Gaelforce West 21/8/10

spurscormac

Wonkagirl wrote: »

That is crucial. Make a plan, and stick to it. I didnt do that at all last yr- as a result i had one banana and one bar for the entire race- disaster! i didnt feel like eating the rest of the stuff so didnt bother, but i had no clear plan as to what and when.. was a spent woman crossing the line. Even if i have to forcefeed myself i'll be eating every half hour this time.


There you go. comments welcome! is 3 bananas too much? afraid i'd be constipated for days!

I've taken your plan & adapted it...

Brekkie (5am)- orange juice
medium bowl of porridge with honey
liking the bagel idea, so bagel it is.
large coffee


On the bus: Ginger Bake NutriGrain, possibly an apple

Kayak interchange: NutriGrain again
At bike: Jaffa Bar
Throughout bike: jaffa bars & NutriGrains - need to make them easy access, ie not zipped in my backpack.
Towards end of bike: power bar 1
At summit of CP: power bar 2
Back on bike: power bar 3 or jaffa bars

Nice idea on the raisins Wonka, might add that or try to find a tasty fruit and nut mix - gonna have to figure somewhere to carry it though.

1.2 lt of water on back, possibly with diorlyte, unsure on that.
750mls of caprisun on bike.

I don't think I'll need to refill on the water at the kayak stop, its far too early for me to have drunk 1.2l of water, might add a second bottle & cage filled with water to the bike.

Wonkagirl

spurscormac wrote: »

At bike: Jaffa Bar
Throughout bike: jaffa bars & NutriGrains - need to make them easy access, ie not zipped in my backpack.

sellotape them to the bike! great tip that i got from brian in total xperience. i'm gonna sellotape a banana and jaffabar
to the bike.. the jellies and raisins can just go in a pocket

spurscormac

Wonkagirl wrote: »

sellotape them to the bike! great tip that i got from brian in total xperience. i'm gonna sellotape a banana and jaffabar
to the bike.. the jellies and raisins can just go in a pocket

Taping to the bike sounds a good idea, will trial it on a spin, make sure its easy to pull off.
I ain't got any pockets in my gear though, except on the back of the cycling jersey, which will of course be covered by the backpack.

I'll figure something out - attach some sort of pocket or bag to the waistband of the backpack.

nerraw1111

Would taking a gel or eating anything before the last bike leg be a waste of time?

It's a 30 minute fast descent to the finish line, barely time for a gel to have an effect.

Drinking 1 litre of water on the first 12km run seems like overkill? You shouldn't really need to drink any water up until the kayak section.

I'm contemplating of leaving all my drinks at the bike transition. Less to carry and you can refuel at full speed. A mouthful of water at the kayak tap should be suffecient.

Wonkagirl

yeah nerraw 1 ltr is probably a bit much, i was thinking of carrying 1lt, drinking maybe 500 mls or so during the 12km- that'll be weather dependent of course, but i'll definitely be sipping away- then replacing that 500ml at the kayak to bring it back to 1ltr.. put it this way, the last thign you want is to run out of water at any stage- nitemare. i came across a fella who was about to cark it half way up Cp last yr- no water, cramping, in bits- didnt have much left myself but had to give him most of what i had, out of pure humanity- was left empty then myself on the last cycle.

does anyone else have a problem with needing to go to the loo the whole time- so even if you go straight before the race, the minute you start you need to go again?
i'm starting to think i'm either overhydrating or it's all in my head

the gels take only 15 mins to kick in apparenlty, so taking one before getting on the bike again is definitely a good option

watergal

nerraw1111 wrote: »

Would taking a gel or eating anything before the last bike leg be a waste of time?

It's a 30 minute fast descent to the finish line, barely time for a gel to have an effect.

Drinking 1 litre of water on the first 12km run seems like overkill? You shouldn't really need to drink any water up until the kayak section.

I'm contemplating of leaving all my drinks at the bike transition. Less to carry and you can refuel at full speed. A mouthful of water at the kayak tap should be suffecient.

I'm just bringing a 500ml bottle of water with me on the first run & filling it if needs be at the kayak. Keeping a bottle of sportsdrink on the bike and will bring the water up CP with me.
If one if well hydrated going into the race, then there shouldn't be a necessity to carry too much water on foot .. ( IMHO of course )

Peterx

Taking a gel just before the last bike leg is good. Better in you then your pocket as you're carrying it anyway and they can start having an effect in less then 10 minutes.
I carry 3 gels taped to the bike and start taking them 90 minutes before my projected finish time at 30 minutes intervals.
All your liquid all day should have either NUUN tabs or diaralyte in it with whatever energy gunk you like added, sometimes I just go with Robinsons orange as it's tasty and has some calories.

spurscormac

Wonkagirl wrote: »

yeah nerraw 1 ltr is probably a bit much, i was thinking of carrying 1lt, drinking maybe 500 mls or so during the 12km- that'll be weather dependent of course, but i'll definitely be sipping away

does anyone else have a problem with needing to go to the loo the whole time- so even if you go straight before the race, the minute you start you need to go again?
i'm starting to think i'm either overhydrating or it's all in my head

I think the main thing to avoid added pit-stops is not to overdrink on the morning of the race. Make sure in the week leading up to it that you're fully hydrated, and consume plenty of water in those days beforehand.

Thats an interesting point from nerraw, might be possible to carry limited gear stuffed in cycling jersey pockets as far as the bike pickup, then throw the backpack on there. Should lessen the load and effort as far as the bike and improve the time - certainly worth considering I suppose.

Must go through the mandatory kit list and trim it to the limit. Will need to be absolutely sure in advance though, as the bike drop will be done the previous day and no changes possible if going that route.

Wonkagirl

It is an interesting point alright (brought up by watergal not nerraw)- so do you mean just carrying a water bottle in your hand watergal (ironic name:D)? That means putting a bar or something into your pocket to eat at the kayakstop?

it's possible.. but tbh ive never minded running with the camelback so i dunno.. i'd hate to have anything jingling around my middle like. is that a banana in your pocket or are you just pleased to see me lol:D

peterx has spoken- 3 gels in the last 90 mins.. for him, that means starting taking the gels at the kayak station:D:D:D For the rest of us, it's 1/3 of the way up CP, which is my plan

nerraw1111

Yeah Peterx will be starting his gels at the kayak so lol.

You will need the mandatory kit at all times.

My plan is to leave all my fluids at the bike stop. Still decided how much though. That might mean the bladder of my camelbak left on the bike overnight and a bottle in the cage. Get to cycle stop and stick bladder in.

Drink the bladder on the bike first so will have as little weight as possible when I get to CP.

At the most, I might carry a small 250ml bottle for the run, depending on how hot/damp it is.

Wonkagirl

Very interesting- very interesting indeed- i like where you're going with that. a 250 ml bottle, which you could of course refill at the kayak station. hmmm.. food for thought.. or water for thought.. it certainly would make the run a helluva lot easier.

Mr Freeze

Carried a bottle on the 1st run last year, won't be doing that again, it was a bit annoying as I never bring a drink with me when running.

Invested in a decent camelbak for this year, barely even know I have it on me, its class.

yop

nerraw1111 wrote: »

It's a 30 minute fast descent to the finish line, barely time for a gel to have an effect. .

You will be in the top 50 if you get yourself down in 30 mins for that leg :eek: Are you plannin that time based on experience of the route?

I think put a 500ml bottle in your bag for the 12km run, you will be 1hr+ on that run so you will be as well to take on some fluids considering you have another 4+ hours ahead of you (PeterX the exception )

The rule said by the lads I cycle with is get a sip of fluid every 15 mins. If you start to feel dry mouth you will be well down the road to dehydration and its a hard situation to recover.

You could possibly over analyze every aspect of gaelforce, but make sure you have enough of fluids and bars and gels. Worst case you will have to put them in the bin!! ****

**** Note, they say they will kick you out if you are seen dumping.

Wonkagirl

yop wrote: »

**** Note, they say they will kick you out if you are seen dumping.

I really hope they enforce that. The amt of people i saw littering all along the route last yr was a disgrace. No respect for the beautiful irish countryside. I was in the 2nd last wave, and at that stage you'd swear a music festival had taken place, not an adventure race.

People should be either disqualified or have a 1hr penalty applied or something.

watergal

Wonkagirl wrote: »

It is an interesting point alright (brought up by watergal not nerraw)- so do you mean just carrying a water bottle in your hand watergal (ironic name:D)? That means putting a bar or something into your pocket to eat at the kayakstop?

it's possible.. but tbh ive never minded running with the camelback so i dunno.. i'd hate to have anything jingling around my middle like. is that a banana in your pocket or are you just pleased to see me lol:D

peterx has spoken- 3 gels in the last 90 mins.. for him, that means starting taking the gels at the kayak station:D:D:D For the rest of us, it's 1/3 of the way up CP, which is my plan

yep - just a small bottle in the hand. I have room for one in my bumbag but I just know it's going to be bouncing around like mad so a 500ml bottle is just right for in the hand. Normally I don't bring a drink on a 12k road run, but seeing as there will be more effort required in this one, I'll just stop and have a sip at maybe 6k and then finish it at the kayak stage.
I'll have filled up on plenty of water in the week beforehand , so this should be enough to keep me going. In the dublin marathon for example, the water stops are every 3 miles, so for most people, that's every 25-30 mins, so I'm going to do the same in GF.

watergal

spurscormac wrote: »

I think the main thing to avoid added pit-stops is not to overdrink on the morning of the race. Make sure in the week leading up to it that you're fully hydrated, and consume plenty of water in those days beforehand.

Thats an interesting point from nerraw, might be possible to carry limited gear stuffed in cycling jersey pockets as far as the bike pickup, then throw the backpack on there. Should lessen the load and effort as far as the bike and improve the time - certainly worth considering I suppose.

Must go through the mandatory kit list and trim it to the limit. Will need to be absolutely sure in advance though, as the bike drop will be done the previous day and no changes possible if going that route.

If I'm doing a long run ( 14+ miles) I stop drinking about an hour beforehand. This gives me time to get out the extra water, so I'm empty going to the start line and then sip the waer on the way. It takes approx 20 mins for water to go through the body and be used, so if you gulp, it'll come straight out. Sip is the key

watergal

someone posted earlier looking for details of the talk that happened tonight. I dropped in. Well done to the guys and gals for organising it.
I'm knackered now ( long day at work) and had to leave at ten past nine as my lift was outside. Would have liked to stay until the very end, but had to go.
Anyway, am shattered, so here are some points made tonight in a nutshell:

-Don't go mad on gels. One every half an hour or so should suffice.(unless you've been doing this in training) otherwise you could end up with the scuts
-Same for carbs
-Paul mentioned that he brings small fun sized bars, nutrigrain,powerbar, flap jacks the like . (he doesn't like bananas)
-Don't go out with a full 2 lt bladder of water in the first run. There will be a water tap at the kayak stage and also at the bike transition. Know how much water you'll need via your training.

-For all the GAA fans out there- don't wear your local team shorts, get some trishorts or similar
-Paul mentioned about bringing nuun tablets and also a sachet of something else ( can't remember what-I wanted to ask him at the end, but I had to go)- Begins with D - basically when you feel a cramp coming on , get this stuff into you
Looked at Peterx's post and it's diaralyte ..that's the stuff.

-Pace yourself - run your own race and let the bullet boys pass you at the start. Padraig made a good point or taking it handy up until CP so that you have plenty of energy to get up and down in decent shape and can race the bike home
-work on your weakest sport in the next couple of weeks
- Learn to kayak in a straight line if you can before GF

On the GF route itself:
-The cycle is 2km longer this year
-The extra bit is doable on a road bike - Gators or armadillos would be the best option here
-There is a rocky part for approx 200 m after CP. Best option is to run/walk this bit avec le bike
-On CP itself, on the way back, the paths meet. Don't follow the pilgrims after this point as this will lead you the wrong way. There will be a marshal at this bit so keep an eye out as they may be easy to miss if there's a lot of people about. If you know CP then you probably know what this means. I've never been on CP , so was a bit over my head.

-Study the map. There will not be marshals at every point and you should not rely on there being one.Also on this point, studying the route will allow you to plan when to take in your food/gels. i.e. don't wait until you are on a hill to start taking them- anticipate where the tough parts are and have enough energy in your system beforehand, to get through them.

** This I'm not sure about- I thought Chris said that the Kayaking stage was not timed out this year. However later I thought that I heard it was. Hopefully someone else on the board may be able to clarify this.
I wanted to ask, but sure had to go.

That's what I can think of at the moment ..if I think of more, I'll add it in

Off for a much needed cuppa T and some anadins..

yop

watergal wrote: »

-For all the GAA fans out there- don't wear your local team shorts, get some trishorts or similar
-

Lol. love that one. Done a few road races in the last 12 months and you see the "boys" turning up in the shorts and socks and Gaa jersey, one lad was funny out in Leenaun, tore off from the line, glorified sprint.
We caught up to him 1km into the race , walking and the hands on the head

Pacing is key

watergal

yop wrote: »

Lol. love that one. Done a few road races in the last 12 months and you see the "boys" turning up in the shorts and socks and Gaa jersey, one lad was funny out in Leenaun, tore off from the line, glorified sprint.
We caught up to him 1km into the race , walking and the hands on the head

Pacing is key

Ha ha - yep have often seen the hands on the head !
Can't take the glory for that quote - came straight from the mounth of Paul..classic

Mr Freeze

yop wrote: »

You will be in the top 50 if you get yourself down in 30 mins for that leg :eek: Are you plannin that time based on experience of the route?

30 mins is spot on for the last cycle part.

Wonkagirl

tks for going to the trouble of posting watergal.. interesting stuff. glad to hear they seem confident about the road bike option. so the 200m bit they are talking about after CP, i assume, is the same bit as last yr? that was fairly treacherous alright.

I need to study the map as i'm confused as how the bike bit differs from last yr. my understanding currently is that there is a slightly different approach to CP, involving some off road? is this the famous 'skelp' that CK refers to?

So, from CP on, it's the same route as last yr?

were there many there watergal?

Wonkagirl

CKWPORT wrote: »

30 mins is spot on for the last cycle part.

yeah it's not far off, i did it in 43 and that was on a high nelly of a yoke, and biking would be my weakest element

going to concentrate on biking (except for tulfarris10) on the basis of what the lads said tonite.

Mr Freeze

Wonkagirl wrote: »

I need to study the map as i'm confused as how the bike bit differs from last yr. my understanding currently is that there is a slightly different approach to CP, involving some off road? is this the famous 'skelp' that CK refers to?

Skelp is the offroad section after CP that was in GF last year.

The bog road is the new bit we have to take up to the base of CP. No where near as rough as skelp and is doable on a racer with normal tires. Common sense is whats needed, not to tear it up, whacking every rock and stone.

yop

CKWPORT wrote: »

30 mins is spot on for the last cycle part.

For the top 50 it is Checked the results, not too many hit that section in 30 mins last year. I didn't spare it and it still took me over 40 mins.

If I can get it in 35 this year then A1.

watergal

Wonkagirl wrote: »

tks for going to the trouble of posting watergal.. interesting stuff. glad to hear they seem confident about the road bike option. so the 200m bit they are talking about after CP, i assume, is the same bit as last yr? that was fairly treacherous alright.

I need to study the map as i'm confused as how the bike bit differs from last yr. my understanding currently is that there is a slightly different approach to CP, involving some off road? is this the famous 'skelp' that CK refers to?

So, from CP on, it's the same route as last yr?

were there many there watergal?

yep. the 200m is after CP and yes to the approach being different on the way to CP.
The race finishes on the quays in Westport this year ( not the westport house). There's a 100-300 metre run at the end to the finish. ( exact disance wasn't specific)

I'd say at least 50 sitting and there were a few more at the side, so maybe between 50-60 people

There was also a video collage of expedition races by Avril, very impressive but I'm just too old for that malarky ! She must have the mental strength of a terminator. Seriously - unbelievable stuff , don't know how in the hell she can do it , but fair play to her !

Wonkagirl

CKWPORT wrote: »

Skelp is the offroad section after CP that was in GF last year.

The bog road is the new bit we have to take up to the base of CP. No where near as rough as skelp and is doable on a racer with normal tires. Common sense is whats needed, not to tear it up, whacking every rock and stone.

cool, tks.. i will definitely be jogging the skelp bit. the extra bit gained by cycling it unscathed is not worth the risk.. jog with bike might lose you 2 minutes, but cycling it and getting a blow out and youre down 15 mins. Even on a hybrid last yr it was treacherous. good to hear the other bit isnt as bad.

Mr Freeze

yop wrote: »

For the top 50 it is Checked the results, not too many hit that section in 30 mins last year. I didn't spare it and it still took me over 40 mins.

If I can get it in 35 this year then A1.

Oh sorry all knowing Yop.

Mr Freeze

Wonkagirl wrote: »

cool, tks.. i will definitely be jogging the skelp bit. the extra bit gained by cycling it unscathed is not worth the risk.. jog with bike might lose you 2 minutes, but cycling it and getting a blow out and youre down 15 mins. Even on a hybrid last yr it was treacherous. good to hear the other bit isnt as bad.

I know what ya mean!

I did 3 weeks ago in 30mins from reek base to the quay, had 60k behind me and was totally shattered....cycled down skelp no problem.

Did it again on Saturday and punctured twice in 5 mins....it has gotten a lot worse though, been a good bit of rain here, and it has made the offroad sections a lot worse. Its still doable on the bike, lad that was with me got over it fine that day, there is a lot of luck involved cycling over that section. I might throw the bike on my shoulder and jog it at the cost of a five minutes on the day, cycling it by far quicker, but the risk of the puncture is very high.

watergal

Wonkagirl wrote: »

yeah it's not far off, i did it in 43 and that was on a high nelly of a yoke, and biking would be my weakest element

going to concentrate on biking (except for tulfarris10) on the basis of what the lads said tonite.

me too.. am an average runner and a **** cyclist ( in fairness only been cycing 2 mths ). Nothing worse than thinking you're doing well and then some bullet boy flys pass looking like he's not even breathing ...( as happened me last night !)

seanie500

Wonkagirl wrote: »

cool, tks.. i will definitely be jogging the skelp bit. the extra bit gained by cycling it unscathed is not worth the risk.. jog with bike might lose you 2 minutes, but cycling it and getting a blow out and youre down 15 mins. Even on a hybrid last yr it was treacherous. good to hear the other bit isnt as bad.

you might be in for a surprise with the new cycling section leading up to C.P.!

drove the route on monday in a transit and its pretty bad to be honest

wouldnt put my bike through that twice!

ok you can avoid the potholes but you will need to be v careful to avoid a puncture here. there's a tough hill on it as well