Options with a phonewatch alarm

Ivan E · 29-03-2010 7:45pm #1

Hi,

I have a phonewatch alarm that was installed around this time in 2001. It's a wireless ITI system. The one for the stronger walls.

Well considering getting rid of my phone line and wondering what options are available to me. I'm considering going the UPC route.

I emailed phonewatch to ask about the GSM unit. They gave me a cost but said that it's probably the older system and that it might cost a bit as I may have to replace the panel. So he said I could either keep the phone line or just use it as a stand alone alarm.

I am not too pushed about the monitoring side of things. But it would be nice to have some sort of notification system.

So what can I do with the existing system?
Can I update it to get another panel with a GSM dialer?
And if I do move away from phonewatch, how easy is it to get the system fixed if anything goes wrong?

Thanks,

Ivan.

KoolKid · 29-03-2010 8:09pm

There would be no problem connecting any alarm digi to the phoneline of of a UPC modem. We have done loads of them.
You could also use a standalone GSM unit lisk Astecs D2M.
As regards upgrading the panel. If its 9 years old you may want to go down that route.
Wireless hase changed a lot since then, so it would be best to updte the panel & the sensors. If you are thinking along those lines move away from pgonewatch & shop around for monitoring . You will get much better deals of some other company's.

Ivan E · 29-03-2010 9:33pm

Thanks koolkid for the reply.

koolkid wrote: »

There would be no problem connecting any alarm digi to the phoneline of of a UPC modem. We have done loads of them.

What exactly does this involve?

koolkid wrote: »

You could also use a standalone GSM unit lisk Astecs D2M.
As regards upgrading the panel. If its 9 years old you may want to go down that route.
Wireless hase changed a lot since then, so it would be best to updte the panel & the sensors. If you are thinking along those lines move away from pgonewatch & shop around for monitoring . You will get much better deals of some other company's.

Are all these options expensive?

kodak · 29-03-2010 9:39pm

We had our 3 panel old eircom to 2 new eircom ones, with the dialler and new smoke alarms
full days work..
Nearly 1000 euro, as far as i can remember :eek:

indie armada · 29-03-2010 10:57pm

you can replace your old eircom panel with a newer one, probably the concord panel would be best. if you didnt want to have to change all your sensors you can install a quick bridge which will marry the newer panel with the older sensors aswell as accomadating any new sensors you need.
your current panel is on 319 mhz and the newer ones are on 433 mhz so thats why the old wont work with the new without the quick bridge.
if you didnt want to take the monitoring the concord panel is easilly connected to a gsm or a normal phoneline.

Ivan E · 29-03-2010 11:06pm

Thanks indie armada. What's the rough cost in doing that?

indie armada · 30-03-2010 1:07pm

Ivan E wrote: »

Thanks indie armada. What's the rough cost in doing that?

that is one thing i couldnt tell ye. i could pm you the number of someone who could if ye like.

KoolKid · 30-03-2010 1:23pm

Ivan E wrote: »

Thanks koolkid for the reply.

What exactly does this involve?

It involves routing the line out of your router into your existing phone connections . Very straight forward because all phone points are paralleled you need only take the connection to the nearest one.
After that the spare cores can be used to give the alarm line seizure.

Ivan E wrote: »

Are all these options expensive?

A standalong GSM unit can be anywhere form €200- €400.
A complete wireless system could be anywhere from €1200 upwards.

indie armada wrote: »

you can replace your old eircom panel with a newer one, probably the concord panel would be best. if you didnt want to have to change all your sensors you can install a quick bridge which will marry the newer panel with the older sensors aswell as accomadating any new sensors you need.
your current panel is on 319 mhz and the newer ones are on 433 mhz so thats why the old wont work with the new without the quick bridge.
if you didnt want to take the monitoring the concord panel is easilly connected to a gsm or a normal phoneline.

I would recommend going towards the new European wireless frequency of 868 MHz . I would not recommend 433 MHz

indie armada · 30-03-2010 2:01pm

''I would recommend going towards the new European wireless frequency of 868 MHz . I would not recommend 433 MHz ''

if the op wishes to use his existing equipment and stay with eircom i dont think he/she would have a choice as eircoms current systems are on 433 mhz

KoolKid · 30-03-2010 2:18pm

indie armada wrote: »

if the op wishes to use his existing equipment and stay with eircom i dont think he/she would have a choice as eircoms current systems are on 433 mhz

We were also discussing the options of upgrading.;)

Ivan E · 30-03-2010 5:33pm

Thanks lads for your replies.

The way it is, is that I can now get broadband from UPC and can get the usual bundle deal for phone and some other tv bundles.

But I have my phonewatch system and eircom phone line. I only use the phone line for broadband. I rarely use it for calls. It's nice to have the option but it's not something I am too bothered about. And I have an alarm system that works fine. Just question whether or not I need to pay €24 a month for it.

So I am not too sure about getting rid of phonewatch and eircom only to pay for a fortune for a new alarm system when I don't need a new one as yet. Using it as a standalone alarm system is appealing as it will cost nothing to this. However I lose any sort of notification when it goes off.

So if I could alter what I have to give me some sort of notification that it has gone off but not cost a lot, that would be the ideal solution for me.

altor · 30-03-2010 9:34pm

Ivan E wrote: »

Hi,

I have a phonewatch alarm that was installed around this time in 2001. It's a wireless ITI system. The one for the stronger walls.

Well considering getting rid of my phone line and wondering what options are available to me. I'm considering going the UPC route.

I emailed phonewatch to ask about the GSM unit. They gave me a cost but said that it's probably the older system and that it might cost a bit as I may have to replace the panel. So he said I could either keep the phone line or just use it as a stand alone alarm.

I am not too pushed about the monitoring side of things. But it would be nice to have some sort of notification system.

So what can I do with the existing system?
Can I update it to get another panel with a GSM dialer?
And if I do move away from phonewatch, how easy is it to get the system fixed if anything goes wrong?

Thanks,

Ivan.

Hi Ivan,

With the system you have installed Eircom can put in a concord panel with a 319 frequency receiver. That way they dont need to replace the sensors you have plus you would be able to get a GSM installed that will work with this panel. Your only other option would be to get rid of the alarm and replace it with a new one.

altor · 30-03-2010 9:37pm

indie armada wrote: »

''I would recommend going towards the new European wireless frequency of 868 MHz . I would not recommend 433 MHz ''

The 868 frequency is the best one to use as the 433 frequency has to many devices on it now.

indie armada wrote: »

if the op wishes to use his existing equipment and stay with eircom i dont think he/she would have a choice as eircoms current systems are on 433 mhz

This is not true. Eircom use 868 on there simon xt. There concord panel can be fitted with a 319 frequency receiver to pick up the old devices.

Ivan E · 30-03-2010 10:50pm

altor wrote: »

Hi Ivan,

With the system you have installed Eircom can put in a concord panel with a 319 frequency receiver. That way they dont need to replace the sensors you have plus you would be able to get a GSM installed that will work with this panel. Your only other option would be to get rid of the alarm and replace it with a new one.

Thanks altor. Looking like the options are to keep it like a stand alone system or keep the phone line as it sounds like it's going to cost to keep a monitored system and get rid of my phone line.

The standalone system is sounding appealing. Looking it up, it seems phonewatch will still fix it for you if you run into problems, they just charge a lot to do so.

altor · 30-03-2010 11:01pm

Ivan E wrote: »

Thanks altor. Looking like the options are to keep it like a stand alone system or keep the phone line as it sounds like it's going to cost to keep a monitored system and get rid of my phone line.

Your welcome Ivan,
Afraid there is no easy way around this for you.

Ivan E wrote: »

The standalone system is sounding appealing. Looking it up, it seems phonewatch will still fix it for you if you run into problems, they just charge a lot to do so.

That is where you are going to get caught and pay handsomely for the service. With that alarm system you can not get replacement parts also so sometime down the line they will tell you you need to get a new system. At the moment they are upgrading the old alarms to concords with the receiver, then taking out two sensors off peoples old system so they can have spare parts for doing jobs like you may need in the future but if the panel ever goes you wont be able to get that replaced.

indie armada · 30-03-2010 11:25pm

i would advise going directly to one of eircoms agents if your planning to keep or upgrade the existing system, it could work out cheaper then going directly to eircom themselves. they might be ble to help you get the system you want without having to take out a monitoring contract with eircom

Ivan E · 31-03-2010 3:58pm

Okay, so keep the alarm. And if it breaks go through an agent to get it fixed. Or if I want to update it later on (probably because it has broken) go through them as they should be able to work with the existing system and add to it if at all possible.

altor · 31-03-2010 5:52pm

indie armada wrote: »

i would advise going directly to one of eircoms agents if your planning to keep or upgrade the existing system, it could work out cheaper then going directly to eircom themselves. they might be ble to help you get the system you want without having to take out a monitoring contract with eircom

This again is not true, i dont know where you getting your info from but it is wrong.

If you go to an agent to upgrade the alarm he wont go near you as he has a contract with eircom that states he cant.

Secondly, eircom are the only ones with rights to the equipment he needs to upgrade the alarm and they wont release it unless he signs up to the monitoring contract with eircom.

Ivan E · 31-03-2010 7:49pm

But if I am not with eircom anymore and have ceased the monitoring agreement?

indie armada · 31-03-2010 9:23pm

the agents are now able to buy the equipment from phonewatch at their descretion. they do however have to bring in a certain ammount of business to eircom each year to keep their contract. it used to be the case that they could only get the equipment for each job as it was presented to eircom but i think eircom copt on that they could make money on the gear as the agents were going to the likes of reliable and other wholesalers that supply the aritec wireless stuff.
there is nothing to stop a licenced installer upgrading the op's alarm untill they try to get the panel but an eircom agent would have no problem in doing this providing the op has no existing contract with phonewatch and i would suggest that the op go to the eircom website and find the nearest agent and give them a call, if even to just get a ball park figure

altor · 31-03-2010 10:09pm

indie armada wrote: »

the agents are now able to buy the equipment from phonewatch at their descretion. they do however have to bring in a certain ammount of business to eircom each year to keep their contract. it used to be the case that they could only get the equipment for each job as it was presented to eircom but i think eircom copt on that they could make money on the gear as the agents were going to the likes of reliable and other wholesalers that supply the aritec wireless stuff.

indie eircom will only sell there wired equipment to there network of installers. They wont sell them the wire free panel which the op will need to upgrade his alarm. Any company that has installed for eircom has a contract with them that they cant go near any eircom job, even if that company has stopped installing for eircom they still cant go near any of there customers, its in there contract which they signed when they started installing for eircom.

indie armada wrote: »

there is nothing to stop a licenced installer upgrading the op's alarm untill they try to get the panel but an eircom agent would have no problem in doing this providing the op has no existing contract with phonewatch and i would suggest that the op go to the eircom website and find the nearest agent and give them a call, if even to just get a ball park figure

Any other company that have never had a contract with eircom will upgrade the ops alarm but an agent cant, even if the op has no contract with eircom.

KoolKid · 31-03-2010 10:26pm

Indie, perhaps you could share your source of information with us. It may help clear up things.

indie armada · 31-03-2010 11:50pm

according to the ppl im in touch with as long as the person does not have an existing contract with eircom there would be no reason for an agent or any other installer to upgrade,change or remove the existing alarm.

having worked closely with eircom in the past im aware of their restrictive policies regarding their agents and staff including the fact they have sole patent on the concord and simon panel but the info i have is that an agent can purchase equipment form phonewatch inc panels, obviously with a view that eircom will eventualy obtain a monitoring contract but thats at the agents descretion.
if an agent is asked by a customer to provide a wireless system and that customer does not want a monitoring contract do you think that an agent is going to turn down that job because he/she cant hand it over to eircom. obvously its in the agents intrest to hand it over to eircom for various reasons inc fufilling their job quota for the year but there is nothing to stop them buying a system and installing it.

as for my sources i would consider them reliable. my posts so far have been an attempt to help the op and it has not been my intention to start or take part in a discussion that strays of the topic.

altor · 01-04-2010 10:21pm

indie armada wrote: »

as for my sources i would consider them reliable. my posts so far have been an attempt to help the op and it has not been my intention to start or take part in a discussion that strays of the topic.

I am only here to help the op with my experience as a previous installer for eircom. I to asked and was correct as was told by a couple of there team leaders that it is in the dealers contract that they cant go near any customers of eircom, even if they are out of contract unless the op is willing to sign up for a monitoring contract with eircom again. If the op wants to get another installer to install a new alarm for him that has nothing to do with eircom.

indie armada · 01-04-2010 11:42pm

altor wrote: »

I am only here to help the op with my experience as a previous installer for eircom. I to asked and was correct as was told by a couple of there team leaders that it is in the dealers contract that they cant go near any customers of eircom, even if they are out of contract unless the op is willing to sign up for a monitoring contract with eircom again. If the op wants to get another installer to install a new alarm for him that has nothing to do with eircom.

it wasnt my intention to turn this topic into a discussion about eircom phonewatch. i too worked for them for a number of years and around the time i left the terms of an agents contract where as you have described, but since then ive been told that since they have allowed the agents to buy the euipment at their descretion, the terms of their contract have either changed or eircom are not as strict with those terms.
if these terms are still strictly enforced, and a customer of an agent wants a wire free alarm but doesnt want the monitoring there is nothing to stop an agent fitting the alarm and handing it over to phone watch and a month or two down the road the customer cancels the contract. however ive only ever seen this happen with customers who went directly to eircom and it was usually a sneaky way of getting a good wireless system or the cert for the insurence.
to put it in another context if i wanted to get a simon for my house i could have one here by tomorow and you could probably say the same .

Options with a phonewatch alarm

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