Dandare's 'Drawing lessons'

DandareRastaban

Well,

According to what I said earlier I would try to run a series of 'lessons' over some topics. I'll also try to help anyone with any problems with drawing as far as I am able to.

After each lesson I'm asking You to send in here the images of what You managed to create ^^. I think it'll be fun. And don't worry if something seem 'not good enough' for You... half of my drawings seem like that for me ^^'. It's meant mostly for people who want to try drawing and have fun with it

Also! You people are the ones who'll decide on topic of next lesson! (Just nothing Hentai related :P). Of course I'm the one to decide in the end but I'll try to bring up what majority wants.

There are only two things I'm asking for:

BE ACTIVE AND HAVE FUN !!!

LESSON 1 "ARMOR DESIGNS"

REF.1 - FACES

REF.2 - ARMLETS

REF.3 - CHEST ARMORS

REF.4 - GAUNTLETS/HAND GEARS

REF.5 - LOWER ARMOR

Saruwatari

No offense, but I think you need to focus more on learning anatomy than something as trivial a subject as armour.
You think the cranium you drew is actually passable?

Funky

Saruwatari wrote: »

No offense, but I think you need to focus more on learning anatomy than something as trivial a subject as armour.
You think the cranium you drew is actually passable?

cause realistic proportions are a paramount rule in manga

Saruwatari

Funky wrote: »

cause realistic proportions are a paramount rule in manga

I know, I know, but still! You'll never get anywhere outside of deviantArt popularity if you draw like this forever...
Unless that's what you want.

DandareRastaban

Saruwatari wrote: »

I know, I know, but still! You'll never get anywhere outside of deviantArt popularity if you draw like this forever...
Unless that's what you want.

Yep. You're right. Tite Kubo never ever did.

On other hand: the armor subject was proposed by the others for a first theme.

ztoical

Funky wrote: »

cause realistic proportions are a paramount rule in manga

You should learn the basics of strong draw skills before trying to develop a style. Picasso was a very strong traditional painter before developing his other styles. You can't break the rules unless you learn them first. Yes some comic book artists have extreme styles but all started with basic understanding of anatomy. If you study comics in college in Japan [or anywhere else for that matter] your first year will focus on life drawing - hours and hours of it and once you've mastered that you start to develop your own style. You'll be taught all those measuring tricks and tips etc and then in the second year told to forget it all.

There is nothing wrong with drawing in the style you like for your own enjoyment but be aware your work will never develop beyond the level it is at. It's why those "how to draw manga" books are a death for anyone who wants to actually develop and grow as an artist.

Cy_Revenant

DandareRastaban wrote: »

Yep. You're right. Tite Kubo never ever did.

On other hand: the armor subject was proposed by the others for a first theme.

Tite Kubo didn't become popular based on his art.

chin_grin

Bewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwbs. Sorry had to.

Also thanks for this! Great for a beginner or if, like me, you've even a remote interest in drawing.

DandareRastaban

ztoical wrote: »

You should learn the basics of strong draw skills before trying to develop a style. Picasso was a very strong traditional painter before developing his other styles. You can't break the rules unless you learn them first. Yes some comic book artists have extreme styles but all started with basic understanding of anatomy. If you study comics in college in Japan [or anywhere else for that matter] your first year will focus on life drawing - hours and hours of it and once you've mastered that you start to develop your own style. You'll be taught all those measuring tricks and tips etc and then in the second year told to forget it all.

There is nothing wrong with drawing in the style you like for your own enjoyment but be aware your work will never develop beyond the level it is at. It's why those "how to draw manga" books are a death for anyone who wants to actually develop and grow as an artist.

More or less why I never did really read any 'how to draw manga' books.

More than this: I have a good story about Manga Artists College!

One of my net friends did learn in one. According to his story afterwards only 1/50 of people after them actually have any success in them. Later he kept telling me about all the artists which never ever were in them and in fact got a REAL big success...

What You told is more or less true but in fact there is nothing worse for someones art than force on it something 'unfitting'. Picasso in fact was veeeeery fond of his art before, and WAS a genius in my opinion. Yet the others seem to be 'bored' with his great paintings... what he did in fact wasn't to 'break the rule' I think but more to ignore them... and people seem to like it unexpectedly (despite some think he never expect them to)

More than this: it's rather fun topic... I do not 'force' anyone into it. Just some people wanted it and my pro friends said I'm more than fine to start making tutorials since they said I already found my own style.

Anyway: good info

Best Regards

DandareRastaban

Cy_Revenant wrote: »

Tite Kubo didn't become popular based on his art.

Then on what? (remember that aspects of 'creating the storyline' are an art aswell... other way You disagree that writers are an artists >_>.)

Also Tite Kubo had a 'good style for a good moment' as I call it. Dynamic lines. Sometimes bit messy looking but clear inking. Also really nice 'catch ups' and character expressions.

World was in need of good battle shounen manga... and he was more than capable of making one for sure XD

Regards

DandareRastaban

chin_grin wrote: »

Bewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwbs. Sorry had to.

Also thanks for this! Great for a beginner or if, like me, you've even a remote interest in drawing.

REAL THANKS ^^!!

It's nice to see someone enjoying my hard work XD

I hope You would join the fun and I'll soon see some of Your 'hard work'

Drawing is real fun. Remember that! And there is not really need of learning more than one thing at one moment and most of things are really simple after You train them a bit XD

Looking forawrd for Your reply ^^!!

ztoical

DandareRastaban wrote: »

More or less why I never did really read any 'how to draw manga' books.

More than this: I have a good story about Manga Artists College!

One of my net friends did learn in one. According to his story afterwards only 1/50 of people after them actually have any success in them. Later he kept telling me about all the artists which never ever were in them and in fact got a REAL big success...

This is a typical attitude of alot of people "why do you need to go to art school to be an 'artist' *insert artist* never went to school and was really great"

Yes some people can make very good careers for themselves without any formal training but even then so called self taught artist spend a great deal of time drawing - like being an athlete it takes alot of time and work, talent is actually pretty meaningless for professonials. The vast majority of working artists have been to art school - the majority of professional comic book artists have been to Art school either to study cartooning or a related field such as illustration, animation, graphic design, printmaking or fine arts. Comic study in Japan is much more structured then in other countries even if you do not study comics in college if you wish to work as a comic book artist you will first look to work as an assitant to an established artist and again focus on the basic - strong basic drawing skills and work your way up to your own established style.

DandareRastaban wrote: »

Picasso in fact was veeeeery fond of his art before, and WAS a genius in my opinion. Yet the others seem to be 'bored' with his great paintings... what he did in fact wasn't to 'break the rule' I think but more to ignore them... and people seem to like it unexpectedly (despite some think he never expect them to)

Picasso's work was, like all artists work should be, changing and developing as he himself aged and learned. The rules I refered to was the rules of perspective which he understood very well via his strong college education in fine arts - after seeing african art and how they viewed perspective he combinded that with his knowledge of perspective. To a lay person it seemed like he just ignored the rules of perspective but when looking at his early cubist period you can see the difference between his work and the work of someone who just don't understand perspective and claims their work looks that way cus it's a style choice and not due to lack of training.

I have very little time for people who blame poor basic anatomy on it being a "style" - there are some fantastic artists out there working with extreme figures [Betteo, Ben Templesmith, and Ashley Wood being but a few] but you can still see and understand the structure of their poses and see that they understood the anatomy they were working with before pushing it and developing their own voices.

DandareRastaban wrote: »

More than this: it's rather fun topic... I do not 'force' anyone into it. Just some people wanted it and my pro friends said I'm more than fine to start making tutorials since they said I already found my own style.

If your going to put tutorials out there for people then be ready to be called on errors. Fine ignore the issues with anatomy seeing as you claim that's not the focus of the lesson your work is full of tangents that destroy any sense of structure. It's very cookie cutter in the sense that it's all outline and little structure and as a result the work ends up looking very flat. When creating a piece you should consider it as a silhouette so you will see quickly what reads and what doesn't...keeping the arms so in near the body is very poor posing and you have major issues with drawing hands and feet.

DandareRastaban

Hmmm...

Just like my friend told me for once he tried to convince me on doing that topic:

"Some people tend to seem all knowing. In fact they're poor in understanding of anything more than loosing own time. Our time is way more prescious. I know You can talk and argue for a days like You did with me and I know that mostly you'll talk over Your 'oponent' but this way You're plainly acting like an idiot who likes to loose time which he could use for something more constructive like: helping others or doing own things. So if You'll try getting serious into it and maybe start make a living on it like me then stop acting like such idiot cause You'll miss all deadlines!"

For me: very, very mature and helpfull words ^^

ztoical

DandareRastaban wrote: »

Hmmm...

Just like my friend told me for once he tried to convince me on doing that topic:

"Some people tend to seem all knowing. In fact they're poor in understanding of anything more than loosing own time. Our time is way more prescious. I know You can talk and argue for a days like You did with me and I know that mostly you'll talk over Your 'oponent' but this way You're plainly acting like an idiot who likes to loose time which he could use for something more constructive like: helping others or doing own things. So if You'll try getting serious into it and maybe start make a living on it like me then stop acting like such idiot cause You'll miss all deadlines!"

For me: very, very mature and helpfull words ^^

Honey your free to think whatever you want and if you think I'm replying to this thread because "I think I know all" but really "have poor understanding and am losing my own time" then fine, the fact is I do take this very seriously as it is what I do for living. I've made no comments on your other thread as I think everyone is free to post their art and enjoy creating it but there is a difference between doing that and posting 'lessons' that focus on teaching people bad habits.

DandareRastaban

ztoical wrote: »

Honey your free to think whatever you want and if you think I'm replying to this thread because "I think I know all" but really "have poor understanding and am losing my own time" then fine, the fact is I do take this very seriously as it is what I do for living. I've made no comments on your other thread as I think everyone is free to post their art and enjoy creating it but there is a difference between doing that and posting 'lessons' that focus on teaching people bad habits.

Ok, now it's becoming... whatever.

I just don't want to disagree and You might do it for a living and might be better than me and whatever else You like. Ok. I just want to point that You're free to post own topic with same nature if You feel like it. For sure many, many people would appreciate it way more than some meaningless fight...


I didn't name this topic: 'Aruging lessons' for reason. There are really many people better than me making a really good living on it and I know at least 6 such people via net... like to talk with them. Like I said I don't force anyone. Ideaa didn't came from me. I have not THAT much of time since I have University on my head and pretty many paid commissions atm.

If anyone want to join and have fun I'm open to help. But I don't want to loose my time on arguing.

Art_Wolf

Woah, I did not see this coming.

The way I did see this developing was as a community tutorial. For instance Dandare has offered ways to draw armour, Dandare has learnt stuff from ztoical etc.

A bit more heated than expected...

Having the option of chatting with people about ways to draw is immensely helpful to people. I still think people offering tips to each other is better than nothing.

Fysh

I realise I'm wandering into this a few days late, but there are a few things I wanted to add.

Firstly, I like this idea of communally-built tutorials. It's something we were trying to do in the Comic Production forum but which has hit a bit of a lull in recent months as it takes a lot of curation and steering. That said, without useful input and feedback it can run the risk of turning into a bit of a circlejerk.

Something that was commented on already was the choice of starting with armour design. I've seen that it was requested by others, and that's fair enough - but tutorials and lesson guides work best if they are structured such that you can progress through them. For example, you might start with anatomy, then progress onto facial expressions, and then move onto costume design. This is all "content" material, though - you could equally decide to focus on "technique" and start with pencilling, followed by inking, colouring and toning, lettering, print preparation. Or you might like to focus on the aesthetics and look at writing for comics and visual storytelling/art direction. There's a lot of material you can cover, so it's useful to have some idea of a structure - not just in terms of helping others, but also in terms of identifying where your own weaknesses are and building on them.

It's always worth having a few suggested textbooks and/or links for further reading if someone needs to work more on a given topic. I know there are loads of frankly pointless "How to draw manga" books out there which should really be retitled "how to draw what I've assumed all manga looks like based on reading Naruto and Dragon Ball", but this just underlines the importance of recommending good reference material - ideally drawn from all fields of the arts, not just those directly related to what you're already familiar with.

In terms of specific comments on the artwork in this thread - unfortunately "generic" is the first term that comes to mind, and not just in terms of the drawing style but also the costume. Looking at the silhouette, there's nothing much of interest happening. This may seem minor, but in terms of character design it is important to try and make characters as distinctive as possible.

I look forward to seeing how these threads develop - they could turn into something very interesting.

seraphimvc

think i should at least show some support :)keep the good work up!!gambate!!!