Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread.

irishbucsfan

wixfjord wrote: »

He's also seriously quick and great on his feet too. I'm liking him the more I see, lovely cameo yesterday.

Game management and penalty kicking will come in time.
Funny that at this stage he's done more than Keatley has done though.

I agree completely. In fairness Keatley wasn't at the same standard he is. That is why he was let go (also because Sexton was coming up behind Conters and it was clear Keatley would get 0 game time).

I think Madigan could be better than iHumph, but it's impossible to tell until he is put under the same pressure. It's brilliant to have him, it makes me far less worried about the prospect of a Sexton injury.

Question is, could Madigan even take Sexton's place in time?

pajunior

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I agree completely. In fairness Keatley wasn't at the same standard he is. That is why he was let go (also because Sexton was coming up behind Conters and it was clear Keatley would get 0 game time).

I think Madigan could be better than iHumph, but it's impossible to tell until he is put under the same pressure. It's brilliant to have him, it makes me far less worried about the prospect of a Sexton injury.

Question is, could Madigan even take Sexton's place in time?

Anything is possible, wouldn't be beyond the pale for any talented player to seriously lose form. Sometimes it just happens.

Really though imo Sexton is an exceptional fly-half, one of the best in the world in my books. I think Madigan can be good, maybe next international good but not better then Sexton

totallegend

geekington wrote: »

One thing I've learnt as a Leinster fan is paitence - lets give him a season and a half and go from there! 12 months ago I wouldn't have put Toner anywhere the team but look how he has come on!

Richardt Strauss another example, he didn't get much game time in his first season but I don't think many of us were expecting him to tear the place up like he did last year.

I think Madigan has great potential and fair play to him, he's making the most of Berquist's absence by playing well whenever he gets a chance. Presumably Jonny will be rested for the Treviso game so that will be a tough task for Madigan to take on.

wixfjord

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I agree completely. In fairness Keatley wasn't at the same standard he is. That is why he was let go (also because Sexton was coming up behind Conters and it was clear Keatley would get 0 game time).

I think Madigan could be better than iHumph, but it's impossible to tell until he is put under the same pressure. It's brilliant to have him, it makes me far less worried about the prospect of a Sexton injury.

Question is, could Madigan even take Sexton's place in time?

Now there's a question.
Possibly better pass, feet, offload in traffic and step, but not by much.
He's definitely quicker too I'd say.

Sexton is miles ahead in experience, kicking from hand and tee and tackling too though. (Sexton is a brilliant defensive OH imo)
Give him a year or two though...

geekington

Has Madigan had any International experience? i.e. with the wolfhounds? Not going to the Churchill this summer was a shame as it would be excellent for fellas like him!

smurphy29

If there are A games this year, I'd like to see Madigan get a chance. He probably needs a few more Pro12 starts between now and then, but I'd expect him to get them. He has improved massively this year so far. I always enjoy naturally skilful players, and he is one.

Unfortunately, Wixfjord, it's not just the case that game management 'will come'. You have to have 'the mental' for this, and not all fly halves have it. ROG has it, Sexto has it, but plenty of talented footballers never learn the art of controlling a game. Think of Shane Geraghty and even James Hook - talented footballers, particularly in Hook's case, but he has never really delivered in terms of controlling the game for his team. Hopefully Madigan will develop this skill - if he does, with his natural talent he could achieve a lot in the game... but it's not a given.

wixfjord

smurphy29 wrote: »

If there are A games this year, I'd like to see Madigan get a chance. He probably needs a few more Pro12 starts between now and then, but I'd expect him to get them. He has improved massively this year so far. I always enjoy naturally skilful players, and he is one.

Unfortunately, Wixfjord, it's not just the case that game management 'will come'. You have to have 'the mental' for this, and not all fly halves have it. ROG has it, Sexto has it, but plenty of talented footballers never learn the art of controlling a game. Think of Shane Geraghty and even James Hook - talented footballers, particularly in Hook's case, but he has never really delivered in terms of controlling the game for his team. Hopefully Madigan will develop this skill - if he does, with his natural talent he could achieve a lot in the game... but it's not a given.

Eh?! Definitely 100% disagree with that!!
You're telling me that ROG and Sexton at this stage of their careers are the same in terms of game management as they were at 21?!
There's certainly a degree of having the bottle, and judging by the Connacht game, he has that, but experience and games does add a huge amount.

Spud83

wixfjord wrote: »

Eh?! Definitely 100% disagree with that!!
You're telling me that ROG and Sexton at this stage of their careers are the same in terms of game management as they were at 21?!
There's certainly a degree of having the bottle, and judging by the Connacht game, he has that, but experience and games does add a huge amount.

I think what he is getting at is that it is not guaranteed to come by simply playing more games. It can hugely depend on the intelligence of the player in question and how they learn from the games they do play. Not all players will learn it.

MaryKing

wixfjord wrote: »

Funny that at this stage he's done more than Keatley has done though.

Ian Keatley (DOB: 01/04/87):
56 Magners Starts. + 6 sub appearances.
Amlin Cup:18 Starts + 2 sub appearances.
International: 2 starts. 0 Sub appearances. (Canada & USA).
Underage Grand Slam.

Ian Madigan (DOB: 21/03/89)
11 Magners starts. +16 sub appearances.
Heineken Cup starts: 0. + 3 sub appearances (total of 34 mins).
International: 6 Nations U20 tournament.

wixfjord

Spud83 wrote: »

I think what he is getting at is that it is not guaranteed to come by simply playing more games. It can hugely depend on the intelligence of the player in question and how they learn from the games they do play. Not all players will learn it.

Ah I see, that i agree with!
I do think Madigan has shown signs of growth even in the past 2-3 months though, which is good.
Great to see a player like that improving game on game, particularly after the awful McKinley incident, which both robbed him and robbed Leinster of an amazing talent.

wixfjord

MaryKing wrote: »

Ian Keatley (DOB: 01/04/87):
56 Magners Starts. + 6 sub appearances.
Amlin Cup:18 Starts + 2 sub appearances.
International: 2 starts. 0 Sub appearances. (Canada & USA).
Underage Grand Slam.

Ian Madigan (DOB: 21/03/89)
11 Magners starts. +16 sub appearances.
Heineken Cup starts: 0. + 3 sub appearances (total of 34 mins).
International: 6 Nations U20 tournament.

In terms of at Leinster I meant Mary, but thanks for that input.

MaryKing

wixfjord wrote: »

In terms of at Leinster I meant Mary, but thanks for that input.

Thanks for clarifying that then (though I don't think Ian Madigan had done much at Leinster at the age Keatley left Leinster).

smurphy29

Spud83 wrote: »

I think what he is getting at is that it is not guaranteed to come by simply playing more games. It can hugely depend on the intelligence of the player in question and how they learn from the games they do play. Not all players will learn it.

Thanks Spud83, that's exactly what I was saying - nobody has it automatically, but not all players ultimately achieve it.

rpurfield

Burgo wrote: »

From the Northside myself and have been a Leinster supporter since my early teens, and I come from an area with a massive GAA following, but in the past two years I have noticed an increasing number of people wearing Leinster gear and flags around the place, and on my way in to work every morning going through drumcondra there is always loads of people wearing Leinster gear, tis a great sight.

just to weigh in on the whole d4 debate im from east meath (a stones throw from shane horgans parents actually) and there is a good few flags and all in the area for leinster.the odd time i can afford to get into games(when i say afford its a combination of bills time off shift work and babysitter availability) its handiest to get the train and its always packed with people from dundalk and drogheda hardly traditional areas for rugby really.i actually work with one of these lads thats from leinster but supports munster and its pure bull if im being honest.fair enough if people have favourite teams in different countries but its where your from here, ive no problem with munster or their fans even give them a cheer when they arent playing leinster but i hate this craic of leinster people supporting munster ahead of their own

wixfjord

Leo has a book coming out too!

**** it, we all know it's going to be ****e, yet how many of us are going to buy it?!

http://www.leinsterrugby.ie/olsc/8931.php


Anyone got Rhapsody in Blue yet btw?

durkadurka

Don't buy it. Someone will give it to you for Xmas. Or you'll get it for a fiver in three months.

Leo must be struggling to pay off his wedding bills. Given that he's still playing I'd say he'll say shag all interesting about Leinster. He might have a thing or two to say about Ireland though...

thomond2006

This is getting out of hand, there's way too many players writing autobiographies these days.

The bubble will burst like the property market soon!

totallegend

durkadurka wrote: »

Don't buy it. Someone will give it to you for Xmas. Or you'll get it for a fiver in three months.

I have two copies of Jackman's book. It doesn't get any better second time round...

I notice Leo's book is sub-titled "The Winning of the Heineken Cup", I hope there's more to it than that, I want to hear about how he hates Eddie O'Sullivan for inexplicably ignoring him for RWC 2003, what it was like winning in Thomond with Leicester etc etc

durkadurka

I found jackmans book very disingenuous. I think he p1ssed off his mates in the squad with it too. A buddy of mine was at the launch of the book and jackman was already apologising for it.

thomond2006

durkadurka wrote: »

I found jackmans book very disingenuous. I think he p1ssed off his mates in the squad with it too. A buddy of mine was at the launch of the book and jackman was already apologising for it.

I suppose you have to toe the line between having an interesting read and testing the trust of your mates.

gcgirl

durkadurka wrote: »

Don't buy it. Someone will give it to you for Xmas. Or you'll get it for a fiver in three months.

Leo must be struggling to pay off his wedding bills. Given that he's still playing I'd say he'll say shag all interesting about Leinster. He might have a thing or two to say about Ireland though...

Alan quinlans book was going for a tenner signed in a book shop in Bray

totallegend

durkadurka wrote: »

I found jackmans book very disingenuous. I think he p1ssed off his mates in the squad with it too. A buddy of mine was at the launch of the book and jackman was already apologising for it.

Disingenuous? In what respect?

While Jackman's book wasn't great, if it didn't p*ss a few people off then it's failed the first test of an autobiography.

gcgirl

gcgirl wrote: »

Alan quinlans book was going for a tenner signed in a book shop in Bray

a prime example of someone who should've waited till they were out of the game. Reckon if he was writing one tomorrow he'd tell a different story alright!

wixfjord

I lost a lot of respect for Hackman with that book tbh. An awful lot of bitching and whining about cheika for my liking.

durkadurka

One sentence is how completely kippered his body is and the next sentence he's complaining for not being picked. I just think he was inventing controversy. Then he admits his darts are bloody awful but blames everyone else when he misses.

skregs

totallegend wrote: »

Disingenuous? In what respect?

While Jackman's book wasn't great, if it didn't p*ss a few people off then it's failed the first test of an autobiography.

He complains that Cheika never treated him like a superstar during the 20 minutes of his career when he wasn't out injured, and spends most of the book talking about being jealous of Munster's success.
Also, it's not an autobiography, just a few stories about Leinster between 2007 and 2009

GerM

One or two things stood out in Jackman's book. He harboured a serious grudge against Cheika. With that said, Cheika seems to have been an egomaniac that was a total loose canon and that has been said by several. In yesterday's programme, for example, Kev McLaughlin talked about his debut in a ML game in Glasgow where they lost and Cheika had to be actually physically restrained in the dressing room after whilst going berserk. He was treated badly at the end by Cheika but good God did he go on about it. In reality, Cheika was exactly what Leinster needed regardless of how players felt.

Also, he discusses Flannery's dedication to throwing and how Fla improved his throwing massively by constant practice. At the same time he says he was never bothered enough himself to practice that much. It was the biggest weakness in his game for years and possibly cost him 20 Irish caps. Disappointing to see that.

He never really sold anyone up the river in terms of his former colleagues really. Told of a few training ground punch ups and of Contepomi's relationship with Munster. I recall he said Horan wasn't very well liked within the game but I don't think that's a massive surprise to anyone. Cheika and Bradley were the only ones who really got a bit of a roasting. Overall the book was just dull. The interesting parts were in the excerpts printed in the media. The rest was filler and quite dull.

Jackman wasn't ever really competitive enough to get 20 Irish caps was he!?

Surely he was quite a way down the list of suitables?

CIARAN_BOYLE

Deleted User wrote: »

Jackman wasn't ever really competitive enough to get 20 Irish caps was he!?

Surely he was quite a way down the list of suitables?

Anyone in the country who put in the work that Fla did on his throwing and got his throwing to that kind of level could get 20 caps for Ireland. As it is he got 9 caps.

durkadurka

Book should have been called ' a poor mans woody'

For about five minutes he was the best available but was never international class IMO.