Series 5, Episode 2 - "The Beast Below"

sock puppet

What I didn't get was why they felt the need to kill anyone who dissented. Surely making them forget what they saw would be a lot less pointlessly oppressive?

Raphael

They had to feed the starwhale somehow.

silverharp

anyone a little sad that Amy still didnt have the "police uniform" on?

Stark

The one downside to the new series (which is otherwise very good, I've actually watched both new episodes about 3 times now and I've only ever done that with "Blink" before) is that the sonic screwdriver still seems to be way overused. Oh we're trapped in the mouth of a whale. The sonic screwdriver will get us out of that.

iUseVi

Silverharp2 wrote: »

anyone a little sad that Amy still didnt have the "police uniform" on?

I can handle the nighty.

Stark wrote: »

The one downside to the new series (which is otherwise very good, I've actually watched both new episodes about 3 times now and I've only ever done that with "Blink" before) is that the sonic screwdriver still seems to be way overused. Oh we're trapped in the mouth of a whale. The sonic screwdriver will get us out of that.

Totally agree. And the brand new screwdriver last week was a total cop out. I thought sonic devices were meant to be rare things.

Doctor DooM

Stark wrote: »

The one downside to the new series (which is otherwise very good, I've actually watched both new episodes about 3 times now and I've only ever done that with "Blink" before) is that the sonic screwdriver still seems to be way overused. Oh we're trapped in the mouth of a whale. The sonic screwdriver will get us out of that.

That actually made sense to me in this one particular case because of the idea of an ultra high frequency sound playing in my head with the sole purpose of discombobulating me seemed reasonable enough sci-fi wise. It's a pretty standard way to disable someone who is usually pretty tough in comic books (Wolverine for example).

Other than that, though, I agree totally, I only want to see it being used to open locks or for clever applications of it's own in world logic.

pixelburp

Silverharp2 wrote: »

anyone a little sad that Amy still didnt have the "police uniform" on?

I'm not a fan of uniforms, I prefer the little denim skirt ensemble she has been wearing for the promo shots

As for the sonic screwdriver, the uses of it we have seen so far have made sense & conformed to internal logic. As Mr Doom points out, a sonic screwdriver in my mouth would make me hurl

At least we have yet to see it tint sunglasses or open bus doors, so there's hope yet it won't dip to those levels

iUseVi

pixelburp wrote: »

At least we have yet to see it tint sunglasses or open bus doors, so there's hope yet it won't dip to those levels

Opening doors is what it is best at!

sock puppet

Raphael wrote: »

They had to feed the starwhale somehow.

I thought the idea was that it ate the refuse that the humans threw out? And there's no way the Doctor would have allowed them to continue feeding humans to the whale after he left.

ixoy

I don't mind the sonic screwdriver as it was used here, as it was actually a believable use.
To be also fair to Moffat - he's the one who had the Doctor unable to use the screw-driver in the Library two parter because he was trying to operate on a wooden structure.

I hope it's not over used as it was - sure even Tom Baker knew that the sonic screw driver wouldn't always help him:

Doctor DooM

sock puppet wrote: »

I thought the idea was that it ate the refuse that the humans threw out? And there's no way the Doctor would have allowed them to continue feeding humans to the whale after he left.

Yes but they were also using the refuse system/ whale to remove malcontents from their society.

sock puppet

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Yes but they were also using the refuse system/ whale to remove malcontents from their society.

That was my point. They could have just made them forget what they saw instead of killing them. And if the humans were needed to feed the Whale then the Doctor just left them at the end to continue killing their own people. There was also the bit were Britain (but not Scotland for some reason) was somehow the only nation in the world with no means of building a spaceship. They were just things that bugged me in the episode. I know it's science fiction but I'd like to see a reasonable premise.

ixoy

sock puppet wrote: »

They were just things that bugged me in the episode. I know it's science fiction but I'd like to see a reasonable premise.

I don't think that's applicable in general to "Doctor Who". Don't get me wrong - I like hard sci-fi (go Greg Egan!) but DW goes more towards the fantasy end over its 31 seasons - "Reverse the polarity of the neutron flow!"

Raphael

Yes, but malcontents provide a much needed source of protein =D. And now that they;re not torturing the whale, it can feed in it's normal way - starkelp, or something. No need to feed it people!

In all seriousness, though, I'd theorise the reason they didn't brain wipe them was so they wouldn't just start the cycle over again.

Edit: I didn't have a problem with everyone else having a spaceship but britain, since they're small and independent. I imagined USA, EU, China, all had their own, Everyone else joined up into groups to work together, britain is saying "No! We'll have our own one! A british one! God Save the Queen!" Fastforward 10 years, everyone else has ****ed off before britain swallows its pride, by which point - too late.

Then the scotland line came along and ruined that. So I'm just going to pretend she said "Scotland went on the EU ship"

pixelburp

Raphael wrote: »

Edit: I didn't have a problem with everyone else having a spaceship but britain, since they're small and independent. I imagined USA, EU, China, all had their own, Everyone else joined up into groups to work together, britain is saying "No! We'll have our own one! A british one! God Save the Queen!" Fastforward 10 years, everyone else has ****ed off before britain swallows its pride, by which point - too late.

Then the scotland line came along and ruined that. So I'm just going to pretend she said "Scotland went on the EU ship"

Screw Scotland, the Queen talks about being monarch of "The United Kingdom and Northern Ireland". Ah now here, I'd like to think that's all sorted by the 30th century Plus can't be much of a UK left if Scotland's fecked off

Stark

pixelburp wrote:

Plus can't be much of a UK left if Scotland's fecked off

Well he did say the "United Kingdom of Britain and Northern Ireland" as opposed to the "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland" Picked up on it at first and thought they made a mistake, then it was clear when they said Scotland had seceded

sock puppet

Raphael wrote: »

Yes, but malcontents provide a much needed source of protein =D. And now that they;re not torturing the whale, it can feed in it's normal way - starkelp, or something. No need to feed it people!

In all seriousness, though, I'd theorise the reason they didn't brain wipe them was so they wouldn't just start the cycle over again.

Edit: I didn't have a problem with everyone else having a spaceship but britain, since they're small and independent. I imagined USA, EU, China, all had their own, Everyone else joined up into groups to work together, britain is saying "No! We'll have our own one! A british one! God Save the Queen!" Fastforward 10 years, everyone else has ****ed off before britain swallows its pride, by which point - too late.

Then the scotland line came along and ruined that. So I'm just going to pretend she said "Scotland went on the EU ship"

Works for me I suppose.

Pittens

That was my point. They could have just made them forget what they saw instead of killing them

True, the killing didn't make a lot of sense in the context of the story since people can be made to forget (in fact, why even tell them in the first place?). Also why was the kid chucked down just for getting his sums wrong. Again. Dramatic effect. He wasnt really a threat to society, and anyway, wouldn't have been eaten.

Again, this is a dramatic script. The Doctor's life has to be in danger, and we have to find out about the SpaceWhale. The sonic thingymabobby needs an outing. The best thing is to chuck them down a rubbish shoot onto a tongue. Then, escape.

I dont expect a whole lot of logic from Dr. Who. Nor consistancy. That 29th century I expect to never see again.

As long the world is not being saved by Donna Noble and her levers, I am happy/

pixelburp

Pittens wrote: »

True, the killing didn't make a lot of sense in the context of the story since people can be made to forget (in fact, why even tell them in the first place?)

My interpretation of this is that inevitably people will put 2 and 2 together and question things, before finally figuring out the truth. Indomitable human spirit I guess. So at that point then they either had a choice to forget (which judging by the Queen, is only a temporary memory wipe and doesn't completely work) or live with the truth, in which case meant becoming a public enemy. My problem was that I couldn't work out the point of the Smilers / monk ... things. Were they supposed to be the guardians of the truth, or generic robots-gone-mad-with-power?

Doctor DooM

pixelburp wrote: »

My problem was that I couldn't work out the point of the Smilers / monk ... things. Were they supposed to be the guardians of the truth, or generic robots-gone-mad-with-power?

Maybe we're supposed to be accepting shades of grey instead of absolutes now. robot monks driven insane by the responsibility?

And yeah, I mean, cmon, the mindwipe not being perfect and limited resources meaning people being offed is ALOT more internally logically and disbelief- suspendy than MAGIC POTION! DNA FROM LIPSTICK! NOOOO, MAGICER POTION!!!

pixelburp

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Maybe we're supposed to be accepting shades of grey instead of absolutes now. robot monks driven insane by the responsibility?

And yeah, I mean, cmon, the mindwipe not being perfect and limited resources meaning people being offed is ALOT more internally logically and disbelief- suspendy than MAGIC POTION! DNA FROM LIPSTICK! NOOOO, MAGICER POTION!!!

Ah don't worry, it'll be ok after President Obama's speech to end the recession!

Doctor DooM

pixelburp wrote: »

Ah don't worry, it'll be ok after President Obama's speech to end the recession!

If he could sort out the fat monsters running round my house too that'd be great.

ixoy

Doctor DooM wrote: »

If he could sort out the fat monsters running round my house too that'd be great.

What's RTD doing in your home? (sorry!)

popebenny16

i feel sooo good about where this season is heading now. the most common description of this season is a scary fairy tale, and in its concept and execution the beast below sounds like something you would read to your kids going to bed at night. It also produced another classic "kids hiding behind" something with my lot, so if that is anything to go by, the show was a success.

Not mad gone on Liz 10 - again like the eleventh hour i feel the audio mix isnt right and i needed to look at the BBC3 repeat to catch some things again. Liked the Star Wars references and I lilked the Doctors flippant way of handling things like in the mouth of the whale. Also good bit of anget in Matt Smith - interesting that he says he cant call himself the doctor anymore after murdering the whale. That has to be countered by the way Smith tackles the way Amy asks the Doctor about the time war, it sounded acted to me, it jarred for some reason.

May also explain how the lads from Skaro end up in WW2

One thing that struck me was good old fashioned discontinuity - are these people escaping the same solar flares that The Arc in Space and Frontios have escaped from?

As for the crack on the ship, and

the cybus cybermen returning for the series finale

i was thinking "thats what happens when your actual Gallifrey crashes through the demensions and stuff. Not to mention all the others who parelell hopped to gay abandon over the past few years"

old hippy

pixelburp wrote: »

Screw Scotland, the Queen talks about being monarch of "The United Kingdom and Northern Ireland". Ah now here, I'd like to think that's all sorted by the 30th century Plus can't be much of a UK left if Scotland's fecked off

Yeah, I sat up at that point. But then, to be fair, it's just sci-fi conjecture. The way we're going in this world of ours, we may not be around as a species in a hundred years, let alone 800

Wibbs

popebenny16 wrote: »

i feel sooo good about where this season is heading now. the most common description of this season is a scary fairy tale, and in its concept and execution the beast below sounds like something you would read to your kids going to bed at night. It also produced another classic "kids hiding behind" something with my lot, so if that is anything to go by, the show was a success.

I agree. As a kid what got me hooked was tom bakers early horror years as the doctor.

Not mad gone on Liz 10 - again like the eleventh hour i feel the audio mix isnt right and i needed to look at the BBC3 repeat to catch some things again.

The mix is fine, except for the music. Mixed way too high IMHO.

One thing that struck me was good old fashioned discontinuity - are these people escaping the same solar flares that The Arc in Space and Frontios have escaped from?

Yep as said before Dr Who is not very consistent in the canon that way. Very piecemeal. Excusable in the shoestring 70's not so much now when others have shown the way. It could be made more believable.

As for the crack on the ship, and

the cybus cybermen returning for the series finale

i was thinking "thats what happens when your actual Gallifrey crashes through the demensions and stuff. Not to mention all the others who parelell hopped to gay abandon over the past few years"

Here comes ........rose again and a chance to have tennant's human doctor interact with smiths continuation. Actually done right that would make for some interesting psychological drama. Kinda like the two doctors concept only one is now human. So whats it like as a human family man then with all that knowledge and 900 years of experience? Are you bored yet? What's she like in the leaba? Do you break out the sonic screwdriver But I do think it might be interesting if done well, though I seriously doubt it would ever happen, except maybe as a children in need special short.

The Recliner

Wibbs wrote: »

What's she like in the leaba? Do you break out the sonic screwdriver

The Sex and Sexuality forum is that way

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I liked the episode but like everyone else thought there were a few loose ends that weren't cleared up or could have been explained better

If nothing else it was a decent episode and another chance to get to know the new Doctor and I ahve to say he is doing well so far and is better than I ahd expected, hopefully the quaility stays high and consistant throughout the series

.SONIC.

so what exactly happened to all the children???

the beast didnt want to kill the children so what happened to them??

popebenny16

thrown over the side i'd imagine.

Busi_Girl08

.SONIC. wrote: »

so what exactly happened to all the children???

the beast didnt want to kill the children so what happened to them??

They were kept as kind of slaves, I think.

Remember when the girl was reunited with her friend who got the zero at the start, he and about 3 other kids were carrying stuff around.