Pulled by Garda - one way street dilema

leroy_brown

Hi All,

Not sure if i am in the right section here but hopefully you will see and make your comment.

Scenario:

Living in Dublin, visited friend in Portlaoise a few weeks ago, we went to a club, it was late 1am or so, no drink taken and none intended.

Not familiar with the town so feeling my way around, drive down a narrow street about 10 meters long and turned onto what seemed like a main street.......drove for maybe another 200 meters down the main street when i noticed a large Garda jeep behind me (with no flashing lights)

I pulled into a space outside the club. I noticed the garda jeep pulling up to block me in, the passenger (Garda) was waving frantically at me. So i wait untl they come near. The driver came over and started giving out yards, do you know what you di do you know what you did to which i replied i have no idea garda, i immediately handed over my licence & insurance etc without him asking. He said i drove down a one way street. As im not familiar with the area i sincerely apologised to the Garda saying same. But he took no notice, my passenger, a Portlaoise native interrupted and explained further to the Garda that I was not from the area, to which the Garda replied, 'you should have known where he was driving and told him, why didnt you?'

Garda scanned the rest of the car, tyres, lights, ins/tax disca etc (all 100%), now at all times i was overly polite as i dont believe in back chat to the Garda works.

So now, the Garda walks off for a few mins, then comes back so i ask, 'Sorry Garda, what is going to happen/', to which he replied, 'you will get a €40 euro fine in the post.' And he walked away.

I then step out of my car and walked over to the Garda as he was back into the Jeep andf asked, 'sorry Garda, by any chance i could have your name', to which he replies 'Garda SURNAME', i aske further 'could i also have your first name?', he replied very abruply, 'no, your not entitled to know my first name'

Long story short, now at no point in time was any Road Traffic Act quoted to me whatsoever, and my friend can say the same (we were both completely sober). Plus, one week later, i get a notice in the post to say i have to pay €80 and i will get two penalty points. I immediately call my friend and tell her i got a notice in the post and i have an €80 fine plus two points. Her immediate first response is 'WHAT, but he said it was €40 fine'.

Now i dont know what next step to take, should i appeal to the Gardda ombudsman or or or. To date i have not paid the fine as i feel i will be acknowledging the alleged offence. Of course, it may have been a one way street, i clearly didnt notice. My two big issues here are, not been notified of any Road Traffic Act, and being told €40 and getting €80 fine.

I drive a high powered Dublin reg non boy racer car, have no penalty point or endorsements

Any comments appreciated.

Voodoomelon

There's no such thing as a €40 fine, the minimum is €80 and 2 points. Whilst i sympathise with you and the ignorant Garda, if you contest it if will probably end up with you getting 4 points as the fact is you went down a one way street and there's no defending it. You caught him on a bad day.

Berty

Oh well. You drove down a one way street.

What are you looking to achieve?

spurious

I'd say just pay it. You're not likely to get anywhere objecting.

stellarartois

Why didn't your 'friend' tell you that you were going the wrong way down a one way street?

Midnight_EG

stellarartois wrote: »

Why didn't your 'friend' tell you that you were going the wrong way down a one way street?

Have you gotten a nose-bleed while on that mighty steed?



OP, you unfortunately were in the wrong, no doubts about it. Might get him a little on the whole €40 thing though, who knows?

Just pay it and be done with it is all that can be done really

leroy_brown

Guys,

Thanks for your comments, yes, theres an overwhelming 'PAY THE FINE' vote here....was just ticking in my head for a while needed to get an opinion.

Thank you

stellarartois

Midnight_EG wrote: »

Have you gotten a nose-bleed while on that mighty steed?

What are you on about?

gbee

€40 is a parking fine ... maybe, just maybe he was going to fine you for parking ~ and then said efyou and did you for the real offence.

That's just my imagination working here.

stellarartois

Why did you want his name?

AugustusMinimus

stellarartois wrote: »

Why did you want his name?

In the case of getting fined, why wouldn't you want the name of the Garda envolved.

TestTransmission

what car do you have op out of interest?

Paddysnapper

FFS...You could have been done for, Driving without due care and attention..Had you cased an accident...Dangerous driving....Be a good boy, pay up and shut up, you where in the wrong!:eek:

Hagar

In all fairness you don't have to know an area to drive in it. One way streets are clearly marked with roadsigns and roadmarkings. Where was your observation while driving? TBH you are lucky not to be done for multiple offences.

the_barfly1

OP, I live in Portlaoise and in all fairness, the one way streets around the main st are pretty well signposted, and the roads laid out in such a way to make it awkward to go the wrong way, especially to get down to the nightclub im thinking you turned down towards.
Id say just pay up and take it as a learning experience

leroy_brown

Yes, a learning experience it is lads, thank you all for your comments...;-)

n0brain3r

Have to say I feel for you OP I did the same thing not being from Port Laoise I was lost looking for an address and managed to turn off one of those double mini roundabouts the wrong way up a one way street. Also see here http://www.penaltypoints.ie/the_full_list_of_offences.php I can only see one point for illegal entry to a one way street. What exactly does it say you got the points for?

Mimikyu

This post has been deleted.

DubTony

The amount of high horses around here will keep the horse breeding industry in business for years.

corktina

did you try telling the gard that you knew it was a one way street but you were only going one way?:D

Put it down to experiance and move on...

donvito99

This really, really annoys me OP. You drove down a one way street. You had a Portlaoise native in your car, who didn't notice that you were going down a one way street.

And you have the cheek to ask for the Garda's name? Just because he did exactly as he should?

Just because you made a so called 'genuine mistake' does not mean that you should in any way get off a ticket. It is up to the Garda to decide.

Maybe you should be more vigilante in the future, instead of starting a thread.

/rant

leroy_brown

n0brain3r wrote: »

Have to say I feel for you OP I did the same thing not being from Port Laoise I was lost looking for an address and managed to turn off one of those double mini roundabouts the wrong way up a one way street. Also see here http://www.penaltypoints.ie/the_full_list_of_offences.php I can only see one point for illegal entry to a one way street. What exactly does it say you got the points for?

yes i was done for 'Driving Without Reasonable Consideration'

Berty

leroy_brown wrote: »

yes i was done for 'Driving Without Reasonable Consideration'

Do you wish to contest it?

Vertakill

donvito99 wrote: »

This really, really annoys me OP. You drove down a one way street. You had a Portlaoise native in your car, who didn't notice that you were going down a one way street.

And you have the cheek to ask for the Garda's name? Just because he did exactly as he should?

Just because you made a so called 'genuine mistake' does not mean that you should in any way get off a ticket. It is up to the Garda to decide.

Maybe you should be more vigilante in the future, instead of starting a thread.

/rant

Erm, this thread 'really' annoys you? I'd hate to be a passenger in your car if this kind of thing annoys you this much.

Plenty of people make mistakes on the road and don't get penalty points or fines. Driving in an unfamiliar area in the dark can be difficult to get your baring sometimes, so people need to relax a bit.

Unless someone was taking the one-way street as a shortcut or doing something plain reckless/dangerous, I don't think the Garda needs to jump for a fine off the bat.

Wasn't there some granny not so long ago that was driving the wrong way down a dual carriageway or something?
I hardly think it's the same as what the OP did.. but he's a young male in a high powered car with a female passenger... *Alarm Bells*

I don't think it warrants €80 and penalty points. He could've just as easily reprimanded and educated the OP about what he had done and let him away.


Also, wouldn't it have been less dangerous if the Gardai to just tap their police bottle on/off to get your attention, rather than follow behind you all the way waving at you?

Midnight_EG

Berty wrote: »

Do you wish to contest it?

'The direction in which I was driving, I considered it to be the right way '

Berty

Midnight_EG wrote: »

'The direction in which I was driving, I considered it to be the right way '

Yes but its still important to figure out if the OP wants to contest it and then try to talk him out of it.

Midnight_EG

Berty wrote: »

Yes but its still important to figure out if the OP wants to contest it and then try to talk him out of it.

I suppose, but will reasonable doubt really come into play here?

TheInquisitor

donvito99 wrote: »

This really, really annoys me OP. You drove down a one way street. You had a Portlaoise native in your car, who didn't notice that you were going down a one way street.

And you have the cheek to ask for the Garda's name? Just because he did exactly as he should?

Just because you made a so called 'genuine mistake' does not mean that you should in any way get off a ticket. It is up to the Garda to decide.

Maybe you should be more vigilante in the future, instead of starting a thread.

/rant

How is it cheeky to ask for a Garda's name? The only cheeky person is the garda who was too immature to give theirs!

leroy_brown

donvito99 wrote: »

This really, really annoys me OP. You drove down a one way street. You had a Portlaoise native in your car, who didn't notice that you were going down a one way street.

And you have the cheek to ask for the Garda's name? Just because he did exactly as he should?

Just because you made a so called 'genuine mistake' does not mean that you should in any way get off a ticket. It is up to the Garda to decide.

Maybe you should be more vigilante in the future, instead of starting a thread.

/rant

Well excuse me, asking a Gardas name is cheek? Are they the superior almighty which we shall obey and never question....please!

Yes, a genuine mistake indeed, it is possible for people to actually make mistakes. But lets be clear here, im not expecting to get off with a ticket because i made a genuine mistake.

Guards arent perfect you know, why would we have and Ombudsman.

And in doing exactly as he should as you say above....this is the purpose of my post, in questioning did he do exactly as he should, i.e. im issued with a notice where he NEVER quoted the act, my understanding is that they are obliged by law to quote the act to you for what offence you are alleged to have committed. He definitely did not quote anything. And, getting told i will be getting a €40 fine and getting €80.

n0brain3r

leroy_brown wrote: »

yes i was done for 'Driving Without Reasonable Consideration'

Sounds a bit harsh were there aggravating factors? Did you drive down the street at 50kph;) or pull in suddenly without indicating etc?

scudzilla

The best thing to do, and ONLY do this if you are 100% certain that your car is perfect on everything.

When the Garda starts walking around your car, checking it out, start walking around his checking it out, The Garda vehicle has to be of the same road worthy standard as anybody elses.

I've done this many times back in Wales and it got me out of a fine twice, as once his rear brake light wasn't working and once his tyre thread was under the legal limit.

Absurdum

scudzilla wrote: »

I've done this many times back in Wales and it got me out of a fine twice, as once his rear brake light wasn't working and once his tyre thread was under the legal limit.

did you give him a fine and penalty points?

donvito99

Vertakill wrote: »

Erm, this thread 'really' annoys you? I'd hate to be a passenger in your car if this kind of thing annoys you this much.

Plenty of people make mistakes on the road and don't get penalty points or fines. Driving in an unfamiliar area in the dark can be difficult to get your baring sometimes, so people need to relax a bit.

Unless someone was taking the one-way street as a shortcut or doing something plain reckless/dangerous, I don't think the Garda needs to jump for a fine off the bat.

Wasn't there some granny not so long ago that was driving the wrong way down a dual carriageway or something?
I hardly think it's the same as what the OP did.. but he's a young male in a high powered car with a female passenger... *Alarm Bells*

I don't think it warrants €80 and penalty points. He could've just as easily reprimanded and educated the OP about what he had done and let him away.


Also, wouldn't it have been less dangerous if the Gardai to just tap their police bottle on/off to get your attention, rather than follow behind you all the way waving at you?

I am not annoyed of the fact that he drove down a one way street. I am annoyed that the OP is challenging the fact that he got a ticket and that he asked for the Garda's name. And its for the Garda to decide, not you.

scudzilla

Absurdum wrote: »

did you give him a fine and penalty points?

Nope, just said that i would be calling the police asking a second Traffic cop to attend as his car wasn't roadworthy either, both times i was told just to head off, never heard anything more

donvito99

TheInquisitor wrote: »

How is it cheeky to ask for a Garda's name? The only cheeky person is the garda who was too immature to give theirs!

As the Garda supposedly said, he does not have to give his name. He has an epaulette number. That is sufficient.

I described the OP as cheeky, because was there any need for him to ask of the Garda's name? The OP was in the wrong, he needed to accept that there and then.

donvito99

leroy_brown wrote: »

Guards arent perfect you know, why would we have and Ombudsman.

.

People are not perfect you know, thats why we have the Guards.

drkpower

scudzilla wrote: »

The best thing to do, and ONLY do this if you are 100% certain that your car is perfect on everything.

When the Garda starts walking around your car, checking it out, start walking around his checking it out, The Garda vehicle has to be of the same road worthy standard as anybody elses.

I've done this many times back in Wales and it got me out of a fine twice, as once his rear brake light wasn't working and once his tyre thread was under the legal limit.

:rolleyes:
Whether the Garda's car is defective has nothing to do with whether you have committed an offence. Trying to be smart vis-a-vis the Garda's car , I would imagine, is less likely to result in the Garda being lenient. If you are reasonable and contrite about whatever minor offence you have committted, you are more likely to be let off with a warning.

dellas1979

I'd be annoyed that Id to pay e80 for my own stupid mistake. I wouldnt be annoyed at the garda for doing his job. Why he said e40, I dont know. Heck, maybe he was confused - maybe he was going to write you up for something else-who knows.

It was a mistake, but in all essence yours was dangerous one. What if someone walking along that piece of road stepped off a footpath not looking around because he wasnt expecting a car to be coming down that direction of a one way street? Would you blame them for not looking around?

Id take the fine, learn a lesson and try be a bit more observant and thankful nothing else happened.

And lets be honest, most people here are not on their high horses. They probably cant get their head around why the OP is contesting this.

Fiesta

scudzilla wrote: »

I've done this many times back in Wales and it got me out of a fine twice, as once his rear brake light wasn't working and once his tyre thread was under the legal limit.

Did you ask the Policeman to apply his brake pedal so you could check out his brake lamps?

I can only imagine this type of behaviour would not have a happy ending for the driver!

leroy_brown

dellas1979 wrote: »

I'd be annoyed that Id to pay e80 for my own stupid mistake. I wouldnt be annoyed at the garda for doing his job. Why he said e40, I dont know. Heck, maybe he was confused - maybe he was going to write you up for something else-who knows.

It was a mistake, but in all essence yours was dangerous one. What if someone walking along that piece of road stepped off a footpath not looking around because he wasnt expecting a car to be coming down that direction of a one way street? Would you blame them for not looking around?

Id take the fine, learn a lesson and try be a bit more observant and thankful nothing else happened.

And lets be honest, most people here are not on their high horses. They probably cant get their head around why the OP is contesting this.

Ok, once again, lets be clear, im not contesting the fact that i drove down a one way street, i am merely querying whether this notice applies as:

1) The Garda didn't quote an Act
2) The Garda stated i would be getting a €40 fine, but instead i received €80 and two penalty points in the post.

With both of the above in mind i am querying do i have a right to contest on this basis?

And to n0brain3er, wasnt driving down the street at 50kph, was more like 10kph, the street was 15-20 meters long and about a car and a half in width. Nothing careless, although it is a high powered car, i never act like a lunatic or think im king of the road sorry if i gave the impression i was.

ardmacha

The OP was guilty of illegal and potentially hazardous driving behaviour. He was caught and the Guard wasn't unduly harsh on him. He should take his punishment like a man (unless he is a she) and stop worrying about irrelevancies.

leroy_brown

donvito99 wrote: »

People are not perfect you know, thats why we have the Guards.

Guards aren't perfect you know, that's why we have Nurses

Abraham

leroy_brown wrote: »

Guards aren't perfect you know, that's why we have Nurses

Yer dead right there. Just take a dekko at all the illegal parking done in the vicinity of Garda stations. How many clamps do you see applied there or cars lifted by the clampers , eh ?
Everyone is equal though but some are more so !

drkpower

leroy_brown wrote: »

With both of the above in mind i am querying do i have a right to contest on this basis?

Its a fixed charge offence and you were provided with a fixed charge notice; they dont need to tell you precisely at the time of the offence what offence you committed or what the precise penalty is.

Suck it up!

MagicSean

leroy_brown wrote: »

Ok, once again, lets be clear, im not contesting the fact that i drove down a one way street, i am merely querying whether this notice applies as:

1) The Garda didn't quote an Act
2) The Garda stated i would be getting a €40 fine, but instead i received €80 and two penalty points in the post.

With both of the above in mind i am querying do i have a right to contest on this basis?

And to n0brain3er, wasnt driving down the street at 50kph, was more like 10kph, the street was 15-20 meters long and about a car and a half in width. Nothing careless, although it is a high powered car, i never act like a lunatic or think im king of the road sorry if i gave the impression i was.

There's no obligation to quote an act. Stating the wrong fine amount will not get you off either. In fact it's quite possible the Garda was going to let you off the ticket or give you one for a minor offence until you decided to get out of your car and look for his name. Driving without due care is the most serious fixed charge offence.

dellas1979

Ok, ok - put it like this...


Did you cause a driving offence - yes or no? Yes

Does the fact the garda not quoting you an act change this? No, you still caused a driving offence and you did get the information in the post.

Does the fact the garda didnt quote you the correct penalty charge change your situation/mistake? No, you still caused an offence.

If the garda did give you the correct e80 amount and told you about penalty points, would you still contest it? Yours to reply...

Guy:Incognito

Midnight_EG wrote: »

Have you gotten a nose-bleed while on that mighty steed?

If the friend was knowledgable enough to chip in with his opinion when the Gards showed up, why didnt he do it earlier when they were heading up a one way street? I dont see why someone has to be on their high horse to ask that.

DubTony wrote: »

The amount of high horses around here will keep the horse breeding industry in business for years.

The amount of bad drivers will keep the insurance companies in business too. Maybe they should stop worrying about horses and concentrate on driving properly.

REXER

Just a quick question about the junction that you entered in the wrong direction.
Was the 1 way status clearly demarcated or is it possible that it was an alley, in the middle of a block that you exited from where the 1 way may not be clearly sign posted?

Any time I have any interaction with a God Guard I alway I verify their ID, just incase that there is a need to follow up for any reason. Why should the Guard have any reason not to clearly identify himself?

AlekSmart

Leroy_Brown has one very clear option available.

Lawyer-Up and go to Court.

There he/she (via his Brief) can put the facts as outlined on this thread to the Judge and get a ruling thereupon.

This adjudication can then,should it prove negative,be appealed to a superior court all the way to the Supreme Court if the grounds exist.

One thing I tend to do when in the vicinity of Garda activity is to make a discreet note of any shoulder tabs I can see and the identifiying code on the Vehicle Roof,although I concede that on a big-jeep it would be difficult to note this.

It might also be worthwhile to inspect the scene in daylight with a view to noting the regulatory signage and/or statutory road-markings which if not all in order could well provide grounds for a strike-out.

Eoin

stellarartois wrote: »

What are you on about?

It was one of those stupid "high horse" references.

drkpower

AlekSmart wrote: »

Leroy_Brown has one very clear option available.

Lawyer-Up and go to Court.

There he/she (via his Brief) can put the facts as outlined on this thread to the Judge and get a ruling thereupon.

This adjudication can then,should it prove negative,be appealed to a superior court all the way to the Supreme Court if the grounds exist.

Yes, he could spend an enormous amount of cash in taking that option; or he could save that cash, pay his fine, and move on.