Einstein Was Not an Atheist

FISMA

I have heard several posters claim that Einstein was an Atheist, I believe this is, point of fact, wrong.

Here is what I am saying, nothing more nothing less: Einstein was not an Atheist.

In his book, "Einstein His Life and Universe" author Walter Isaacson cites an interview between Einstein and George Sylvester Viereck and several other conversations.

The following are excerpts quoted from the book - their words, not mine. Q is for the question from Viereck and E is for Einstein. Einstein's words are in bold, the author's are not.

Pick up a copy Chapter 17 is a great read.

Page 386

Q. Do you believe in God?
E: I'm not an atheist

More interesting quotes.

E: I am a Jew, but I am enthralled by the luminous figure of the Nazarene.

Q. You accept the historical existence of Jesus?
E. Unquestionably! No one can read the Gospels without feeling the actual presence of Jesus.

E: My religiosity consists of a humble admiration of the infinitely superior spirit that reveals itself in the little that we can comprehend in the knowable world. That deeply emotional conviction of the presence of a superior reasoning power, which is revealed in the incomprehensible universe, forms my idea of God.

page 389
Throughout his life, he was consistent in deflecting the charge that he was an atheist. There are people who say there is no God, he told a friend. But what makes me really angry is when they quote me for support of such views.

This is not an attack on your community. Frankly, if Einstein was an Atheist, I would not care, so I do not see why any Atheist would care otherwise.

The posting is to correct a common misconception about Einstein.

Here's the information required to verify.
Publisher: Simon and Schuster
(c) 2007
ISBN 13: 978-0-7432-6473-0
ISBN 10: 0-7432-6473-8

Slugs

FISMA wrote:

Frankly, if Einstein was an Atheist, I would not care

Obviously you did, or you wouldn't have felt the need to disprove it =/

MrStuffins

>>Sorry Slugs<<

Slugs

^ I actually find that pic disgusting o.O And I don't know why... Might be the hour...

MrStuffins

Originally posted by Albert Einstein (in a letter to Guy Raner Jnr)

I received your letter of June 10th. I have never talked to a Jesuit priest in my life and I am astonished by the audacity to tell such lies about me. From the viewpoint of a Jesuit priest I am, of course, and have always been an atheist.

Next?

Slugs

MrStuffins wrote: »

Next?

FISMA

Jesuits are Christians who steadfastly assert Jesus as the Christ. If you do not believe in Jesus as God, then you do not believe in God and are an atheist.

That's why Einstein said "from the viewpoint of a Jesuit priest I am, of course, and have always been an atheist."

But you already know that, don't you?

Cute, but please do better.

Your question answered, please answer mine. I ask you to explain my misinterpretation of

I'm not an atheist

and There are people who say there is no God. But what makes me really angry is when they quote me for support of such views.

Slugs

Albert Einstein, letter to Guy H. Raner Jr., Sept. 28, 1949, quoted by Michael R. Gilmore in Skeptic, Vol. 5, No. 2 wrote:

I have repeatedly said that in my opinion the idea of a personal God is a childlike one. You may call me an agnostic, but I do not share the crusading spirit of the professional atheist whose fervor is mostly due to a painful act of liberation from the fetters of religious indoctrination received in youth. I prefer an attitude of humility corresponding to the weakness of our intellectual understanding of nature and of our own being.

Albert Einstein, letter to Morris Raphael Cohen, professor emeritus of philosophy at the College of the City of New York, March 19, 1940. wrote:

Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds. The mediocre mind is incapable of understanding the man who refuses to bow blindly to conventional prejudices and chooses instead to express his opinions courageously and honestly.

Is this going to be a quote war o.O, if it is let me get some tea...

MrStuffins

FISMA wrote: »

Jesuits are Christians who steadfastly assert Jesus as the Christ. If you do not believe in Jesus as God, then you do not believe in God and are an atheist.

That's what Einstein said "from the viewpoint of a Jesuit priest I am, of course, and have always been an atheist."

Nitpicking i'm afraid.

Einstein was athiest, and you obviously care as much as you want people to believe you don't.

Originally posted by FISMA


Your question answered, please answer mine.

And i didnt you ask a question

FISMA

Do you believe in God?

I'm not an atheist

Slugs

FISMA wrote: »

Do you believe in God?

I'm not an atheist

What exactly are you looking to get out of this exactly? o.O

strobe

I heard Einstein was a Hindu.

"I believe completely in Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva!" - Albert Einstein :eek:

Fairly definitive if you ask me. What does this have to do with anything??? Well.....nothing....but...like..God and junk!

MrStuffins

FISMA wrote: »

Do you believe in God?

I'm not an atheist

Bravo Sir, mystery answered!

It's crazy how so many people around the world are in the belief that Einstein was Athiest and all they had to do was come to Boards.ie at this precise moment!

The perception that he believed in Nature and being as "God", smashed to pieces. it is so clear now that he believed in a personal God! My eyes have now been opened.

If it's good enough for Albert, it's good enough for me, off to the Christianity forum i go!

Slugs

MrStuffins wrote: »

Bravo Sir, mystery answered!

It's crazy how so many people around the world are in the belief that Einstein was Athiest and all they had to do was come to Boards.ie at this precise moment!

The perception that he believed in Nature and being as "God", smashed to pieces. it is so clear now that he believed in a personal God! My eyes have now been opened.

If it's good enough for Albert, it's good enough for me, off to the Christianity forum i go!

Indeed, before I follow you, I'll make a point.
All this proves is one of two things:

1) He was an agnostic
2) He just suffers from another mental illness.

either way, I really don't see how much else changes. I mean I've never see Einstein brought up in any A&A threads I've been or lurked in, maybe I should get around more on here.

FISMA

Good night, this is tiring and depressing. I honestly thought one could appeal to the logic and reasonable side of Agnostics or Atheists.

I'll stop after this and defer the final comment to you.

Read Chapter 17. See what Einstein said. Don't take my word or some blog of quotes.

I don't see how a logical or reasonable person can, in the face of this direct quote, asked point blank, and answered concisely, conclude that Einstein was an Atheist.

Again, I am not saying he was a man of God, was religious, spiritual, ...

I'm not an atheist

There are people who say there is no God. But what makes me really angry is when they quote me for support of such views.

Slugs

FISMA wrote: »

Good night, this is tiring and depressing. I honestly thought one could appeal to the logic and reasonable side of Agnostics or Atheists.

I'll stop after this and defer the final comment to you.

Read Chapter 17. See what Einstein said. Don't take my word or some blog of quotes.

I don't see how a logical or reasonable person can, in the face of this direct quote, asked point blank, and answered concisely, conclude that Einstein was an Atheist.

Again, I am not saying he was a man of God, was religious, spiritual, ...

I'm not an atheist

There are people who say there is no God. But what makes me really angry is when they quote me for support of such views.

Obviously your own logic and perception are in dire need of some assistance. Whereupon did I say he was an atheist o.O? And you failed to answer my question. What're you looking to get out of this?

MrStuffins

FISMA wrote: »

Good night, this is tiring and depressing. I honestly thought one could appeal to the logic and reasonable side of Agnostics or Atheists.

I'll stop after this and defer the final comment to you.

Read Chapter 17. See what Einstein said. Don't take my word or some blog of quotes.

I don't see how a logical or reasonable person can, in the face of this direct quote, asked point blank, and answered concisely, conclude that Einstein was an Atheist.

Again, I am not saying he was a man of God, was religious, spiritual, ...

I'm not an atheist

There are people who say there is no God. But what makes me really angry is when they quote me for support of such views.

Quotes Shmotes!

Originally posted by David Icke

I am the Son of God

That clears that up then.

Sam Vimes

Einstein was a deist afaik

Rev Hellfire

Sam Vimes wrote: »

Einstein was a dentist afaik

Are you sure ?

Sam Vimes

Rev Hellfire wrote: »

Are you sure ?

Not totally sure. I know he didn't believe in a personal god but he did believe in something:

"I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with fates and actions of human beings." Upon being asked if he believed in God by Rabbi Herbert Goldstein of the Institutional Synagogue, New York, April 24, 1921, Einstein: The Life and Times, Ronald W. Clark, Page 502.

That not a pantheist
Edit: I just spotted your edit of my post. No I do not believe Einstein fixed people's teeth

cavedave

Thanks Vimes. AFAIK Einstein was a Spinozian Deist.

Which isnt an atheist but isnt a pie in the sky when you die theist either.

D-Generate

I thought it was well known that Einstein wasn't an Atheist. Sure isn't one of the most famous debates in history between Einstein and Bohr on theology?

robindch

Sam Vimes wrote: »

Einstein was a deist afaik

Only in the most vague sense that he believed that there was an innate tendency towards order in the universe -- many religious people have interpreted this to mean that he believed in their particular deity, which is, of course, untrue.

If about.com is to be trusted, then Einstein wrote the following in 1945:

Albert Einstein wrote:

I received your letter of June 10th. I have never talked to a Jesuit priest in my life and I am astonished by the audacity to tell such lies about me. From the viewpoint of a Jesuit priest I am, of course, and have always been an atheist.

Which is clear enough, I think!

bnt

If you're going to go quote-mining to justify your personal beliefs, would you mind at least reading the Wikipedia page on the subject of Albert Einstein's Religious Views? A lot of people have said a lot of things on the topic, including Albert himself:

I'm not an atheist and I don't think I can call myself a pantheist. We are in the position of a little child entering a huge library filled with books in many different languages. The child knows someone must have written those books. It does not know how. The child dimly suspects a mysterious order in the arrangement of the books but doesn't know what it is. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God.

Einstein didn't call himself an atheist because he didn't like the word and its connotations:

I have repeatedly said that in my opinion the idea of a personal God is a childlike one. You may call me an agnostic, but I do not share the crusading spirit of the professional atheist whose fervor is mostly due to a painful act of liberation from the fetters of religious indoctrination received in youth. I prefer an attitude of humility corresponding to the weakness of our intellectual understanding of nature and of our own being.

I have no problem with that. We don't have the right to label anyone else against their wishes. It's just a word, and it's lost many of its negative connotations since Albert's time. These days, we can be atheists without that "crusading spirit" he associated with the concept. In other words: while he was a great scientist, that didn't make him an expert on everything, and he was mistaken on the topic of atheism. I'm not just talking about today's understanding of the term - he was around at the same time as Bertrand Russell, who did so much to clarify the concepts.

Dades

Einstein wasn't an atheist, ergo my particular branch of the Christian God exists... zing!

gbee

E: My religiosity consists of a humble admiration of the infinitely superior spirit that reveals itself in the little that we can comprehend in the knowable world. That deeply emotional conviction of the presence of a superior reasoning power, which is revealed in the incomprehensible universe, forms my idea of God.

I'd go along with this up to the bold part.

stevejazzx

He was agnostic leaning towards deism out of his belief that there was an order in the Universe 'god does not play dice'.
Note to OP: He was unreservedly atheist to relation to all personal gods. That is a fact - there are question of this.
Like the OP's other post he seems to have a massive problem differentiating between the two.

"I'm am not a atheist"
(in realtion ito everything i.e I believe there may an intelligent universal entity of some kind) which when despairing towards the end of his life he questioned; hence agnostic leaning towards.

"I am atheist"
(in relation to all personal gods).

So both of these very easy to understand points explain why we see the differing quotes presented here. Any deist who thinks the idea of personal god is ridiculous is going to be easy to misquote.
Now that that's cleared up - what on earth is the point of this?

drkpower

FISMA wrote: »

Einstein Was Not an Atheist

Ok, lets just say he was the most devout God-believing Jew....

So where does that get us?

Really clever man who believed in God: Albert Einstein

Really stupid man who believed in God: Bertie Ahern

Its 1-all; can we move on now?

liamw

robindch wrote: »

Only in the most vague sense that he believed that there was an innate tendency towards order in the universe -- many religious people have interpreted this to mean that he believed in their particular deity, which is, of course, untrue.

I agree. He definitely did not believe in a God in any obvious sense of the word.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GY_p_ry9V5s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKt9EgENzGI

Antbert

Firstly, I don't necessarily believe you.

Secondly, Einstein wasn't an atheist? ****. *chucks out school and college physics books*

Who the hell cares?

Dr. Loon

OP, so he wasn't an atheist. Grand. Now what? Is there a point?

Ickle Magoo

STOP PRESS

Scientist born in 1879 may not have declared himself an atheist?!

Shockerooonies! :eek::pac:

robindch

Antbert wrote: »

Who the hell cares?

All those religious people who wish to place their religious beliefs in the reflected afterglow of Einstein's approval?

ColmDawson

robindch wrote: »

All those religious people who wish to place their religious beliefs in the reflected afterglow of Einstein's approval?

The reflected afterglow of the Almighty Lord God's approval isn't enough?

bleg

Yea? Well Jesus wasn't Christian!!!

cypharius

Einstein was an agnostic, he used God as a Metaphore for the unknown...


END OF!

Tomk1

D-Generate wrote: »

I thought it was well known that Einstein wasn't an Atheist. Sure isn't one of the most famous debates in history between Einstein and Bohr on theology?

D-Generate, sorry but what debate is this? is there a link or audio/video recording.
btw it is frustrating when people post comments in referrence to some book or site, but do not include a link.

FISMA wrote: »

I have heard several posters claim that Einstein was an Atheist, I believe this is, point of fact, wrong.

BELIEF?

FISMA wrote: »

Here is what I am saying, nothing more nothing less: Einstein was not an Atheist.

Now Fact?

FISMA wrote: »

In his book, "Einstein His Life and Universe" author Walter Isaacson cites an interview between Einstein and George Sylvester Viereck and several other conversations.

The following are excerpts quoted from the book - their words, not mine. Q is for the question from Viereck and E is for Einstein. Einstein's words are in bold, the author's are not.

Pick up a copy Chapter 17 is a great read.

Page 386

Q. Do you believe in God?
E: I'm not an atheist

Did you read the Question? If I asked someone if they believe's in santa&god they will answer YES, did AE answer "YES"?
For a long time I never called myself an Atheist, just move agnostic, with a belief in a universal life force (god-like) but not a crazed breaded skydaddy, that lets priests talk on his/her behalf.
If I was asked that Q. considering the position of AE and not wanting to offend any one, that's a great answer, If he said I don't believe in God but I'm not an atheist then that would of confused the simpletons

FISMA wrote: »

More interesting quotes.

E: I am a Jew, but I am enthralled by the luminous figure of the Nazarene.

Q. You accept the historical existence of Jesus?
E. Unquestionably! No one can read the Gospels without feeling the actual presence of Jesus.

E: My religiosity consists of a humble admiration of the infinitely superior spirit that reveals itself in the little that we can comprehend in the knowable world. That deeply emotional conviction of the presence of a superior reasoning power, which is revealed in the incomprehensible universe, forms my idea of God.

page 389
Throughout his life, he was consistent in deflecting the charge that he was an atheist. There are people who say there is no God, he told a friend. But what makes me really angry is when they quote me for support of such views.

I have heard stories like this where AE is Quoted for half a sentence, I looked for an article I seen before about some famous misqoute used by theists, but the full-quote said the opposite

FISMA wrote: »

This is not an attack on your community. Frankly, if Einstein was an Atheist, I would not care, so I do not see why any Atheist would care otherwise.

The posting is to correct a common misconception about Einstein.

Here's the information required to verify.
Publisher: Simon and Schuster
(c) 2007
ISBN 13: 978-0-7432-6473-0
ISBN 10: 0-7432-6473-8

I have this but the linked page is nolonger there:

Albert Einstein described belief in God as "childish superstition" and said Jews were not the chosen people, in a letter to be sold in London this week, an auctioneer said Tuesday.
The father of relativity, whose previously known views on religion have been more ambivalent and fuelled much discussion, made the comments in response to a philosopher in 1954.
As a Jew himself, Einstein said he had a great affinity with Jewish people but said they "have no different quality for me than all other people".
"The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish.
"No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this," he wrote in the letter written on January 3, 1954 to the philosopher Eric Gutkind, cited by The Guardian newspaper.
The German-language letter is being sold Thursday by Bloomsbury Auctions in Mayfair after being in a private collection for more than 50 years, said the auction house's managing director Rupert Powell.
In it, the renowned scientist, who declined an invitation to become Israel's second president, rejected the idea that the Jews are God's chosen people.
"For me the Jewish religion like all others is an incarnation of the most childish superstitions," he said.
"And the Jewish people to whom I gladly belong and with whose mentality I have a deep affinity have no different quality for me than all other people."
And he added: "As far as my experience goes, they are no better than other human groups, although they are protected from the worst cancers by a lack of power. Otherwise I cannot see anything 'chosen' about them."
Previously the great scientist's comments on religion -- such as "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind" -- have been the subject of much debate, used notably to back up arguments in favour of faith.
Powell said the letter being sold this week gave a clear reflection of Einstein's real thoughts on the subject. "He's fairly unequivocal as to what he's saying. There's no beating about the bush," he told AFP.

Zombrex

FISMA wrote: »

I have heard several posters claim that Einstein was an Atheist, I believe this is, point of fact, wrong.

Einstein was a scientist. He didn't like absolute claims about things we can't know, and rejected the idea that science had demonstrated intelligent creators didn't exist. Equally though he rejected as the childish rambling of ignorant people the notion of these creators as described by human religion.

He was an atheist in that he rejected human theism, rather than declared there was no intelligent creator (something he realized we couldn't know).

Which makes him pretty similar to most atheists on this forum.