Protest Sunday April 4 Pro Cathedral

Arcus Arrow

RELIGIOUS ABUSE TRUTH are holding a symbolic protest at the Pro Cathedral, Marlborough St. Dublin 1 at 11 am on Easter Sunday 04/04/10.

Religious abuse truth are calling everyone to bring along a pair of Childs shoes to represent all the children who were horrifically abused, murdered and tortured by the religious of the Roman Catholic Church in Ireland.

We must never forget the voices of the children who were never heard by staying silent ourselves.
We must never stay silent while allowing those who perpetuated these crimes remain unaccountable to face trial.

More reports of abuse come in on a daily basis; a testimony of the scale of abuse of children throughout the world had to endure. The Vatican's code of practice on child abuse is to keep it secret.

No more oaths of silence, secrecy or cover-up.

We can no longer carry this burden for the crimes committed against us, justice must be served now.

Let now the voices of the young girls and women who suffered in the Magdeline Laundries for nearly a centaury; let them now be heard. Release the records!

Religious abuse truth is calling for a full International criminal investigation into the Roman Catholic Church in Ireland.

Please show your support Easter Sunday at the Pro Cathedral 11am, this is not just an Irish problem, it is global.

Ensuring the safety of children is our responsibility, please act responsibly and bring a pair of shoes. Children of all ages suffered, so it will not matter what size shoe you bring.

If you cannot attend, please bring a pair of shoes to your local parish on Easter Sunday.

Thank you

Religious Abuse Truth

axer

Sponsored by Clarkes Shoes...

on a more serious note, is this the church that brady says mass?

Pushtrak

Could a better name not have been devised? That doesn't exactly roll off the tongue.

strobe

Plus, the acronym is RAT......

Won't be there but good luck with the protest anyways.

Arcus Arrow

strobe wrote: »

Plus, the acronym is RAT......

Won't be there but good luck with the protest anyways.

Thanks. It's a shame but there are so many people in little groups here and there trying to do something.
I'm not sure I should tell them about the acronym......
I'm working on ways at the moment to turn few people into a bigger statement but I fear all these revelations at some point will start to suffer news fatigue. It's hard to tell how many people will turn up. None of these people have the budgets to run campaigns and with the plethora of survivor groups it's almost like the DIY version of divide and conquer.

Either way I think the Pro Cathedral might be an interesting place to be next Sunday. That's something that hasn't been true for years.
[FONT=times new roman, new york, times, serif]http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/abuse-victims-brother-plans-altar-protest-during-easter-sunday-mass-115834.html#mon


[/FONT]

cypharius

Should not this be on the Christianity forum? I'm not saying it should, I don't post here much and I'm genuinely asking the question.

But good luck on the protest, I'll be there.

cypharius

Accidental double post, please ignore.

Arcus Arrow

cypharius wrote: »

Should not this be on the Christianity forum? I'm not saying it should, I don't post here much and I'm genuinely asking the question.

But good luck on the protest, I'll be there.

The problem with the Christianity forum is everyting about this issue has be confined to 4 threads which means everthing gets lost on a toilet roll of a thread. If you're going to be there send me a PM.

Arcus Arrow

Pushtrak wrote: »

Could a better name not have been devised? That doesn't exactly roll off the tongue.

Well no, it does'nt but I suppose being incarcerated for childhood is no substitute for a few years studying marketing. It's difficult but necessary to keep in mind when listening to or dealing with survivors of these crimes, what they went through. With many of them their language is often brutal while they speak with no malice whatsoever. I think their experience is reflected in the fact there are so many differnt groups and so much mistrust between them. They must feel almost forgotten by the majority of the population.

bleg

Name reminds me of the rural juror

Arcus Arrow

axer wrote: »

Sponsored by Clarkes Shoes...

on a more serious note, is this the church that brady says mass?

axer wrote: »

Sponsored by Clarkes Shoes...

on a more serious note, is this the church that brady says mass?

I'd take money from Clarkes........

The Pro Cathedral in Dublin is where none other than Archbishop Martin says mass.....


The photo attached is of the same guy in the article burning the Ryan Report on Christmas eve outside the church being approached by ABish Martin.

goat2

Arcus Arrow wrote: »

Thanks. It's a shame but there are so many people in little groups here and there trying to do something.
I'm not sure I should tell them about the acronym......
I'm working on ways at the moment to turn few people into a bigger statement but I fear all these revelations at some point will start to suffer news fatigue. It's hard to tell how many people will turn up. None of these people have the budgets to run campaigns and with the plethora of survivor groups it's almost like the DIY version of divide and conquer.

Either way I think the Pro Cathedral might be an interesting place to be next Sunday. That's something that hasn't been true for years.
[FONT=times new roman, new york, times, serif]http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/abuse-victims-brother-plans-altar-protest-during-easter-sunday-mass-115834.html#mon[/FONT]

take a look
there has already been a walkout down the country
http://www.the-kingdom.ie/news/story/?trs=mhcwidmhoj&cat=news

Arcus Arrow

If McDonalds had been caught covering up a child rape ring in it's midst what would happen to a manager who'd intimidated two underage victims into swearing an oath of silence. It sounds like Mafia tactics.

Brady not subject of garda probe
30/03/2010 - 16:47:57

The Garda Commissioner Fachtna Murphy has confirmed that Cardinal Seán Brady is not under garda investigation at this point in time.

The head of the Catholic Church in Ireland was forced to reject calls for his resignation earlier this month, after it emerged that he attended two meetings in the 1970s when two children who had been abused by Fr Brendan Smyth were sworn to secrecy.

Cardinal Brady is being sued in a personal capacity, as well as in his role as Catholic Primate of All Ireland, by a woman who was raped by the notorious paedophile priest over five years.



http://www.thepost.ie/breakingnews/ireland/eyojcwauojgb/

I'd say it will be a huge turnout !

Arcus Arrow

rarnes1 wrote: »

I'd say it will be a huge turnout !

I don't know. I think in this country everbody expects somebody else to do what they think should be done. It's going to need a lot of bodies to tie up 700 pairs of childrens shoes. Everbody hopes it will happen but not to the extent they'll do it themselves.

The last time it was only about 2 or 3 hundred but they made a hell of a display. The Church left them up for three days. Maybe they are running out of staff.....


And you can't be arrested for a peacful protest.....that's official from the Garda.

Arcus Arrow

Update: the time to be there is 10am to start the hanging......of the shoes!

This Sunday morning April 4th. Pro Cathedral, Marlbourough St. Dublin 1

PapaRatzinger

Epic. Fail.

Mass-goers will soon be tucking into their spring lamb, having got their Sunday dose of divine sustenance.

The recreational protesters are probably all over expressing their "outrage" at the Sinn Fein/IRA protest right now.

axer

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Epic. Fail.

Mass-goers will soon be tucking into their spring lamb, having got their Sunday dose of divine sustenance.

The recreational protesters are probably all over expressing their "outrage" at the Sinn Fein/IRA protest right now.

In fairness, they made the news which is a good achievement thus the point was made. I would not call that Epic. Fail.

PapaRatzinger

axer wrote: »

In fairness, they made the news which is a good achievement thus the point was made. I would not call that Epic. Fail.

For all the yarns and yarns of bluster that the obedient Irish media-readers have been subjected to over Lent, you'd think there would be at least a couple of hundred foot soldiers on the ground.

Maybe it was just all that: bluster. Today, 100,000s of Catholics went to Mass as usual. They don't seek to "make the news". They just get on with it.

Better luck next year.

rovert

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Epic. Fail.

Mass-goers will soon be tucking into their spring lamb, having got their Sunday dose of divine sustenance.

The recreational protesters are probably all over expressing their "outrage" at the Sinn Fein/IRA protest right now.

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

For all the yarns and yarns of bluster that the obedient Irish media-readers have been subjected to over Lent, you'd think there would be at least a couple of hundred foot soldiers on the ground.

Maybe it was just all that: bluster. Today, 100,000s of Catholics went to Mass as usual. They don't seek to "make the news". They just get on with it.

Better luck next year.

Never knew there were religious internet message nuthuggers like you see on sports forums.

axer

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

For all the yarns and yarns of bluster that the obedient Irish media-readers have been subjected to over Lent, you'd think there would be at least a couple of hundred foot soldiers on the ground.

Irish catholics have been brainwashed for decades from when they were babies upwards. Its gonna take a few years for them to see reality.

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Maybe it was just all that: bluster. Today, 100,000s of Catholics went to Mass as usual. They don't seek to "make the news". They just get on with it.

Better luck next year.

Each step in the right direction no matter how small is progress.

philologos

How did this work out OP?

cypharius

I was going to go but I was too tired :[

As well, maybe I can do my part by trying to get my mam to convert to Quakerism.

Arcus Arrow

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

For all the yarns and yarns of bluster that the obedient Irish media-readers have been subjected to over Lent, you'd think there would be at least a couple of hundred foot soldiers on the ground.

Maybe it was just all that: bluster. Today, 100,000s of Catholics went to Mass as usual. They don't seek to "make the news". They just get on with it.

Better luck next year.

100,000s of thousands where? Out of the ones that do go how many are walking out and leaving the instruction manual behind them in the pew? The miniscule number of godfree on the census in Ireland I suspect can't account for the amount of condoms, contraceptive pills sold, registry office marriages nor the number of people travelling for abortions. I'd also suspect that the reduction in the average size of families in Ireland over the years is not due to some cosmic bogey man shooting some spiritual spermicide through the atmosphere. You can’t truly claim to have followers when they are marching in the other direction.

But the Catholic Church Limited system is virulent and is very successful. It's so powerful it reduces some minds to a malleable mush that can be convinced that the rape and torture of children is just yarns and bluster. What else can one expect when the top echelon start comparing themselves being uncovered as a global child rape ring, to the persecution of the Jews. They’ve had to backtrack on that one already.
The success of the CCL is best summed up as the prosperity of lies.

Arcus Arrow

Jakkass wrote: »

How did this work out OP?

I'll get back to you by Tuesday. There is a sub plot developing but how that turns out I won't know for a few days.

So far it's a snippet on RTE news. It was on Sky I'm told. There were a good number of newpaper reporters there. The Archbishop Martin left by the back laneway which from what I know is not like him. One (or maybe two) people did get into the chruch and leave shoes on the altar. I wasn't in there so I don't know the exact details. A lot of coverage just ends up on file.

PapaRatzinger

The Pro-Cathedral did the right thing by having the Gardai on hand to deal with any interruption in Church services. That said, there were several society members available to physically remove protesters if necessary. Thankfully, it didn't come to that.

Anyway, they made their little point. You'd think that 1,000s of infants were sexually violated the way they were going on with their little pink shoes.

cypharius

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

The Pro-Cathedral did the right thing by having the Gardai on hand to deal with any interruption in Church services. That said, there were several society members on hand to physically remove protesters if necessary. Thankfully, it didn't come to that.

Anyway, they made their little point. You'd think that 1,000s of infants were sexually violated the way they were going on with their little pink shoes.

1,000's were raped by preists...


1,000's still are, outside Ireland.

PapaRatzinger

Arcus Arrow wrote: »

100,000s of thousands where? Out of the ones that do go how many are walking out and leaving the instruction manual behind them in the pew? The miniscule number of godfree on the census in Ireland I suspect can't account for the amount of condoms, contraceptive pills sold, registry office marriages nor the number of people travelling for abortions. I'd also suspect that the reduction in the average size of families in Ireland over the years is not due to some cosmic bogey man shooting some spiritual spermicide through the atmosphere. You can’t truly claim to have followers when they are marching in the other direction.

But the Catholic Church Limited system is virulent and is very successful. It's so powerful it reduces some minds to a malleable mush that can be convinced that the rape and torture of children is just yarns and bluster. What else can one expect when the top echelon start comparing themselves being uncovered as a global child rape ring, to the persecution of the Jews. They’ve had to backtrack on that one already.
The success of the CCL is best summed up as the prosperity of lies.

Last night's Easter Vigil in St Kevin's, Harrington Street: packed.

This morning's Easter Mass in my local parish: packed.

Numbers don't lie.

I heard the Coptic Church had midnight Mass in Dublin's Pro-Cathedral at midnight yesterday. Fair play to the Irish Church for facilitating our Eastern brethern in this manner. I heard the vestments were amazing. Would love to have seen it.

PapaRatzinger

cypharius wrote: »

1,000's were raped by preists...


1,000's still are, outside Ireland.

1,000s of infants?

cypharius

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

1,000s of infants?

No, I was talking about eggs that were raped by raptorjesus' evil nemisis Lucy-Fur, the daemon squirel.

PapaRatzinger

cypharius wrote: »

No, I was talking about eggs that were raped by raptorjesus' evil nemisis Lucy-Fur, the daemon squirel.

In other words, you're a gossiper.

philologos

PapaRatzinger: You would agree that child abuse is still a very serious issue that the RCC needs to work on? It could be perceived as hurtful to refer to real life incidents as mere gossip.

cypharius

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

In other words, you're a gossiper.

Spreading the good word of Raptorjesus as told in the holy forum is hardly gossip!

How dare you insult Raptorjesus! He went extinct for your sins, and if you don't repent then you will be torn apart by rabid teridactels in the one of the 9 levels of the shivering isles!

PapaRatzinger

Jakkass wrote: »

PapaRatzinger: You would agree that child abuse is still a very serious issue that the RCC needs to work on? It could be perceived as hurtful to refer to real life incidents as mere gossip.

Journos re-hashing the same stories from the 1990s is just that: gossip. At the end of the day, they're in the business of selling advertising. Nothing like a good paedo story to whet the appetite of the foaming-at-the-mouth outraged masses.

axer

Jakkass wrote: »

It could be perceived as hurtful to refer to real life incidents as mere gossip.

Is that not what the pope (or one of his minions) did too? i.e. refer to it as gossip

PDN

axer wrote: »

Is that not what the pope (or one of his minions) did too? i.e. refer to it as gossip

Yes, and, as Jakkass has said in his post, that should be seen as hurtful.

PapaRatzinger

Anyone who tries to interrupt Mass or prevent people from entering/exiting their place of worship is scum. They should not be surprised what comes their way. The scenes outside the Pro Cathedral yesterday were farcical.

axer

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Anyone who tries to interrupt Mass or prevent people from entering/exiting their place of worship is scum. They should not be surprised what comes their way. The scenes outside the Pro Cathedral yesterday were farcical.

and anyone who attempts to cover up abuse of children is scum.
The question is which is worse and I wonder what is coming their way?

PapaRatzinger

axer wrote: »

and anyone who attempts to cover up abuse of children is scum.
The question is which is worse and I wonder what is coming their way?

Do you condone the actions of those who prevent people entering and exiting their place of worship?

Do you condone those who seek to interrupt Mass?

Because if you do, you're nothing more than a terrorist. Neither the Church nor the faithful will negotiate with such people.

axer

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Do you condone the actions of those who prevent people entering and exiting their place of worship?

Yes and I think the rcc is an evil organisation that has caused suffering to countless vunerable children and adults.

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Do you condone those who seek to interrupt Mass?

Yes because the rcc still do not get it. They think this is just some blip that they can forget about and move on. They think it is unfair that they are coming undercriticism. Poor them.

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Because if you do, you're nothing more than a terrorist. Neither the Church nor the faithful will not negotiate with such people.

I'd rather be a "terrorist" supporter than a paedophile/abuser supporter. :pac: Which one are you?

PapaRatzinger

axer wrote: »

I'd rather be a terrorist supporter than a paedophile supporter. :pac:

I treat your accusation that I am a paedophile supporter with contempt. If you apply the same flawed logic to your Utopian civil society, that you subscribe to and pay taxes towards, then you too are a paedophile.

Bunch of cowards yesterday targeting ordinary Mass-goers. Many of those "protesting" yesterday have already gotten their compensation payout and settled their cases. It would be unfair to name and shame them. They're deliberately reopening their wounds and showing them off to the media/public in the hope that people will take pity on them and get even more money. I will qualify this by saying that there were people outside the Church yesterday with genuine grievances - albeit grievances directed at the wrong people and through inappropriate channels. In all, yesterday was nothing short of a farce. Thank God I had the sense to go to midnight Mass and not have to witness it.

axer

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

I treat your accusation that I am a paedophile supporter with contempt. If you apply the same flawed logic to your Utopian civil society, that you subscribe to and pay taxes towards, then you too are a paedophile.

I treat your accusation that I am a terrorist supporter with contempt.

I don't fund the abusers nor abuser facilitating organisations directly but catholics do and they fund their defence too when they are caught. How does that make you feel? all warm and fuzzy inside?

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Bunch of cowards yesterday targeting ordinary Mass-goers. Many of those "protesting" yesterday have already gotten their compensation payout and settled their cases. It would be unfair to name and shame them. They're deliberately reopening their wounds and showing them off to the public in the hope that people will take pity on them and get even more money.

Yeah, I know. Its not like the rcc f'ucked up their lives or anything - they should just get over it. And its not like the rcc are still not being fully up front about things or trying to brush things under the carpet.

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

I will qualify this by saying that there were people outside the Church yesterday with genuine grievances - albeit grievances directed at the wrong people and through inappropriate channels. In all, yesterday was nothing short of a farce. Thank God I had the sense to go to midnight Mass and not have to witness it.

I know. It would be awful to have to see that people are angry with the rcc for facilitating abusers, covering it up and not coming out with information until it is dragged out of them and then making comments that they are the victims or that its just gossip - It is better to cover your ears and keep saying "la la la la".

PapaRatzinger

axer wrote: »

I treat your accusation that I am a terrorist supporter with contempt.

I don't fund the abusers nor abuser facilitating organisations directly but catholics do and they fund their defence too when they are caught. How does that make you feel? all warm and fuzzy inside?

Yeah, I know. Its not like it f'ucked up their lives or anything. And its not like the rcc are still not being fully up front about things or trying to brush things under the carpet.

I know. It would be awful to have to see that people are angry with the rcc for facilitating abusers, covering it up and not coming out with information until it is dragged out of them. Then making comments that they are the victims or that its just gossip.

I didn't call you a terrorist. You successfully answered negatively to my two tests of what constitutes a terrorist.

You're obviously an extremist. Extremists are well-known to react irrationally when confronted. I've made my opinion on this forum.

Are you enraged? Are you a bitter man? Did you get bitten by the Church when you were a boy or something? Perchance, were you heckling Mass-goers there yesterday?

axer

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

I didn't call you a terrorist. You successfully answered negatively to my two tests of what constitutes a terrorist.

Considering you fund the rcc as you are a mass goer then I can only assume you don't mind funding abusers and abuse facilitators. I would rather be a terrorist supporter than a paedophile supporter is what I said. I never said you are a paedophile.

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

You're obviously an extremist. Extremists are well-known to react irrationally when confronted. I've made my opinion on this forum.

Nope nothing extreme about it. Where is my irrationality?

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Are you enraged? Are you a bitter man? Did you get bitten by the Church when you were a boy or something?

Are you asking was I abused by one of your priests? Luckily no. I do know some who have been though. How do you think they feel? How do you as a catholic feel to have funded this priest?

Should you not have approached the protestors and appoligised as a catholic for the failings of your organisation? you choose the easy route instead and ignored them. How very christian of you. Maybe I am a better catholic than most out there.

PapaRatzinger

axer wrote: »

Considering you fund the rcc as you are a mass goer then I can only assume you don't mind funding abusers and abuse facilitators. I would rather be a terrorist supporter than a paedophile supporter is what I said. I never said you are a paedophile.

Nope nothing extreme about it. What is my irrationality?

Are you asking was I abuse by one of your priests? Luckily no. I do know some who have been though. How do you think they feel? How do you as a catholic feel to have funded this priest?

Either you're unemployed or you pay no tax. One way or the other, I'm guessing you've far too much time on your hands (I'm guess it's due to the former rather than the latter). Would you not go out for a walk or something? I'm off down to Fairyhouse today. A bit blustery, but sure I'll survive.

axer

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Either you're unemployed or you pay no tax. One way or the other, I'm guessing you've far too much time on your hands (I'm guess it's due to the former rather than the latter). Would you not go out for a walk or something? I'm off down to Fairyhouse today. A bit blustery, but sure I'll survive.

More avoidence of the harsh truth. Best of luck today - I hope to see you around the A&A forum again so that you can tell me how you feel about your church's behaviour.

rovert

PapaRatzinger the sensible face of the RCC

Arcus Arrow

100,000s of thousands where? Out of the ones that do go how many are walking out and leaving the instruction manual behind them in the pew? The miniscule number of godfree on the census in Ireland I suspect can't account for the amount of condoms, contraceptive pills sold, registry office marriages nor the number of people travelling for abortions. I'd also suspect that the reduction in the average size of families in Ireland over the years is not due to some cosmic bogey man shooting some spiritual spermicide through the atmosphere. You can’t truly claim to have followers when they are marching in the other direction.

You seem to have missed the above.

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

The Pro-Cathedral did the right thing by having the Gardai on hand to deal with any interruption in Church services. That said, there were several society members available to physically remove protesters if necessary. Thankfully, it didn't come to that.

Members of what society? I don't think you were there at all. You sound like you’re working from a combination of wishful thinking and second hand information. The Gardai and security prevented people from entering the church at one point. Yet there were shoes left on the altar.

You may well sneer at the survivors of Catholic Church child rape and torture. Sure why not? At least you're consistent with the sinister wrinkled old male virgins who control your foreign religion. By the way since you're such an expert on Rome who is that handsome effeminate guy who accompanies Herr Ratzinger everywhere?

robindch

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Do you condone those who seek to interrupt Mass? Because if you do, you're nothing more than a terrorist.

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

Anyone who tries to interrupt Mass or prevent people from entering/exiting their place of worship is scum. They should not be surprised what comes their way.

Following yesterday's warning + card, PapaRatzinger is now taking a week off to relax.

PapaRatzinger wrote: »

You're obviously an extremist. Extremists are well-known to react irrationally when confronted.

Matthew 7:3-5

premierlass

I was at the Mass yesterday with no idea of what had been planned. It is a pity the protest was so undignified. If it had been done silently, it would have made more impact than all the shouting. As it was, the protesters only alienated the people who were there to participate in the Mass. Whatever the corrupt leadership has done, they have the right to do that.

Incidentally, contrary to what has been reported in the media, I heard no "hissing" from the congregation. There were a few annoyed murmurs, but by and large there was silence.

Arcus Arrow

premierlass wrote: »

I was at the Mass yesterday with no idea of what had been planned. It is a pity the protest was so undignified. If it had been done silently, it would have made more impact than all the shouting. As it was, the protesters only alienated the people who were there to participate in the Mass. Whatever the corrupt leadership has done, they have the right to do that.

Incidentally, contrary to what has been reported in the media, I heard no "hissing" from the congregation. There were a few annoyed murmurs, but by and large there was silence.

I was there and I don't think shouting abuse at people does anyone any good. The police and security did block a number of people from entering to put shoes on the altar.
On the other hand I can't imagine what I'd be like if I'd been incarcerated as a child and made to suffer constant degradation at the hands of Rome's clerics. How angry would you be when it all comes out and the same system is used to abuse the survivors all over again.


The Murphy only covers a sample number of priests in one diocese. There are a total of 26 dioceses in Ireland. By limiting the investigation they then build the "few bad apples" defence. There should be just as much focus on the network of arch Catholics in politics and the civil service as there is on Bishops and clerics.