secondary school, not surprisingly she failed her junior cert - was a bit bothered and promised to make effort in 4th year to prepare for the leaving cert.
Since she started secondary school her attendance in school is appalling, i can honestly say it's a battle every single schoolday to get her to go to school... it's hit and miss with her.. mostly miss - Every day it's the same... at this stage after 4yrs of this battle to get her to go, even do homework - she refuses and there's a battle - nothing works with her - i'm both physically and mentally drained from the early morning battles everyday - i have tried everything... talking/explaining the consequences of having no qualifications; gone to the school and talked to teachers with her- taken all her privilages/phone/ even took the quilt off her bed - even threatened her with boarding school; tried appealing to her good nature that the school can ring social services and i will get into serious trouble if she doesn't attend school.. Nothing works... she doesn't care - she says she's sick - i've taken her to doctors - they found nothing physically wrong with her. She can be extremely abusive and hurtful; has even attacked me on occasion - I seperated from her father 9yrs ago and every argument we have she blames the break up - then she says she's depressed i've booked counselling for her - and she attended a couple of sessions but gave up as she didn't relate to counsellor so i got another and same story - refused to go... and so on. I have even tried reverse psychology and let her off - but she seem's to love this.. would prefer to stay in bed all day and up all night.
I've told her today that if she won't even make the effort she can go and live with her dad as i can't do this anymore. (they have a very volatile relationship)
I went to the school last week again and explained what's going on... they spoke to her aswell and explained that it's very serious - and that she need's her education - she agreed she'd make the effort at least and they said they'd help her catch up... but the very next day she refused to go and and hasn't been in since she refuses to go - this is the 47th school day this year she has missed - i've spent 1.5hrs trying to get her to go. All i'm getting is abuse name calling.
I've tried to get her father to talk to her.. she refuses to answer his call's/texts. I've tried family members and she's same with them... says "i'm sick" "i didn't sleep last nite"..... and then blames me for ruining her life....
I guess what i'm asking here... what can i do? is there a truancy officer or something i can contact to scare her into it or something? I can't stand by and let her throw away her future...
She says i don't care but i have tried everything to help her.. but how can u keep trying if someone is battling you all the way and will do Nothing to help themselves?
Thanks for taking time to read
Please help?
Throw her out of the house and let her fend for herself.If she is too selfish to listen to your advice then she can get a dose of the real world.0 -
If you have really tried everything than this than this may be the way to go. She obv needs perspective.Throw her out of the house and let her fend for herself.If she is too selfish to listen to your advice then she can get a dose of the real world.
It must be infuriating as a parent to see how immature her behavior is.0 -
this is a GREAT breakthrough.. well done you both. i think your approach is a great one here, and breaking it down into managable issues to deal with together one by one is key..look at all the options with her, and see which one suits you both.
of course the principal doesnt think bullying is a big deal - clearly shes never been bullied herself. i endured years of it and because the bullies were from affluent families in the area, principal never did a single thing to help. its very hard to deal with - any 'official' attempts to solve it from the school may take it outside of the school area, or escalate it and make the situation worse. even though you would love to give those little b**ches a piece of your mind, be guided by your daughter on what she thinks might work or not. she is living it after all.it affected various areas of my life, so you are right to take this seriously. dont be convinced by the school otherwise.
it all probably had a knock on effect, the bullying caused her to miss school which caused her to fall behind which causes anxiety, with noone to talk to builds up and all she can do is try to avoid the horrible situation and unleash her frustration in the one safe space (you)
but there is light at the end of the tunnel - school is not forever, college is way different. having my mum as a sympathetic ear helped me get through it.
a move to another school, repeating a year might be all it needs - i hadnt that option but would have loved a fresh start at the time. immediately, can she do something else on her breaks - eg leave the school for lunchtime, help out in the tuckshop or something that she doesnt have to hide in a toilet? repeating a year is no big deal, and removes the 'catchup' pressure she is under at the moment
counselling will help her come to terms with her feelings on the issues, and give her great coping skills to deal with her bullies, as well as build her confidence. i wouldnt let her give this up just yet.
in light of the bullying, i dont think a boot camp will do anything to solve her anger, it only adds another stressor into the mix to deal with, and she doesnt deserve it. but there still needs to be ground rules that she needs to abide by.
she is also probably very lonely, can you hang out with her doing girlie stuff on a weekend or something? any kind of hobbies that might interest her?
school work can always be caught up on - im proof of that, but first the bullying issue needs tackled and you might be surprised what falls into place after that.:D
hi,
we love to do everything together; believe it or not; aside from all these issues we are very close and do everything outside of school together - (when she's up out of bed, that is) i spend all my time with her; and we do have some great laughs/ go for walks/ drives and the cinema together - but we don't have a mutual hobbie as such.
I will definately be following up on the bullying issue when the easter break is over - i know she's extremely lonely and upset by it all - i remember that feeling only too well from my own school days - and i had it in a work situation as an adult myself - it's really traumatic - so how is a child expected to cope.0 -
WorriedMom wrote: »
basically she's spent months alone in school with no-one to talk to there- she has fallen out with friends - one girl accused her of lying and the rest of the group followed suit.. so they have all dropped her......
she also feels overwhelmed because she's missed so much time.. she can't concentrate in class - and she can't catch up....
Thats pretty much exactly what happened to me. The more I missed the harder it got to go to school.
Getting help for her to catch up with her work is really important, but I personally think the best thing for your daughter would be to find a way to be happy out of school first.
There are hundreds of drama schools across the country, some bigger ones like Stagecoach in bigger towns too I think. It might be expensive, but if it would help her social life and her confidence it would do her a world of good, and would probably reflect in better attitudes to schoolwork.
If she makes friends out of school its very likely some will go to her school too, so she might have some friends she can hang around with in school too.
I think the main thing here is your girls confidence. Its taken a real knock if she has lost friends, and she is angry and upset so lashing out at you.
Get her feeling better about herself and everything else might fall back into place.0 -
just a thought..if she is struggling and feels she is falling behind ..have you looked in to the leaving cert applied..not every school dose it...but as its practical and based on doing assignments it might help her confidence...
sometimes thing start out small and then get out of hand for teenagers
try and imaging being a 14 or 15 year old who is struggling academically and then add issues around friends either falling out with them... or bulling..and you can see even if the child come from the most loving supportive family environment...going to school is going to be a struggle for that child
i thing as adults we forget that for most teenagers having friend is the be all and end all of everything.
career guidance teachers do a masters in career guidance and counseling and are a great resource for parents if you need help0 -
Thats pretty much exactly what happened to me. The more I missed the harder it got to go to school.
Getting help for her to catch up with her work is really important, but I personally think the best thing for your daughter would be to find a way to be happy out of school first.
There are hundreds of drama schools across the country, some bigger ones like Stagecoach in bigger towns too I think. It might be expensive, but if it would help her social life and her confidence it would do her a world of good, and would probably reflect in better attitudes to schoolwork.
If she makes friends out of school its very likely some will go to her school too, so she might have some friends she can hang around with in school too.
I think the main thing here is your girls confidence. Its taken a real knock if she has lost friends, and she is angry and upset so lashing out at you.
Get her feeling better about herself and everything else might fall back into place.
hi,
thanks for that - checked out stagecoach in our area and there is one on our doorstep - so have enrolled her today - she's really delighted - so hopefully this will help, sounds like a good place to start - she starts in April so has something to look forward to.
thanks0 -
mariaalice wrote: »just a thought..if she is struggling and feels she is falling behind ..have you looked in to the leaving cert applied..not every school dose it...but as its practical and based on doing assignments it might help her confidence...
sometimes thing start out small and then get out of hand for teenagers
try and imaging being a 14 or 15 year old who is struggling academically and then add issues around friends either falling out with them... or bulling..and you can see even if the child come from the most loving supportive family environment...going to school is going to be a struggle for that child
i thing as adults we forget that for most teenagers having friend is the be all and end all of everything.
career guidance teachers do a masters in career guidance and counseling and are a great resource for parents if you need help
Hi,
This is one option the school will discuss with us on the 12th, although i did mention it to her and she seemed to be completely against this option - don't know why... but will discuss same again in the meeting with school... for now i'm just preparing her for returning to school on the 12th.
And your right - for her at this age having friends is the be all and end all of her live at the moment - she's really upset over it. I've suggested she try's to contact them but no way - she say's they've made it very obvious that they want nothing to do with her.
For the holidays now i'm concentrating on getting her back into a routine of early to bed and up early and keeping active during the day with me.. still trying to get her to agree to counselling but she's avoiding that so far. But is resigned to the fact that she must go back to school after easter.
thanks0 -
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hang on, have you actually asked her?not shouted/cajoled, etc? why dont you take her away for a day, jsut 2 of you, treat her like an adult, go to a spa or something, and talk? surely your relationship is more important?education isnt the be all and end all, she sounds depressed and alone. have you spoke to her about alternatives? youth reach?training courses? have you opened your mind to other options?if its just you promoting school as the only option shes going to feel like youre not listening and she obviously has something she needs to say!! dear god i hated school and didnt even try it was only in my 20s after working awful jobs i realized what i threw away and went back to school and college and got great qualifications-because i myself knew what i wanted and needed.
talk to her and say if she wants to be treated like an adult and make decisions , then you will treat her like an adult.agree a small amount of rent she has to pay, chores to do etc, halp her get info on alternatives, reassure her that you've got her back and stop trying to get everyone on your side and isolating her even more0 -
IMO, school and education is way overrated. School and degrees prepare one for a monotonous existence in some field of expertise, one soon yearns for the retirement freedom and capitol releases.
Work is exciting and I think children should be allowed to work ... when I was a boy in poor inner-city slum, I used to collect cardboard and sell it, bottles and sell or refund them too.
The mighty Dunne's empire started by a kid selling the items he had bought in Woolworth's for an extra farthing ~ people just assumed he was cheaper and it made a fortune.
Bill Gates is a college drop out ... I could go on and on ... with a few exceptions, most successful people in the world today were uneducated. Legally I had to keep my own daughter in school until she was 16, but in reality she should have been working as what she loved long before that.
Education is only good if you have a job to go to ... or naturally for recreation and self fulfilment .. but at 16, no one has this outlook.0 -
stop trying to get everyone on your side and isolating her even more
Excuse me? You couldn't be more wrong - i am not trying to get everyone on my side??? i'm trying to get a proper education for my daughter and spare her the awful jobs as you experienced. I have spoken to her about her options so far - however, having great qualifications & experience myself - I cannot get a job in this recession myself - i don't see what chance someone with no experience/or qualifications will have securing employment in this climate, do you? We have looked at the youth reach options but she herself has decided this is not for her, unfortunately, (i speak only for one in our area, but she know's people in this group and has decided she would rather not go there) Education in my opinion is paramount at this stage with no jobs to walk into.0 -
IMO, school and education is way overrated. School and degrees prepare one for a monotonous existence in some field of expertise, one soon yearns for the retirement freedom and capitol releases.
Work is exciting and I think children should be allowed to work ... when I was a boy in poor inner-city slum, I used to collect cardboard and sell it, bottles and sell or refund them too.
The mighty Dunne's empire started by a kid selling the items he had bought in Woolworth's for an extra farthing ~ people just assumed he was cheaper and it made a fortune.
Bill Gates is a college drop out ... I could go on and on ... with a few exceptions, most successful people in the world today were uneducated. Legally I had to keep my own daughter in school until she was 16, but in reality she should have been working as what she loved long before that.
Education is only good if you have a job to go to ... or naturally for recreation and self fulfilment .. but at 16, no one has this outlook.
I know what your saying.. but these days - i honestly think she need's a decent education behind her... And I don't want her coming back to me in years to come - saying why didn't i study - look at the opportunity wasted. Its hard enough these days to get work when you have your education.. what chance does a 16yr drop out have in this recession.. if after i've tried every single option she still drops out then... least we tried everything - i'd rather live with that than just give up on it now?0 -
There's certainly a lot of people suggesting that the only way through this is counselling, removal of privileges and showing her the harsh alternatives etc. From what I gather, the OP has tried this and has not been successful.
I can only speak from experience, and I am not a parent although I am in my early twenties and can appreciate what it means to be that age.
OP, your daughter is 16 years old and will soon be an adult. Some would say she already is. An important aspect of this is to treat her like an adult from the point of view of respecting her opinions and allowing her to make her own decisions. Of course, another important aspect of this is to not treat her like an adult with regards to support and finances. She'll still need your help until she can support herself. Cruel treatment is something I doubt will help considering her school situation is ok in terms of bullying etc. and she has friends. If she's unhappy whilst living a comfortable life, I don't see how showing her the alternatives to "scare" her would help.
By doing this, you will be getting on your daughter's side. She will be feeling like everybody is against her and it's important that you are not.
The Leaving Cert is still a couple of years away, and transition year is not all that important academically. I think what you need to do is convince your daughter (yourself first!) that there is nothing wrong with her, that she has clearly no interest in her studies and that she should take time to explore her true interests, even if this means an extended period away from school. She is intelligent enough to do this but needs your support.
If on the other hand, you try to "correct" her by forcing her to pertain to some standard mould which she clearly has no interest in, she will grow to resent you, and you will perpetuate the problem.
The first step is to sit down with her (another poster mentioned this) and ask her what she's really interested in doing. In all likelihood, because of your currently turbulent relationship, she won't open up to you even if she knows the answer. It will take time but let her know that things have changed and that you are on her side, not just in the rhetorical way, but that you genuinely will support her in her decisions.
Your daughter is to be given credit for realising that she isn't happy in her current situation. It does take intelligence to realise this.0
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